Post-Game Talk: Oilers lose 3-1, sky is falling, etc

[2 Minute Minor]

Here are some uninvited observations from a Blues fan:

Slepyshev looks very promising. I hadn't heard much about him before the game, but he looks like a guy ready to play in the NHL.

The coaching structure is visibly better. I think Edmonton made a good hire here, and the integration of forwards and defense is good....whereas last year this time it was painful to watch.

I wonder how much bad habits have taken root in young high potential players. I was still surprised at how many times Hall in particular was trying to play on the wrong side of the puck. I don't mean to single him out, but I do think there are some lasting costs to the developmental ceiling for some of the young players who have had suboptimal development.

The Blues are very good at face offs, but I think that will be a good way to measure improvement in the coaching. Winning face offs is a team activity, not the center alone. Edmonton will need to (and I have confidence McLellan will cause) improvement in this area.

I think the defense isn't as far off as it looked last year. With better EFFECTIVE support from the forwards, I think the Oilers will have an average defense. With the young horses coming up there will be enough to build on. But it would still be nice to acquire a top pairing veteran

McDavid is fast as lightning and will be a joy to watch. You are lucky to have him. I hope the media will give him space to be a rookie and grow.

 

[BoldNewLettuce]

what i meant is it is a more balanced stat to determine who is a better finisher then total points or goals for example, even though eberle gets better lien mates and more pp time etc, he still buried more of his chances, it tell you how many of their chances they bury eberle buries more of his chances hence being a better finisher. My first post was poorly worded.

dragon?

 

[Tyrolean]

There definately is improvement and also bad habits still there. I will wait until 20 games or so, to see any lasting patterns before I pronounce anything as gospel.

 

[Replacement*]

I don't compare Yak to Omark..it has to do with the Yak fans to Omark fans....I thought of all people on this board you were smart enough to figure that out...clearly I was wrong.

Actually I'm not a mind reader and not much to figure out other than you blending the names together as if to say they are one and the same type player. That's obviously what people are going to interpret there. Not something completely different.

Especially seeing the perspective of your comments on Yak.

 

[oilz89*]

Here are some uninvited observations from a Blues fan:

Slepyshev looks very promising. I hadn't heard much about him before the game, but he looks like a guy ready to play in the NHL.

The coaching structure is visibly better. I think Edmonton made a good hire here, and the integration of forwards and defense is good....whereas last year this time it was painful to watch.

I wonder how much bad habits have taken root in young high potential players. I was still surprised at how many times Hall in particular was trying to play on the wrong side of the puck. I don't mean to single him out, but I do think there are some lasting costs to the developmental ceiling for some of the young players who have had suboptimal development.

The Blues are very good at face offs, but I think that will be a good way to measure improvement in the coaching. Winning face offs is a team activity, not the center alone. Edmonton will need to (and I have confidence McLellan will cause) improvement in this area.

I think the defense isn't as far off as it looked last year. With better EFFECTIVE support from the forwards, I think the Oilers will have an average defense. With the young horses coming up there will be enough to build on. But it would still be nice to acquire a top pairing veteran

McDavid is fast as lightning and will be a joy to watch. You are lucky to have him. I hope the media will give him space to be a rookie and grow.

It's very hard to acquire a top pairing veteran dman unless he wants a trade. You should know that. You developed your top pairing dman instead of trading for one lol

 

[Replacement*]

So by what you are basically saying, Eberle's results are solely reliant on Pouliot and Nuge?

70 point year for Purcell this season by your way of thinking.

Actually this is silly.

Of course Eberle is going to get more quality chances playing with quality players. There is nothing difficult to ascertain in that perspective. A first line, and playing with first linemates, and on first PP unit is going to be seeing and generating more scoring chances than somebody buried on a 3rd line.

This of course does not equate to Eberles results being solely reliant. Obviously Nuge is a quality player. A higher quality than Yak usually sees.

