Out of Town Thread Part XXIII

[Andrei79]

It's interesting how established pro star athletes can suffer personal and interpersonal setbacks that drops their level of play either permanently or temporarily and it's accepted that those non-physical setbacks affected their game, yet young players in their most crucial years of development apparently wouldn't be affected unless they "never had it" to begin with.

 

[Runner77]

This logic is used all the time but it's not always so cut and dry.

If you put salt instead of sugar into the cake batter, no matter what you do after that, you can't salvage the cake. So when Therrien and Lefebvre ****ed up Scherbaks development, there's not much LA can do after he's spoiled.

He was handled by poor coaches no doubt however, his work ethic is what it is. As is his hockey IQ. You can't draw water from a stone either.

 

[Andrei79]

How many players coached and developed by Kevin Constantine have gone on to have success in the NHL?

From what I understand, he's more about winning in the WHL, then hej is about developing

So is it possible that Scherbak's development may have been compromised before he even got to the NHL?


I agree that this team has had issues with development - but not every player is capable of being developed.

For years I've said that fans have a distorted view of what the AHL is...

Most players who play in the NHL, either bypass the AHL all together or play limited amounts of time in the AHL.

The idea that the AHL is a breeding ground for perspective NHL players, I've never really believed in.

Sure there are examples like Tomas Plekanec...

But there are tons of examples of players who didn't play in the AHL as well.




It's so backwards

Yeah, it's good question to ask actually. It kind of makes me wonder sometimes if Russians arent better off staying in the KHL until they're ready rather than playing the CHL. There's probably value there for defensemen, but if your playstyle is based on creativity and technical skills, maybe the best place to work on that in your 16-23 years might be where it's better encouraged.

On that last part, yeah... Were talking Russians here, but theyre not even the ones getting the worst treatment, even in hockey.

As far as the AHL goes. This kind of twofold. Honestly, I can find numerous examples of good to great players that spent significant amounts of games there, but this is also where likely good vs awful coaching would make a difference in the amount of time in the minors. Both AHL and NHL coaching actually, because if both of your staffs are weak, then youre not giving yourself much of a chance to help these kids.

 

[417]

All my point is, taking the player completely out of the picture.

But you can't remove the player from the equation since the player is largely responsible for where his career ultimately ends up.

Just because a prospect doesn't make it in another organization isn't an exoneration for his development. It doesn't mean that his development wasn't ruined or the player wasn't mishandled.

IMO, it probably means he was never going to make it no matter where he was drafted.

I don't buy that teams/coaches can sabotage players careers to this degree.

This "poisoned well" theory doesn't really fly with me personally.

You will never know because we can't rewrite history. But I just hate the posts that use it as vindication for Therrien and Lefebvre when their track record wasn't very good.

In the end, Lefebvre and Therrien were fired for lack of results and Scherbak is someone they didn't get results out of. I don't think the Kings games have any value at all in the debate.

Yeah I certainly don't think Therrien and Lefebvre should be exonerated from anything...they were both terrible.

But maybe we should re-examine the way we look at the roles of coaches.

They don't have the power to make a player someone he's not. I'd venture to say that the biggest obstacle in Scherbak's career so far is the player himself.

Sure, we can look at Therrien and Lefebvre...but why stop their?

What about Kevin Constantine? What about his coaches in Russia when he was a youth player? Do they not all have a part to play in the career of a player?

 

[Runner77]

WTH is going on with William Nylander?

 

[Runner77]

What's next for Nylander, silver grills?

 

[Habs]

He was handled by poor coaches no doubt however, his work ethic is what it is. As is his hockey IQ. You can't draw water from a stone either.

Don't tell Thompson , Peca or Weal.

 

[Runner77]

Don't tell Thompson , Peca or Weal.

Where else will those 5th and 6th round picks come from at the TDL?

 

[habsgirl5000]

WTH is going on with William Nylander?

i think we have more important issues to be concerned about, then what a leaf does on vacation,

our players probably do worse, its just not posted on social media

 

[Runner77]

i think we have more important issues to be concerned about, then what a leaf does on vacation,

our players probably do worse, its just not posted on social media

It was just posted for levity, not as a cause for concern.

Whatever rocks your boat.

 

[The Real Timo]

Don't know if this belongs to this thread but here is an interview with Scherbak. It is messed up. Unfortunately not surprising.

Scherbak tire à boulets rouges sur le CH

 

[habsgirl5000]

I am sure plenty of rookies feel the same way, regardless of their nationality,

We don't give kids enough opportunities,

Out with the old, in with the new, should be the new motto

 

[sheed36]

Aaron Ward just now on TSN690. I never played for Therrien but I heard that Therrien was a prick.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Aaron Ward just now on TSN690. I never played for Therrien but I heard that Therrien was a prick.

Watch one episode of 24CH and it's so apparent.

 

[1909]

I am sure plenty of rookies feel the same way, regardless of their nationality,

We don't give kids enough opportunities,

Out with the old, in with the new, should be the new motto

Really ? Ask KK or Mete or Juulsen or Lehkonen..... When they deserve ice time, they got it.

 

[LaP]

Aaron Ward just now on TSN690. I never played for Therrien but I heard that Therrien was a prick.

Who did not?

 

[Adam Michaels]

Aaron Ward just now on TSN690. I never played for Therrien but I heard that Therrien was a prick.

The return of the Broad Street Bullies in Philadelphia. Only the bully is behind the bench and not on the ice.

 

[Runner77]

The return of the Broad Street Bullies in Philadelphia. Only the bully is behind the bench and not on the ice.

The fact that a dinosaur like Therrien has found employment with an NHL club proves that the NHL remains a friends-helping-friends network.

 

[peate]

Would be hilarious if the Flyers make the post season and we don't.

 

[Adam Michaels]

The fact that a dinosaur like Therrien has found employment with an NHL club proves that the NHL remains a friends-helping-friends network.

Pretty much.

A few new bloods have entered the last few years, but it's always been this way.

 

[LaP]

It was just posted for levity, not as a cause for concern.

Whatever rocks your boat.

To be fair it still looks better than Drouin's haircut ... or lack of.

 

[Andrei79]

Would be hilarious if the Flyers make the post season and we don't.

Why ? They have more talent.

 

[peate]

Why ? They have more talent.

Possibly, though I was doing a coaching parallel. We're still under construction.

 

[Milhouse40]

The fact that a dinosaur like Therrien has found employment with an NHL club proves that the NHL remains a friends-helping-friends network.

One of his very best friend is the only one blind enough to hire him. He was pretty much out of it, his name wasn't even mentioned in most job opening. I'm sure he would have stay at RDS and make a career of it if the Habs were not forced to hire some french coach in 2012.

 

[japhi]

That's not exclusive to the Montreal Canadiens.

There are teams who, without any scruples, do not draft/trade/sign Russian players.

This has long been accepted in NHL culture...

One Russian taken in the first round this year tells you all you need to know. The idea that Montreal is anti Russian is hilarious. The whole leauge has been moving away from Russians for at least a decade. Vegas is about to blow through TWO top KHL guys in their only two years in the league lol. Lots of teams haven’t had a significant Russian player in decades, in some cases ever.

I’d be ok with the Habs never drafting a Russian player in the first three rounds again.