Player Discussion: Patrik Laine (mod warning in post #150)

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Jun 15, 2013
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he is biggest player in Winnipeg history and should get to be all concentrations on at this team. right from start here he should have been at first line "Learning" fastest possible how to best to be the new mario Lemieux.

Bobby Hull? Lars Eric Sjoberg? Anders Hedberg? Ulf Nillson? Kent Nillson? Dale Hawerchuk? Dave Babych? Phil Housley? Thomas Steen? Teemu Selanne?

Don't embarrass yourself by comparing our 19 year phenom to some of the greatest players in hockey history yet. He's got a long was to go to reach Zhamnov, Tkachuk or Numminen status, let alone Selanne or Hawerchuk.

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avgard

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Jan 8, 2017
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easy down. i have opinion i put these things under microscope. i have rights to be concern why not laine is being at 1st line since start. he is unique superstar..MEGAstar already at this Young age. he is can be better than Lemieux . i say at any team he would be at first line . these rare MONSTERplayers Always go right up in first line. he playd already 2 seasons in bad positions in team. very misshandled by team stuff. he learn and develope nothing playing in line not working with small amount of icetimes. he should play as much as possible. say at least 22 min. the faster he MONSTER the better..and right

Sir avgard hockeyprofessor
 
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Plural

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Mar 10, 2011
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Bobby Hull? Lars Eric Sjoberg? Anders Hedberg? Ulf Nillson? Kent Nillson? Dale Hawerchuk? Dave Babych? Phil Housley? Thomas Steen? Teemu Selanne?

Don't embarrass yourself by comparing our 19 year phenom to some of the greatest players in hockey history yet. He's got a long was to go to reach Zhamnov, Tkachuk or Numminen status, let alone Selanne or Hawerchuk.

[MOD]

Yeah. Although he played for the WHA Jets, Bobby Hull is the greatest player to ever wear Jets jersey.

Hawerchuk was probably the first big name for the NHL Jets and Selanne was the first legit superstar.

Laine's got a long way the go. Heck, he might even be overshadowed by Scheifele during their years in Winnipeg.
 
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jepjepjoo

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Yeah. Although he played for the WHA Jets, Bobby Hull is the greatest player to ever wear Jets jersey.

Hawerchuk was probably the first big name for the NHL Jets and Selanne was the first legit superstar.

Laine's got a long way the go. Heck, he might even be overshadowed by Scheifele during their years in Winnipeg.

With Laine's current career trajectory Bobby Hull is the only player whose accomplishments he'll have a hard time surpassing.
 
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grieves

silent prayer
Apr 27, 2016
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Let's get this thing up to date (let me know if it is missing something):

2015-16 Liiga Rookie of the Year.
2015-16 Liiga Rookie Goals Leader.
2015-16 Liiga Rookie Points Leader.
2015-16 Liiga Playoff MVP and Champion.
2015-16 Liiga Playoff Goals Leader.
2015-16 Liiga Record Setter for Most Playoff Goals By a Rookie.
2016 World Junior All Star Team.
2016 World Junior Gold Medal.
2016 World Junior Goals Leader.
2015 U-18 All Star Team.
2015 U-18 Silver Medal.
2015 U-18 Goals Leader.
2016 World Championship MVP.
2016 World Championship Silver Medal.
2016 World Championship All-Star Team.
2016 World Championship, IIHF Directorate Award for Best Forward.
2016 World Championship, Award for Top 3 Player on Team.
2016 World Championship Goals Leader.
2016 World Championship Record Setter for Most Goals by a Player in First Year of NHL Draft Eligibility.
2016 World Championship Record Setter for Most Points by a Player in First Year of NHL Draft Eligibility.
Second-Highest Point Total by a U-19 Player at a World Championship Tournament (behind only Sidney Crosby, 2006).
Youngest player ever to score three hat tricks in the NHL
Fastest 18 Year-old to achieve 30 goals in the NHL (era-adjusted)
PPG player as an 18 Year-old in the NHL (56 games in. Finished season 73gp, 64 points)
3rd European teenager ever to reach 100 career points in the NHL
Longest point streak by a teenager in NHL history at 14 games
Scored 40 goals in less ice-time than anyone in the NHL since ice-time has been recorded (44 Goals averaging 16:29 minutes)
 