 

[McDeathbyCheerios*]

Actually this is silly.

Of course Eberle is going to get more quality chances playing with quality players. There is nothing difficult to ascertain in that perspective. A first line, and playing with first linemates, and on first PP unit is going to be seeing and generating more scoring chances than somebody buried on a 3rd line.

This of course does not equate to Eberles results being solely reliant. Obviously Nuge is a quality player. A higher quality than Yak usually sees.

People have to bring down other players to bring their favorites up.

People call Yak good and I'm starting to agree.

Then others are saying Eberle is only good because of who he plays with and is worse than Yak. Which isn't true. Both are good in their own right.

Eberle is in the top 6 because he is always producing, and is very creative offensively.

Yak could be better than Eberle in time but right now he isn't.

Eberle is good.
Yak is good.

 

[Red Deer Rebel]

I wonder how much bad habits have taken root in young high potential players. I was still surprised at how many times Hall in particular was trying to play on the wrong side of the puck. I don't mean to single him out, but I do think there are some lasting costs to the developmental ceiling for some of the young players who have had suboptimal development.

I think there are some coachability issues with respect to a couple of our young players - Hall and Yakupov. It's hard to say if these issues can be fixed.

Justin Schultz was also regressing badly on this team, but he looks much better this year with McLellan.

The irony here is two of the three people most responsible for the "suboptimal" player development record - Kevin Lowe and Craig MacTavish - are still employed with this club in high positions. They've been moved around and given new titles, but they never go away.

They're like a disease, and I don't think this team will ever be truly fixed until they are completely flushed.

 

[Replacement*]

People have to bring down other players to bring their favorites up.

People call Yak good and I'm starting to agree.

Then others are saying Eberle is only good because of who he plays with and is worse than Yak. Which isn't true. Both are good in their own right.

Eberle is in the top 6 because he is always producing, and is very creative offensively.

Yak could be better than Eberle in time but right now he isn't.

Eberle is good.
Yak is good.

I'm not saying anything different just so we're clear. Eberle is very skilled in opposition end and our most dangerous player. Yak whoever is more dangerous offensively than he's given credit for. Really the amount of goals he's scored outside of the Eakins Triangle is consistent with him being a goal scorer. Especially considering an ample amount of his looks has been lower in the lineup where goals generally don't come from.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I'm not saying anything different just so we're clear. Eberle is very skilled in opposition end and our most dangerous player. Yak whoever is more dangerous offensively than he's given credit for. Really the amount of goals he's scored outside of the Eakins Triangle is consistent with him being a goal scorer. Especially considering an ample amount of his looks has been lower in the lineup where goals generally don't come from.

There is not a single reason why Yakupov can't shoot the puck more or simply go to the net.

Not every goal is going to be a one-timer.

 

[Replacement*]

Two things, and then I'm going to bow out. I've been on this board for more than two hours now and its coming up to 5:30 AM here now. Thank God hockey season is back

1. What about the post I made earlier asking, how it is that Yakupov can have success with Roy (and I don't dispute that he did)? Derek Roy, whose last "good" NHL season was 2009? Derek Roy who just signed in Switzerland because nobody in the NHL wanted him anymore. At any price. Is it your contention that playing Yakupov with Derek Roy is "giving the player service", but playing him with actual NHL players is not?

Yakupov played a fair bit with Gagner, no? You and I both like Gagner as a player. Smart, good passer, offensively talented, works well with others. Most people on this board would probably say Derek Roy and Sam Gagner are the same guy, personally I think Gags is better. My question; focusing strictly on offense (never mind the +/-) did you ever see Yakupov lighting the world on fire with Gagner?

