Confirmed with Link: Pavel Datsyuk to Mitch Album: I'm going home next season

[Frk It]

Wish he just negotiated a shorter deal and retired, minus this baggage. This is annoying, and he should not be going out like this.

Just play another ****ing year dude.

 

[Sentinel]

Pavel clearly feels he is not good enough to be a star player in this league anymore. He wants to be remembered for what he once was, not what he has become. He feels he only has a year of hockey left in him and he wants to spend it in Russia. After so many surgeries, I can't believe he is still playing.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Pavel clearly feels he is not good enough to be a star player in this league anymore. He wants to be remembered for what he once was, not what he has become. He feels he only has a year of hockey left in him and he wants to spend it in Russia. After so many surgeries, I can't believe he is still playing.

Yes but it's the playing in Russia that makes this a bit hard to take.

I totally understand not feeling up to the level of another NHL season. But then he should LTIRetire. He can go back to Russia and be with his family, would still get paid, and the Wings wouldn't get hammered with the cap hit.

As big of a fan as I am of Datsyuk, the reality is he's walking away from the final year of his contract to (potentially) play in another league. Yes there are a lot of mitigating personal reasons, but that fact is still there.

 

[Frk It]

Yes but it's the playing in Russia that makes this a bit hard to take.

I totally understand not feeling up to the level of another NHL season. But then he should LTIRetire. He can go back to Russia and be with his family, would still get paid, and the Wings wouldn't get hammered with the cap hit.

Plus he could let his body rest for a year (he could probably use that), then just play in the KHL the following season.

 

[jaster]

He won't sit out a full season. I guarantee you that.

Would there be a big push back from Wings' fans? After the way he's ****ing the team two ways from Sunday cap-wise? I dunno. I'm not overly sympathetic to his cause myself, but there's probably lots of other people around here that feel differently than me.

I can see him sitting for a year, depending on just how serious he is about his daughter/family. But if there is indeed a loophole for retired players, then I guess it's a moot point.

I'm with you, I'm not very sympathetic to him either. I'm just gauging the reaction I've seen so far from Wings fans (on this board, in other media, on FB), and I'm sure you're right, lots of people feel differently than you and I. Most seem to find no fault, or nearly no fault, it what he's doing.

 

[Laser Rayzor]

Is there a way where both parties agree to nullify the contract? I could be remembering wrong but I seem to remember something like that happening before.

Re: LTIRetring
If Holland and the Illitch's can convince Pav to play a year he didn't really want to (this year) I think they can convince him to sit out a year to help out the team cap wise.

 

[splot]

Guys, Datsyuk's situation is regulated by NHL by-laws regarding Volutary Retirement. Detroit can't prevent him from signing in KHL because voluntary retirement was designed specifically for such situations. Pasha will file his papers, terminate his contract and be free to do whatever he pleases outside of NHL. This is not slavery and Datsyuk doesn't break his contract, he is using a legal option given to him by NHL.

That's why it is important to trade him before he retires. I guess when Holland says that he won't trade his rights he doesn't mean it, he just hopes to talk him into playing one more year.

Can someone send a link to the relevant rules regarding how it'd work? As I remember it, both parties had to be in agreement for a player to retire the way Kovalchuk did, but that's just from the top of my mind.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Is there a way where both parties agree to nullify the contract? I could be remembering wrong but I seem to remember something like that happening before.

Re: LTIRetring
If Holland and the Illitch's can convince Pav to play a year he didn't really want to (this year) I think they can convince him to sit out a year to help out the team cap wise.

That's basically what the Devils did with the Kovalchuk contract. Both parties agree to void it. That doesn't negate the cap hit though. The Devils are still paying for the recapture penalty and will be for the next four seasons. Likewise Datsyuk's cap hit would still count against the Wings payroll.

If Holland doesn't try to trade Datsyuk's cap hit, potentially freeing up $5+ million in salary, he should be fired. The Wings wouldn't be trading the actual player, just his hit. And Dats will likely be wearing a different jersey next season anyway.

 

[Retire91]

Datsyuk leaving is worse then Federov leaving. Datsyuk has one more year on his contract and will screw the wings over next year. Federov had no reason to resign with the Wings as he was a free agent and could be replaced.

I am going to go out on a limb and say you are using that phrase loosely

I don't see it as the same or worse than Fedorov's leaving. Although time has shown it was the organizations fault at the time it was a huge controversy and most fans immediately turn on Fedorov. Daytsuk has publicly hinted at leaving for years and is now working it out with Detroit and the fans, and is walking away from a dumpster fire instead of a cup contender. Its apples to oranges and Fedorov's leaving was a much bigger controversy and a bigger deal IMO.

