Orpik and Niskanen vs Two Potatos

Zoidberg Jesus

Trotzkyist
Oct 25, 2011
3,814
0
Last offseason, Maple Leafs fans were posed a tough question: did Dave Nonis have a better offseason than a potato? Today, Caps fans face a similarly difficult dilemma. GM Brian MacLellan earlier today signed Brooks Orpik and Matt Niskanen to 5 year, 27.5M and 7 year, 40.25M contracts, respectively. Caps fans are forced to wonder, was this the right move, or would GMBM have been better off offering those contracts to these two russet potatoes?

russet-potato.jpg


Clearly, this question requires some serious thought. I've provided a rundown of these players/tubers for your convenience.

Brooks Orpik
LH Defenseman
6'2, 219 lbs, 33 years old

Orpik is a defenseman know for his physicality and leadership, as well as his numerous injuries and declining play. Brooks had sports hernia surgery in 2011 (you know, what Green and Laich had), and missed time this year due to a concussion and a knee injury. To be fair, Orpik played the shutdown minutes in Pittsburgh... sort of like how Erskine played shutdown minutes two years ago... He also led Penguins defensemen in hits and blocked shots, which as Penguins fans will tell is because he takes himself out of position chasing hits, and has to block shots because he's not good enough positionally to prevent them.

Matt Niskanen
RH Defenseman
6'0, 209 lbs, 27 years old

Niskanen had a career year this season, scoring 46 points after four straight seasons without topping 21. Did this have something to do with his 1031 PDO, 5th amongst the 120 defensemen to play 60+ games and 15+ a night? Perhaps. Does the severe drop off of his numbers when away from Crosby and Malkin further suggest he's not going to repeat his numbers with the Caps? Maybe. Whatever the case, the player three years removed from being a throw-in in the James Neal trade is now the Caps' fourth highest paid player.

Potato and Potahto
Russet Potatos
6 ounces each

The Potato Brothers are American farm boys with all the personality, candor, and insight you expect from a North American hockey player, not to mention their trademark versatility. You can fry them up for Lars, ferment them into vodka to help Ovechkin forget he's stuck here for another 7 years, even wire them up to power a nightlight for MacLellan's "deep thinking" in his hammock. The one minor weakness is that as inanimate objects incapable of movement, just like John Erskine they cannot actually play hockey. Depending on whether or not being consumed counts as retirement, they may need to be put on LTIR for the duration of their contracts.

So there you have it, the duds versus the spuds. Who is more deserving? Be sure to check in next time, when I compare the relative merits of Brooks Laich and a red potato as our new second line center.
 

HeyMattyB

Sports bring out the worst in everyone.
Aug 20, 2010
2,301
2,534
Philadelphia, PA
Three (sincere) questions (because I do not remember):

1) What was our starting defense on opening night?
2) What was our defense at the worst of injuries?
3) What was our defense at the end of the season?
 

Liberati0n*

Guest
Three (sincere) questions (because I do not remember):

1) What was our starting defense on opening night?
2) What was our defense at the worst of injuries?
3) What was our defense at the end of the season?

4) What do all of the above questions really have to do with this thread?
 

Ovechkins Wodka

Registered User
Dec 1, 2007
17,624
7,319
DC
whats overpaying the 2 by a combined 3 mill or so, not like we could find a better use for it. Im thrilled with our new D.
 

BrooklynCapsFan

No more choking!
Oct 23, 2002
17,872
60
Brooklyn, New York
I guess I shouldn't be, but I'm pretty surprised at how angry people are about the team's defense getting significantly better

It's a commitment to mediocrity for the next five years. There's not a special dman on the team or in the pipeline for the foreseeable future. One could argue that none of Carlson, Alzner, Niskanen or Orpik are top pairing quality dmen.

We're better but we're going nowhere. Even worse, buying our way to the next step isnt an option anymore.

We're a playoff team that loses in 6 in a good year for the next five years.
 

Halpysback*

Guest
I think any time the Edmonton Oilers do a significantly better job of signing two FA defensemen than you do you have to go with potatoe
 

MyCapsCap

Registered User
Apr 19, 2014
43
0
I don't know anything but I like the signings but don't really like the length of the contracts or the money.
 

Ovechkins Wodka

Registered User
Dec 1, 2007
17,624
7,319
DC
It's a commitment to mediocrity for the next five years. There's not a special dman on the team or in the pipeline for the foreseeable future. One could argue that none of Carlson, Alzner, Niskanen or Orpik are top pairing quality dmen.

We're better but we're going nowhere. Even worse, buying our way to the next step isnt an option anymore.

We're a playoff team that loses in 6 in a good year for the next five years.

one could also argue we have 6 top 4 d-man now. Im not sure you understand how much a upgrade that is over the AHL crap we were sending out. Or you can argue Green is top pairing being a norris finalist a couple times, Niskanen just lead Dmen in +/-, and orpik carlson and alnzer all have played top line min.

Sorry we werent gonna land Doughty or PK subban today if thats what you think we need
 

g00n

Retired Global Mod
Nov 22, 2007
30,644
14,749
The board up this board's ass has a board up its ass
 

BrooklynCapsFan

No more choking!
Oct 23, 2002
17,872
60
Brooklyn, New York
one could also argue we have 6 top 4 d-man now. Im not sure you understand how much a upgrade that is over the AHL crap we were sending out. Or you can argue Green is top pairing being a norris finalist a couple times, Niskanen just lead Dmen in +/-, and orpik carlson and alnzer all have played top line min.

Sorry we werent gonna land Doughty or PK subban today if thats what you think we need

I can't think of a real contender that doesnt have a #1 or two.

