Salary Cap: Penguins Salary Cap Thread IXIIV: We want a backup goalie right meow

[Kristopher Letang]

Trading for Petry means that Letang is 100% gone.

Where did y’all get that rumor from btw?

 

[ChaosAgent]

Trading for Petry means that Letang is 100% gone.

Where did y’all get that rumor from btw?

Kingerski who gets it from Hfboards

 

[ChaosAgent]

This needs to be repeated more often. The players are not 'overcoached' with how they generate offense; if anything, they're undercoached.

Disagree. Guardiola, probably the best soccer/football coach in the world ATM says "my job is to get you to the attacking zone. Whatever you do there is up to you." I don't want my team over coached in the offensive zone.

 

[Tender Rip]

I mean these are all good points and if you really feel this team is a strong contender the next few years then you sign Rust, sure…I don’t however…

I just don't get the perspective, mate. Even if you don't think we can compete, how does it make any sense to walk away from one of your most productive assets? It's here and now with Sid and Geno. The further down the line you go, the less likely we are to compete.

In any case I don't think we are a strong contender right now either. I think we are too bland to get there, even if we could beat anyone if ours stars are at their best, including Jarry. But I do think we are chemistry and a successful move or two away (plus health, obviously) from being right there.

here’s the other thing: I think Geno and Letang deserve to return for the next couple years…just on the forward side alone then we have Sid and G and Carter who will be old as the hills…I really don’t want our wings to have age on them too with that group…

If you want to stick with Geno and Letang (so do I), then you are win now. Right now. Rust has yet to turn 30, if his legs go at.... say 33... it is just unlikely to matter anymore. Maybe he still has something and we deal him with retention when we are past the days of Sid and Geno.
We are at our last shots with this core. You can argue they're past it, but I don't think anyone can argue that there are more shots down the line if we rebuild around them.
By all means change around the supporting cast, but if you aren't making a great return - or at least some sort of return! - on the few guys playing like stars, then I don't see any sense in letting them walk.

we should be looking to move out wingers like Rust and Zucker who are 30+ and bring in younger legs…we definitely aren’t going to find a player as good as Rust but who knows…maybe Nylander, Poulin etc gets a shot, maybe we make a trade for some aged 25 winger or less…having cap space might let us be a player for a RFA who’s team can’t qualify him or a team looking to dump a higher salaried younger player…

There is no reason guys showing promise from the farm should not get chances. If they show themselves ready, then you try to trade away older guys to make room. I've been on the Zohorna and Angello train since last year for instance, both because I think they add as much as some of the bottom 6'ers we have (though differently), but more so because I see them giving us something extra on an otherwise smallish and non-physical team. Some "hard to play" factor. Which we lack... so much.

But there is great difference between a guy like Zucker who has performed way below expectation after being acquired at a significant expense, and then Bryan Rust.
Again, if we had traded Rust before the season, I would have understood from an asset management point of view. But he is one of the only wo genuine top six wingers we have, and the added cap hit on him will conceivably be like 2.5 million more which he has richly deserved.
You make/save 4,75 million on replacing Zucker with Zohorna. You make another 1.1 million replacing ZAR with... whoever down there deserves it.

Maybe if you are thinking asset management like me, you see if you can get a meaningful asset/pick for Dumo (who is declining visibly, IMO) and see if POJ can swim and then there's 3 million there. And you look in UFA also, of course. For the next Ceci, etc.

 

[Russian Factor]

Do we know if we can just pull a Kucherov with Zucker? Core muscle surgery can supposedly take 3 months but not sure how shutting him down without explicitly shutting him down would be able to work. Not sure if they can pull that off or not. It gets fun if we can. If scouts and people that would know can tell if Petry's issues are actually just emotional fallout from off ice stuff I would love to do something like

PIT:
M. Matheson
S. Poulin
N. Legare
2nd rounder

FOR

MTL:
J. Petry (full price)
Brett Kulak (@50%)

and then maybe see if GMJRs adoration of Marino and Kap can screw Vancouver with something like

PIT:
J. Marino
K. Kapanen
J. Riikola
C. DeSmith
P.O. Joseph or different future like a pick instead

FOR

VAN:
C. Garland
J.T. Miller
L. Schenn
J. Halak (retention via another team whatevers necessary I guess)

MTL/Petry and VAN/GMJRconnection are two situations where I think we could have some leverage despite our poor sellable assets that could lead to a significant swing if capitalized on right. Its definitely a gamble due to Petrys age but I'm at the point where Im actually worried Marino is Maatta 2.0 as much as that kills me to entertain. We need to either see if getting him another Jack Johnson blankie like Giordano or Chiarot fixes him or we need to get someone we arent terrrified to put on the ice in the playoffs against tough competition.

