Coach Discussion: Paul Maurice Pt II, The gooder, the badder, the uglier.

[Ducky10]

Conference finals last year because Rinne **** the bed. A losing record this year against playoff bound teams. Too many penalties of the lazy and or stupid variety. You can and should be aggressive while still playing within clearly defined boundaries. Lowry got a little rowdy against the Wild, but for the most part he exemplifies how this can be done. Either we have several really brain dead players who just can't learn, or a coach who won't force them to change. Guess which one can be easily changed. There's a Stanley Cup winning coach sitting at home twiddling his thumbs, and there's an owner in Toronto with enough wealth to offer said coach whatever he wants. But between Chipman and Chevy, there's just too much inertia. Let's not overreact, slow and steady, this chair is just too comfy to get out of. In the spirit of the season, all I can say is...

Don't forget .910 goaltending, that has nothing to do with anything.

Coach's can't do much unless a player decides he's going to be better first, it starts there. Consequences, sure. Forcing a player to be smarter, nope.

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

The more coaching opinions fascinate me tbh, I'm not sure what some people think coaches do with athletes at this level. Coaching players at the highest levels of sport, who are completely autonomous in their skill development means very little "teaching" going on when it comes to most things.

It's funny that people harp on Maurice for being a terrible coach, yet almost all of his players will say exactly the opposite. Even the ones he claims to "not have to coach". I think way too much has been made of a little soundbite, it's pretty clear the ones hanging onto that have no concept of what he's talking about. Great coach's s are not the type of teachers most people think they are.

This isn't about teaching, it's about conditioning. Reward and punishment. And applying it equitably. The inmates run this asylum, doing whatever they please with impunity. Sure, a lot of players will love a coach that does that, the same way a child will love being allowed to dip his hand into the cookie jar whenever he wants.

 

[Ducky10]

This isn't about teaching, it's about conditioning. Reward and punishment. And applying it equitably. The inmates run this asylum, doing whatever they please with impunity. Sure, a lot of players will love a coach that does that, the same way a child will love being allowed to dip his hand into the cookie jar whenever he wants.

Yeah, I really don't think that's the issue, but you're entitled to think that. I think the players we have are of higher character than that personally. The type of team you're describing does not fit with a team as successful as the Jets have been over the last year and a quarter. They aren't children and I doubt they are as impudent as you seem to think they are.

 

[kelsier]

This isn't about teaching, it's about conditioning. Reward and punishment. And applying it equitably. The inmates run this asylum, doing whatever they please with impunity. Sure, a lot of players will love a coach that does that, the same way a child will love being allowed to dip his hand into the cookie jar whenever he wants.

Unfortunately you're absolutely right. Certain players have held the-get-out-of-the-jail-free card for as long as I've been watching the Jets, while at the same time punishments have been delivered to others not belonging to the blue chip vets club. Paints a bad picture out of Maurice for not having the ballz. A couch should never let himself be pushed or bullied into such corner. The ones who do though, should probably consider another line of work or learn how to become stronger characters.

 

[Duke749]

People are being naive if they think Maurice isn’t like 90% of coaches out there. We would see the same people with the same exact complaints with plenty of other coaches.

 

[Adam da bomb]

People are being naive if they think Maurice isn’t like 90% of coaches out there. We would see the same people with the same exact complaints with plenty of other coaches.

The real trick is getting one of the other 10%

 

[Halberdier]

People are being naive if they think Maurice isn’t like 90% of coaches out there. We would see the same people with the same exact complaints with plenty of other coaches.

Exactly. Problem with Maurice is that those other 90% of coaches that are his level are not in NHL...

 

[Psych0dad]

There is no accountability for formet thrashers and that is solely on Maurice. When have you seen any of them demoted for a bit for bad performances? We have seen Ehlers, Laine, Connor and Roslovic moved around in the lineup to shake things up but some things never change....Wheeler attached to Chef, Little in 2nd line and Buff on the first PP. And any objective observer should know there have been plenty of times when those positions should have been challenged.

