Pat Lafontaine resigns position with team

[FoSotC]

That TBN front page spread has already made its way to the main boards sticky on this whole ordeal. I guess it was only a matter of time

 

[machpo]

Don't know who would come on board, but I know one GM that would submit to that kind of management structure, Jay Feaster:



http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=681495

I wonder if Patty didn't have something like this in mind when he signed up for the job?

I don't think that's a good comparison. I love Patty, but he has zero relevant front-office/gm/drafting experience. It's one thing to to agree to these sort of shared duties w/someone like Burke who has done this stuff forever, but it's quite another to agree to have your decisions vetted by someone with nowhere near the background and experience you have.

I don't know, this is all so odd. I personally can't imagine Murray taking the job under that stipulation. Maybe Pegula really did screw this up and tell Patty one thing while doing another. At this point, though, I don't think the one tweet that bleach keeps repeating (clearly a leak from Lafontaine, imo) is enough evidence yet to base any solid opinions on.

 

[Paxon]

We don't accept that Pegula gave Patty final say. The only time Patty had final say was when their was a void in the GM position ... after Murray was hired Lafontaine himself stated it was Murrays call.

You don't have to accept it but the reality is LaFontaine said in an interview that the buck stops with him on all hockey decisions. That was after he hired Murray. It's more reasonable to assume Pegula led him to being under that impression than it is to assume he didn't, especially since all supporting evidence indicates that to be the case. Supporting evidence includes the tweet referenced in this thread, Pegula offering LaFontaine the GM job and then an even more powerful job, etc.

 

[Karate Johnson*]

Isn't Sakic one?

He was. He got a bigger role this year.

I don't know what they call him, but Sakic makes all the decisions there now. Their "GM" has no power.



I guess my point was it's not a normal position an seems to be a show of lack of faith in your GM.

 

[Beerz]

You don't have to accept it but the reality is LaFontaine said in an interview that the buck stops with him on all hockey decisions. That was after he hired Murray. It's more reasonable to assume Pegula led him to being under that impression than it is to assume he didn't, especially since all supporting evidence indicates that to be the case. Supporting evidence includes the tweet referenced in this thread, Pegula offering LaFontaine the GM job and then an even more powerful job, etc.

Id love it if you could point me to this interview because it would certainly change my opinion on this matter seeing how everything I have seen and remember points to Lafontaine stating Murray would have the reigns.

I honestly believe this has nothing to do with Murray and had more to do with Lafontaine and upper upper management as the news reporter suggested.

 

[minuteater]

That TBN front page spread has already made its way to the main boards sticky on this whole ordeal. I guess it was only a matter of time

And it's a Bucky article that gets the front page nonetheless

 

[Paxon]

Id love it if you could point me to this interview because it would certainly change my opinion on this matter seeing how everything I have seen and remember points to Lafontaine stating Murray would have the reigns.

I honestly believe this has nothing to do with Murray and had more to do with Lafontaine and upper upper management as the news reporter suggested.

I'll try and find the interview tomorrow. I'm quite sure it exists, though he did also say seemingly contradictory things in other interviews so we're looking at a situation where it was probably unclear who really held or was supposed to hold the final say. Seeing as how LaFontaine quit (or was fired) over not having final say, he was surely under the impression that he should have it. I don't see a situation where Pegula doesn't take some of the blame for not making it crystal clear what everyone's responsibilities and authority were.

If his issue was with upper management, that still implies to me the problem was upper management sided with Murray's plan to trade Miller etc rather than LaFontaine's doomed plan to keep him, which ultimately means LaFontaine did not have the final say over hockey operations.

An earlier tweet from IIRC a legit reporter stated a front office source from another team claimed to have called about acquiring Miller only to have LaFontaine in charge of the conversation and claiming that they weren't shopping Miller. At the same time, Murray was shopping Miller. So it's possible imo that LaFontaine was fired rather than resigned, due to interfering with GM to GM conversations. Even if LaFontaine really did have final say, it'd be ridiculous for both him to be working the phones as well.

 

[MagnumForce2]

Does anyone think this could have been as simple as Lafontaine telling Murray that he wants him to re-sign Miller....Murray being new, unsure of what to do and having a different opinion talks to some of the higher ups in Pegula's circle about this....they inform Murray that you are the GM, in charge and it's your decision to make, not his, on whether or not to trade Miller....and he did it without consulting with or telling Lafontaine. And/Or could Lafontaine have given a verbal promise to Miller and/or Ott that they would be re-signed and they weren't offered a contract. I am just fishing and trying to make sense out of this lol

 

[Karate Johnson*]

I highly doubt this happened because Murray is a new GM. He has been doing this for 20+ years and has an uncle to ask questions to.

