Speculation: Official Fantasy Trade Offers/Armchair GM Thread

[Dread Clawz]

Well we all know Haley is going to play, and they're not going to make the captain a routine scratch.

 

[vendetta]

Especially Haley, I don't mind MacKenzie as much although he needs to get to that .53%, preferably .54% win rating at the dot.

But Haley is just useless.

So is Mackenzie. His time is done. Not good defensively and an absolute black hole everywhere else. He did well in his time here but time to strips the c and let him be 13th forward. We have younger guys that can actually contribute to the team now. The battle in training camp should be the best it’s ever been. There’s a lot of player vying to make the roster

 

[Beezeral]

If 17 was leaving, it would have already been announced so there could be time for everyone to “process”

 

[GrumpyKelly]

So is Mackenzie. His time is done. Not good defensively and an absolute black hole everywhere else. He did well in his time here but time to strips the c and let him be 13th forward. We have younger guys that can actually contribute to the team now. The battle in training camp should be the best it’s ever been. There’s a lot of player vying to make the roster

If he can deliver in the dot then I don't agree.

But otherwise he's in the same category as Haley.

 

[Beezeral]

If he can deliver in the dot then I don't agree.

But otherwise he's in the same category as Haley.

Just being able to win face offs isn’t enough when you are bad at everything else. You can’t have a 4th line getting sheltered minutes that gets outscored 2:1 like ours does

 

[GrumpyKelly]

Just being able to win face offs isn’t enough when you are bad at everything else. You can’t have a 4th line getting sheltered minutes that gets outscored 2:1 like ours does

MacKenzie can still skate. Add good face-off numbers and he's fine for another year on the fourth line. I think he'll be better next year.

 

[Beezeral]

MacKenzie can still skate. Add good face-off numbers and he's fine for another year on the fourth line. I think he'll be better next year.

Can still skate? Huh? He was absolutely awful last year. I don’t know how it’s reasonable to expect him to bounce back at 37 or however old he is.

 

[GrumpyKelly]

Can still skate? Huh? He was absolutely awful last year. I don’t know how it’s reasonable to expect him to bounce back at 37 or however old he is.

He can totally still skate. I don't know who you were watching if you don't think so.

 

[Beezeral]

He can totally still skate. I don't know who you were watching if you don't think so.

Maybe he’s fast enough for you, but he’s always one of the slowest players on the ice.

17 has been outscored 61-32 at 5 on 5 the last two seasons. That’s not good enough for me.

 

[Gentle Man]

He can totally still skate. I don't know who you were watching if you don't think so.

He can skate on a straight line.

Problem is his utilization is reliant more on start and stops and quickness (PK for example) which he doesn't have anymore. Cant even stay on his feet enough.

His faceoff also CRATERED this past season. He was over 50% his first 3 seasons in Florida. This past season there was a point where he was in the high 30s. Without fact-checking, I think he was sub 45%

 

[GrumpyKelly]

He can skate on a straight line.

Problem is his utilization is reliant more on start and stops and quickness (PK for example) which he doesn't have anymore. Cant even stay on his feet enough.

His faceoff also CRATERED this past season. He was over 50% his first 3 seasons in Florida. This past season there was a point where he was in the high 30s. Without fact-checking, I think he was sub 45%

He was over 52% but if he gets to 54% like he was two years ago, that's top 20 in the league.

He had some shoulder issue going on like we saw on the race for playoffs documentary so maybe that's why he wasn't as good as before. I'm hoping that he rebounds, just like I did with Bjuggy last summer.

 

[Beezeral]

He was over 52% but if he gets to 54% like he was two years ago, that's top 20 in the league.

He had some shoulder issue going on like we saw on the race for playoffs documentary so maybe that's why he wasn't as good as before. I'm hoping that he rebounds, just like I did with Bjuggy last summer.

He was terrible from day one. You don’t hope 37 year old 4th liners bounce back the next year. You replace them. The reality is that if he wasn’t wearing the C it would be a unanimous decision. There is literally nothing defendable about his play.

