Randyne
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- May 20, 2012
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2nd should've been 1st. 13 biased voters gave him 5th place, incredible, best player on Earth they placed on 5th place...
One trick pony Ovechkin leading the league in ES assists
- Thread starter illpucks
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- Feb 10, 2010
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In the season where Ovie scored 65 goals and won the Art Ross, one guy left Ovie off his ballot entirely.
NHL Stats
The leading point getters have dominated the Hart and Lindsay awards including notable high assist men like Thornton and Sedin. Then the leading goalscorers have a marginal edge over the leading assist men.
If you want to give a slight edge to a player with more goals over assists then go ahead. Of course other factors like linemates, team support, 2-way also need to be considered.
Alexander the Gr8
Registered User
These guys scored upwards of 80 assists per season in their prime, that's what I mean. You would not get any Hart consideration as a playmaker if you only racked up 50 assists in a normal season. 50 goals on the other hand will get you at least in the conversation.
SI90
Registered User
The sport always goes on but it’s going suck when OVI hangs em up. What a pleasure it’s been to watch this guy dominate for 15 years and counting.
You are throwing out numbers without any context.
Look at the Hart nominees over the last 30 seasons and you see that the Top 3 point Getters dominate the Hart voting with the top 3 goalscorers and top 3 assist men both getting significantly less votes but goalscorers fare marginally better.
An elite playmaking C is just as an important as an elite goalscoring winger.
Alexander the Gr8
Registered User
Of course, I don't deny that. I'm just saying that the raw numbers are not valued equally. In practice, 1 assist is not valued exactly the same as 1 goal, even though they both count for 1 point.
Rorschach
Who the f*** is Trevor Moore?
To me, AO is basically like the reincarnation of Gordie Howe, the guy who Gretzky, Orr and Lemieux concurrently say is the greatest of all.
The Gr8 Dane
L'harceleur
Imagine being one of those weirdos who hated on ovi for like 10 years LOL dude is a MACHINE what a treat to watch def one of the GOATS
Nathaniel Skywalker
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- Oct 18, 2013
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No crosby 1. Same amount of points as ovechkin with 9 more games which everybody says adds value right? Unless it's not in their interest
Nathaniel Skywalker
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Randyne
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- May 20, 2012
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Ovechkin still added more value despite playing 9 games less:
Team goals for with Ovi on ice =148; against =45
Team goals for with Sid on ice =138; against =79
Night Shift
Registered User
Your agenda is entirely different than that and it's somewhat sad you don't know that anyone who frequents this site knows it. If you don't know what your agenda is, it's to pump Crosby's tires as much as you can (in obscure ways) and try to figure out some way, any way, to shit on players like Ovechkin and McDavid.
So when I present a position that the majority of people would agree with, then the "agenda" card gets thrown out.
Ovechkin had every opportunity to show he could be an elite setup man and it didn't happen. His numbers speak for themselves.
Not as dominant (but tougher in todays league especially up against Crosby/Malkin and now McDavid) but he had an amazing peak, outstanding physical play for a star player and elite consistency well past his peak. He's probably the closest modern day comparable if you could really say anyone is.
- Feb 10, 2010
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- 10,264
Well no, he didn't have every opportunity, because he doesn't take face-offs (which generate assists) and he is used as a trigger man - which greatly reduces the opportunities for assists.
Regardless, he has put up elite assist totals. He's top 10 in assists throughout his time in the NHL and top 3 in assists this season.
No part of your statement is even remotely accurate.
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Randyne
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Add to Ovi about 80-150 secondary assists which goalscorers are banned from having those on their scored goals. Ovechkin rush style in first 5 years and then on the PP have a ton of such assists.
That's why primary points tell more story. And Ovechkin is already Top 14 all-time while Crosby is 34th.
SeanConn
Registered User
I wouldn't be so sure about that. Never say never, and legit, some guys WANT to go out while on top, and don't want to be along the ride as a stats collector or w/e in the NHL. I hope Ovi plays in the NHL for as long as possible, but I doubt he'd continue playing past this contract, even if he's still an elite talent/ superstar.
He has said many times he wants to play in Russia before he hangs up his skates for good, and the NHL may pull their players of the Olympics after 2026.
