Patrik Laine to the devils for...?

[Lou is God]

Our cup run was a fluky as the one Montreal had last year, so please spare me this notion that we were this elite team with Parise when we weren’t. We walked in favorable situations round after round and because we lost Parise and Koby for nothing, that was the main reason why Lou tried to patch job he did for what was 5 years and set us back yearssssss because of it.

LOL, point to where I said they were an elite team, I'll wait champ. And that team in 2012 was built to win and the proof is they did win. On top of that Parise gave indications he intended to stick around, I was here when it he didn't and everyone was stunned, so why would you trade a top player if you think he's going to stay? He might have wanted to go home but he might have stuck around if the Devils didn't have cash flow problems that kept Lou from sealing the deal before the UFA market hit.

Fluke team my ass.

 

[NJDevs26]

Montreal was barely over NHL .500 in the weakest division in hockey last year (and specifically only played them all season until after the first two rounds), the 2011-12 Devils had over 100 points in the toughest division in the league with three other 100 point teams in it, beating two in the playoffs. But sure one is just like the other.

The problem with Lou letting guys go for nothing wasn’t him keeping rentals in win now mode, it’s that he seldom made actual attempts to keep anyone once they hit UFA. Even Elias got ghosted by Lou who was fortunate Elias circled back one more time. Parise ironically was one of the few guys Lou legit tried to keep but the ownership financial issues put a crimp in that, along with Parise’s wanting to play at home

 

[Buck Dancer]

Montreal was barely over NHL .500 in the weakest division in hockey last year (and specifically only played them all season until after the first two rounds), the 2011-12 Devils had over 100 points in the toughest division in the league with three other 100 point teams in it, beating two in the playoffs. But sure one is just like the other.

The problem with Lou letting guys go for nothing wasn’t him keeping rentals in win now mode, it’s that he seldom made actual attempts to keep anyone once they hit UFA. Even Elias got ghosted by Lou who was fortunate Elias circled back one more time. Parise ironically was one of the few guys Lou legit tried to keep but the ownership financial issues put a crimp in that, along with Parise’s wanting to play at home

And you move him if that player wants a one year deal, walking him straight to free agency, knowing our GM doesn’t talk contracts during the season.

He left and it set us back years. Trying to twist things in a pretzel won’t change the fact that everyone saw it coming from a mile away. Some fans had their blinders screwed on super tight and didn’t see the obvious but that’s ok.

 

[Devs3cups]

Our cup run was a fluky as the one Montreal had last year, so please spare me this notion that we were this elite team with Parise when we weren’t. We walked in favorable situations round after round and because we lost Parise and Kovy for nothing, that was the main reason why Lou tried to patch job he did for what was 5 years and set us back yearssssss because of it.

I honestly ask myself if you really believe what you’re saying. Going on a fluke run doesn’t cement a team moving forward. It’s a nice story, I’ll admit to that but it gave false hope to an entire fanbase that views it just like you do and like Habs fans who were certain they’d be Cup contenders for years and now they’re about to pick top #3, 12 months later.

I know you're trying to make a point, and I'm honestly just lurking this thread for entertainment purposes (it's an entertaining thread what can I say) but holy moly is this wrong lmfao. Come on man.

 

[Guttersniped]

How the f*** was Parise not elite? The knee injury was terribly timed and tough to come back from but if you don’t think 2008-10 Parise was elite… I don’t know what to say.

Unless you have some weird personal definition of elite that includes… I don’t even know, again I don’t see how those seasons aren’t elite. He was 5th & 13th in Hart voting those years. (And 8th & 12th in Selke voting too.)

And Lou is trading Parise at TDL? Lou? Lou Lamoriello? The former Devils GM Lou Lamoriello? That guy? In what galaxy does that happen in? How do you have any familiarity with him as a GM and think that was a possibility?

And this weird “throw everything and the kitchen sink in weird whataboutism tangents” doesn’t help anything and wins no “debates” ever.

Making bullshit broad-stroke characterizations of “board takes” (“Larsson was elite?” He had a breakout season in 2015-16 and it got us Hall, is there a problem here? “Nico is elite?” WTF?)

I personally don’t give a shit about anyone’s previous takes. At all. Life is about learning more, taking in new information and constantly updating your takes. (And “takes” here seem to mostly refer to “guesses about the future” and those are often wrong.)

Engaging in discussions, listening to what other posters have to say instead of treating this like junior high debate club (which is intellectually empty and useless), is actually a way to develop your understanding of hockey. Or at least that’s my position.

