Salary Cap: Pens Salary Thread: Teh offseason! All your defense are belong to us

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Big Friggin Dummy

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Feb 22, 2019
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I don't know that the make up of the bottom-6 matters all that much. You could throw any combination of schlubs out there and be in relatively the same spot. Geno's wing still has a glaring vacancy at LW. /shrug

All that said, I think I'd rather have E-Rod at $2 million playing in the bottom-6 than Kap at $3.2 million.
 
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I don't know that the make up of the bottom-6 matters all that much. You could throw any combination of schlubs out there and be in relatively the same spot. Geno's wing still has a glaring vacancy at LW. /shrug

All that said, I think I'd rather have E-Rod at $2 million playing in the bottom-6 than Kap at $3.2 million.
I mean there's only so much you can do with the space we have (had) and the players available.

Realistically, when you have Zucker, Heinen, and Kapanen available, there's not much more you can realistically ask for. Consider them the 4th top 6 wing, go around the league and see how many team have better. Not many.

This all assumes the 2nd line is Zucker-Malkin-Rakell. If Rakell is put on the LW, then the gap is at RW but I get what you are saying.

Rakell-Malkin-Heinen/Kapanen
Zucker-Carter-Kapanen/Hainen

works just as well too.
 

Tasty Biscuits

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Eh, it's close. I'd rather have neither, but I guess I'll take Kap. We freed ourselves from Simon, we've (hopefully) freed ourselves from ZAR, and now we've freed ourselves from E-Rod. I'm kinda surprised anyone would want him back for anything other than league min.
 

Big Friggin Dummy

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I get not being a big E-Rod fan. I'm not exactly a big E-Rod fan, but to equate "being rid of" E-Rod to being rid of an AHL (at best) talent in Simon or some forgettable nobody 4th liner like ZAR is bonkers.
 

Tasty Biscuits

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E-Rod's career before last season basically was just that -- AHL player who was mostly forgettable. I don't think he finally found the fountain of IQ at age 29.
 

Peat

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I get not being a big E-Rod fan. I'm not exactly a big E-Rod fan, but to equate "being rid of" E-Rod to being rid of an AHL (at best) talent in Simon or some forgettable nobody 4th liner like ZAR is bonkers.

People complained about them getting overplayed. ERod actually got overplayed. I'm happier to see him gone than the other two.

Kapanen is a winger and ERod is a center. They don't play the same position.

The argument to be made is whether they should have not re-signed Carter and instead re-signed ERod to be the 3C, but I think that's a major "Captain Hindsight" argument.

Don't think I'm the only person here who spent a lot of last season wondering if ERod was a better 3C than Carter.

Really agree ERod wasn't much of a wing though.
 
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Pens x

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“Teams are trying to move out cap to sign Erod”

Colorado makes no such trade. Erod signs a year deal worth $2 million. Teams apparently look at players’ entire seasons, not only 3 months. Weird.

So, I guess the other teams around the league didn’t see much value in Sully’s pets this off-season, considering only 1 of 4 have a guaranteed contract and the season starts in a month.
 
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Darren McCord

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I don't know that the make up of the bottom-6 matters all that much. You could throw any combination of schlubs out there and be in relatively the same spot. Geno's wing still has a glaring vacancy at LW. /shrug

All that said, I think I'd rather have E-Rod at $2 million playing in the bottom-6 than Kap at $3.2 million.

Ehhh Erod got played a ton and got more points. He would not reproduce that again here. He had 1 more EVS G than Kap with wayyyy more ice time. Erods career shooting % is pedestrian. 7.8% He was 29th in the league in shots on goal. Kap had a down year in shooting % and play.

I would much rather have the better EVS player who had a down year than a guy who relied on minutes he wont ever see here again.

Kap popping off is more likely than Erod repeating even if both are long shots. The Erod who had like 2 goal in 40 games in the second half is much more likely to be the erod you get.