Plural

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Mar 10, 2011
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1. Fastest 18 Year-old to achieve 30 goals in the NHL (era-adjusted)
2. PPG player as an 18 Year-old in the NHL (56 games in. Finished season 73gp, 64 points)

1. Are you using HR's era adjustment?
2. Is that 56 first games of his rookie season? That's f***ing impressive, but strikes to me too arbitrary to actually put on a list of accomplishments.
 

grieves

silent prayer
Apr 27, 2016
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^ Interesting to note that Laine was already a PPG player at 18 when playing with Scheifele 53 games in his first season. Then he went to ELL. Hoo boy they are gonna do some damage in the future.
 

grieves

silent prayer
Apr 27, 2016
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1. Are you using HR's era adjustment?
2. Is that 56 first games of his rookie season? That's ****ing impressive, but strikes to me too arbitrary to actually put on a list of accomplishments.

1. The list is so old that honestly I don't remember where the era-adjustments came from but I'm not concerned there is a problem with them. Laine's stats are crazy even without era-adjustments.

2. You might be right, it's only the fact that he is 18 that kind of makes it special but we should probably remove that. Let's see what the rest of the jury says.

edit: On second thought, "he was PPG at some point in the season" does seem kind of stupid.

Here is where Laine situates comparing 18 year-olds. This kid is disgusting if you take era-adjustment and ELL into account.
 
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Halberdier

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May 14, 2016
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Great list @grieves but that list is still missing one of his most extraordinary achievement ever:

Laine was officially U18 on those WHC championships 2016 even when he did turn to 18 before tournament ended, so while he was all time second for U19 as well as being U18 is also U19 and U20 and so on, he did just double the previous modern day U18 record by Jaromir Jagr and did beat handily (by 12 points to 7 or so) the previous all time record from early 20th century.
 

grieves

silent prayer
Apr 27, 2016
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Great list @grieves but that list is still missing one of his most extraordinary achievement ever:

Laine was officially U18 on those WHC championships 2016 even when he did turn to 18 before tournament ended, so while he was all time second for U19 as well as being U18 is also U19 and U20 and so on, he did just double the previous modern day U18 record by Jaromir Jagr and did beat handily (by 12 points to 7 or so) the previous all time record from early 20th century.

Uhh... I'm el confused.

How should I modify the list? Feel free to republish the list as you see fit (you can take out the being PPG at 18 while you're at it).
 

kelsier

Registered User
Aug 17, 2013
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Let's get this thing up to date (let me know if it is missing something):

2015-16 Liiga Rookie of the Year.
2015-16 Liiga Rookie Goals Leader.
2015-16 Liiga Rookie Points Leader.
2015-16 Liiga Playoff MVP and Champion.
2015-16 Liiga Playoff Goals Leader.
2015-16 Liiga Record Setter for Most Playoff Goals By a Rookie.
2016 World Junior All Star Team.
2016 World Junior Gold Medal.
2016 World Junior Goals Leader.
2015 U-18 All Star Team.
2015 U-18 Silver Medal.
2015 U-18 Goals Leader.
2016 World Championship MVP.
2016 World Championship Silver Medal.
2016 World Championship All-Star Team.
2016 World Championship, IIHF Directorate Award for Best Forward.
2016 World Championship, Award for Top 3 Player on Team.
2016 World Championship Goals Leader.
2016 World Championship Record Setter for Most Goals by a Player in First Year of NHL Draft Eligibility.
2016 World Championship Record Setter for Most Points by a Player in First Year of NHL Draft Eligibility.
Second-Highest Point Total by a U-19 Player at a World Championship Tournament (behind only Sidney Crosby, 2006).
Youngest player ever to score three hat tricks in the NHL
Fastest 18 Year-old to achieve 30 goals in the NHL (era-adjusted)
PPG player as an 18 Year-old in the NHL (56 games in. Finished season 73gp, 64 points)
3rd European teenager ever to reach 100 career points in the NHL
Longest point streak by a teenager in NHL history at 14 games
Scored 40 goals in less ice-time than anyone in the NHL since ice-time has been recorded (44 Goals averaging 16:29 minutes)