EDIT:

Guentzel - Crosby - Garland
Miller - Malkin - Rust
Zucker - Rodrigues - Carter
Z. A. R. - Blueger - McGinn

Dumoulin - Letang
Pettersson - Petry
Kulak - Schenn

Jarry
Halak

Cmon

 

[Gurglesons]

Do we know if we can just pull a Kucherov with Zucker? Core muscle surgery can supposedly take 3 months but not sure how shutting him down without explicitly shutting him down would be able to work. Not sure if they can pull that off or not. It gets fun if we can. If scouts and people that would know can tell if Petry's issues are actually just emotional fallout from off ice stuff I would love to do something like

PIT:
M. Matheson
S. Poulin
N. Legare
2nd rounder

FOR

MTL:
J. Petry (full price)
Brett Kulak (@50%)

and then maybe see if GMJRs adoration of Marino and Kap can screw Vancouver with something like

PIT:
J. Marino
K. Kapanen
J. Riikola
C. DeSmith
P.O. Joseph or different future like a pick instead

FOR

VAN:
C. Garland
J.T. Miller
L. Schenn
J. Halak (retention via another team whatevers necessary I guess)

MTL/Petry and VAN/GMJRconnection are two situations where I think we could have some leverage despite our poor sellable assets that could lead to a significant swing if capitalized on right. Its definitely a gamble due to Petrys age but I'm at the point where Im actually worried Marino is Maatta 2.0 as much as that kills me to entertain. We need to either see if getting him another Jack Johnson blankie like Giordano or Chiarot fixes him or we need to get someone we arent terrrified to put on the ice in the playoffs against tough competition.

EDIT:

Guentzel - Crosby - Garland
Miller - Malkin - Rust
Zucker - Rodrigues - Carter
Z. A. R. - Blueger - McGinn

Dumoulin - Letang
Pettersson - Petry
Kulak - Schenn

Jarry
Halak

Cmon

Seems realistic.

 

[Russian Factor]

Seems realistic.

Listen friend Im under no impression the things I talk for fun about on here are going to actually happen in real life. Knowing cautious ass Hextall Im sure all we actually do is pay like a 7th rounder for Brossoint or whatever

 

[Tender Rip]

@Russian Factor - far too many moving pieces to really contemplate, but I'd say that you overpay Montreal wildly, whereas Vancouver would never do that.

 

[3ladesof5teel]

Do we know if we can just pull a Kucherov with Zucker? Core muscle surgery can supposedly take 3 months but not sure how shutting him down without explicitly shutting him down would be able to work. Not sure if they can pull that off or not. It gets fun if we can. If scouts and people that would know can tell if Petry's issues are actually just emotional fallout from off ice stuff I would love to do something like

PIT:
M. Matheson
S. Poulin
N. Legare
2nd rounder

FOR

MTL:
J. Petry (full price)
Brett Kulak (@50%)

and then maybe see if GMJRs adoration of Marino and Kap can screw Vancouver with something like

PIT:
J. Marino
K. Kapanen
J. Riikola
C. DeSmith
P.O. Joseph or different future like a pick instead

FOR

VAN:
C. Garland
J.T. Miller
L. Schenn
J. Halak (retention via another team whatevers necessary I guess)

MTL/Petry and VAN/GMJRconnection are two situations where I think we could have some leverage despite our poor sellable assets that could lead to a significant swing if capitalized on right. Its definitely a gamble due to Petrys age but I'm at the point where Im actually worried Marino is Maatta 2.0 as much as that kills me to entertain. We need to either see if getting him another Jack Johnson blankie like Giordano or Chiarot fixes him or we need to get someone we arent terrrified to put on the ice in the playoffs against tough competition.

EDIT:

Guentzel - Crosby - Garland
Miller - Malkin - Rust
Zucker - Rodrigues - Carter
Z. A. R. - Blueger - McGinn

Dumoulin - Letang
Pettersson - Petry
Kulak - Schenn

Jarry
Halak

Cmon

Did you try this in NHL 2022 on Xbox? Cmon brah

 

[OtherThingsILike]

Disagree. Guardiola, probably the best soccer/football coach in the world ATM says "my job is to get you to the attacking zone. Whatever you do there is up to you." I don't want my team over coached in the offensive zone.

