Proposal: Oilers Neal for Predators Turris

[Fig]

Turris ($1 million retained) for Wennberg? (The retention is to offset the longer contract.)

Wennberg is a great defensive center and great in the PK, but doesn’t shoot anymore for some reason (Tom Wilson induced concussion). Wennberg’s contract is a year shorter and $1.5 million less. He’s a slightly overpaid 3C that can play some 2C but not a real 2C. He can frustrate Torts, but he also does a lot Torts likes. Like back check and screen goalies.

So Nashville could save 1/2 million for three years and $5 million in the last year of the contract. And get a solid player that would have a role on the team.

Turris could be a 2c again in Columbus and could provide veteran leadership after Foligno retires. (He is 2 years younger than Foligno.) He’d cost more than Wennberg.

Both would be exposed to Seattle now. Unless he seriously bounces back, there is no way Turris gets picked without a sweetener. Wennberg might be picked depending on whether Columbus chooses to protect 4 D (Savard and Murray would also be free agents so they wouldn’t be picked, so Columbus could have 6 D off the table) and how he performs next year and Seattle’s strategy (2 years of a slightly overpaid 3 C to get to league minimum). (He was good in the playoffs and scored an amazing goal which was so uncharacteristic of how he plays.) But if they both play well after a trade, maybe they could be picked by Seattle.

I don’t know how I feel about this as a CBJ fan. I think standing pat makes a lot of sense for Columbus given the general uncertainty and the upcoming expansion draft. I am trying to find a 2C upgrade without losing guys like Texier, Foudy, and Gavrikov. So I am looking for a potential trade that could help both teams. If Turris had a shorter contract, lots of teams might be interested, but nobody would offer him close to 4 x $6 million today.

Isn't Wennberg a 1/3 buyout candidate due to age?

 

[hmc1987]

No, he bounced all over the lineup because we already have our 4 center slots filled --- Duchene, Johansen, Bonino, and Sissons are our centers.

Well, you could say he bounced all over because of that AND because he can't seem to play wing for some weird reason.

I have no doubt he can get 50 points again. But he still sucks to 90% of the league, because you have to spoonfeed him the opportunity in order to obtain that. Still, if you project a gaping hole at 2C, he's certainly going to be adequate to fill that. He certainly was for us in 2017-18 when we had precisely that gaping hole to fill. And he did it playing with a sophomore Kevin Fiala and Craig Smith almost exclusively... not bad players, but certainly no Mark Stones.

What he did in the WC with Mantha was also very representative. Just run him out there with a player like that, and he'll chip in the necessary production to easily hit 50 points.

I think there have been a few teams mentioned with possible 2C openings around here... but Buffalo filled theirs, Florida and Minnesota have been mentioned, but it's not a big need around the league. Teams with that need are usually building too, and they have young players coming and don't want to block out their youngsters for 4 years. That's certainly true for Detroit at least. I don't think Edmonton should even be on the list, because Turris isn't what the Oilers are looking for. So it was a limited market to begin with, and now with Covid and everything, it could be zero market.

And all of Duchene, Johansen, and Bonino are underperforming. Which is an underperformer like Turris can be floated between 1C and 4C as well as a healthy scratch.

Nashville is in a very tough spot for the next 4-5 years imo. They have so much money locked in to players who haven't lived up to expectations and their prospect pool isn't exactly flooding with talent...the price for being good for as long as they were.

I don't think any team would take on Johansen and his contract or Duchene until he performs better for a couple of seasons. Forsberg definitely has value as does Arvidsson. They could also get a decent haul for Josi probably, but it's a tough spot. Hopefully Nashville coaching can get more out of their roster

 

[koteka]

Isn't Wennberg a 1/3 buyout candidate due to age?

Yes. But he is too good to buy out and who would Columbus replace him with?

Basically he is overpaid by a million and has not lived up to expectations. But if we was paid $3.5 instead of $4.5 and had not reached 59 points the one season when Columbus had a good power play, nobody would think he was overpaid or hadn’t met expectations. He would just be seen as a good defensive C.

His biggest knock is he doesn’t shoot enough. He can play wing, but he is a defensively responsible wing who doesn’t score enough.

I like Wennberg, but he gets a lot of crap from some people on the Jackets board. I like defensive hockey. My kids are all defensemen. I didn’t play hockey, but I was a soccer goalie. I respect people who play solid defense. I’d rather be called boring and win a game 3-2 than be called fun to watch but lose a game 6-5.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

Turris really needs to be on a team where he could play as a #2 center. He isn't as bad as most around here believe and if given the opportunity could be pretty productive.

I also think Poile would just keep Turris, if for nothing else as injury protection. He had a chance to keep Neal and chose Jarnkrok over him which should tell you something.

Also Poile said that we needed to get younger and Neal doesn't really fit that bill.

You’re conveniently leaving out Neal being a impending UFA and Jarnkrok having a sweetheart contract at the time Poile made that choice. But sure, keep bending the truth to make it work in your favor

 

[HolyGhost]

3 years vs 4 years of a bad contract

 

[GoldOnGold]

And all of Duchene, Johansen, and Bonino are underperforming. Which is an underperformer like Turris can be floated between 1C and 4C as well as a healthy scratch.

Nashville is in a very tough spot for the next 4-5 years imo. They have so much money locked in to players who haven't lived up to expectations and their prospect pool isn't exactly flooding with talent...the price for being good for as long as they were.

I don't think any team would take on Johansen and his contract or Duchene until he performs better for a couple of seasons. Forsberg definitely has value as does Arvidsson. They could also get a decent haul for Josi probably, but it's a tough spot. Hopefully Nashville coaching can get more out of their roster

Bonino was great last year, Johansen and Duchene not so much.