The list is so remarkable that I think most hockey fans have hard time putting all of it into right perspective, me included - the accolades/records are simply just so nuts that if someone had publicly predicted anything of the kind prior to lets say season 2015-16 I think he/she would've been made to look like a clown and e-stoned, ha. Like someone already mentioned I believe the list is missing his all-time u18 point record in the WHC which he stole from Jagr who had gleaned to it for 26 years, and not only did he stole the record but pretty much demolished it by almost having near triple point totals with the old record being 5 points and current one 13 points. The achievements dating back to when he was still undrafted kiddo and today, Laine has managed to accomplish so many feats that maybe a handful of players in the history can match up with. With that said, of course the past is the past and the future is what matters. The great thing about it though is that I don't see him side-tracking from the development trajectory at all when you look at the recent results. His sophomore season bested his rookie year which alone was already impressive. I have little doubt in my mind he would have been a PPG+ player already in 17-18 with more and more consistent ice time as opposed to it jumping up and down. So when we look at statistics, we also have to take in account all the circumstances surrounding his season.

Anyway, something like this is always a welcomed reminder of the player we are discussion, if not even awed by for the some of us. I'm sure after a decade there's not many people in Winnipeg who do not know and recognise Patrik Laine and fast-forward even further along the way they will think of the NHL draft 2016 and praise the hockey gods for winning the lottery. I hope next season he can really break the bank like Ovy did in his 20 yo season. Nothing would be more awesome. Still it's not a necessity or even something I expect of him (as all players develop in different time frames). Nonetheless I suppose first we have to endure the long painful summer without hockey and then have our fingers crossed. Cheers!
 

LowLefty

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This is getting comical. You first lecture about a player having to earn something to get somewhere, and not only this but making it perfectly clear in your very first statements that a player needs to be better than <insert another player> to reach there. Then when pressed against reality, You've hardly presented a case where Connor was the better player than either Laine or even Ehlers. There's a lot more to hockey than cycling and boards and again do you even realise that when you have two line drivers in the unit, it creates a ton of space (leaving just enough room for a skilled youngster to thrive and at the same time have some cover for his own personal flaws and weaknesses). No, you haven't really presented a real case for Connor being the best player of all of them even right now (and honestly if this is really how you thought, then wow, I don't even really know what I could possible add to that, ha). Also you refuse to even to acknowledge that maybe, just maybe there was something else in the play as well than just the "who'd adapts the best playing with S & W" - like team dynamics for starters, you simply shake it off and dismiss the entire idea like it was never considered by the management, then continue to rant the same old broken record. Maybe it wouldn't hurt to actually try consider all the factors in play and be open-minded if you really wanted to get into the bottom of something? Anyway, the statistics let alone the common logic definitely are definitely not working in your favour here. I mean how would someone score more points by playing lesser minutes with lesser line mates in the begin with? It's quite funny to even talk about this with a straight face considering one of these guys just wrapped a season being the second best goal scorer in the entire league.

Your memory seems to either fade away or be selective cause while taunting this narrative you seem to forget the simple fact where the player we are all discussing in this very particular topic got exactly 0 chances to make a show case for the top line in the beginning of last year, while all Connor, Ehlers and even Perreault played there before the management cemented the line. I mean, when your only claim is that player A is better fit than player B for line X and yet player B never played in the line X how can you with a good conscience claim that you are not assuming that B would be worse fit to play in a line X? If there's no data to back it up, then what do you have other than your own opinions and assumptions? By the way do you even remember when Scheifele got injured and Wheelers replaced him? Who was his original wingers then, can you tell? If yes, care to share what again happened with the three of them?

Seriously I'm completely fine about someone's viewpoints differing with mine, but trust me that when you deal and talk about complicated matters that are not as black and white as you wish to believe them to be, you're not going to sell your story with concluding most of the the statements with "that's just how things are so deal with it!". Amusingly enough I never even stated in the begin with that Laine had to play in the top unit. That's another product of your imagination. The team betting all it's best guns in one basket is never a good idea. I simply stated he was misused and that his TOI had a significant drop down despite of him being a better player than last year. I also pointed out that was not the correct way to use Laine (have him skate more than a handful of 12+, 13+ or 14 minute games for starters, nevermind forcing a dysfunctional line almost up until Stastny arrived) - or in general any franchise level talent who's more than NHL ready and capable. If you think the first ~40 games served his best interests or development then I don't think I will ever be even remotely on the same page with you in the concepts regarding development itself (right now it's a coin toss apart even with the hockey knowledge and idealism itself). Nonetheless, the bottom line is that coach should never force a young talented player in a position where he's not comfortable and leave him rot there until he figures out better ways to get the most out of his talent.