Kapanen is a winger and ERod is a center. They don't play the same position.

The argument to be made is whether they should have not re-signed Carter and instead re-signed ERod to be the 3C, but I think that's a major "Captain Hindsight" argument.

This. Zucker - Erod - Kap was an interesting line last year and one I wish they would have tried again. Once they signed Carter mid season tho, there was not chance. Carter at the time was worth it but the timing overall was pretty dumb. I am just glad they didnt sign them both after the first half.
 
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Big Friggin Dummy

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Truth is probably closer to Kap and E-Rod being pretty similarly flawed, aggravating players; third liners who look absolutely wretched when they're cold, and really solid when they're on a hot streak.

I'll take the cheaper guy who can play center if choosing between the two. I'd rather not give a shit about either and try to concentrate the efforts in landing Geno a legit winger to push Zucker down the lineup, but y'know.

-edit- As for the "Sully misuses E-Rod" thing, I agree. He also misuses Kap. Neither should be in the top-6, imo.
 

SteadyYeti

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Aug 1, 2022
26
10
PIT
In: Ehlers, Gostisbhere, Dineen
Out: Jarry, Dumoulin, Kapanen, 2023 1st, Poulin



WPG
In: Chychrun, Kapanen
Out: Stanley, Ehlers

AZ
In: Stanley, Jarry, Poulin, Dumoulin, 2023 PIT 1st
Out: Gostisbhere, Chychrun, Dineen
 

SteadyYeti

Registered User
Aug 1, 2022
26
10
PIT
In: Ehlers, Gostisbhere, Dineen
Out: Jarry, Dumoulin, Kapanen, 2023 1st, Poulin



WPG
In: Chychrun, Kapanen
Out: Stanley, Ehlers

AZ
In: Stanley, Jarry, Poulin, Dumoulin, 2023 PIT 1st
Out: Gostisbhere, Chychrun, Dineen
Pets + Teddy Blueger for Jeff Skinner
 

Empoleon8771

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Aug 25, 2015
81,359
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Redmond, WA
PIT
In: Ehlers, Gostisbhere, Dineen
Out: Jarry, Dumoulin, Kapanen, 2023 1st, Poulin



WPG
In: Chychrun, Kapanen
Out: Stanley, Ehlers

AZ
In: Stanley, Jarry, Poulin, Dumoulin, 2023 PIT 1st
Out: Gostisbhere, Chychrun, Dineen

steve-harvey-confused.gif
 

AuroraBorealis

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Oct 16, 2018
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NHL site.
Nice! Didn't know that's a filter. Will try to use that this year then.
Probably, but then if they're calling more penalties on us they might call more against us. Tied 16th in the league last season. Yeah, having the best penalty differential in the league is kinda nice, but with the personnel we've got I'm okay with trading a lot of special teams time. So far we've only lost one first choice PKer - Marino, not the guy I'd consider msot important - and look set to have more time with Geno, our msot important PPer. There's guys there to replace ZAR. Less so Boyle and his faceoff ability. I also think having a few bigger dmen to stick on the PK might help a lot.
I don't have the deep dive numbers, but no ZAR and Boyle may hurt. Boyle did a really good job with his reach and breaking up passes near the point.
ZAR played better on the PK than he ever has before. If they make the right choices with their replacements then we may be fine, but we'll see.
I would personally put Rakell on PP1 and use Rust on the PK full time. At least that should be tried.
I know people want Kap on the PK but I looked at his numbers there with Toronto and they're not that special. He was mediocre. Maybe worth a shot but my expectations would be low.
As for the why the team's best periods were the 1st... proximity to message seems a good guess. But my guess would be the team was in part just trying to coast and preserve energy a little. Once they got ahead, they were content to maintain a stranglehold and not go for the jugular (unless it was Detroit).