Well good, since that's also what Sullivan's philosophy seems to be.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Matheson has been their 2nd best defenseman this year so I'd be mildly irked if they traded him right now, to put it lightly.

 

[Big Friggin Dummy]

It's tough to really gauge Petry on a miserable Habs team but he seems kinda shitty this season, and I don't know if we're in the best spot to gamble assets+cap/term on the guy rebounding at 34.

Dead horse and all, but I think we gotta gun for serious offensive punch if we're spending any significant assets on anything. Preferably a long-term solution, even if it costs us big in futures--though I know Hexturke have said they don't want to part with those.

 

[Andy99]

I just don't get the perspective, mate. Even if you don't think we can compete, how does it make any sense to walk away from one of your most productive assets? It's here and now with Sid and Geno. The further down the line you go, the less likely we are to compete.

In any case I don't think we are a strong contender right now either. I think we are too bland to get there, even if we could beat anyone if ours stars are at their best, including Jarry. But I do think we are chemistry and a successful move or two away (plus health, obviously) from being right there.



If you want to stick with Geno and Letang (so do I), then you are win now. Right now. Rust has yet to turn 30, if his legs go at.... say 33... it is just unlikely to matter anymore. Maybe he still has something and we deal him with retention when we are past the days of Sid and Geno.
We are at our last shots with this core. You can argue they're past it, but I don't think anyone can argue that there are more shots down the line if we rebuild around them.
By all means change around the supporting cast, but if you aren't making a great return - or at least some sort of return! - on the few guys playing like stars, then I don't see any sense in letting them walk.



There is no reason guys showing promise from the farm should not get chances. If they show themselves ready, then you try to trade away older guys to make room. I've been on the Zohorna and Angello train since last year for instance, both because I think they add as much as some of the bottom 6'ers we have (though differently), but more so because I see them giving us something extra on an otherwise smallish and non-physical team. Some "hard to play" factor. Which we lack... so much.

But there is great difference between a guy like Zucker who has performed way below expectation after being acquired at a significant expense, and then Bryan Rust.
Again, if we had traded Rust before the season, I would have understood from an asset management point of view. But he is one of the only wo genuine top six wingers we have, and the added cap hit on him will conceivably be like 2.5 million more which he has richly deserved.
You make/save 4,75 million on replacing Zucker with Zohorna. You make another 1.1 million replacing ZAR with... whoever down there deserves it.

Maybe if you are thinking asset management like me, you see if you can get a meaningful asset/pick for Dumo (who is declining visibly, IMO) and see if POJ can swim and then there's 3 million there. And you look in UFA also, of course. For the next Ceci, etc.

you seem to start with the premise that the FO wants to put the team in the best position to win….see, I don’t see that…they seem to want to win only to the extent it can be done with certain constraints that include keeping high draft picks, being conservative with the cap etc…so if they are not going all out to improve this team’s chances of winning a Cup, including improving backup goalie, defensive balance, and another top six shooter, then I see no reason to pay Rust…sure we’ll be worse off but does it really matter if we’re just a first round exit team….get worse then and at least get a chance at winning the draft lottery lol

 

[JRS91]

Why do people want to move Matheson?

He's one of the better acquisitions we've had in the past 4 years.

 

[eXile3]

Yeah not sure why we're trading players that are working and helping us win. Kap is one thing but MM is really helping drive offense and cut back on his mistakes.

 

[3ladesof5teel]

Why do people want to move Matheson?

He's one of the better acquisitions we've had in the past 4 years.

Yes, not getting that at all. Matheson's contract is ageing rather well and I am willing to bet by the end it will be a steal.

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

Trading for Petry makes absolutely no sense going forward, and that rumor that has POJ going to Montreal is even bigger trash

No thank you unless the Habs want a mid level prospect, a 3rd round pick and Pettersson for Petry and some retention

 

[Le Magnifique 66]

It's tough to really gauge Petry on a miserable Habs team but he seems kinda shitty this season, and I don't know if we're in the best spot to gamble assets+cap/term on the guy rebounding at 34.