And holy shit if you approach interactions on this board by thinking you’re a great unique bastion of hockey knowledge, superior from all the rest (and you have to turn everyone else’s positions into fictional cartoons to make that a functional narrative)… I don’t even know what you get out of this.

I’m here because I want to hear other takes, obsess with other obsessives, learn more about hockey and make jokes (posting gifs is fun too, I’m kind of getting into that).

I will quibble and debate over specific points, but I don’t manipulate stats, I don’t do whataboutism (there’s such a thing as helpful examples but those aren’t it) and I don’t play “I know hockey more, your other takes are bad, blah blah” because it’s childish and I can’t stress this enough, I don’t give a shit who wanted to sign UFA player X or trade Player Y at some point. Those are other specific situations and they likely had their reasons. And this is a hockey board, random people are just shooting the shit here, it’s not a job.

I’m not even against having Laine as player per se, I just think Blue Jackets are probably keeping him and if they don’t we would give up more than I would want to give up. (We would have a goal scorer but other massive holes and less ability to fill them.)

I would prefer to find Buchnevich type trades if possible, where we don’t give up anything too important, particular for wingers who aren’t as hard to get. (There are exceptions but I wouldn’t put Laine in that category because he doesn’t drive play.)

You can disagree. I argued the Nico trade thing more because there are no remotely similar trades for an unsigned RFA winger and locked up player like that, but I’ve said the same thing like a dozen times on that (or it feels like it). If you disagree, fine, again, just chatting on a hockey board.

But getting on a high horse about this shit… I don’t recommend it. I can get pretty cutting when people provoke me like that and I’m not the only one. (I do make an effort to not be asshole on this board, ever, it’s a life goal of mine. I’ve found myself getting testy lately and it’s not great feeling when I realize it happens.)

“blah blah you wanted Shattenkirk” no one f***ing careszzzzzzz

 

[My3Sons]

How the f*** was Parise not elite? The knee injury was terribly timed and tough to comeback from but if you don’t think 2008-10 Parise was elite… I don’t know what to say.

Unless you have some weird personal definition of elite that includes… I don’t even know, again I don’t see how those seasons aren’t elite. He was 5th & 13th in Hart voting those years. (And 8th & 12th in Selke voting too.)

And Lou is trading Parise at TDL? Lou? Lou Lamoriello? The former Devils GM Lou Lamoriello? That guy? In what galaxy does that happen in? How do you have any familiarity with him as a GM and think that was a possibility?

And this weird “throw everything and the kitchen sink in weird whataboutism tangents” doesn’t help anything and wins no “debates” ever.

Making bullshit broad-stroke characterizations of “board takes” (“Larsson was elite?” He had a breakout season in 2015-16 and it got us Hall, is there a problem here? “Nico is elite?” WTF?)

I personally don’t give a shit about anyone’s previous takes. At all. Life is about learning more, taking in new information and constantly updating your takes. (And “takes” here seem to mostly refer to “guesses about the future” and those are often wrong.)

Engaging in discussions, listening to what other posters have to say instead of treating this like junior high debate club (which is intellectually empty and useless), is actually a way to develop your understanding of hockey. Or at least that’s my position.

And holy shit if you approach interactions on this board by thinking you’re a great unique bastion of hockey knowledge, superior from all the rest (and you have to turn everyone else’s positions into fictional cartoons to make that a functional narrative)… I don’t even know what you get out of this.

I’m here because I want to hear other takes, obsess with other obsessives, learn more about hockey and make jokes (posting gifs is fun too, I’m kind of getting into that).

I will quibble and debate over specific points, but I don’t manipulate stats, I don’t do whataboutism (there’s such a thing as helpful examples but those aren’t it) and I don’t play “I know hockey more, your other takes are bad, blah blah” because it’s childish and I can’t stress this enough, I don’t give a shit who wanted to sign UFA player X or trade Player Y at some point. Those are other specific situations and they likely had their reasons. And this is a hockey board, random people are just shooting the shit here, it’s not a job.

I’m not even against having Laine as player per se, I just think Blue Jackets are probably keeping him and if they don’t we would give up more than I would want to give up. (We would have a goal scorer but other massive holes and less ability to fill them.)

I would prefer to find Buchnevich type trades if possible, where we don’t give up anything too important, particular for wingers who aren’t as hard to get. (There are exceptions but I wouldn’t put Laine in that category because he doesn’t drive play.)