I really hope this is the year when the team doesn't have to go balls to the wall in November/December to cope with injuries and can look to crank it up in January.
Yes, we're overly reliant on streaks around winter time. That's been a common trend in the Crosby era.
The preserving energy thing is a good guess too. Our really poor HDCF finishing got in the way of going for the jugular. I'm hoping that balances out this year.
Well you nailed the big one in the bolded. But without looking at his game logs, if you could have reduced the bad games to 2 or 3 and got another 3 or 4 points out of them, that gets the team creeping up.
Yeah but if you look at it as a whole, if CDS did that then he's likely around .920 to end the year. That's a big expectation from a backup making peanuts.
If he ends up around .915 again then that means at some point in the season he turns it up to compensate for other losses.
Yes, consistency is optimal in hockey but that's just not the reality. The players have emotions. They are susceptible to getting caved in when vibes are bad and the confidence is low. It's gonna happen. Not really possible to be in the same headspace every game.
I felt CDS salvaged his season nicely...well until the injury lol.
 
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Pancakes

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E-Rod's career before last season basically was just that -- AHL player who was mostly forgettable. I don't think he finally found the fountain of IQ at age 29.
He always rated fairly well analytically even prior to this year.

Will be interesting to see what he does this year
 

Peat

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Jun 14, 2016
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Nice! Didn't know that's a filter. Will try to use that this year then.

Goals by period and leading/trailing.

I don't have the deep dive numbers, but no ZAR and Boyle may hurt. Boyle did a really good job with his reach and breaking up passes near the point.
ZAR played better on the PK than he ever has before. If they make the right choices with their replacements then we may be fine, but we'll see.
I would personally put Rakell on PP1 and use Rust on the PK full time. At least that should be tried.
I know people want Kap on the PK but I looked at his numbers there with Toronto and they're not that special. He was mediocre. Maybe worth a shot but my expectations would be low.

The problem with relying too much on individual PK stats is that they don't tell you who they're against (unless you want to dig real deep). Two guys can post the same numbers and be actually very different in performance depending on whether they're against PP1 or PP2.

F'instance I just realised nobody scored a goal against our PK the entire time Blueger was out there without McGinn - and we're talking an hour of play here - but what does that actually mean?

So ZAR did have the best chance metrics of any regular PKer along with Carter... but they're joint 4th choice, how much of that is against PP1? In any case, he didn't outperform the chance metrics like a lot of our PKers.

Boyle's metrics were kinda meh - 2nd highest xGA behind McGinn - and he has the highest GA/60 by nearly 2, so I'm not sure he's going to be a big loss... except if it means Carter getting more time due to his faceoffs.

In any case... I'm not 100% sure we won't miss them, but I believe a competent PKer will fit in well, as they're getting good coaching.

Yes, we're overly reliant on streaks around winter time. That's been a common trend in the Crosby era.
The preserving energy thing is a good guess too. Our really poor HDCF finishing got in the way of going for the jugular. I'm hoping that balances out this year.

I feel like it was less of a thing before the stupid injury crisises and we were more of a March team.

Yeah but if you look at it as a whole, if CDS did that then he's likely around .920 to end the year. That's a big expectation from a backup making peanuts.
If he ends up around .915 again then that means at some point in the season he turns it up to compensate for other losses.
Yes, consistency is optimal in hockey but that's just not the reality. The players have emotions. They are susceptible to getting caved in when vibes are bad and the confidence is low. It's gonna happen. Not really possible to be in the same headspace every game.
I felt CDS salvaged his season nicely...well until the injury lol.

I know it's not the reality, but it's the aim. He could have had a more stable .914 due to less fantastic games when he came around and less awful games when he was awful.

Or, hell, yeah, he could just post a .920 season. Big aim, but he's done it before.

Whatever he does, I think it's a fair expectation he shouldn't be so awful we don't dare play him for half the season. It'll happen occasionally during his career, it shouldn't happen every season.

edit: Actually, for a better look at what I want from DeSmith, look at his 18-19 season. His percentage was .916, so fairly small difference, but his quality start percentage was at .6 rather than .5. Quality starts are what I want from the backup.

