Confirmed with Link: Pens trade 1st (No. 31) + Oskar Sundqvist for Ryan Reaves and Blues 2nd (No. 51)|Pt.2

[tom_servo]

I'm looking forward to seeing Reaves play on a team with pace. It might be too much for some teams.

 

[NewAgeOutlaw]

We traded our 5th center for one of the best physical 4th line wingers in the league. The pick exchange was a minor sweetener to get the deal done, since Reaves is an established NHLer and OS isnt. Whats the problem?

OS is not some elite prospect. He was passed up by Rowney this year and did not play in the playoffs. The org did not think OS could replace Cullen. The 4th C will either be Rowney or some UFA.

The problem is that some people here don't realize that JR wasn't making this trade in NHL 17. Some people don't realize that you have to throw in something extra to get a proven nhl player for a meh prospect in real life.

 

[ETA]

but he's not actually in the box during the PK all that much. 34 PIM from minors last season. That ties him with Schultz for 4th on our team. 1 more penalty than Letang or Daley. 1 less than Kunitz. 18 less than Geno and 12 less than Cole. The year before that he took 9 minors in 64 games. 188 of his career 695 PIMs come from minor penalties.

I'd also be curious how often he took a penalty that left the team shorthanded vs roughing calls or whatever where there were matching penalties.

I'm keeping an open mind here but my impression of Reaves before this trade was made was that he was the kind of "tough" that we could use -- a guy who can take a regular shift and chip in 20-30 points or so in our system.

I could care less if he gets into any fights -- I prefer the idea that other teams know that if they run Murray or whatever then someone on their team is going to get nailed (ideally with a clean hit).

And in the playoffs (assuming Reaves fits in with our system and assuming we make the playoffs ), I'm hoping he'll be able to dish out (clean) punishment that will help to wear down the opposition (unlike someone like Kuhn who seemed to specialize in hitting the boards where his target used to be 1 second earlier).

Like others, I was becoming increasingly disillusioned with Sundqvist so I don't feel we gave up much in the trade. The difference between our 31st overall and the 2nd we got back is probably pretty
minimal this year -- either pick probably has fairly similar odds of never playing in the NHL.

Now we just need to pick up JT for our 3rd line center and maybe shore up the D (and figure out the backup goalie situation)...

 

[Jaded-Fan]

Reaves is a hell of a fourth liner that fits this system. I couldn't be more stoked. I mean, I'll miss watching Kuhn fall all over the ice every shift and look mostly useless, but somehow I'll get over it.



Game isn't changing Big, especially during the remains yrs left of Crosby and Malkin's career. The dimwit commissioner publically blew off Jr's concerns about protecting stars as pandering to the refs. If that doesn't wake people up to the old boys network running the league...

I hate goons, have been very vocal about it for years. I had them chasing me around rinks doing their goony things since I was little, and even broke a goon's arm once because I had enough...

However, RR isn't a goon. He's a legit hard nosed guy that can skate and doesn't go looking for cheap shots ala Wilson. That's one of the other reasons I really respect and loved watching him play.

You guys have the wrong impression of him, simply because he can beat the **** out of anyone he feels like.

We have the 'wrong' impression about him because JR outright said he was bringing in a guy to 'protect' Crosby, Malkin, Jake and the other stars and this is who he got.

It is a fantasy that bringing Reaves in will stop any of that, and people are going to be sorely disappointed when Crosby and others take as much abuse as before. But the false expectations were brought about by JR and the Pens.

Worse, Reaves knows why he was brought in, and will act like an idiot whenever Crosby gets checked to justify his role.

Further if you know you can get Reaves to retaliate and get a Power play just by checking Crosby it may ironically increase the crap that Sid takes.

It is set up to fail is my biggest problem with it. That doesn't even get into the example it sets for guys like Malkin who have a history of discipline issues.

 

[vodeni]

I'm looking forward to seeing Reaves play on a team with pace. It might be too much for some teams.

well you watched fehr, Kuhn, Rowney, Wilson ended up lifting the Cup, this is a move IN THAT direction

 

[Whale Mingo]

I keep waiting for the RickRoll. I mean, it's coming, right?

 

[HandshakeLine]

We have the 'wrong' impression about him because JR outright said he was bringing in a guy to 'protect' Crosby, Malkin, Jake and the other stars and this is who he got.