You can disagree. I argued the Nico trade thing more because there are no remotely similar trades for an unsigned RFA winger and locked up player like that, but I’ve said the same thing like a dozen times on that (or it feels like it). If you disagree, fine, again, just chatting on a hockey board.

But getting on a high horse about this shit… I don’t recommend it. I can get pretty cutting when people provoke me like that and I’m not the only one. (I do make an effort to not be asshole on this board, ever, it’s a life goal of mine. I’ve found myself getting testy lately and it’s not great feeling when I realize it happens.)

“blah blah you wanted Shattenkirk” no one f***ing careszzzzzzz

Brave Clarice. You will let me know when those lambs stop screaming, won’t you?

 

[Buck Dancer]

How the f*** was Parise not elite? The knee injury was terribly timed and tough to come back from but if you don’t think 2008-10 Parise was elite… I don’t know what to say.

Unless you have some weird personal definition of elite that includes… I don’t even know, again I don’t see how those seasons aren’t elite. He was 5th & 13th in Hart voting those years. (And 8th & 12th in Selke voting too.)

And Lou is trading Parise at TDL? Lou? Lou Lamoriello? The former Devils GM Lou Lamoriello? That guy? In what galaxy does that happen in? How do you have any familiarity with him as a GM and think that was a possibility?

And this weird “throw everything and the kitchen sink in weird whataboutism tangents” doesn’t help anything and wins no “debates” ever.

Making bullshit broad-stroke characterizations of “board takes” (“Larsson was elite?” He had a breakout season in 2015-16 and it got us Hall, is there a problem here? “Nico is elite?” WTF?)

I personally don’t give a shit about anyone’s previous takes. At all. Life is about learning more, taking in new information and constantly updating your takes. (And “takes” here seem to mostly refer to “guesses about the future” and those are often wrong.)

Engaging in discussions, listening to what other posters have to say instead of treating this like junior high debate club (which is intellectually empty and useless), is actually a way to develop your understanding of hockey. Or at least that’s my position.

And holy shit if you approach interactions on this board by thinking you’re a great unique bastion of hockey knowledge, superior from all the rest (and you have to turn everyone else’s positions into fictional cartoons to make that a functional narrative)… I don’t even know what you get out of this.

I’m here because I want to hear other takes, obsess with other obsessives, learn more about hockey and make jokes (posting gifs is fun too, I’m kind of getting into that).

I will quibble and debate over specific points, but I don’t manipulate stats, I don’t do whataboutism (there’s such a thing as helpful examples but those aren’t it) and I don’t play “I know hockey more, your other takes are bad, blah blah” because it’s childish and I can’t stress this enough, I don’t give a shit who wanted to sign UFA player X or trade Player Y at some point. Those are other specific situations and they likely had their reasons. And this is a hockey board, random people are just shooting the shit here, it’s not a job.

I’m not even against having Laine as player per se, I just think Blue Jackets are probably keeping him and if they don’t we would give up more than I would want to give up. (We would have a goal scorer but other massive holes and less ability to fill them.)

I would prefer to find Buchnevich type trades if possible, where we don’t give up anything too important, particular for wingers who aren’t as hard to get. (There are exceptions but I wouldn’t put Laine in that category because he doesn’t drive play.)

You can disagree. I argued the Nico trade thing more because there are no remotely similar trades for an unsigned RFA winger and locked up player like that, but I’ve said the same thing like a dozen times on that (or it feels like it). If you disagree, fine, again, just chatting on a hockey board.

But getting on a high horse about this shit… I don’t recommend it. I can get pretty cutting when people provoke me like that and I’m not the only one. (I do make an effort to not be asshole on this board, ever, it’s a life goal of mine. I’ve found myself getting testy lately and it’s not great feeling when I realize it happens.)

“blah blah you wanted Shattenkirk” no one f***ing careszzzzzzz

This post is filled with irony lol

If someone has a different opinion, you’ll throw stats their way to make them think they’re wrong. If Jim doesn’t like Jack’s game because he’s turning the puck over that leads to goals against, despite his PPG average, he’ll get smoked for it when he’s actually right. If I think we need more "GrIt", I’ll have snarky remarks and takes calling me out for having a dump POV and I can go on and on for about another 10 minutes of opinions that get belittled by posters who don’t see it that way. God forbid someone speaks wrong of any of our "core" players, that’s just calling for trouble when some are calling a spade a spade while the rest have their head in the sand.