2. What really gets me about some of the more vociferous Yakupov backers is that they will actively insinuate that the Oilers don't care about Yakupov. Usually they will add in that this is because he is not a "good old Canadian kid". I would like to ask if you honestly believe that the Oilers don't care about Yak. Because if that is true, then we have far more serious problems than anyone ever imagined. That would mean that the Oilers did the following; tank a whole season to get the first overall pick. Have first dibs on any draft eligible kid on the planet. Scout and plan carefully. Choose a player and then almost immediately stop caring about the player. Purposely stunt his development. Purposely do things that help the kid fail. Purposely give him the line mates least suited to his game etc.

I'm sorry, but none of that makes sense. Incompetence I get. The evidence is all over the place. Flat out engaging in a vendetta against a guy you wasted a whole season in order to have the privilege of choosing is a different matter all together. Incompetence aside, because really all players on the team have faced the same incompetence, the situation we have right now with this player is mostly on the player. He isn't playing an NHL game.

Yak did well with both Gagner and Roy, the two most talented centers he's had the opportunity to play with for a long enough contiguous time. Unfortunately Gagner, injured in TC the next season, and hampered by that, and Eakins was never the same in the subsequent year. Took a while for Gagner to get going that year and Yak by then was in his funk. Yak, you'll remember went through an incredible lot from this org in recrimination that year including being made to answer any and all questions from a hostile media scrum that the Oilers vindictively setup. That being shortly after Yak and his agent were considering what the hell was going on with the teams treatment of the player here.

This team as we know is averse to any kind of trouble. Yak will continue to be in a difficult spot here and I really do think events of last year really labeled him with the org even if Eakins was such a disaster as a coach that somebody standing up to him was perhaps validated. tbh you know my take. I applaud Yak for taking the stand he did. He was the only on the team that outed some of the **** while it was occurring last season.

But historically the Oilers get rid of anybody with that potential to speak out as you well know.

cheers

 

[Replacement*]

There is not a single reason why Yakupov can't shoot the puck more or simply go to the net.

Not every goal is going to be a one-timer.

Yak does go to the net. Trouble is he can go to the net all day with people that aren't finding him. As a result Yak is often left with trying to do things himself. Which he's being criticized for. Sounds like some no win.

 

[Dorian2]

Actually this is silly.

Of course Eberle is going to get more quality chances playing with quality players. There is nothing difficult to ascertain in that perspective. A first line, and playing with first linemates, and on first PP unit is going to be seeing and generating more scoring chances than somebody buried on a 3rd line.

This of course does not equate to Eberles results being solely reliant. Obviously Nuge is a quality player. A higher quality than Yak usually sees.

I know it's a silly post. It was meant as such. A silly post to a silly poster who throws Eberle under the bus and calls Yaks the teams #1 sniper.

I have no issue with Yaks play so far this year, but this constant complaining that he doesn't get 1st line minutes and #1 PP time is getting old. He still hasn't proven, in so far as I can tell, that he can play against 1st line competition. And although he is looking better this year, he's still all over the place out there. He comes across (to me anyways), as someone who thinks he is the only guy on the ice at times. He has to work on that still.

 

[McDeathbyCheerios*]

I'm not saying anything different just so we're clear. Eberle is very skilled in opposition end and our most dangerous player. Yak whoever is more dangerous offensively than he's given credit for. Really the amount of goals he's scored outside of the Eakins Triangle is consistent with him being a goal scorer. Especially considering an ample amount of his looks has been lower in the lineup where goals generally don't come from.

I know i was more just expanding and agreeing, like you did.

Yakupov is better then he gets credit for, my thing is I want him to show it anywhere. Show he is to good for the third line. That's all to me really. I know he can, he has the ability he just hasn't yet, I think it's what McLellan wants to.

 

[Replacement*]

I know it's a silly post. It was meant as such. A silly post to a silly poster who throws Eberle under the bus and calls Yaks the teams #1 sniper.

I have no issue with Yaks play so far this year, but this constant complaining that he doesn't get 1st line minutes and #1 PP time is getting old. He still hasn't proven, in so far as I can tell, that he can play against 1st line competition. And although he is looking better this year, he's still all over the place out there. He comes across (to me anyways), as someone who thinks he is the only guy on the ice at times. He has to work on that still.