It is a fantasy that bringing Reaves in will stop any of that, and people are going to be sorely disappointed when Crosby and others take as much abuse as before. But the false expectations were brought about by JR and the Pens.

Worse, Reaves knows why he was brought in, and will act like an idiot whenever Crosby gets checked to justify his role.

Further if you know you can get Reaves to retaliate and get a Power play just by checking Crosby it may ironically increase the crap that Sid takes.

It is set up to fail is my biggest problem with it. That doesn't even get into the example it sets for guys like Malkin who have a history of discipline issues.

So, what marketing says about the guy is more important than how he actually plays?

Jaded, you so mad, you're not making any sense.

 

[HandshakeLine]

People shouldn't expect a player doing anything to protect our stars, that's true. It doesn't matter what JR said or not or what some talking head said about that. But if you can't see why Reaves would be a good player on this team as a team that wants to have a fast, suffocating forecheck, you might want to go get mad at other things in the draft thread for a while.

 

[Ogrezilla]

We have the 'wrong' impression about him because JR outright said he was bringing in a guy to 'protect' Crosby, Malkin, Jake and the other stars and this is who he got.

It is a fantasy that bringing Reaves in will stop any of that, and people are going to be sorely disappointed when Crosby and others take as much abuse as before. But the false expectations were brought about by JR and the Pens.

Worse, Reaves knows why he was brought in, and will act like an idiot whenever Crosby gets checked to justify his role.

Further if you know you can get Reaves to retaliate and get a Power play just by checking Crosby it may ironically increase the crap that Sid takes.

It is set up to fail is my biggest problem with it. That doesn't even get into the example it sets for guys like Malkin who have a history of discipline issues.

Do you really think Sully is going to let him just run around like an idiot? Hell, Reaves has never done that. He had 17 minor penalties last year. That's half as many as Malkin had. And I'm sure some of those saw the other guy go off with him for matching roughing calls.

Sully doesn't let our team play like that. Reaves has never been that kind of guy in the first place. I don't expect the two to combine and turn Reaves into Tom Wilson.

 

[HandshakeLine]

I think Jaded's just going off of reputation here and letting emotion get the better of him.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

We have the 'wrong' impression about him because JR outright said he was bringing in a guy to 'protect' Crosby, Malkin, Jake and the other stars and this is who he got.

It is a fantasy that bringing Reaves in will stop any of that, and people are going to be sorely disappointed when Crosby and others take as much abuse as before. But the false expectations were brought about by JR and the Pens.

Worse, Reaves knows why he was brought in, and will act like an idiot whenever Crosby gets checked to justify his role.

Further if you know you can get Reaves to retaliate and get a Power play just by checking Crosby it may ironically increase the crap that Sid takes.

It is set up to fail is my biggest problem with it. That doesn't even get into the example it sets for guys like Malkin who have a history of discipline issues.

If you believe that Reaves taking dumb penalties regularly is going to be a thing under Sully, you may want to re-watch that clip of him telling Malkin to shut the **** up.

Forgetting for the moment that I'm reasonably sure Reaves has understood his role for as long as he's been in the league and never been that sort of goof, I doubt that a coach who would put a franchise player making 9.5 mil in his place in public is going to tolerate a 4th line grinder messing up his strategy.

 

[Jaded-Fan]

So, what marketing says about the guy is more important than how he actually plays?

Jaded, you so mad, you're not making any sense.

For what it is worth, no one would be happier to be wrong than I would. I truly hope that I am.

 

[ETA]

People shouldn't expect a player doing anything to protect our stars, that's true.

Couldn't agree more. I do hope though, perhaps unrealistically, that teams might hesitate a bit before using the "hit the **** out of the Pens" strategy now that we have someone who can give it back to them. The crosschecks and headshots and all that bs is something that only the league can put an end to though...

It doesn't matter what JR said or not or what some talking head said about that. But if you can't see why Reaves would be a good player on this team as a team that wants to have a fast, suffocating forecheck, you might want to go get mad at other things in the draft thread for a while.

And also, maybe Malkin won't feel that he has to be the team tough guy any more...

 

[Ogrezilla]

For what it is worth, no one would be happier to be wrong than I would. I truly hope that I am.

I just think you have the wrong impression of the guy. He's not Tom Wilson at all. He's fast, hard working, responsible with the puck, good defensively, can cycle, and can hit like a truck. Fighting is not why he's in the NHL. It's a bonus on top of what he does between the whistles. If he never fights anybody, he will still be a good hockey player for us. He's not a guy who I expect to be stirring up ****. He's going to be a guy who hits hard and fights guys who have already started ****. If I'm wrong on that last part, I won't be happy with this either.