 

[KingBogo]

Exactly. Problem with Maurice is that those other 90% of coaches that are his level are not in NHL...

Of course they are in the NHL. Maurice has the exact same complaints from posters as just about every fan base on HF has for their coach. The one common thing linking every fan base is no one likes their coach past the opening honey moon period.

 

[Psych0dad]

Of course they are in the NHL. Maurice has the exact same complaints from posters as just about every fan base on HF has for their coach. The one common thing linking every fan base is no one likes their coach past the opening honey moon period.

You might get that impression reading forums. People complain more than praise. But if you watch hockey outside of Jets, you have to notice how much better some coaches are at maximizing utility and strategy. I've seen guys pull goalies 5 minutes left 2 goals down. That's progress, that's trust in analysis. Not something we will ever see from Maurice. Also when it comes to reacting within games and playing who is hot instead who is not.

His tools seem oddly outdated, especially for a smart dude who likes reading. He isn't even old, so it's hard to understand why he is so stubborn.

 

[Peggy]

Yeah, I really don't think that's the issue, but you're entitled to think that. I think the players we have are of higher character than that personally. The type of team you're describing does not fit with a team as successful as the Jets have been over the last year and a quarter. They aren't children and I doubt they are as impudent as you seem to think they are.

Kind of does. Even last year the jets had similar problems. Just this year it's more noticeable because the opponents gave gotten better

 

[Ducky10]

Opinions here have been repeated ad nauseum, some are a broken record and incomplete and others aren't. You lose all credibility when you continually blame coaching each time the team loses. It's so simplistic.

 

[Jetfaninflorida]

The way some people respond, you would think there is only one person pointing out our obvious coaching issues. News flash - many others are observing the same issues and discussing them openly. Just read the threads.

 

[Duke749]

The way some people respond, you would think there is only one person pointing out our obvious coaching issues. News flash - many others are observing the same issues and discussing them openly. Just read the threads.

There are obviously some coaching issues. Plenty of people have noticed. But it’s only some. Not literally everything done. And this is all just a knee jerk reaction to a game filled with soft calls, weak defense, and weak goaltending in the end. Reacting this way after a loss like that is putting way too much stock into recent play and not everything as a whole. It’s a bit short sighted in reality.

It’s also pretty obvious some people have their mind made up ahead of time and this is just an easy excuse to blame coaching.

 

[Psych0dad]

Opinions here have been repeated ad nauseum, some are a broken record and incomplete and others aren't. You lose all credibility when you continually blame coaching each time the team loses. It's so simplistic.

As long as the same problems remain, why would the tune change? It's natural that the same coaching issues are pointed out until they have been fixed

 

[Eyeseeing]

People are being naive if they think Maurice isn’t like 90% of coaches out there. We would see the same people with the same exact complaints with plenty of other coaches.

That’s totally true and inevitably good will runs out eventually.
Either the owner, the team or the fan base turns on the coaches.
Personally I don’t think Maurice is even close to that yet.
Quenville reached that point after an extremely successful run in Chicago as it’s the nature of the beast.
The only way Maurice gets fired is if we miss the playoffs by a large margin

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

There are obviously some coaching issues. Plenty of people have noticed. But it’s only some. Not literally everything done. And this is all just a knee jerk reaction to a game filled with soft calls, weak defense, and weak goaltending in the end. Reacting this way after a loss like that is putting way too much stock into recent play and not everything as a whole. It’s a bit short sighted in reality.

It’s also pretty obvious some people have their mind made up ahead of time and this is just an easy excuse to blame coaching.

If it will make you feel better, I will call for Maurice to be fired after every win, too.

 

[Gabe Kupari]

Sitting Niku and going with 2 LHDs who are not good is on coaching. Our D play sucks.. Lets not give the kid with potential a chance tho.

