The last time the won the cup they sucked so much they fired the coach mid season. The regular season has been a constant cake walk and its worked out so well the last few years...
Post-Game Talk: Penguins 0 - Predators 300: Better Than No Sex Cake Edition
- Thread starter SEALBound
- Start date
The last time the won the cup they sucked so much they fired the coach mid season. The regular season has been a constant cake walk and its worked out so well the last few years...
The fact that we struggle, in and of itself doesn't concern me. The specific reasons for why we're struggling, very much do.
Mr Jiggyfly
Registered User
- Jan 29, 2004
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Most fans are bandwagon, go with the direction of the wind kind of fans. In all sports. Just in Pgh, they quickly turn on Roth and Crosby when times get tough. It doesn't matter that these guys brought championships to this city and want to win... it doesn't matter that the other guy is good to, it just matters about "what have you done lately".
I only hang on two boards, really. This one and a Steelers board, but I don't post much there because the level of stupidity is off the charts (and it is sadly the best Steelers board I have found over the years). On that board, it's insane how many people wanted to trade Roth before the season. Then they loved him again. Now they should trade him again. Some guy had a huge diatribe about how Roth doesn't care about winning anymore and it's time to move on from him.
I'd link the post, if I didn't like you. People actually believe this stuff to. That's what scares me.
Ogrezilla
Nerf Herder
Teams play their best against all of the good teams, and most of the bad teams. Sure, a team is a bit more likely to take their foot off the gas against Carolina or maybe overlook the Oilers. But the Islanders, Caps, Rangers and even Flyers and Devils? No, I don't see it. Teams play hard pretty much every night. We are not some special snowflake that gets everyone extra motivated. It is ridiculous to try to link our injuries and struggles to such a baseless claim.
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This was a bad game. About as bad as it gets for a team who is not in stated re-build or "in the process" of something.
Most concerning from me is the intersections of effort, coaching, and leadership. I think its naive as a fan to think we know exactly what is wrong, and prescribe. However, i think educated observers at some point have seen enough evidence that things are amiss.
From my outsider's, uninformed opinion of the current state, i put much of the blame on MJ and Crosby. Obviously the roster is a major issue, but that doesn't mean current group of players is accountable for playing to their AVG. potential.
I blame MJ for many of the line combos, line changes, and at time a seeming lack of appropriate gameplan. That is not a critique of his hockey mind. Only that other teams seem to be more prepared to play us, and take away what we do well. We never seem to be making those game to game adjustments, and/or having them work.
My blame for Sid is purely on his work as captain (in the most classic sense of the word). To his credit Sid still skates hard, has appears to have consistent focus. I just don't see him playing with the same commitment to winning that he used to. When we played the Caps, and we were getting shut out while Ovie had two goals i was looking for the Crosby I had come to expect. The one who never laid down in those type of games "way back when".
I don't expect him to fight, or suddenly become something he's not. But he used to elevate his game when we were losing, getting embarrassed (like yesterday), getting one upped (like the caps game). Now i see a perimeter player. Not a lead by example guy putting it all on the line to win.
If the team needs more emotion, a good captain can find the right guys to provide it. If the locker room has issues, leaders are quick to close the door and figure it out. Maybe all this is happening, maybe its not. But judging by the Captain we see on the ice, i imagine its more of the same in the room.
I hope for nothing else but the pens, MJ, and Crosby figuring this out.
Most concerning from me is the intersections of effort, coaching, and leadership. I think its naive as a fan to think we know exactly what is wrong, and prescribe. However, i think educated observers at some point have seen enough evidence that things are amiss.
From my outsider's, uninformed opinion of the current state, i put much of the blame on MJ and Crosby. Obviously the roster is a major issue, but that doesn't mean current group of players is accountable for playing to their AVG. potential.
I blame MJ for many of the line combos, line changes, and at time a seeming lack of appropriate gameplan. That is not a critique of his hockey mind. Only that other teams seem to be more prepared to play us, and take away what we do well. We never seem to be making those game to game adjustments, and/or having them work.