I don't see Daytsuk leaving in any way "Screwing the wings" especially considering that management knew this was a strong possibility.

I think the only real bummer was not knowing about this when the season started. It would have been nice for the fans to know if they went to a game it would have been the last time they were seeing him on the ice.

 

[Mount Suribachi]

Plus he could let his body rest for a year (he could probably use that), then just play in the KHL the following season.

He's what, 38 now? Takes a year out and then tries to come back at 40 with one knee, and no ankles? Just not realistic for him to try and regain his fitness at that age, even for a lower intensity league like the KHL.

 

[Ingvar]

Can someone send a link to the relevant rules regarding how it'd work? As I remember it, both parties had to be in agreement for a player to retire the way Kovalchuk did, but that's just from the top of my mind.

It took me some time but here: By-laws
Section 8 covers how player can be transferred from Reserve List to Voluntary Retirement List. In short, it can be done without approval of the club. It is not clear what happens to the player contract after he is placed on Voluntary Retirement List but my guess that it is terminated.

 

[chances14]

I can see him sitting for a year, depending on just how serious he is about his daughter/family. But if there is indeed a loophole for retired players, then I guess it's a moot point.

I'm with you, I'm not very sympathetic to him either. I'm just gauging the reaction I've seen so far from Wings fans (on this board, in other media, on FB), and I'm sure you're right, lots of people feel differently than you and I. Most seem to find no fault, or nearly no fault, it what he's doing.

if people weren't so anti holland right now, I'm sure there would be less sympathy towards datstyuk in this situation

bottom line is we have a player that signed a contract that he now wishes he hadn't and is trying to renege on it

 

[Frk It]

He's what, 38 now? Takes a year out and then tries to come back at 40 with one knee, and no ankles? Just not realistic for him to try and regain his fitness at that age, even for a lower intensity league like the KHL.

Taking a year off = one knee and no ankles?

Wouldn't a year off make those things better? I mean, that was my point.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

It took me some time but here: By-laws
Section 8 covers how player can be transferred from Reserve List to Voluntary Retirement List. In short, it can be done without approval of the club. It is not clear what happens to the player contract after he is placed on Voluntary Retirement List but my guess that it is terminated.

The IIHF would hammer this understanding of the agreement when it was contested. For instance the team that drafted Robstov should tell him to voluntarily retire from the KHL when his fee is up for debate, Svechnikov's little brother why wait for your contract to be in-line just retire and ditch the KHL... Radulov or Kovalchuk himself could have been targeted to just retire in the KHL for years. Yes they often terminate contracts overseas making this different. However, this isn't a retirement and nobody could be convinced of that unless he doesn't play hockey next year. Now the Wings could make the same deal the Devils did and terminate his contract to let him go. Not sure why they would. They can in fact contest that he in violation of their agreement because he hasn't retired from playing professional ice hockey.

Furthermore do you think Datsyuk doesn't have a non-compete clause somewhere in his contract? These guys are often prohibited from things like snow skiing, motorcycle riding and so forth. I severely doubt that even in the event of a faux retirement they couldn't find his playing in the KHL as a violation of his binding contractual agreement. Now it would involve some serious litigation and it would be heartbreaking to watch, but the idea they have to sit back on their hands and take it if they don't want to is something I seriously doubt.

 

[HockeyinHD]

Taking a year off = one knee and no ankles?

Wouldn't a year off make those things better? I mean, that was my point.

Wait till you get to be that age. You will be stunned how little extended rest impacts ability to recover, especially from chronic injuries.

It's horrifyingly annoying.

 

[Mount Suribachi]

Taking a year off = one knee and no ankles?

Wouldn't a year off make those things better? I mean, that was my point.

He has 1 knee and no ankles now. At 38/39/40, regaining your conditioning is incredibly difficult to do. Remember how after the 2004 lockout how Brett Hull and others just couldn't get back into game shape?

Plus there's the motivation factor. A lot of athletes talk about when they retire, its not because they can't put themselves through another season, it's that they can't put themselves through another pre-season trying to get fit again.

 

[splot]

It took me some time but here: By-laws
Section 8 covers how player can be transferred from Reserve List to Voluntary Retirement List. In short, it can be done without approval of the club. It is not clear what happens to the player contract after he is placed on Voluntary Retirement List but my guess that it is terminated.

Thanks a lot for digging that up, I sure couldn't find it and it wasn't from a lack of trying. I'm in no way a lawyer, but section 8.5. (a) and (b) sure makes it look like he wouldn't be allowed to play professional hockey anywhere unless Detroit says he can.