 

[Jakeybonz]

He was terrible from day one. You don’t hope 37 year old 4th liners bounce back the next year. You replace them. The reality is that if he wasn’t wearing the C it would be a unanimous decision. There is literally nothing defendable about his play.

and this is where I find weakness in boughner. how can he be this psychotically loyal to haley? and not stripping mackenzie of the C and benching him is also crazy. why does boug want such a hideous 4th line? we have so many good 4th line players. not enough top 6'ers but plenty of talent to have one of the best 4th lines in the league skill-wise. just madness to use two spots on bad players. we're going nowhere yet again if that's our 4th line this year. u can't give up 6-7 minutes per game for no reason and expect to have a good year. especially when the top 9 isn't particularly stellar.

 

[Clint]

...sort of like the under the table rule of no offer sheeting players anymore.

This is not a thing.

 

[Jakeybonz]

This is not a thing.

then why does it basically never happen anymore? and why didn't we offer sheet kucherov? that was the most obvious offer sheet situation the panthers have ever seen. make us stronger and tampa weaker. they couldn't have matched even a 6.25 million offer. they were totally cap screwed.

 

[Clint]

then why does it basically never happen anymore? and why didn't we offer sheet kucherov? that was the most obvious offer sheet situation the panthers have ever seen. make us stronger and tampa weaker. they couldn't have matched even a 6.25 million offer. they were totally cap screwed.

This is discussed every offseason. It's because offer sheets exist not as assset acquisition tools, but to ensure teams and GM's negotiate fairly with their restricted free agents. Without the threat of an offer sheet, GM's can lowball their RFA's and players have no recourse short of a holdout.

 

[Jakeybonz]

This is discussed every offseason. It's because offer sheets exist not as assset acquisition tools, but to ensure teams and GM's negotiate fairly with their restricted free agents. Without the threat of an offer sheet, GM's can lowball their RFA's and players have no recourse short of a holdout.

yes but threats only work if theres something to back them up. if no one's offer sheeting, the players know its an empty threat. there never was and never will be an excuse for the panthers not offer sheeting kucherov when huberdeau was out for most of the season and all kuch wanted was around 6.5 mil for 7 yrs. we couldve ruined tampa and become a powerhouse ourselves. and it was a blatantly obvious move that required no hindsight. tampa was against the wall. all we had to do was squash them. instead they got one of the best hockey players in the world for 4.75 million for 3 years. a not insignificant amount of time. and now the cap will rise just in time for them to keep him. awesome.

 

[Clint]

yes but threats only work if theres something to back them up. if no one's offer sheeting, the players know its an empty threat. there never was and never will be an excuse for the panthers not offer sheeting kucherov when huberdeau was out for most of the season and all kuch wanted was around 6.5 mil for 7 yrs. we couldve ruined tampa and become a powerhouse ourselves. and it was a blatantly obvious move that required no hindsight. tampa was against the wall. all we had to do was squash them. instead they got one of the best hockey players in the world for 4.75 million for 3 years. a not insignificant amount of time. and now the cap will rise just in time for them to keep him. awesome.

The reason why no one's offer-sheeting is because GM's are negotiating fairly with their RFA's, and opposing teams don't want to pay the compensatory draft picks for a risky high-bid. No one predicted that Kucherov would be a 100-point player two years after his contract went into effect. If GM's could predict the future and Kucherov were still low-balled then yes, he might have been a sheet target from not just the Panthers, but from the entire league.

Further, you say there's no excuse to not sheet Kucherov at 6 million. A first, second, and third round pick in compesnation are a pretty good excuse, especially not knowing Kucherov would blow up the way he has.

Anyway, the point is that Kucherov's team-friendly contract is not an indicator that there's a gentleman's agreement among GM's to not offer-sheet.

 

[Jakeybonz]

The reason why no one's offer-sheeting is because GM's are negotiating fairly with their RFA's, and opposing teams don't want to pay the compensatory draft picks for a risky high-bid. No one predicted that Kucherov would be a 100-point player two years after his contract went into effect. If GM's could predict the future and Kucherov were still low-balled then yes, he might have been a sheet target from not just the Panthers, but from the entire league.

Further, you say there's no excuse to not sheet Kucherov at 6 million. A first, second, and third round pick in compesnation are a pretty good excuse, especially not knowing Kucherov would blow up the way he has.