 

[AKAChip]

The NHL as a whole is terrified of new blood and it’s how guys like Hitchcock keep coming back over and over again when it is beyond clear that they have nothing left to give. I honestly can’t say what exactly the issue is but both the NBA and NFL have shifted to hiring young, innovative coaches that have shown a great deal of success. I realize that hockey, basketball and football are all vastly different sports but something had to happen in the other two leagues that made hiring smart, new blood a viable option that hasn’t happened in hockey yet.

Maurice is what he is. His schemes aren’t horrible but his lineup and roster decisions are close to as bad as any coach in the league. We can read other boards complaints about things like AV overplaying Glass on those Ranger teams, Hakstol playing McDonald far too many minutes for the Flyers and while Maurice may not be worse than those guys, he certainly isn’t better and more flummoxing yet is that he doesn’t seem to be learning. Thorburn and Hendricks were played well beyond their capabilities until they left the team and now the same can be said for Myers, Chiarot and Morrow.

I won’t for a second suggest that I or anyone else on here knows more about hockey than Maurice does but while it does take someone with a great deal of hockey knowledge to create and run a scheme, I would argue that it takes significant less detailed hockey knowledge to know when a player is struggling or just plain horrible and adjust accordingly. Seems like Maurice is adequate at the more difficult aspects of being a coach but a complete and utter disaster with the relatively easy aspects. And no, he isn’t the sole reason when the Jets lose but with each year it becomes more and more clear he would rather go down his way than make a meaningful adjustment to his roster decisions.

 

[Ducky10]

As long as the same problems remain, why would the tune change? It's natural that the same coaching issues are pointed out until they have been fixed

Pointing out coaching issues are one thing, maintaining that coaching is holding the team back and the main reason the team loses is another. It's simplistic and more narrative driven than factual.

 

[Psych0dad]

Pointing out coaching issues are one thing, maintaining that coaching is holding the team back and the main reason the team loses is another. It's simplistic and more narrative driven than factual.

We can agree to disagree. I maintain the coaching is an issue holding the team back.

 

[Ducky10]

The NHL as a whole is terrified of new blood and it’s how guys like Hitchcock keep coming back over and over again when it is beyond clear that they have nothing left to give. I honestly can’t say what exactly the issue is but both the NBA and NFL have shifted to hiring young, innovative coaches that have shown a great deal of success. I realize that hockey, basketball and football are all vastly different sports but something had to happen in the other two leagues that made hiring smart, new blood a viable option that hasn’t happened in hockey yet.

Maurice is what he is. His schemes are horrible but his lineup and roster decisions are close to as bad as any coach in the league. We can read other boards complaints about things like AV overplaying Glass on those Ranger teams, Hakstol playing McDonald far too many minutes for the Flyers and while Maurice may not be worse than those guys, he certainly isn’t better and more flummoxing yet is that he doesn’t seem to be learning. Thorburn and Hendricks were played well beyond their capabilities until they left the team and now the same can be said for Myers, Chiarot and Morrow.

I won’t for a second suggest that I or anyone else on here knows more about hockey than Maurice does but while it does take someone with a great deal of hockey knowledge to create and run a scheme, I would argue that it takes significant less detailed hockey knowledge to know when a player is struggling or just plain horrible and adjust accordingly. Seems like Maurice is adequate at the more difficult aspects of being a coach but a complete and utter disaster with the relatively easy aspects. And no, he isn’t the sole reason when the Jets lose but with each year it becomes more and more clear he would rather go down his way than make a meaningful adjustment to his roster decisions.

What are his schemes and why are they terrible? What adjustments should he make? Are the players executing the schemes?

The rest I largely agree with.

 

[Ducky10]

Sitting Niku and going with 2 LHDs who are not good is on coaching. Our D play sucks.. Lets not give the kid with potential a chance tho.

Agreed

 

[AKAChip]

What are his schemes and why are they terrible? What adjustments should he make? Are the players executing the schemes?

The rest I largely agree with.

I meant to say they aren’t horrible. Will edit.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

This can only go well. I know you mean well though Mort. No disrespect intended.

I get your point - and I knew when I posted that. But I am getting more than a little PO'ed about the issue. We are winning more than we are losing so it is being ignored - here and elsewhere.