Post-Game Talk: Penguins 4, Islanders 1 - What The **** Was That?

[Gurglesons]

I think that centers around the 4th line being so much of an abomination that the bottom 6 lives and dies with BART's production.

I think production from a 4th line is unrealistic. But the 4th line is actively hurting us every game. Taking penalties giving up goals against, etc. I know people hate McCann but he will do a lot to stabilize that. Teams don’t score on him.

 

[SEALBound]

I think Brassard would have gotten more minutes had he been effective. Instead, he shat the bed for a year and a half.

Catch 22, I think Brassard needed MORE minutes to be effective to play good but because he played bad, he didn't get more minutes.

It's like highering a Director or Manager for a field level grunt work job. Some may do well, others not if their success is based on how they operate as a Director or Manager, ya know? Brassard wasn't a 3C...

 

[KIRK]

I think production from a 4th line is unrealistic. But the 4th line is actively hurting us every game. Taking penalties giving up goals against, etc. I know people hate McCann but he will do a lot to stabilize that. Teams don’t score on him.

I don't know that it's necessarily unrealistic, especially given the impact on the mix of forwards IF you moved one of Dumo/Pets for a forward who can play anywhere in the lineup.

EDIT: A fully healthy Blues team, for instance, could ice 3 lines that can score and a BART style line centered by Sundqvist (2016 Pens being another example).

 

[ZorkEnchanter]

I don't know that it's necessarily unrealistic, especially given the impact on the mix of forwards IF you moved one of Dumo/Pets for a forward who can play anywhere in the lineup.

I think with injuries and fill-ins it's been unrealistic up to this point. I.e. we have Petts back, Dumo is finally coming back.

Erod hurt.
McCann hurt.
Salary Cap/Covid... I posted earlier on this they are pretty much the leftover Line 5 (maybe Line 5.5 haha)
I suspect they are waiting to see the injured back in the lineup before a trade happens.

I'll also give Sullivan some credit, he knows they are bad and the hyperbole (not you... you are pretty level headed compared to the half the board ) that they are the worst ever is reaching MM levels.

They played about 1 SHIFT per period. The definitely flubbed some zone entries, lost puck battles but... they are literally whatever we have left line.

 

[Khelandros]

I think with injuries and fill-ins it's been unrealistic up to this point. I.e. we have Petts back, Dumo is coming back, etc.

Erod hurt.
McCann hurt.
Salary Cap/Covid... I posted earlier on this they are pretty much the leftover Line 5 (maybe Line 5.5 haha)
I suspect they are waiting to see the injured back in the lineup before a trade happens.

I'll also give Sullivan some credit, he knows they are bad and the hyperbole (not you... you are pretty level headed compared to the half the board ) that they are the worst ever is reaching MM levels.

They played about 1 SHIFT per period. The definitely flubbed some zone entries, lost puck battles but... they are literally whatever we have left line.
View attachment 398025

I'm pretty sure the offensive zone tripping call that Lafferty took had a little something to do with the decreased ice time.

 

[The Old Master]

I get where you're coming from, but I think we'll just have to agree to disagree in terms of how we see the risks versus rewards. Won't be the first time.

As to POJ, I agree that might be most likely, and it will be an awful ******* mistake.

i could work out if it's short term.... but if poj is still not playing after the trade deadline then it will be a.........

 

[HandshakeLine]

Yeah, POJ's ceiling is just so much higher than Petts (or Dumo's current ceiling). I get the fears of regression, but POJ just has more tools in his box.

 

[Gurglesons]

So in the 1992 Pens vs 1997 Wings thread in the history of hockey thread someone just said if Lemieux was such a powerhouse in 91 and 92 what happened to him in 93?

Lol. JFC.

 

[Gurglesons]

I don't know that it's necessarily unrealistic, especially given the impact on the mix of forwards IF you moved one of Dumo/Pets for a forward who can play anywhere in the lineup.

EDIT: A fully healthy Blues team, for instance, could ice 3 lines that can score and a BART style line centered by Sundqvist (2016 Pens being another example).

I don’t see a difference between Sundqvist and McCann.