LaFontaine wanted to make decisions. He wasn't going to. I think it worked this way:


LaFontaine wanted to be involved in decisions

Ted Black went to his friend Terry Pegasus and said "I like Pat, but he isn't qualified to make these decisions, we hired Tim Murray for a reason"

LaFontaine either wasn't OK with that, or caught wins of Ted Blacks comments.......

Bottom Line.... It's a good thing. Pat can't run a team because why would he be able to?

 

[wunderpanda]

Does anyone think this could have been as simple as Lafontaine telling Murray that he wants him to re-sign Miller....Murray being new, unsure of what to do and having a different opinion talks to some of the higher ups in Pegula's circle about this....they inform Murray that you are the GM, in charge and it's your decision to make, not his, on whether or not to trade Miller....and he did it without consulting with or telling Lafontaine. And/Or could Lafontaine have given a verbal promise to Miller and/or Ott that they would be re-signed and they weren't offered a contract. I am just fishing and trying to make sense out of this lol

Makes more sense than some of the dystopian dramas, post concussion lunacy, family secrets, Muckler puppet conspiracies and other theories of unhealthy dissent that have been posted

 

[Sabretip]

I think him coming here and bringing in Nolan salvaged the most important commodity this team has right now..... It's youth and team spirit. I felt Regier was destroying both.

There was nothing left to salvage IMO - the player quotes in the wake of the Regier/Rolston firing and LaFontaine/Nolan hiring all attested to that. Both LaFontaine (whose reputation was renowned amongst players) and Nolan instilled a new sense of hope and trust that they were committed to teamwork and winning and that everyone would work together. More importantly, they each represented inspirational figures that others could rally behind. Regier & Rolston were the opposite of that - and if Murray lets Nolan go, I'm not so sure that Murray's style or demeanor will help keep what Pat & Ted brought.

No, I'll wait on the official Sabres statement of yanking Pat around before continuing.

Fat chance the Sabres will issue anything "official" that will tell the true story...

SOMETHING Patty said or did started all this today and led to his resignation. I can't see what it is that wouldn't put him in kind of a bad light.

More likely, it's what he wasn't allowed to say. If Bucky's and Benigni's reports are accurate, he felt left out of the process/discussions and wasn't consulted as part of the decision-making process on the Miller trade. He obviously didn't sign on as a PR stunt nor did he want the "emperor" role Pegula said wouldn't occur. He espoused a managemment team that would collaborate on decisions - apparently, he didn't get to weigh in or have his input taken as seriously as he thought it was supposed to when Pegula made him President.

Higher than Murray would be any one of:
Ken Sawyer
Cliff Benson
Ted Black
Joe Battista
Craig Patrick (probably not, but he is still there)

If you recall, Regier and Black each went to great lengths in several WGR interviews to explain that Black was not Regier's boss and that they both equally reported to Pegula. By extension, one would expect that Black is not above Murray either.

Thread of the year

It's chapter 1 in the book LeBrun is clamoring for

Pierre LeBrun @Real_ESPNLeBrun 8h
Please tell me someone is going to write a book on the 2013-14 Buffalo Sabres season.

I'm anxious to read his and McKenzie's analysis and findings on what really happened.

I'm not even sure what Pegula's inner circle and Lafontaine would be butting heads about...

Not one thing makes sense in the whole ordeal

Well, Sawyer is still there and he was a strong advocate of Regier - it wouldn't be a stretch to think he disagreed with Pegula's decision to fire Regier and possibly harbor some resentment with Regier's replacements.

I hope Tim Murray can navigate this "inner circle" moving forward.

Birds of a feather flock together - and human nature is to seek familiarity in things. Ergo, the odds of Murray replacing Nolan and bringing in some of his associates from Ottawa / Anaheim in the offseason seem good.

How much power did Pat really expect to have? The job of the GM is to shape the roster and coaching staff to what he thinks will be a winning hockey team. Pat's job was to hire the GM.

Adam Benigni ‏@AdamBenigni 4m

talked to more than a half dozen sources... common theme = power struggle and subsequent rift... @wgrz

Adam Benigni ‏@AdamBenigni 3m

and that a good portion of this falls on LaFontaine how he tried to use power within organization... @wgrz

Adam Benigni ‏@AdamBenigni 1m

Told LaFontaine eventually felt cut out... and situation deteriorated... That's the consensus of what I've been told @wgrz

The initial PC revealed that Pegula trusted LaFontaine's judgement on how to restructure the team: he deferred to Pat on the hire of Nolan and then again on the hiring of Murray and Patrick. Pat said in his intro PC that he'd oversee the entire hockey operations side and in the Murray PC, that he wanted a team of management where the GM is not alone in making decisions (justifying why Patrick was added).

The close timing between the Miller trade and the resignation points to the trade not being made by committee as LaFontaine probably wanted it to be.