Dude, please tell me where I am telling anyone that Connor is better than Laine. I can save you some time - you won't find it.

Oh, and check out my new profile pic - what do you think?
 

PhilJets

Winnipeg is Good
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^ Interesting to note that Laine was already a PPG player at 18 when playing with Scheifele 53 games in his first season. Then he went to ELL. Hoo boy they are gonna do some damage in the future.

He was the Jets top scorer before the hit during his rookie year.
He was top 10 in the league.

He was killing it.

:)
 

PhilJets

Winnipeg is Good
Jun 24, 2012
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Somewhere nice
Let's get this thing up to date (let me know if it is missing something):

2015-16 Liiga Rookie of the Year.
2015-16 Liiga Rookie Goals Leader.
2015-16 Liiga Rookie Points Leader.
2015-16 Liiga Playoff MVP and Champion.
2015-16 Liiga Playoff Goals Leader.
2015-16 Liiga Record Setter for Most Playoff Goals By a Rookie.
2016 World Junior All Star Team.
2016 World Junior Gold Medal.
2016 World Junior Goals Leader.
2015 U-18 All Star Team.
2015 U-18 Silver Medal.
2015 U-18 Goals Leader.
2016 World Championship MVP.
2016 World Championship Silver Medal.
2016 World Championship All-Star Team.
2016 World Championship, IIHF Directorate Award for Best Forward.
2016 World Championship, Award for Top 3 Player on Team.
2016 World Championship Goals Leader.
2016 World Championship Record Setter for Most Goals by a Player in First Year of NHL Draft Eligibility.
2016 World Championship Record Setter for Most Points by a Player in First Year of NHL Draft Eligibility.
Second-Highest Point Total by a U-19 Player at a World Championship Tournament (behind only Sidney Crosby, 2006).
Youngest player ever to score three hat tricks in the NHL
Fastest 18 Year-old to achieve 30 goals in the NHL (era-adjusted)
PPG player as an 18 Year-old in the NHL (56 games in. Finished season 73gp, 64 points)
3rd European teenager ever to reach 100 career points in the NHL
Longest point streak by a teenager in NHL history at 14 games
Scored 40 goals in less ice-time than anyone in the NHL since ice-time has been recorded (44 Goals averaging 16:29 minutes)

Led the league in pp goals
As under 20 in 1 season.

20 goals
Only player to reach 20 last year.
 
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kelsier

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Aug 17, 2013
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Dude, please tell me where I am telling anyone that Connor is better than Laine. I can save you some time - you won't find it.

Oh, and check out my new profile pic - what do you think?

Where did you state this, are you frigging kidding me? Alright as you wish.

You may not agree with the deployment of Laine in certain situations and that's probably what this is discussion is really all about.
Laine hasn't been handed a slot on the number one line and he shouldn't. Maybe this upcoming season he won't show up exhausted and perhaps work his way onto the big line - that's how the NHL works, get used to it.
As for Kyle Connor, I didn't claim anything - I did say that he earned his position on the top line and much of that came from hard work - he changed his game to incorporate a more aggressive cycle game that works well with Scheif and Wheels. Earning that spot was based on his success (points) and his game (work ethic).
Conner didn't "out point" everyone but he made the necessarily changes to his game to become a better fit with Wheels / Scheif.
Look - regarding my comment that you set in bold above, Laine can either work to be a better fit on the line - or not - I don't care.
Connor is doing an excellent job on the number 1 line and has learned what he needs to do to stay there - both Scheif and Wheels have publically stated that they love playing with the guy because of what he brings.
That's the way it is - whether or not you agree with any of that, I couldn't care less.
This discussion is becoming LOL funny because you really think the coach doesn't recognized Laine's talent and has him slotted down the line up because he fails to recognize Laine's talent - Or - Maurice doesn't like Laine.
I'm hoping Laine works on these areas of his game - I'd love to see him contributing on the top line. But he won't get there, IMO, until he improves his cycle, board, tight traffic game.