 

[MadDevil]

The idea that any player is above criticism on this board is complete and utter bullshit. We literally shit on every single player at some point around here. Some of us just prefer to not constantly shit on the good players we do have because they didn't meet our personal expectations as a #1 overall or didn't miraculously turn this team into a contender or because we blindly hate the GM that drafted them or whatever other reason some come up with to just dislike them. And last time I checked, you haven't been banned from posting or are being censored, so please climb down off the cross you've nailed yourself to of being this poor persecuted minority that is "just being real" around here.

 

[NJDevs26]

Nobody's getting censored for unpopular or incorrect opinions...trolling and flaming however, is a different story. My patience for this back and forth is running thin, especially now that it's becoming more about the board at large than the players themselves. Continually trying to drag an ostensibly Laine trade thread into 'I'm one of the few smart ones here because I think Nico's not untouchable' referendum on the rest of the board and using that or other whataboutisms to whine about what others think of you or anyone else is basically trolling and going OT by making the discussion about yourself.

So if you don't want to be persecuted for 'unpopular opinions', let's at least keep this discussion to the opinion of actual NHL players and not of board posters or their perceived homerism levels going forward.

 

[Buck Dancer]

Nobody's getting censored for unpopular opinions...trolling and flaming however, is a different story. My patience for this back and forth is running thin, especially now that it's becoming more about the board at large than the players themselves. Continually trying to drag an ostensibly Laine trade thread into 'I'm one of the few smart ones here because I think Nico's not untouchable' referendum on the rest of the board and using that or other whataboutisms to whine about what others think of you or anyone else is basically trolling and going OT by making the discussion about yourself.

So if you don't want to be persecuted for 'unpopular opinions', let's at least keep this discussion to the opinion of actual NHL players and not of board posters or their perceived homerism levels going forward.

Nobody is saying that at all and if this notion that standing for what you think is some sort of reason to think "I'm one of the few smart ones here", than it probably has more to do with the posters imagining things than me actually saying it. Having different opinons is what makes this place special and even if some are in the minority, that shouldn't be a reason to pile on them.

With that out of the way, if the rest of that message was ment for me, I'll definitely stick to why adding Patrick Laine on our team would make us much better in the short and long term, even if it means moving a good but not great player.

Thanks for the heads up and I hope we can have a civil and honest discussion for the soul purpose of seeing the team we all love, become relevant, sooner rather than later.

 

[mdj12784]

2 more for the bum!

 

[Captain3rdLine]

No one’s calling him a bum. He’s a talented player who can score goals and is really hot right now. He’s also gained a reputation for being lazy, and very one dimensional. If you want an example of a play that demonstrates both of those things go watch the Auston Matthews goal tonight.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

No one’s calling him a bum. He’s a talented player who can score goals and is really hot right now. He’s also gained a reputation for being lazy, and very one dimensional. If you want an example of a play that demonstrates both of those things go watch the Auston Matthews goal tonight.

The same things were said about Kovalchuk in 2010, the Devils are in no room to scoff at talented goal scorers which is what Laine is. Also if Holtz becomes what every Devils fan expects, you’d have the two most lethal snipers in the league next to Hischier and Hughes for the next decade. Their top 6 would be out of this world also if Bratt continues his pace instead of being a one year wonder.

 

[Triumph]

The same things were said about Kovalchuk in 2010, the Devils are in no room to scoff at talented goal scorers which is what Laine is. Also if Holtz becomes what every Devils fan expects, you’d have the two most lethal snipers in the league next to Hischier and Hughes for the next decade. Their top 6 would be out of this world also if Bratt continues his pace instead of being a one year wonder.

The same things were said about Kovalchuk in 2010 and they were right, Kovalchuk did learn some defense here but it cost him offense and 2 out of the 3 seasons he was a Devil, he was a disappointment. And the thing about Kovalchuk is that I don't think he was lazy, he was just single-mindedly committed to offense.

That said, your team that you've constructed is totally unaffordable. You can't afford all of those players.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

The same things were said about Kovalchuk in 2010, the Devils are in no room to scoff at talented goal scorers which is what Laine is. Also if Holtz becomes what every Devils fan expects, you’d have the two most lethal snipers in the league next to Hischier and Hughes for the next decade. Their top 6 would be out of this world also if Bratt continues his pace instead of being a one year wonder.

That’s exactly the thing. Not a single person on here is scoffing at Laine or any talented scorer. It’s just a debate on how much he is worth and whether we should trade one of the players you mentioned in Hischier for him. Many people have pointed out the things I mentioned above as things that significantly decrease his value and what he would be worth in a trade.