Good lord, this still isn't ironed out.

Don't expect it to be for several months - like the 7-1-07 debacle and the Muckler/Nolan/Hasek feud, there are probably a lot of different layers and tidbits that will come to light with time and more reporters looking into it.

We hope Murray will be a good GM, he hasn't yet become one

Amen.

People defending LaFontaine need to read this article.

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304023504577319912036433148

Patty has some serous personal issues that he needs to fix.

How in the world do you read that and come out of it thinking it makes him look bad

Someone works with Patty and calls his actions "cowardly" and you see nothing that makes him look bad.

Milbury never worked with LaFontaine - his rant in the article is nothing more than a biased opinion of someone defending his former employer, Wang.

Pat LaFontaine was hired for a mostly meaningless advisory role with the Islanders and quit when the general manager was fired a couple months after being hired... in the summer. It was an absolutely absurd bit of management and LaFontaine rightly wanted no part.

"I believe you treat people fairly,"

That quote in a nutshell is telling of why LaFontaine won't tolerate games that mismanage people. He felt Wang didn't treat Smith fairly in the Islander situation and wanted no part of a team operating that way; it appears likewise that he may have had a problem with Pegula promising something when he got the President title and buy-in to the committee approach of running the team, only to then get left out.

He was promised the power of the GM, but declined that power. However, when it came down to it, he wanted the power without the title.

He was offered the title of GM - and all of the responsibilities that come with it. However, he was pretty clear when asked about the President title that it meant he'd have oversight and input on all hockey-related matters. I never read or heard anything that changed that once the GM was hired; all that came out of the Murray PC was that the trio of LaFontaine/Murray/Patrick would work together with ownership and scouting dept. in personnel decisions.

Great news.... The Chicken Wing is moving into the Golden Age...

Many will hate him doing so but I'm all for Bucky delving into this and finding out what happened, like he did in the Drury/Briere mess.

No GM is going to let someone else build their team. Sorry not happening.

Seriously. What GM would ever agree to come on board with that sort of setup?

I wonder if Patty didn't have something like this in mind when he signed up for the job?

It's exactly what he had in mind - he even referred often to the Bruins' situation with Neely working together with Chiarelli and their management team. Neely isn't doing all the day-to-day duties of a GM but he is consulted on personnel decisions.

Whether you think it makes sense or not, LaFontaine was clearly under the impression that he had final say and could overrule the GM. All relevant evidence and contextual clues point to Pegula putting LaFontaine under that impression. If you find it ridiculous, then you simply find the position he was hired to fill and the situation Pegula created ridicuous.

Well-stated.

 

[Chainshot]

Wow. Go out for the day and all sorts of things happen.

 

[enthusiast]

I'd wondered where you'd been, Chain.


Nice post Tip

 

[Sabretip]

Here comes Bucky - love him or hate him, he still makes some common sense points and knows how to describe what most fans feel:

LaFontaine loved his gig with the Sabres. It was his dream job. He said so numerous times during his 109-day stay after assuming command. He was intent on getting the right pieces in place. He felt like he was home. His family was prepared to build a life here. He was obsessed with making it work in Buffalo, for Buffalo.

Why would he lie?

Well, I’m guessing that he wasn’t lying. And that left me to wonder Saturday that there was more to this doozy, that he actually was fired after losing a power struggle with people in the front office. No matter, clearly his relationship with Terry Pegula & Co. quickly imploded before he walked, or was pushed, out the door.

Honestly, I’m not sure what, or whom, to believe anymore. The persistent turmoil that was evident before LaFontaine arrived appeared to be tapering off. The Sabres appeared to have a good, strong leader. By all accounts, LaFontaine brought intelligence, class and integrity the organization desperately needed.

And now this?

Goodness, gracious.

Nothing comes easy to the Sabres, who under LaFontaine were making progress in terms of restoring whatever credibility they had left.

Pardon me for having too many questions and not enough answers, but that’s what happens when trying to make sense of something that doesn’t make sense.

Right when it looks like the Sabres are going in the right direction, the organization makes a U-turn. Right when it looks like the front office found serenity, chaos returns.

If you think the Sabres appear to be a dysfunctional franchise, imagine what people are thinking outside of Buffalo. Seriously, why would anyone want to play here?

Pegula talked about winning championships when he purchased the team, but instead watched his team spend more money and win less. He fired a coach he should have kept, kept a general manager he should have fired. Finally, he made a wholesale change that included LaFontaine at the top of the hockey department.

It’s strange now, but LaFontaine was hired to make sense of this mess

http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/sabres-nhl/dysfunction-returns-to-the-sabres-front-office-20140301

I don't doubt for a second that we'll be reading similar reactions / conclusions from the national media, many of whom were just as skeptical and jaded about the Sabres' operations before LaFontaine was hired.