You started up with a statement saying that he was exhaust coming into the NHL (which isn't even true to be honest, Laine's muscles were adjusting from the summer work out - absolutely nothing to do with being physically exhaust) and continued with a notion that one needs to work his way up to the first line, which he gradually did by finishing second in the league in goals. So again another statement that holds zero validity. The lines aren't combined by how great an individual is doing, but so that they'll serve the team's best interest. Laine playing in the second the entire season pretty much tells he was there to spread the wealth, not because he wasn't "good enough". Oh and of course lets not forget the ludicrous conclusion of "the way NHL works, get used to it!" :D

Then as for Connor you said he earned his position while Ehlers was doing even better in the very first games scoring multi point games and being absolutely great. So applying the logic of who's the most deserving again doesn't work, but that team dynamics comes first. Furthermore again, Laine wasn't even given an opportunity to make his tryout for this line, so someone making a statement that Connor had better success (or even work ethic) is simply false.

Regarding the third paragraph, Laine needs to work better to fit the line, it doesn't even make any sense since Laine is a workhorse. He doesn't consume alcohol and has shown nothing but devotion of becoming the best player in the planet (wherever that leads is up to him). Then justifying utilization by a compliment veteran players release to the press in regards to a youngster? Seriously? Wonder how many generational talents the NHL would have if all Gretzky's public compliments were 100% valid.

As for Maurice not liking Laine and using or misusing him as he pleases, even I wouldn't go that far. If you feel like Connor had the better cycling or tight traffic game, that's fine. We won't really know how he would have excelled with lets say Ehlers and Little and with far, far less open space on the ice (created by team's two best line drivers). I've said it before and I'll say it again, Laine didn't have to be in the first line in the begin with to at least have similar aTOI that he had in his rookie year. P.Mo significantly cutting that down instead finding ways to use him more was a bad move on his part and did not serve the cause of helping Laine develop better. In the end, Laine crawled out of the mud on his own with little help from the management (apart from Chevy acquiring Stastny, who isn't even an elite center, just good enough).

To summarise, you clearly felt and indicated that Connor was more deserving to play in the first line that Laine cause he was better fit and if Laine was the better player he would have made it there. Meanwhile you fail to acknowledge the fact that Laine was never given a proper opportunity, you ignore the entire team dynamics (spreading firepower), the fact that Connor was indeed fed far more on the silver plate than most other players in the team and basically every other detail that could have anything to do with how the lines are combined. Furthermore there are severe fundamental logical conflicts in the statements and some which are just plain false without even having to properly even examine them as I pointed out earlier. I've asked you time and time again for details or further explanation that would support the claims. For instance, what happened when Scheifele got injured and Wheelers become his short-term replacement. I suppose since you didn't have the answer I'll have to remind and elaborate. After a few games one out of the two wingers got dropped out and replaced from that line cause he wasn't able to contribute and play the game at desired level. Who again was it? Connor. So if he was so deserving, had way superior traffic, cycle and whatnot game, why did he got dropped out instead of Laine? Basically by reading your statements, you've been purposely leaving out every single factor that could have any significance to the discussion and hand-picking and gleaning on the ones that do serve the purpose. Have you ever heard of the term intellectual dishonesty by the way? Maybe you should google it out.

For the profile pict, kewl. Good to know you're a huge fan of Connor. Who would have ever guessed! xD
 
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LowLefty

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Where did you state this, are you frigging kidding me? Alright as you wish.






You started up with a statement saying that he was exhaust coming into the NHL (which isn't even true to be honest, Laine's muscles were adjusting from the summer work out - absolutely nothing to do with being physically exhaust) and continued with a notion that one needs to work his way up to the first line, which he gradually did by finishing second in the league in goals. So again another statement that holds zero validity. The lines aren't combined by how great an individual is doing, but so that they'll serve the team's best interest. Laine playing in the second the entire season pretty much tells he was there to spread the wealth, not because he wasn't "good enough". Oh and of course lets not forget the ludicrous conclusion of "the way NHL works, get used to it!" :D

Then as for Connor you said he earned his position while Ehlers was doing even better in the very first games scoring multi point games and being absolutely great. So applying the logic of who's the most deserving again doesn't work, but that team dynamics comes first. Furthermore again, Laine wasn't even given an opportunity to make his tryout for this line, so someone making a statement that Connor had better success (or even work ethic) is simply false.