Dead horse and all, but I think we gotta gun for serious offensive punch if we're spending any significant assets on anything. Preferably a long-term solution, even if it costs us big in futures--though I know Hexturke have said they don't want to part with those.

I wouldn't really touch Petry to be honest, also it seems that he is missing his family a lot which moved back to Detroit because of all the government restrictions in Montreal.

 

[Pens x]

Why do people want to move Matheson?

He's one of the better acquisitions we've had in the past 4 years.

Our list of acquisitions over the last 4 years hasn’t been impressive.

 

[chethejet]

Petry will be on the market if Letang signs with the Habs anyway. they have to move him to make room so Pens can be in the mix and not being hammered in the deal. I do think Letang will sign here anyway. Malkin I think will be a little more interesting as to AAV.

 

[K Fleur]

Do we know if we can just pull a Kucherov with Zucker? Core muscle surgery can supposedly take 3 months but not sure how shutting him down without explicitly shutting him down would be able to work. Not sure if they can pull that off or not. It gets fun if we can. If scouts and people that would know can tell if Petry's issues are actually just emotional fallout from off ice stuff I would love to do something like

PIT:
M. Matheson
S. Poulin
N. Legare
2nd rounder

FOR

MTL:
J. Petry (full price)
Brett Kulak (@50%)

and then maybe see if GMJRs adoration of Marino and Kap can screw Vancouver with something like

PIT:
J. Marino
K. Kapanen
J. Riikola
C. DeSmith
P.O. Joseph or different future like a pick instead

FOR

VAN:
C. Garland
J.T. Miller
L. Schenn
J. Halak (retention via another team whatevers necessary I guess)

MTL/Petry and VAN/GMJRconnection are two situations where I think we could have some leverage despite our poor sellable assets that could lead to a significant swing if capitalized on right. Its definitely a gamble due to Petrys age but I'm at the point where Im actually worried Marino is Maatta 2.0 as much as that kills me to entertain. We need to either see if getting him another Jack Johnson blankie like Giordano or Chiarot fixes him or we need to get someone we arent terrrified to put on the ice in the playoffs against tough competition.

EDIT:

Guentzel - Crosby - Garland
Miller - Malkin - Rust
Zucker - Rodrigues - Carter
Z. A. R. - Blueger - McGinn

Dumoulin - Letang
Pettersson - Petry
Kulak - Schenn

Jarry
Halak

Cmon

One player is Jason Zucker and the other is Nikita Kucherov. So you can imitate but you definitely can’t duplicate.

Also Even JR would laugh you out of the building if you came calling with that ridiculous trade.

 

[HandshakeLine]

f*** off

Lol okay tiger.

Two more things. P60 is not projected stats. It's stats relative to usage.

And was Kap's usage not wildly different last year? Did we not have an extraordinarily strange season which is probably unduplicatable outside of a lockout year? Did injuries not gift Kap ice time and opportunities (like McCann) that he is not getting this year? How on earth are Kap's previous seasons in Toronto and his current season comparable to last year, outside of the fact that they were in the NHL?

The East was terrible last year, especially the teams who were bottom feeders like NJD, NYR, BUF, and PHI. Like I don't know how you can honestly compare the 4 conferences?

I'm fine with saying Kap thrives on different usages than he's getting this season, but that's not what you're saying, no?

 

[AuroraBorealis]

Lol okay tiger.



And was Kap's usage not wildly different last year? Did we not have an extraordinarily strange season which is probably unduplicatable outside of a lockout year? Did injuries not gift Kap ice time and opportunities (like McCann) that he is not getting this year? How on earth are Kap's previous seasons in Toronto and his current season comparable to last year, outside of the fact that they were in the NHL?

The East was terrible last year, especially the teams who were bottom feeders like NJD, NYR, BUF, and PHI. Like I don't know how you can honestly compare the 4 conferences?

I'm fine with saying Kap thrives on different usages than he's getting this season, but that's not what you're saying, no?

If you're gonna respond to multi paragraph posts with a 1 word post of "lol", like you're 13, don't ask me to continue conversations. I've already lost interest.

 

[HandshakeLine]

If you're gonna respond to multi paragraph posts with a 1 word post of "lol", like you're 13, don't ask me to continue conversations. I've already lost interest.

Absolute lol.

I'm sorry, your highness, I'll observe court protocol from now on when you take offense at something innocuous.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Should I give myself a flogging now, or would that be too presumptuous of me to cut my own switch? Would you do it for me?