 

[GeeoffBrown]

Neal had one good month out of the last 24. He is barely an NHLer IMO

 

[BigFatCat999]

Turris+3rd for Neal +2nd

As a Preds fan, ok. The spot he takes is currently occupied by Tomassino, (If there is no CHL season). I'd rather he play in Europe if there isn't a CHL season. Also, he might add a bit of snarl.

 

[Bringer of Jollity]

And all of Duchene, Johansen, and Bonino are underperforming. Which is an underperformer like Turris can be floated between 1C and 4C as well as a healthy scratch.

Nashville is in a very tough spot for the next 4-5 years imo. They have so much money locked in to players who haven't lived up to expectations and their prospect pool isn't exactly flooding with talent...the price for being good for as long as they were.

I don't think any team would take on Johansen and his contract or Duchene until he performs better for a couple of seasons. Forsberg definitely has value as does Arvidsson. They could also get a decent haul for Josi probably, but it's a tough spot. Hopefully Nashville coaching can get more out of their roster

Bonino has been excellent for us and was probably our best overall forward last season.

Johansen and Duchene are more talented than Turris and making $8M piece. There was zero chance Lavy was going to slot them in bottom 6 roles regardless of how poorly they were playing and Sissons was just a far more natural fit as the 4th line center (and also was playing "fine," no need to displace him).

Rather than bouncing him around the top 9 is a wing, you give Turris a slot as 2C, or 3C for a team that rolls three scoring lines, and PP time and he'll be fine.

 

[BigFatCat999]

If it's a 3 team deal where Preds eat a little of Turris' contract, Oilers send Neal to the Preds, and then the Oilers send Turris for someone they need to team #3 after eating a little bit. Say Preds eat 500K, then the Oil eat 500K. Team 3 gets Turris for 5 Million, vs 6 and the Preds and Oilers save on a buyout AND get a player who they need.

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

Both overpaid, but Turris is minimally useful.
Neal = waste of space

Neal scored 19 goals in 55 games and provides decent net front presence on the PP that certainly hits the bar of minimally useful. Though minimally useful isn't enough given the price tag.

Ultimately though if it was up to me I'd buy out Neal this off-season he would have a $1,916,667 cap-hit for 6 years, if we got Turris I'd play him for a single season and be unhappy about his one dimensional game and how overpaid he is then buy-him out the folllowing season with a buyout cap-hit of $2M for 6 years. In this situation a Neal buyout over a year of Turris represents $4.08M in cap space to play with in a stagnant cap world which should net a better player than Turris and the cap-penalty of the buy-out in this scenario would also end one year sooner so there isn't that extra $2M cap-hit on the books 7 years from now.

 

[_Del_]

I'm surprised bad contracts don't get swapped more often. Neal/Lucuc type moves could boost a team, rather than just let a player sit, fester, and whither away.

Well, it's easier to just ignore or bury them and then pursue a free agent or other trade to fill a real need.

Now with a flat cap, and not a lot of room for teams to add free agents, I think you'll start to see a lot more Neal-Turris style trades. It'll be a good season or two for trade watching and critiquing.

 

[Porter Stoutheart]

If it's a 3 team deal where Preds eat a little of Turris' contract, Oilers send Neal to the Preds, and then the Oilers send Turris for someone they need to team #3 after eating a little bit. Say Preds eat 500K, then the Oil eat 500K. Team 3 gets Turris for 5 Million, vs 6 and the Preds and Oilers save on a buyout AND get a player who they need.

Turris ($1M retained NAS + $1M retained EDM) on 4 x $6M AAV
Neal ($1M retained) on 3 x $5.75M AAV
Sutter ($1M retained) on 1 x $4.375M AAV

Predators
2020-21: Neal $4.75M + $1M Turris retention = $5.75M
2021-22: Neal $4.75M + $1M Turris retention = $5.75M
2022-23: Neal $4.75M + $1M Turris retention = $5.75M
2023-24: $1M Turris retention = $1M
- slight savings vs. Turris contract, but need a winger more than a center

Oilers
2020-21: Sutter $3.375M + $1M Turris retention + $1M Neal retention = $5.375M
2021-22: $1M Turris retention + $1M Neal retention = $2M
2022-23: $1M Turris retention + $1M Neal retention = $2M
2023-24: $1M Turris retention = $1M
- not much different than a straight Neal buyout, although they get a year of Sutter if they think he can be the 3C they need

Canucks
2020-21: Turris $4M + $1M Sutter retention = $5M
2021-22: Turris $4M = $4M
2022-23: Turris $4M = $4M
2023-24: Turris $4M = $4M
- if they actually needed a 2C, Turris at $4M wouldn't be so bad, but they really don't --- so this part of it is broken and only illustrative... is anybody out there trying to move a bad contract at 3C but needs a 2c? Seems like an implausible scenario...

I'm thinking something like this scenario wouldn't really be popular with anybody? There's just not enough gain, unless you can find the truly ideal 3rd partner to substitute into it.

 

[Armourboy]

You’re conveniently leaving out Neal being a impending UFA and Jarnkrok having a sweetheart contract at the time Poile made that choice. But sure, keep bending the truth to make it work in your favor

Its not that sweetheart, he's getting paid about what he is worth. Jarnkrok's value is in his ability to fill any spot and not kill you, but his production is never going to set the world on fire.

Truth is he kept Jarnkrok because he was younger. It also didn't hurt that he was best buds with some more important names that were coming up for contracts too.

We would have been better off had he kept Neal. Jarnkrok is part of that group that has gotten overly comfortable and his job really should have been up for grabs.