Thanks for clarifying. I don't have a handle on every posters tendencies and don't know much about what the other poster had been stating.

As for "earning" a topsix spot this is what I find interesting. Who really "earns" assignments here. Hall, Eberle, Nuge on the basis of being here first and being good, end up with the majority of time together. That's a temporal dynamic that occurred before Yak was even drafted. Yak arrives and he's immediately odd man out. He's outside of the star allotment box. He has been every year he's played here. I thought with McDavid addition shaking things up this would be the year Yak would be seeing better assignments and pairing.

Lets examine something interesting as well. The team has afforded Drai ample topsix looks. They've even done that for Slep. They've done it with Purcell, Pouliot who have played poorly this year. Yak was one of the best Oilers in preseason this year and he starts the season with Lander and Korpikoski.

With Eberle not here, and Yak buried with obsolescence the team goes on to score zero goals.

The team could use some goals.

You think something isn't odd here?

Purcell and Pouliot are Yes men that will say the right things all the time which is loved on this org. Regardless of how they play.

 

[booyakasha]

I know i was more just expanding and agreeing, like you did.

Yakupov is better then he gets credit for, my thing is I want him to show it anywhere. Show he is to good for the third line. That's all to me really. I know he can, he has the ability he just hasn't yet, I think it's what McLellan wants to.

I think this is what everybody wants.
....I missed it, Yak can't because he's "buried with obsolescence"

 

[Replacement*]

I think this is what everybody wants.

Yeah lets show your good playing with korpikoski and an AHLer playing one of the best teams in the league. A recipe that has worked for nobody.

Blues limit time and space. Lander has negligible passing ability at this level. Korpi isn't what I consider an offensive player. Theres going to be quite a limit to much one player can generate in offense playing with these 2. still, Yak tried valiantly to get something going lastnight that wasn't going to be there against a tight checking squad.

Also, this just in, nobody got anything going last night despite playing with better offensive linemates.

But lets get on Yak. What did he do..

 

[harpoon]

Interesting that two videos were posted over the last couple of pages. People posted them to prove different things, but I noticed a couple things that relate to recent "hot" topics on the board.

Eberle video - Hall gets the puck and uses his speed to go straight up the wall and create a goal. Funny as hell to see the Flame d-man waving his stick in vain. Some posters on this site frequently state that Hall hogs the puck. He is not a puck hog. He has confidence in his ability to utilize speed to get past several defenders and then dish the puck. Its not always the right play, obviously, but it does work and that video illustrates a facet of Hall's game that his detractors conveniently ignore when they call him a puck hog. And I've watched Hall create a lot of goals just like the one in the video over the past few seasons.

Hall makes an all world pass, at top speed, to Eberle. People say Hall can't pass, won't pass. People who post a falsehood like that should be ashamed.

Eberle makes an all world shot. Enough said. Nobody creates more chances for himself, finishes a higher percentage of chances he's presented with, or scores more goals in general for this team than Eberle.

Yakupov video - Yak's centerman on the play is Belanger (obviously put out to win the draw with no time left) but there's an example of Yakupov scoring a goal with a "plug". Proving that if you put yourself in position to score, you might just score, regardless of what kind of "low quality" NHL player the team may be forcing you to play with.

Yak's goal (like most of his goals to date) has little to do with anyone else on the ice. He scored on his own talent. At some point we have to ask why has Yakupov only had any kind of success with Roy (and Gagner)? Does it have to be the case that all the players ever tried with Yakupov weren't good enough for him? Or could it maybe be that this is a player who doesn't have a clue how to play his position, and confuses anyone on his line?

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Yak does go to the net. Trouble is he can go to the net all day with people that aren't finding him. As a result Yak is often left with trying to do things himself. Which he's being criticized for. Sounds like some no win.