 

[Ingvar]

The IIHF would hammer this understanding of the agreement when it was contested. For instance the team that drafted Robstov should tell him to voluntarily retire from the KHL when his fee is up for debate, Svechnikov's little brother why wait for your contract to be in-line just retire and ditch the KHL... Radulov or Kovalchuk himself could have been targeted to just retire in the KHL for years. Yes they often terminate contracts overseas making this different. However, this isn't a retirement and nobody could be convinced of that unless he doesn't play hockey next year. Now the Wings could make the same deal the Devils did and terminate his contract to let him go. Not sure why they would. They can in fact contest that he in violation of their agreement because he hasn't retired from playing professional ice hockey.

Furthermore do you think Datsyuk doesn't have a non-compete clause somewhere in his contract? These guys are often prohibited from things like snow skiing, motorcycle riding and so forth. I severely doubt that even in the event of a faux retirement they couldn't find his playing in the KHL as a violation of his binding contractual agreement. Now it would involve some serious litigation and it would be heartbreaking to watch, but the idea they have to sit back on their hands and take it if they don't want to is something I seriously doubt.

There are multiple ways to end your contract in other leagues. In KHL, for example, a player can buyout his last year of a contract without consent of his club. And players use it to leave their club to play NHL. Why would IIHF have problems with it if it is just another legal way to terminate a contract?

Thanks a lot for digging that up, I sure couldn't find it and it wasn't from a lack of trying. I'm in no way a lawyer, but section 8.5. (a) and (b) sure makes it look like he wouldn't be allowed to play professional hockey anywhere unless Detroit says he can.

There are 2 possible problems: 1) Does NHL recognise international leagues as "organized hockey"? Judging by some situations with CHL-NHL agreement I'm not so sure about it. 2) What does Memorandum of Understanding between KHL and NHL actually say? If Datsyuk is not bound by a contact, does KHL have to respect by-laws
of NHL? I doubt it.

 

[splot]

There are 2 possible problems: 1) Does NHL recognise international leagues as "organized hockey"? Judging by some situations with CHL-NHL agreement I'm not so sure about it. 2) What does Memorandum of Understanding between KHL and NHL actually say? If Datsyuk is not bound by a contact, does KHL have to respect by-laws
of NHL? I doubt it.

Playing lawyer isn't really something I'm interested in, the contract he signed seems to prohibit him from playing in the KHL. Best case scenario would be that he plays in the KHL anyway without Detroits permission and they declare him in breach of contract. Voila, no more cap problem and Pavel gets to do what he wants.

Either way, I won't fret about this too much. If Pavel decides that he doesn't want to play in the NHL next season the odds are pretty good that they make the cap hit go away somehow, be it breach of contract, LTIR or traded to some other team.

 

[TheRatPoisoner]

It took me some time but here: By-laws
Section 8 covers how player can be transferred from Reserve List to Voluntary Retirement List. In short, it can be done without approval of the club. It is not clear what happens to the player contract after he is placed on Voluntary Retirement List but my guess that it is terminated.

Is there any precedent for that besides Kovalchuk? Serious question, because I'm not sure.

If that's the only example of a player using voluntary retirement to get out of a contract to go play in another league, then it's not the best argument because 1) The Devils agreed to let him and 2) that was a highly controversial move and widely considered to be a massive **** show.

There are multiple ways to end your contract in other leagues. In KHL, for example, a player can buyout his last year of a contract without consent of his club. And players use it to leave their club to play NHL. Why would IIHF have problems with it if it is just another legal way to terminate a contract?

There are 2 possible problems: 1) Does NHL recognise international leagues as "organized hockey"? Judging by some situations with CHL-NHL agreement I'm not so sure about it. 2) What does Memorandum of Understanding between KHL and NHL actually say? If Datsyuk is not bound by a contact, does KHL have to respect by-laws
of NHL? I doubt it.

I think you're right: there's no formal agreement between the both leagues that players under contract can't be signed by the other. Both seem to agree informally, however, that you don't touch players that are under contract. Think that's what the whole memoranda of understanding thing is all about.

Whether or not the Wings could make a civil claim against Datsyuk (i.e. sue him for breach of contract) I dunno either.

But all this talk about what recourse the Wings might be able to take in order to get him to honour the final year of his contract is pointless anyways. Even if the Wings did have a say in the matter, if he wanted to go back to Russia next season, they'd let him go back.

 

[Frk It]

Kobe and Datsyuk the same year... not fair.

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

Kobe and Datsyuk the same year... not fair.

Come on, one is the Patrick Kane of Basketball and the other is the Tim Duncan of hockey. Apples and oranges.

 

[Frk It]

Come on, one is the Patrick Kane of Basketball and the other is the Tim Duncan of hockey. Apples and oranges.

I like both a great deal. Never really bought into that narrative with Kobe, but that's just me. Think he is an *******, but I don't think he ever raped anyone.