He gets .55, I'm happy. He gets .5, I'm probably a little ho-hum.
 
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Gurglesons

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Goals by period and leading/trailing.



The problem with relying too much on individual PK stats is that they don't tell you who they're against (unless you want to dig real deep). Two guys can post the same numbers and be actually very different in performance depending on whether they're against PP1 or PP2.

F'instance I just realised nobody scored a goal against our PK the entire time Blueger was out there without McGinn - and we're talking an hour of play here - but what does that actually mean?

So ZAR did have the best chance metrics of any regular PKer along with Carter... but they're joint 4th choice, how much of that is against PP1? In any case, he didn't outperform the chance metrics like a lot of our PKers.

Boyle's metrics were kinda meh - 2nd highest xGA behind McGinn - and he has the highest GA/60 by nearly 2, so I'm not sure he's going to be a big loss... except if it means Carter getting more time due to his faceoffs.

In any case... I'm not 100% sure we won't miss them, but I believe a competent PKer will fit in well, as they're getting good coaching.



I feel like it was less of a thing before the stupid injury crisises and we were more of a March team.



I know it's not the reality, but it's the aim. He could have had a more stable .914 due to less fantastic games when he came around and less awful games when he was awful.

Or, hell, yeah, he could just post a .920 season. Big aim, but he's done it before.

Whatever he does, I think it's a fair expectation he shouldn't be so awful we don't dare play him for half the season. It'll happen occasionally during his career, it shouldn't happen every season.

edit: Actually, for a better look at what I want from DeSmith, look at his 18-19 season. His percentage was .916, so fairly small difference, but his quality start percentage was at .6 rather than .5. Quality starts are what I want from the backup.

He gets .55, I'm happy. He gets .5, I'm probably a little ho-hum.
Nice! Didn't know that's a filter. Will try to use that this year then.

I don't have the deep dive numbers, but no ZAR and Boyle may hurt. Boyle did a really good job with his reach and breaking up passes near the point.
ZAR played better on the PK than he ever has before. If they make the right choices with their replacements then we may be fine, but we'll see.
I would personally put Rakell on PP1 and use Rust on the PK full time. At least that should be tried.
I know people want Kap on the PK but I looked at his numbers there with Toronto and they're not that special. He was mediocre. Maybe worth a shot but my expectations would be low.

Yes, we're overly reliant on streaks around winter time. That's been a common trend in the Crosby era.
The preserving energy thing is a good guess too. Our really poor HDCF finishing got in the way of going for the jugular. I'm hoping that balances out this year.

Yeah but if you look at it as a whole, if CDS did that then he's likely around .920 to end the year. That's a big expectation from a backup making peanuts.
If he ends up around .915 again then that means at some point in the season he turns it up to compensate for other losses.
Yes, consistency is optimal in hockey but that's just not the reality. The players have emotions. They are susceptible to getting caved in when vibes are bad and the confidence is low. It's gonna happen. Not really possible to be in the same headspace every game.
I felt CDS salvaged his season nicely...well until the injury lol.

Poehling was used a ton as a PKer in the AHL for Laval.
 

AuroraBorealis

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Poehling was used a ton as a PKer in the AHL for Laval.
I mean I guess it's better having that experience than not having it, but QMJHL play means next to nothing for me. That league is easy mode.
If he did it for Wilkes successfully that'd mean a lot more.
Not opposed to trying new things, although I don't expect him to do it better than Rust, for example.
 

Gurglesons

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I mean I guess it's better having that experience than not having it, but QMJHL play means next to nothing for me. That league is easy mode.
If he did it for Wilkes successfully that'd mean a lot more.
Not opposed to trying new things, although I don't expect him to do it better than Rust, for example.

Well, it was in the AHL as I said which is comparable to Wilkes.

He also PKed for Montreal in 19-20 and was relatively effective in the minutes he got.
 
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