 

[Buck Dancer]

No one’s calling him a bum. He’s a talented player who can score goals and is really hot right now. He’s also gained a reputation for being lazy, and very one dimensional. If you want an example of a play that demonstrates both of those things go watch the Auston Matthews goal tonight.

That’s what you get from an elite sniper like him. He’ll give you 2 and probably cost you one. That’s something I’m willing to live with if he can put 35/40 behind a goalie.

By the way, the defending of Matthews on that one leg flamingo in OT on Laine’s goal isn’t how Sheldon Keefe wrote it on the clipboard, that’s for sure.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

That’s what you get from an elite sniper like him. He’ll give you 2 and probably cost you one. That’s something I’m willing to live with if he can put 35/40 behind a goalie.

By the way, the defending of Matthews on that one leg flamingo in OT on Laine’s goal isn’t how Sheldon Keefe wrote it on the clipboard, that’s for sure.

He won’t give you two. If he hits 40 goals that’s actually only 0.5 goals a game. Simple math. He’s probably as hot as he’s ever been in his career right now. He’ll consistently give you lazy and poor off the puck and defensive play though.

Also not sure if you know what a flamingo is. Go watch that again from all the angles. Doesn’t flamingo at all, has both skates on the ice, tries to block it and it goes between his legs. Matthews is also a very good defensive forward.

 

[MadDevil]

See, the thing is I'm not sure he's giving you 35-40 goals a year either. Since his first two seasons he's basically played at like a 30 goal pace. So if you're acquiring him, you better be damn sure he can get back to a 35-40 goal level if you're spending assets to get him and then giving him a big contract. Also in this fantasy world we're playing in, trading Nico weakens us at center and puts a lot on the shoulders of Mercer, who we're not even 100% sure ends up a center long term. Sure it gives Jack his scoring winger, but does that offset what we're losing at center by trading Nico? Or are we just creating one weakness to fill another?

 

[Buck Dancer]

He won’t give you two. If he hits 40 goals that’s actually only 0.5 goals a game. Simple math. He’s probably as hot as he’s ever been in his career right now. He’ll consistently give you lazy and poor off the puck and defensive play though.

Also not sure if you know what a flamingo is. Go watch that again from all the angles. Doesn’t flamingo at all, has both skates on the ice, tries to block it and it goes between his legs. Matthews is also a very good defensive forward.

I’m saying that more often than not, he’ll do what he did today. He’ll be like Severson, but actually produce offensively. If he were a defensive dynamo, he’d be borderline untouchable.

That defensive effort was horrible. It wasn’t s flamingo, you’re right… saw it from the other angle. Whatever that was wasn’t a stellar defensive play, that’s my point. You don’t back off all the way to the edges of the face off dot, screening you goalie more than anything else, when a guy with a lethal shot like Laine comes down on you.

 

[Buck Dancer]

See, the thing is I'm not sure he's giving you 35-40 goals a year either. Since his first two seasons he's basically played at like a 30 goal pace. So if you're acquiring him, you better be damn sure he can get back to a 35-40 goal level if you're spending assets to get him and then giving him a big contract. Also in this fantasy world we're playing in, trading Nico weakens us at center and puts a lot on the shoulders of Mercer, who we're not even 100% sure ends up a center long term. Sure it gives Jack his scoring winger, but does that offset what we're losing at center by trading Nico? Or are we just creating one weakness to fill another?

If we can get a defensively responsible center, who would take on most of Nico’s "harder matchups", where his offensive role wouldn’t be all that needed, like a Dvorak in Montreal for example, I wouldn’t be worried one second about Mercer getting more responsibilities. He actually thrived when playing bigger minutes with quality wingers. Even if we can’t get a Dvorak, I’d still do it since you can find more Dvorak’s than you can Laine’s.

It won’t happen, I know that, just saying I honestly think we’d be a better team.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

The same things were said about Kovalchuk in 2010 and they were right, Kovalchuk did learn some defense here but it cost him offense and 2 out of the 3 seasons he was a Devil, he was a disappointment. And the thing about Kovalchuk is that I don't think he was lazy, he was just single-mindedly committed to offense.

That said, your team that you've constructed is totally unaffordable. You can't afford all of those players.