Regarding the third paragraph, Laine needs to work better to fit the line, it doesn't even make any sense since Laine is a workhorse. He doesn't consume alcohol and has shown nothing but devotion of becoming the best player in the planet (wherever that leads is up to him). Then justifying utilization by a compliment veteran players release to the press in regards to a youngster? Seriously? Wonder how many generational talents the NHL would have if all Gretzky's public compliments were 100% valid.

As for Maurice not liking Laine and using or misusing him as he pleases, even I wouldn't go that far. If you feel like Connor had the better cycling or tight traffic game, that's fine. We won't really know how he would have excelled with lets say Ehlers and Little and with far, far less open space on the ice (created by team's two best line drivers). I've said it before and I'll say it again, Laine didn't have to be in the first line in the begin with to at least have similar aTOI that he had in his rookie year. P.Mo significantly cutting that down instead finding ways to use him more was a bad move on his part and did not serve the cause of helping Laine develop better. In the end, Laine crawled out of the mud on his own with little help from the management (apart from Chevy acquiring Stastny, who isn't even an elite center, just good enough).

To summarise, you clearly felt and indicated that Connor was more deserving to play in the first line that Laine cause he was better fit and if Laine was the better player he would have made it there. Meanwhile you fail to acknowledge the fact that Laine was never given a proper opportunity, you ignore the entire team dynamics (spreading firepower), the fact that Connor was indeed fed far more on the silver plate than most other players in the team and basically every other detail that could have anything to do with how the lines are combined. Furthermore there are severe fundamental logical conflicts in the statements and some which are just plain false without even having to properly even examine them as I pointed out earlier. I've asked you time and time again for details or further explanation that would support the claims. For instance, what happened when Scheifele got injured and Wheelers become his short-term replacement. I suppose since you didn't have the answer I'll have to remind and elaborate. After a few games one out of the two wingers got dropped out and replaced from that line cause he wasn't able to contribute and play the game at desired level. Who again was it? Connor. So if he was so deserving, had way superior traffic, cycle and whatnot game, why did he got dropped out instead of Laine? Basically by reading your statements, you've been purposely leaving out every single factor that could have any significance to the discussion and hand-picking and gleaning on the ones that do serve the purpose. Have you ever heard of the term intellectual dishonesty by the way? Maybe you should google it out.

For the profile pict, kewl. Good to know you're a huge fan of Connor. Who would have ever guessed! xD

That's a long response - thanks;)
So, in a nutshell, we disagree:

I believe Connor has made the necessary adjustments to his game to get him on the 1st line - which is where he was for most of the season and is likely where he will be when the season begins (that's an assumption).
I also believe Connor worked hard to get that spot including a few adjustments to his game that would help him better "fit" with wheels / Scheif. The adjustments, IMO, centered around improving certain aspects of his game to better support how the lines plays - ie; cycle game.
This is my opinion - this is why I believe Connor is on the top line. I don't believe it had anything to do with the "Silver Plate" you noted. In fact, the silver plate excuse sounds a little desperate.

On the other hand, you believe that Laine should be the one on the top line based on his skill and has never been given the "proper opportunity".

Personally, I believe the opportunity lies in the preparation you need to undergo in order to get to play with Wheels and Scheif.
The preparation appears to be developing a well rounded game - Scheif and Wheels have both commented on the fact that they really like Connors game and that it matches up very well with theirs. These 2 vets, like it or not, have a lot of pull in this organization - and IMO, they want Connor (assuming he continues to play well).
I'm simply trying to provide you with an angle or explanation that might explain why things are as they are.

Anyway, at his point, you and I are covering the same ground over and over again - why don't we just call it a day and agree to disagree:).
 

kelsier

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Aug 17, 2013
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That's a long response - thanks;)
So, in a nutshell, we disagree:

I believe Connor has made the necessary adjustments to his game to get him on the 1st line - which is where he was for most of the season and is likely where he will be when the season begins (that's an assumption).
I also believe Connor worked hard to get that spot including a few adjustments to his game that would help him better "fit" with wheels / Scheif. The adjustments, IMO, centered around improving certain aspects of his game to better support how the lines plays - ie; cycle game.
This is my opinion - this is why I believe Connor is on the top line. I don't believe it had anything to do with the "Silver Plate" you noted. In fact, the silver plate excuse sounds a little desperate.