Then the team needs to direct the puck to the net more.

Hockey isn't so difficult but the Oilers sure make it that way.

 

[smokersarejokers]

Here are some uninvited observations from a Blues fan:

Slepyshev looks very promising. I hadn't heard much about him before the game, but he looks like a guy ready to play in the NHL.

The coaching structure is visibly better. I think Edmonton made a good hire here, and the integration of forwards and defense is good....whereas last year this time it was painful to watch.

I wonder how much bad habits have taken root in young high potential players. I was still surprised at how many times Hall in particular was trying to play on the wrong side of the puck. I don't mean to single him out, but I do think there are some lasting costs to the developmental ceiling for some of the young players who have had suboptimal development.

The Blues are very good at face offs, but I think that will be a good way to measure improvement in the coaching. Winning face offs is a team activity, not the center alone. Edmonton will need to (and I have confidence McLellan will cause) improvement in this area.

I think the defense isn't as far off as it looked last year. With better EFFECTIVE support from the forwards, I think the Oilers will have an average defense. With the young horses coming up there will be enough to build on. But it would still be nice to acquire a top pairing veteran

McDavid is fast as lightning and will be a joy to watch. You are lucky to have him. I hope the media will give him space to be a rookie and grow.

Thanks.

Yeah, I think it's hard for some people to look at the team objectively after so many years of mismanagement and very poor play. You can only get kicked in the teeth so many times.

That was game 1 and they hung in there with a cup contender. They have a lot of things to work on, but, like you say, they have a much better coaching staff in place. The improvement will come, we just have to be patient.

I feel optimistic for the first time in a really long time. There are still major holes, but I'm confident in Chiarelli and McLellan to make the appropriate moves to improve this team going forward.

 

[booyakasha]

Yeah lets show your good playing with korpikoski and an AHLer playing one of the best teams in the league. A recipe that has worked for nobody.

Blues limit time and space. Lander has negligible passing ability at this level. Korpi isn't what I consider an offensive player. Theres going to be quite a limit to much one player can generate in offense playing with these 2. still, Yak tried valiantly to get something going lastnight that wasn't going to be there against a tight checking squad.

Also, this just in, nobody got anything going last night despite playing with better offensive linemates.

But lets get on Yak. What did he do..

no body is getting on Yak from last nights game...WTF you getting on about?

And as for the bolded...dude, get real.

 

[Replacement*]

no body is getting on Yak from last nights game...WTF you getting on about?

i'm just used to it here.

Call me paranoid.

cheers

 

[booyakasha]

i'm just used to it here.

Call me paranoid.

cheers

Cheers, sorry I understand, as I get a little rattled from HF as well.





....and I can be a bit much at times, as well.

 

[frag2]

Yeah lets show your good playing with korpikoski and an AHLer playing one of the best teams in the league. A recipe that has worked for nobody.

Blues limit time and space. Lander has negligible passing ability at this level. Korpi isn't what I consider an offensive player. Theres going to be quite a limit to much one player can generate in offense playing with these 2. still, Yak tried valiantly to get something going lastnight that wasn't going to be there against a tight checking squad.

Also, this just in, nobody got anything going last night despite playing with better offensive linemates.

But lets get on Yak. What did he do..

Didn't Hall play with Lander and Purcell last season?

 

[Soundwave]

I actually think Yak's "limited I.Q." might work well with McDavid.

That was basically Erie's offence ... wingers who just kept it simple and then McDavid would quarterback everything and make sure they got the puck right by the net for tap ins.

I think Yak will get his chance eventually unless Korpi is lights out on that line. And if he is, then good for him and good for us.

Eberle is not coming back for several more weeks, and if McDavid-Hall don't play well together, then eventually I have to think Yakupov's number will come up as being McDavid's RW.

If they play Gazdic with McDavid before Yakupov then something is up, lol.