Entire team was atrocious in 10-11, a lot of parallels to this year where consistency plagued them along with an inept head coach. 11-12, he was borderline a Hart trophy candidate and probably had the best Devils forward year in history up to that point by being played by DeBoer with defensemen like time on ice with having to be double shifted on the fourth line because of how DeBoer was enamored with Peter Harrold of all people. 12-13, the team had the best corsi in the league if I'm not mistaken but couldn't finish whatsoever and their goaltending duo couldn't stop a nosebleed with a 40 year old Marty and Johan Hedberg. Kovalchuk wasn't the problem in any of the years here and none of the years did we get worse defensively because of his play style. Do I think Laine will ever come close to what Kovy did in 11-12? No, but scoffing at his defensive game while completely ignoring the fact he'd be the best shot would have on the power play or even 5v5 since that game breaker Kovalchuk we had in 2011-2012 is utterly laughable. Can't say you want to have Hughes and Nico to have better wingers than scoff at arguably the best shot in the league sans Matthews and Ovy. It also allows us options with Holtz instead of banking on one guy being said sniper.

 

[Guttersniped]

And I don’t believe Columbus is trading Laine. When we hear talk about the Blue Jackets looking to move him and team making offers then I’ll care more about HFBoard proposals.

Not saying it can’t possibly happen of course but I don’t see the point of endlessly debating it. (Others can have at it their hearts content of course, but it’s not a pressing topic to me.)

The Boeser stuff is more interesting to me because it’s tied to actual chatter. Vancouver needs to move out cap and we keep getting name dropped (though I have my suspicions about Zacha’s agent and his tendency to work the phones.)

 

[Captain3rdLine]

I’m saying that more often than not, he’ll do what he did today. He’ll be like Severson, but actually produce offensively. If he were a defensive dynamo, he’d be borderline untouchable.

That defensive effort was horrible. It wasn’t s flamingo, you’re right… saw it from the other angle. Whatever that was wasn’t a stellar defensive play, that’s my point. You don’t back off all the way to the edges of the face off dot, screening you goalie more than anything else, when a guy with a lethal shot like Laine comes down on you.

Severson is very good defensively. Laine is terrible defensively. Not comparable.

You also completely misdescribed the play that happened. Voracek came down carrying the puck. Laine came with him. Voracek is getting by Reilly and as that happens Matthews starts to move towards him because he has to or Voracek will have a clear lane to the net. As he does that Voracek dishes it off to Laine and Matthews does all he can do at this point which is try to block Laine’s shot but it goes through his legs. Very little Matthews could’ve done and as I said he is a very good defensive forward. Not sure what he has to do with this conversation anyways.

 

[Buck Dancer]

Severson is very good defensively. Laine is terrible defensively. Not comparable.

You also completely misdescribed the play that happened. Voracek came down carrying the puck. Laine came with him. Voracek is getting by Reilly and as that happens Matthews starts to move towards him because he has to or Voracek will have a clear lane to the net. As he does that Voracek dishes it off to Laine and Matthews does all he can do at this point which is try to block Laine’s shot but it goes through his legs. Very little Matthews could’ve done and as I said he is a very good defensive forward. Not sure what he has to do with this conversation anyways.

No wonder we don’t see eye to eye, you think Severson is good defensively. I’ve seen Severson give that type of effort and make boneheaded plays just as much, if not more, than Laine… and he’s actually a defensemen.

By the way, Matthews is in this conversation because you pointed out the mediocre effort Laine did on his goal where I replied by saying AM made an equally bad read on Laine’s OT goal.

Elite scoring wingers can’t all be Patrice Bergeron’s, that’s just life.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

No wonder we don’t see eye to eye, you think Severson is good defensively. I’ve seen Severson give that type of effort and make boneheaded plays just as much, if not more, than Laine… and he’s actually a defensemen.

By the way, Matthews is in this conversation because you pointed out the mediocre effort Laine did on his goal where I replied by saying AM made an equally bad read on Laine’s OT goal.

Elite scoring wingers can’t all be Patrice Bergeron’s, that’s just life.

Severson very rarely makes bad defensive plays like that. And he more than makes up for it with what he does on a shift by shift basis.

Yes I pointed out what Laine did because we’re talking about Laine in this thread. Not Matthews. And calling those equally bad plays is ridiculous. Matthews couldn’t have done very much there at all. You first wrongly claimed that he flamingoed and then went on to completely misdescribed what actually happened on the play. Literally just trying to make up what happened on the play to fit whatever point you’re trying to make (still not sure what that is).

Nobody is asking for Laine to be an elite defensive forward like Bergeron. Laine just so happens to be on the complete opposite end of that spectrum which reasonably has a significant effect on his value and how good of a player he is. And what he is worth in a trade.