 

[HandshakeLine]

For what it is worth, no one would be happier to be wrong than I would. I truly hope that I am.

Time will tell, dude. But for what it's worth, I've always thought Reaves was a way better defensive player than his reputation and status suggested.

 

[SaturdayNightSlegr]

Liking this deal more and more.
St. Louis protected Reaves in the expansion draft over Perron. Blues fans have good things to say about him in the main board trade thread.

This is not about protection or goonery. This is not Tanner Glass 2.0. This is about getting a fast, physical NHL player who can effectively forecheck and help you win games.

 

[REAVES]

Couldn't agree more. I do hope though, perhaps unrealistically that teams might hesitate a bit before using the "hit the **** out of the Pens" strategy to wear them down now that we have someone who can give it back to them.



And also, maybe Malkin won't feel that he has to be the team tough guy any more...

Kunitz at $ 2.8 million = 120 hits 7 goals top 9

Or REAVES at $ 1.1 million = 200 hits 7 goals 4th line

Hmmm

 

[bathroomSTAAL]

I'm not going to act like I watch a ****ton of Blues games but Reaves has always seemed like a decent energy 4th liner when I do.

We gotta give Sully the benefit of the doubt. Clips of him telling Malkin to shut the **** up, clips of him yelling at the whole bench "Why do you gotta get into the ********?! Why?!" He's not going to tolerate running around and idiocy.

And it's not like we gave up a 1st 6 months ago. We traded the 31st overall pick right before taking it, which probably means they were hoping someone was still around and traded down when he wasn't.

Sundqvist is whatever. I do think this makes re-signing Bonino or getting someone similar pretty important, obviously.

 

[ETA]

St. Louis protected Reaves in the expansion draft over Perron. Blues fans have good things to say about him in the main board trade thread.

This is not about protection or goonery. This is not Tanner Glass 2.0. This is about getting a fast, physical NHL player who can effectively forecheck and help you win games.

Good points / I agree.

TBH, I'm thinking of Reaves as a Kuhn upgrade / solid addition to our 4th line more than anything else.

I'm also not sure why people are bashing Tom Wilson so much...? I mean, I hate the guy as much as anyone because he's on the Capitals and tends to cross the line on hits, but he's an effective 4th liner who can contribute offensively, hits like a truck and can take on the other team's tough guy if necessary.

 

[SaturdayNightSlegr]

The only thing I don't like is Reaves is a UFA after this year. That probably was a big factor in why he got traded.

If he comes in, has a great year, we will likely lose him for nothing.

 

[Nakawick]

Man, MAF leaving is only the 2nd most emotional Pens moment of the last 3 days.

Sid Geno 3C Sundqvist Rowney
Phil Horny Rust Kuhnhackl Archibald
Jake Sheary Hags Wilson

That is 14 guys who can't be waived, plus we have Sprong, Blueger, ZAR who may play themselves onto the team. Plus we signed Tiffels after an impressive World Championship. Simon as well.

Sundqvist isn't a sure bet for anything and became expendable. Heck, with Reaves taking a roster spot we still have the same problem. We got to many forwards. Someone else will likely get moved as well.

I don't get the poor asset management argument. We got the better player and gave up pick #31 for #51. Also appears we got a player that we wanted with #51.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Good point / I agree.

TBH, I'm thinking of Reaves as a Kuhn upgrade / solid addition to our 4th line more than anything else.

I'm also not sure why people are bashing Tom Wilson so much...? I mean, I hate the guy as much as anyone because he's on the Capitals and tends to cross the line on hits, but he's an effective 4th liner who can contribute offensively, hits like a truck and can take on the other team's tough guy if necessary.

because he takes a ton of dumb penalties and goes way out of position to make hits.

 

[Jacob]

I'd love Tom Wilson, but he'd definitely have to be reigned in a lot. I think Trotz is just not great at doing that sort of thing, but Sullivan I think would be.

 

[wej20]

Watching Archibald and Reaves fly around will be fun at least.

 

[Ogrezilla]

Watching Archibald and Reaves fly around will be fun at least.

I would say there's a decent chance he blocks Archibald from making the team. I expect it to be Wilson - 4C - Reaves with Archie/Rownie as extras.