 

[HandshakeLine]

So in the 1992 Pens vs 1997 Wings thread in the history of hockey thread someone just said if Lemieux was such a powerhouse in 91 and 92 what happened to him in 93?

Lol. JFC.

The History of Hockey used to be a great forum. Now it's basically mainboard-for-the older generation.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

So in the 1992 Pens vs 1997 Wings thread in the history of hockey thread someone just said if Lemieux was such a powerhouse in 91 and 92 what happened to him in 93?

Lol. JFC.

Just 160 points in 60 games with a bad back and coming off Chemo treatments. What's so special about that?

You have to remember more than half the people that post on these boards are clueless.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

So in the 1992 Pens vs 1997 Wings thread in the history of hockey thread someone just said if Lemieux was such a powerhouse in 91 and 92 what happened to him in 93?

Lol. JFC.

Meh, he was only on pace to break Gretzky’s all time points record in a season until that little cancer thing got in the way.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

I don’t see a difference between Sundqvist and McCann.

I would take Blueger over Sundqvist any day of the week and so would the Pens. When the Pens traded Sundqvist he was already beat out by a journeyman Rowney for 4th line Center and already passed up in the system by Blueger. Sundqvist would be terrible in our system. Sundqvist is so slow with his first few steps at Maatta level. Honestly never liked him as a prospect. I am glad he is working out in the Blues style of play and it was a good fit for him.

Our 3rd line has put up great production this year and I am sure the analytics have to be near the top in the NHL for 3rd line production. The McCann-Blueger-Tanev line was doing good but the ZAR-Blueger-Tanev line has been even better which surprised me. I knew they are a good shut down line but ZAR has really improved his skating and the line looks great.

 

[CascadiaPenguin]

I'm pretty sure the offensive zone tripping call that Lafferty took had a little something to do with the decreased ice time.

Not to mention the way Laff pouted after that call. Dude has the most negative body language. I already have forgotten why I was optimistic about him at the beginning of the season.

 

[KIRK]

I think with injuries and fill-ins it's been unrealistic up to this point. I.e. we have Petts back, Dumo is finally coming back.

Erod hurt.
McCann hurt.
Salary Cap/Covid... I posted earlier on this they are pretty much the leftover Line 5 (maybe Line 5.5 haha)
I suspect they are waiting to see the injured back in the lineup before a trade happens.

I'll also give Sullivan some credit, he knows they are bad and the hyperbole (not you... you are pretty level headed compared to the half the board ) that they are the worst ever is reaching MM levels.

They played about 1 SHIFT per period. The definitely flubbed some zone entries, lost puck battles but... they are literally whatever we have left line.
View attachment 398025

I was suggesting that if you added a guy and as you got hurt guys back, it wouldn't be unreasonable to expect some production from the non BART line.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

+++++ BART - what's happening right now.
+ Kapanen - guy is out there working hard for his spot
+ Jarry - Not a super hard night but not an easy night team played well in front

+ for A effort for the team
Can we do it again?

 

[Gurglesons]

Meh, he was only on pace to break Gretzky’s all time points record in a season until that little cancer thing got in the way.

The situation is a hypothetical 92 Pens vs 97 Wings so his retort was what happened to PIT in 93.

Which of course is what we all know here. We have a “healthy” Lemieux and Stevens prior to his face getting broken.

 

[KIRK]

I don’t see a difference between Sundqvist and McCann.

One of them has shown a pulse in the playoffs before. Otherwise, I get your meaning.

 

[Gurglesons]

One of them has shown a pulse in the playoffs before. Otherwise, I get your meaning.

I’m not sure McCann has gotten a chance in the playoffs tbh. Anyone thinking McCann was the little engine that could for Marleau and Hornqvist last year after G1 would be a Mike Sullivan.

 

[ZorkEnchanter]

I was suggesting that if you added a guy and as you got hurt guys back, it wouldn't be unreasonable to expect some production from the non BART line.

Didn't read all the previous threads and it all adds up now. Do you think a:

Doc/Scevior - McCann - Erod would be pretty decent?