If you're going to spend, spend on great players. We'd have been better off throwing big bucks at Stastny and whatevers left at Fayne.
 

Cfdsiv

Registered User
Mar 3, 2004
9
0
It's been 32 years since the Caps upgraded their defense in one day like they did today.

Carlson, Alzner, Orlov, Green, Niskanen, Orpik, Erskine with call-ups like Schmidt, Kundratek and Carrick... the Caps are lot deeper on the blueline now.
 

Zoidberg Jesus

Trotzkyist
Oct 25, 2011
3,814
0
one could also argue we have 6 top 4 d-man now. Im not sure you understand how much a upgrade that is over the AHL crap we were sending out. Or you can argue Green is top pairing being a norris finalist a couple times, Niskanen just lead Dmen in +/-, and orpik carlson and alnzer all have played top line min.

Sorry we werent gonna land Doughty or PK subban today if thats what you think we need

Yeah, Green is gone. It's either that, or he stays and we make no additions whatsoever to the forwards.

Marcus Johansson ($2.000m) / Nicklas Backstrom ($6.700m) / Alex Ovechkin ($9.538m)
Evgeny Kuznetsov ($0.900m) / Brooks Laich ($4.500m) / Troy Brouwer ($3.667m)
Jason Chimera ($2.000m) / Eric Fehr ($1.500m) / Joel Ward ($3.000m)
Jay Beagle ($0.900m) / Michael Latta ($0.575m) / Tom Wilson ($0.894m)
Aaron Volpatti ($0.575m) /

Those are the forward lines if nothing changes. That's utter crap. No defense could win us a Cup with an offense like that, especially one made of three second pairings. If Green is traded for picks and prospects, then basically we've downgraded from Green to Niskanen, and then gave Orpik that awful contract instead of trading for someone like Gorges or Gunnar who would be better and cheaper. It's just indefensible.
 

Zoidberg Jesus

Trotzkyist
Oct 25, 2011
3,814
0
I guess I shouldn't be, but I'm pretty surprised at how angry people are about the team's defense getting significantly better

What's crazy to me is that our D has been so bad for so long that people are willing to accept these contracts and brush aside all the outside voices telling them how awful they are. I guess I'm just not old enough to have the Stockholm Syndrome so much of the fanbase has.
 

Holtbyisms

Matt Irwin is a legit talent
Jul 1, 2012
6,990
3,661
Bedford, PA
I absolutely love how the same people who complain about us doing nothing are the ones who complain when we go all in and improve the team more than I can remember in a very long time.

Also the absolute ignorance in thinking one can simply throw money at any FA on the market and they'll come play for your team is laughable. I challenge you to listen to a fair amount of FA pressers/conference calls and tell me what the vast majority of them single out as a reason they turned down more money to go where they went (ie: Niskanen). This is the NHL and nobody is holding ESPN specials about taking their talents to D.C. Is about comfort, family and familiarity. Those both played a part in our two D signings.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.
 

NobodyBeatsTheWiz

Happy now?
Jun 26, 2004
23,422
1,973
The Burbs
It's a commitment to mediocrity for the next five years. There's not a special dman on the team or in the pipeline for the foreseeable future. One could argue that none of Carlson, Alzner, Niskanen or Orpik are top pairing quality dmen.

We're better but we're going nowhere. Even worse, buying our way to the next step isnt an option anymore.

We're a playoff team that loses in 6 in a good year for the next five years.

It's really not. This is the deepest Caps' defense since the Cup Finals run. We've already seen Alzner-Carlson be an excellent playoff top pair and sure, you could argue that Carlson individually isn't top pairing quality, but it's a very poor argument. How much will they improve with a coach that's not only competent, but elite in developing defensemen?

Next year, the lineup looks something like this:

Ovechkin-Backstrom-Kuznetsov
Burakovsky-Johansson-Brouwer
Chimera-Laich-Wilson
4LW-4C-4RW

Alzner-Carlson
Orpik-Niskanen
Orlov-Carrick

Holtby
Peters

With a no rise in the Cap, there's slightly under $20M in space to sign Holtby, Kuznetsov, and Johansson (RFAs) plus fill any holes. Plenty of flexibility to add good pieces and/or replace poor fits.

Today didn't doom the Caps at all.

It's interesting how this board works, sometimes. Plenty don't want to judge Niskanen based on one season, but want to do so with Orpik and Stralman.

Just relax and let things play out. It's the first significant investment we've had on defense in decades, and it just might work out.
 

Liberati0n*

Guest
How the **** is it hard to comprehend that some people want them to make the right moves, not just moves? Wanting them to do things doesn't mean you're a hypocrite if you complain when they do the wrong ones.
 

NobodyBeatsTheWiz

Happy now?
Jun 26, 2004
23,422
1,973
The Burbs
What's crazy to me is that our D has been so bad for so long that people are willing to accept these contracts and brush aside all the outside voices telling them how awful they are. I guess I'm just not old enough to have the Stockholm Syndrome so much of the fanbase has.

What outside voices? The idiots on TSN and NHL network? Those guys actually fit the old GMGM axiom, "if they knew the game, they'd be in it". I trust Barry Trotz far more than any of those talking heads.

They were over-payments, sure. But you've got to pay to improve on the UFA market, unless the UFAs have already decided to sign with you (see Vanek, Thomas and Ehrhoff, Christian), and there's always a way to rid yourself of players that don't work out.
 

Devil Dancer

Registered User
Jan 21, 2006
18,460
5,447
These two signings are so different, it's not appropriate to analyze them together. One is good to excellent, the other bad to terrible.
 

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