My blame for Sid is purely on his work as captain (in the most classic sense of the word). To his credit Sid still skates hard, has appears to have consistent focus. I just don't see him playing with the same commitment to winning that he used to. When we played the Caps, and we were getting shut out while Ovie had two goals i was looking for the Crosby I had come to expect. The one who never laid down in those type of games "way back when".
I don't expect him to fight, or suddenly become something he's not. But he used to elevate his game when we were losing, getting embarrassed (like yesterday), getting one upped (like the caps game). Now i see a perimeter player. Not a lead by example guy putting it all on the line to win.
If the team needs more emotion, a good captain can find the right guys to provide it. If the locker room has issues, leaders are quick to close the door and figure it out. Maybe all this is happening, maybe its not. But judging by the Captain we see on the ice, i imagine its more of the same in the room.
I hope for nothing else but the pens, MJ, and Crosby figuring this out.
Ogrezilla
Nerf Herder
This is it right here. Along with everything Jaded said. We don't just come on this site to ***** because we lose. We don't expect a cakewalk. We *****ed just as much last year with Disco when we were winning games. And that's because we are *****ing about the way we are playing, not the outcome of the games.
mikethelegacy
formerly mikelegacy
Yepp yepp. Teams losing or playing bad should at last show flashes of ability to make breakouts, win battles, and just at least play a somewhat respectable game. This team is doing none of that and losing game in ways that gives me nightmares. Literally when the puck goes in the corner and it's not Sid, Geno or Perron fighting for it, I pretty much succumb to the fact that the Pens aren't going to have the i puck on the other end.
Ugene Magic
EVIL LAUGH
That's where I'll totally disagree.
You don't find other teams stars going down so much, so often as ours.
There's plenty of pudding in the truth. Reverse that.
Teams being up to play the Pens is far more reality when they're good/bad or whatever they are at any given time.
Teams get up for the challenge or kick them when their down, there are no breaks.
Just like when all those years the Islanders were very bad, but they played the Pens tough every single time.
Look at how a team will be in a losing streak no matter the teams they lose to, and they explode against the Pens even though they just played a good amount of good teams, even rivals.
There are good teams out there, and there is a team with the perceived top two talents who are seen as tops by the league.
If you don't think they get extra attention I don't know what to tell you.
I'll say not one star in the league gets more attention on ice than Crosby or Malkin. That alone tips the scales. Now add in the rest.
Ogrezilla
Nerf Herder
Find me a team who doesn't have fans saying teams always seem to play their best against them. Just like the refs are always hurting them. Or rookies always do well against them. Every team in the league loses to first NHL game goalies if you ask their fans.
I just think you're completely out to lunch on this one. Sure, Sid and Geno get extra physical attention. But go watch Stamkos or Toews or Tavares and tell me they aren't taking all kinds of extra physical attention too. If you say they don't, you are simply wrong.
Sidney the Kidney
One last time
- Jun 29, 2009
- 55,762
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A part of me (the vindictive part) would like to see Crosby traded just so those idiot mouth breathers can witness just how bad this organization would be without Sid carrying the load offensively year after year.
Haha.....come on Jiggy....don't try and fool us with tales of your martial relations. We don't believe your married. And what gave it away, your ridiculous story, is that women don't understand anything about hockey. Let alone trying to critique a player. Come on man, sharpen up on your story embellishment.
mike legacy is right, obvious troll is obvious.
I agree with all of this and think the team needs a coaching change. I know it's the popular thing to do right now, to bag on Sill and Adams, but the 4th line is about the only line that plays with 110% effort on every shift. The aren't the most talented guys (obviously), but it's the only line I've seen in the last 2 weeks that puts on a solid physical 2-man forecheck. They don't go in just swinging their sticks at the puck like 3/4's of the top 6 guys. They crash the boards and put their body on someone else's and battle. Hell, I've seen them log more offensive zone time than our top line on some nights. Like I said, I've read more posts ripping Sill and Adams, but I don't think anyone can honestly say if you took them off the team that all our problems would cease to exist. They are the least of this teams problems actually.
billybudd
Registered User
- Feb 1, 2012
- 22,049
- 2,249
Rupp was on Madden the other day and rejected the idea that "talent" was a problem outright. Preferred to use euphamisms instead of calling the team out, but I got the distinct impression he thought the team was light on size and balls. Also specifically pointed to the loss of (and failure to replace) Duper's footspeed as a problem because he forces turnovers that are no longer getting forced.