That is where I was going... it may not be enough but you've got to see them play a bit.

Either way, I think we pretty much have to trade one of Dumo/Petts, etc. we just have too many bodies and not enough seats. No way we should sit POJ. (If you want to lighten his load then put him on the 3rd line.)

 

[KIRK]

Didn't read all the previous threads and it all adds up now. Do you think a:

Doc/Scevior - McCann - Erod would be pretty decent?

That is where I was going... it may not be enough but you've got to see them play a bit.

Either way, I think we pretty much have to trade one of Dumo/Petts, etc. we just have too many bodies and not enough seats. No way we should sit POJ. (If you want to lighten his load then put him on the 3rd line.)

That 4th line is for shit.

Concur on moving on of Dumo/Pets. Whoever gets the best deal goes, the other plays with Ceci.

The best deal may be futures.

I was noting earlier that the best deal may be from the Whitney for Kunitz + Tangradi school.

Whatever the approach, IF the Pens go for a forward, it needs to be a swiss army knife do everything type (Kunitz) or a warrior who can slot up and down the lineup. Maybe he's a C/W, so you're not forced to play McCann at center. BUT, either way, he needs to be good enough to supplant Zucker or Kapanen in the top 6, because it's not enough to say 'I can't make a change of a Zucker or a Kapanen because there's nobody who legitimately could slot up' if you expect to be more than a one and done type team.

 

[KIRK]

i could work out if it's short term.... but if poj is still not playing after the trade deadline then it will be a.........

Nah. POJ is in. If he fades a little, you slot him back with Ceci. Those two guys were fine together. But, to the bench. There's no justification for it, not when you have holes at forward and lack for futures.

Of course, that's likely what they'll do, make POJ odd man out.

 

[HandshakeLine]

Nah. POJ is in. If he fades a little, you slot him back with Ceci. Those two guys were fine together. But, to the bench. There's no justification for it, not when you have holes at forward and lack for futures.

Of course, that's likely what they'll do, make POJ odd man out.

Ideally, that's why you move one of Petts or Dumo-- you just don't need both of them, especially with 4 healthy LD (5 if you count Riikola as the depth guy) and a rookie playing well enough for a permanent slot on the team.

If Dumolin gets pushed down to the 3rd, (and likewise for Petts) you should move 'em. Mattheson has looked pretty good on the 2nd with Marino, so I wouldn't break up a pairing with chemistry until they hit a slump.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

The situation is a hypothetical 92 Pens vs 97 Wings so his retort was what happened to PIT in 93.

Which of course is what we all know here. We have a “healthy” Lemieux and Stevens prior to his face getting broken.

92 Pens would kick the shit out of them. 11 games in a row and swept the last two rounds. What makes it more impressive is that the team we swept in the Finals had an 11 game playoff win streak coming into the series. That is the record. Sorry we would destroy them. Not only did that team have two generational players but guys like Francis, Mullen, Murphy, Tocchet, Stevens, and others. I would put that team up against any past team including the Oilers teams of the 80's. 93 team was probably our best team but team was stupid and went after the regular season win streak record which they still own and ran out of gas in the playoffs. Playing Barrasso all 18 of those games in a row pretty much is why that team lost and of course the refs letting Kasper mug Mario that whole series.

 

[Gurglesons]

92 Pens would kick the shit out of them. 11 games in a row and swept the last two rounds. What makes it more impressive is that the team we swept in the Finals had an 11 game playoff win streak coming into the series. That is the record. Sorry we would destroy them. Not only did that team have two generational players but guys like Francis, Mullen, Murphy, Tocchet, Stevens, and others. I would put that team up against any past team including the Oilers teams of the 80's. 93 team was probably out best team but team was stupid and went after the regular season win streak record which they still own and ran out of gas in the playoffs. Playing Barrasso all 18 of those games in a row pretty much is why that team lost and of course the refs letting Kasper mug Mario that whole series.

Yeah p much. Some in there tried to argue Wings have better forward depth which is p hilarious. The Detroit D versus PIT’s is an argument but Lemieux consistently made Vernon his bitch.