 

[sba]

Bucky isn't impartial, his "source" is now gone.

 

[JamieG]

Maybe we are all off target.

Maybe it was a LaFontaine/Black feud?

Barnaby is saying Nolan will be gone soon and it is a soap opera of a mess. I believe him. He has connections to Buffalo. Heck, I heard Brad May on a Toronto radio station, May said he knew what was happening but wasnt at liberty to say. I don't find it hard to believe Barnaby talks to ex teammates like Ray and May.

At least this new theory is better than Dreggers "uh, Sabres tell me nothing is wrong at all!"

But I still believe Barnaby the most. I guess we will see soon based on what happens with Nolan.

 

[dotcommunism]

Bucky isn't impartial, his "source" is now gone.

Bucky's still grinding his axe regarding a guy who was fired months ago

 

[RazielMoshman]

Is anyone here surprised by the Lafontaine move? If so don't be, what Patty said is right on the money, he was brought in as a transition guy, he never gave up his old job and intended to go back. We have a GM and solid front office team so transition done and the Miller trade was the bookend to that. That was public knowledge at the time.

Not sure why this is surprising. Sure I expected it in the offseason but I did expect it. Buffalo News acting like *******s once again I see.

 

[jBuds]

Regardless of what happens and what leaks, this leaves a piss poor portrait of an organization that is floundering.

Put it this way: these next three drafts better be grand****ing slams. Or we are in for a funk bordering on the intolerable for multiple decades. Yes... DECADES.

 

[jBuds]

Is anyone here surprised by the Lafontaine move? If so don't be, what Patty said is right on the money, he was brought in as a transition guy, he never gave up his old job and intended to go back. We have a GM and solid front office team so transition done and the Miller trade was the bookend to that. That was public knowledge at the time.

Not sure why this is surprising. Sure I expected it in the offseason but I did expect it. Buffalo News acting like *******s once again I see.

Pat departing doesn't happen three months after arrival without a massive disturbance occurring. Don't be foolish.

 

[Karate Johnson*]

Regardless of what happens and what leaks, this leaves a piss poor portrait of an organization that is floundering.

Put it this way: these next three drafts better be grand****ing slams. Or we are in for a funk bordering on the intolerable for multiple decades. Yes... DECADES.

The next 3 drafts have to be incredible or we will be bad for 20+ years? Do you realize how over dramatic that statement is?

We are in the exact same situation, in regards to the rebuilding of the team, that we were 48 hours ago. Pat leaving changed nothing, except maybe now there isn't a distraction of him trying to control Murray.

But yeah, if you think the next 3 drafts are going to make us or break us for 20+ years maybe just chill out a little. Most of the guys drafted this year will be retired by then.

 

[MayDay]

Is anyone here surprised by the Lafontaine move? If so don't be, what Patty said is right on the money, he was brought in as a transition guy, he never gave up his old job and intended to go back. We have a GM and solid front office team so transition done and the Miller trade was the bookend to that. That was public knowledge at the time.

Nothing LaFontaine said publicly seemed to me that he only intended to be here as a temporary transition guy.

He talked a lot about want to help build this team over the next few years, about being involved in trying to attract players and events to Buffalo, etc.

And the timing of this is crazy. If LaFontaine were really leaving amicably and on hid own terms, it wouldn't have happened now. He would have waited until after the trade deadline at least, and probably not until after the draft. And he wouldn't have left abruptly without even making a statement or appearance. There would have been a press conference.

 

[aceface33]

This gives me a very low opinion of Pat LaFontaine.

You're not happy with the role you have in the organization now? Fine, but you know it looks bad if you resign right after trading the franchise player and days before the trading deadline. For the sake of the organization that put so much faith in you wait until the summer and then resign saying you did what you had to do to put the Sabres on the right track and are now handing things over to Tim Murray.

How can you have a ****ing power struggle with a GM you yourself hired a month ago. Who does that??? And of course it's the Sabres who come out looking like ****. Sigh.

 

[Chainshot]

This gives me a very low opinion of Pat LaFontaine.

You're not happy with the role you have in the organization now? Fine, but you know it looks bad if you resign right after trading the franchise player and days before the trading deadline. For the sake of the organization that put so much faith in you wait until the summer and then resign saying you did what you had to do to put the Sabres on the right track and are now handing things over to Tim Murray.

How can you have a ****ing power struggle with a GM you yourself hired a month ago. Who does that??? And of course it's the Sabres who come out looking like ****. Sigh.

After reading a few things on this, this is pretty much were I shake out on these things.

 

[chadthestampede]

It's beyond me why anyone still reads TBN. Look at that drivel. It's all desperate pandering to fans blinded by nostalgia, and the worst part is that it works.