On the other hand, you believe that Laine should be the one on the top line based on his skill and has never been given the "proper opportunity".

Personally, I believe the opportunity lies in the preparation you need to undergo in order to get to play with Wheels and Scheif.
The preparation appears to be developing a well rounded game - Scheif and Wheels have both commented on the fact that they really like Connors game and that it matches up very well with theirs. These 2 vets, like it or not, have a lot of pull in this organization - and IMO, they want Connor (assuming he continues to play well).
I'm simply trying to provide you with an angle or explanation that might explain why things are as they are.

Anyway, at his point, you and I are covering the same ground over and over again - why don't we just call it a day and agree to disagree:).

Well finally, there it is. Assumption. Unlike you previously stated of not assuming a single thing, now at least you've come around enough to admit that your claims are based on assumptions and personal beliefs. But still c'mon, you're discussing about a twenty year old youngster who somehow magically makes a huge adjustments to his game that enables him to be not only the perfect fit for the top line but also better than the rest. Be honest with yourself and just admit you cannot possible tell how anyone of the kids would have excelled given the same opportunity and accept the fact that not all were even granted that opportunity.

I simply don't understand how many times I need to tell you that I never said Laine should be on the top line. It's like knocking on a dead wood. I just wonder if you read even half of which you're responding to? Cause seriously, I'm not going as far as having to quote myself. From the very beginning I stated that you cannot possibly know who would have had the best results in a particular unit if given a chance to do so. Nevermind there being far more to the story since the topic of the day isn't boxing or golf but hockey - a team sport. Yet as opposed to providing anything concrete to support these claims, every time your mind starts to derail into meaningless matters like public statements, some well-rounded cycle and traffic game and so on. Nothing anyone does not already know by now.

Anyway, I certainly can agree to disagree as I always do if there's no logic behind something, let alone any factual evidence. Nevertheless, like I already said that's completely fine, I don't judge people who's views collide with mine.
 
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LowLefty

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7,300
13,109
Well finally, there it is. Assumption. Unlike you previously stated of not assuming a single thing, now at least you've come around enough to admit that your claims are based on assumptions and personal beliefs. But still c'mon, you're discussing about a twenty year old youngster who somehow magically makes a huge adjustments to his game that enables him to be not only the perfect fit for the top line but also better than the rest. Be honest with yourself and just admit you cannot possible tell how anyone of the kids would have excelled given the same opportunity and accept the fact that not all were even granted that opportunity.

I simply don't understand how many times I need to tell you that I never said Laine should be on the top line. It's like knocking on a dead wood. I just wonder if you read even half of which you're responding to? Cause seriously, I'm not going as far as having to quote myself. From the very beginning I stated that you cannot possibly know who would have had the best results in a particular unit if given a chance to do so. Nevermind there being far more to the story since the topic of the day isn't boxing or golf but hockey - a team sport. Yet as opposed to providing anything concrete to support these claims, every time your mind starts to derail into meaningless matters like public statements, some well-rounded cycle and traffic game and so on. Nothing anyone does not already know by now.

Anyway, I certainly can agree to disagree as I always do if there's no logic behind something, let alone any factual evidence. Nevertheless, like I already said that's completely fine, I don't judge people who's views collide with mine.

Well it's good to see that you finally came around - it was getting to be a bit like knocking on a dead wood for me.
 

Halberdier

Registered User
May 14, 2016
4,467
4,980
Uhh... I'm el confused.

How should I modify the list? Feel free to republish the list as you see fit (you can take out the being PPG at 18 while you're at it).

So Laine broke the all time point record for U18 player on mens WHC tournament. He broke it by doubling the amount of points made by someone 80 years ago.

Also in the process he broke the "modern day record" made by Jagr 26 years earlier by more than doubling it. Or if you wish, in only less than 2 games!



I don't remember whether it was Aavco who did maintain that list, but every time he brought up an updated list with that U19 second place on it, I kept reminding that all time second place as an U19 player is nice, but he was also virtually unbeatable #1 as U18 player. Everytime he chose to ignore that. But I guess that's the way it goes forever: the list will show up forever without that feat, and I will every time remind about that ;-)

Edit: oh noes with these automatic url matching by this forum software. I didn't want to link that video, but whole Sportsnet article about how Laine broke that Jagr record in just 2 games.
 
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