If Russia doesn't win the Gold at the 2022 Olympics or 2026 Olympics, and he's already reached/passed 895 goals to secure the record, I could maybe see him playing a few more years in Russia for one final chance at Olympic Gold in 2030, but even as a Canadian, I kinda hope he gets the Olympic Gold in 2022 or 2026. 2030 could be a real stretch, but if NHL players aren't being sent, Russia is a pretty safe bet to win gold.
He'd be like 44 years old or something at the 2030 Olympics, but I think Selanne was like 43 in his final olympics... where he was named the MVP/ became all time leader in points scored in hockey at the Olympics. So Ovi sticking around hockey in Russia for one more kick at the can at the Olympics isn't THAT hard to imagine.
Calderon
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- Mar 24, 2006
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^ While Ovi has been and continues to be elite in the NHL, in national teams more often than not things just don't seem to work out for him both individually and team-wise (compared to what's generally expected of him, that is), be it due to coaching, linemates or something else. For that reason I don't see him making team Russia in 2030, maybe not even 2026.
Well, there's a good chance he does anyway given his status and who knows what Russia's rosters will look like as a whole in those years. I just don't see him being a great asset if he's not given big top 6 minutes and a lot of PP time. I guess this season so far he's showing that he can be a terrific team player even if he's not primarily focused on scoring goals, though.
Nevertheless, would be nice to see him win Olympic gold regardless (unless it's against my country).
Edit: Forgot all about Selänne, which was a huge reason I wanted to make a reply in the first place. For various, mostly unknown reasons Selänne always outdid Ovi in national teams. If my memory serves, Selänne is the highest scoring male hockey player in the Olympics all time. He delivered. Overall Ovi will leave Teemu in the dust in terms of NHL career (already has) but internationally Selänne is comfortably ahead.
Well, there's a good chance he does anyway given his status and who knows what Russia's rosters will look like as a whole in those years. I just don't see him being a great asset if he's not given big top 6 minutes and a lot of PP time. I guess this season so far he's showing that he can be a terrific team player even if he's not primarily focused on scoring goals, though.
Nevertheless, would be nice to see him win Olympic gold regardless (unless it's against my country).
Edit: Forgot all about Selänne, which was a huge reason I wanted to make a reply in the first place. For various, mostly unknown reasons Selänne always outdid Ovi in national teams. If my memory serves, Selänne is the highest scoring male hockey player in the Olympics all time. He delivered. Overall Ovi will leave Teemu in the dust in terms of NHL career (already has) but internationally Selänne is comfortably ahead.
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I know there’s a milestone thread - this deserves an entirely different thread. Forgive me if theres something else posted...
36 YEARS OLD, and despite Mcdavid/Draisaitl’s torrid pace to start the season, the great eight now has 46 points in 29 games. Pretty incredible. 21 goals to boot.
How is he doing this at this age? Perhaps shortened seasons in the previous two years has helped older aged players? What do you guys think? Love it regardless the reason!
edit: yes, I understand the Oilers have played a couple few less games - but for instance, Draisaitl is pointless in 4 of his last 5, two games means minimal when droughts and surges occur
36 YEARS OLD, and despite Mcdavid/Draisaitl’s torrid pace to start the season, the great eight now has 46 points in 29 games. Pretty incredible. 21 goals to boot.
How is he doing this at this age? Perhaps shortened seasons in the previous two years has helped older aged players? What do you guys think? Love it regardless the reason!
edit: yes, I understand the Oilers have played a couple few less games - but for instance, Draisaitl is pointless in 4 of his last 5, two games means minimal when droughts and surges occur
It's hard to believe but 36 years old Ovechkin leads NHL in 'Even Strength Points' with a 9 points gap! And he always labelled as a 'PP specialist' by a lot of fans here on HFBoards. But only 10 out of his 46 points are from PP this season! ... & 1 is a shorthanded.
NHL Point Leaders as for 15.12.2021:
1) Ovechkin - 46
2/3) McDavid & Draisaitl - 45
NHL Even Strength Point Leaders as for 15.12.2021:
1) Ovechkin - 35 (+1 shorthanded point)
2) Kaprizov - 26
3) Stamkos, Gaudreau & Draisaitl - 25
NHL Point Leaders as for 15.12.2021:
1) Ovechkin - 46
2/3) McDavid & Draisaitl - 45
NHL Even Strength Point Leaders as for 15.12.2021:
1) Ovechkin - 35 (+1 shorthanded point)
2) Kaprizov - 26
3) Stamkos, Gaudreau & Draisaitl - 25