This is, essentially, what I see. In the last clutch and grab era (which Rupp would be familiar with, having won a championship on the clutchingest, grabbingest club there ever was), the way to create against disciplined teams trying to turn the ice into a swamp usually boiled down to either team mobility or team size. Interfering with Adam Lowry or Chris Gratton is tough because they're so friggin big. Interfering with Grabner or Bondra is tough because they've often got a step on you and are often on top of you before you're ready to make a pass.
Finally, Dumo wasn't even up here for our slide, so he's an odd guy to single out.
Darth Vitale
Dark Matter
Mr Jiggyfly
Registered User
- Jan 29, 2004
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I know how that story ends, but you know, common sense.
Haha.....come on Jiggy....don't try and fool us with tales of your martial relations. We don't believe your married. And what gave it away, your ridiculous story, is that women don't understand anything about hockey. Let alone trying to critique a player. Come on man, sharpen up on your story embellishment.
mike legacy is right, obvious troll is obvious.
I thought my made up story about having a wife would give me 1000 magna message board cred. I guess I took it too far when I said she understands hockey.
What a whopper.
Shady Machine
Registered User
- Aug 6, 2010
- 36,704
- 8,141
gordie
5x
Ugene Magic
EVIL LAUGH
The guys you listed don't get half the treatment Sid and Geno get, and that goes as far as the team as well.
There's a reason for this, it's generational, it's one team, and x2. It's been that way for a decade.
Sorry you missed it.
Not one team has that besides, "one."
Wrong is thinking another team, or even another player compares to the abuse that this team/player(s) take(s) season in and out. Did I say decade?
Do we need to compare man games lost? I'm not even talking self inflicted misery here. In game abuse that is either on purpose or not.
Trying to brush this stuff off, or it doesn't exist, heck.... even that it doesn't matter, is wrong
Just check out who all are mentioned in this link and how much they didn't have to deal with it in-tune to 5 Stanley cups.
http://mangameslost.com/nhl-team-worse-since-2009-2010-season/
If you don't have health forget about showing up in the playoffs.
cassius
Registered User
- Jul 23, 2004
- 13,560
- 706
gordie
5x
Harrington hasn't played enough consecutive games to really get a full picture of him yet but those other two are projects and sometimes projects take a couple of years. Scuderi was put on waivers in 2007 by the Pens and came back and contributed to two Stanley Cup winners in Pittsburgh and LA.
Your Boy Troy
Registered User
The fourth-line has been decent for the last games. Do I personally want it to remain to have both Sill and Adams? No. However, they're not reason why the Pens have been in a drought. If a fourth-line is capable of not getting stuck in the defensive zone the whole game; then they have done their job. At least that's what my expectations are with how the fourth-line currently looks. Only a few fourth-lines in the league are capable of chipping in offensively on occasion.
This fourth-line wouldn't improve that much with Spaling, Lapierre, and Arcobello/Adams on it. It would have difficulties keeping possession of the puck in the offensive zone. Not a line that should be expected to forecheck effectively.
The Islanders and Captials are examples of what a real fourth-line should look like.
If no trades to be are made this is what I would have the fourth-line look like:
Leblond - Lapierre - Comeau
My dream fourth-line:
Hendricks or Neil - Lapierre - Peluso
This fourth-line wouldn't improve that much with Spaling, Lapierre, and Arcobello/Adams on it. It would have difficulties keeping possession of the puck in the offensive zone. Not a line that should be expected to forecheck effectively.
The Islanders and Captials are examples of what a real fourth-line should look like.
If no trades to be are made this is what I would have the fourth-line look like:
Leblond - Lapierre - Comeau
My dream fourth-line:
Hendricks or Neil - Lapierre - Peluso
Ogrezilla
Nerf Herder
Stop saying this like it means anything to your point. You are talking as if the link between man games lost and teams playing us more physically is a given truth. Its not, you are speculating and drawing conclusions purely to serve your own purposes.