Anyway, the point is that Kucherov's team-friendly contract is not an indicator that there's a gentleman's agreement among GM's to not offer-sheet.

absolute nonsense. he had a massive year straight after an impressive year. he led the lightning in scoring which says a lot. u didn't need a time machine to know he was the kind of player ud wanna lock up at 6-7 per for 7 years. it was insanely obvious and I posted on it frequently at the time. am I a prophet of the lord? no just a sane person who knows hockey. and our gm unfortunately wasn't. kuch knew he deserved more and was arguing with the lightning. he could easily have been sheeted by us and no sorry not by every team in the league. there were only about 2-3 teams that had the cap space and were supposedly competing for a cup. a 1st 2nd and 3rd rounder are nothing compared to kuch and even less when u consider they'd be low picks cause wed be an actual team. this isn't even slightly controversial and wasn't at the time. I'm quite sure there is a gentlemans agreement about offer sheeting if not an implicit threat just based on how it basically is a non thing anymore.

 

[Clint]

absolute nonsense. he had a massive year straight after an impressive year. he led the lightning in scoring which says a lot. u didn't need a time machine to know he was the kind of player ud wanna lock up at 6-7 per for 7 years. it was insanely obvious and I posted on it frequently at the time. am I a prophet of the lord? no just a sane person who knows hockey. and our gm unfortunately wasn't. kuch knew he deserved more and was arguing with the lightning. he could easily have been sheeted by us and no sorry not by every team in the league. there were only about 2-3 teams that had the cap space and were supposedly competing for a cup. a 1st 2nd and 3rd rounder are nothing compared to kuch and even less when u consider they'd be low picks cause wed be an actual team. this isn't even slightly controversial and wasn't at the time. I'm quite sure there is a gentlemans agreement about offer sheeting if not an implicit threat just based on how it basically is a non thing anymore.

Okay. You're a hockey genius and everyone else is an idiot for not sheeting Kucherov. Frankly I don't know why you're posting on this board when you clearly should have NHL GM job interviews lined up. You're a sane person who knows hockey and It's not even slightly controversial.

 

[Jakeybonz]

Okay. You're a hockey genius and everyone else is an idiot for not sheeting Kucherov. Frankly I don't know why you're posting on this board when you clearly should have NHL GM job interviews lined up. You're a sane person who knows hockey and It's not even slightly controversial.

correct.

and what i take from that reply is that no one should post on hockey forums because that will inevitably lead to a difference of opinion with what GMs do and what dissenters who post here wanted them to do, so why arent all of these disagreeable people GMs? dont they know that every GM was 100% the correct man for the job and every decision theyve ever made is beyond scrutiny? humble urselves people. GMs are talking here.

 

[Clint]

correct.

and what i take from that reply is that no one should post on hockey forums because that will inevitably lead to a difference of opinion with what GMs do and what dissenters who post here wanted them to do, so why arent all of these disagreeable people GMs? dont they know that every GM was 100% the correct man for the job and every decision theyve ever made is beyond scrutiny? humble urselves people. GMs are talking here.

I'm all about a healthy exchange of ideas but you're the one that poisoned the well with "absolute nonsense" and moving the goalposts from "GM's have a gentlemen's agreement not to sheet players" to "I'm rly rly angry we didn't sheet Kucherov, boy am I wicked smaht."

 

[pb1300]

I'm all about a healthy exchange of ideas but you're the one that poisoned the well with "absolute nonsense" and moving the goalposts from "GM's have a gentlemen's agreement not to sheet players" to "I'm rly rly angry we didn't sheet Kucherov, boy am I wicked smaht."

Clint, don’t even waste your time, it’s not worth it.

 

[Jakeybonz]

I'm all about a healthy exchange of ideas but you're the one that poisoned the well with "absolute nonsense" and moving the goalposts from "GM's have a gentlemen's agreement not to sheet players" to "I'm rly rly angry we didn't sheet Kucherov, boy am I wicked smaht."

weird that i have a boston irish accent there, but ok. and no sorry i didnt poison ur well. but we absolutely shouldve offer sheeted kucherov and i was obviously proven correct and our gm/owner proven wrong so i guess i am pretty wicked smart. not to mention all the other things i said should and should not have been done over the years, every single one of which ive been shown to be correct about besides taking drouin over barkov. but then, even the best gm in the nhl thought that too, so i dont feel bad about that one. sorry for being correct with high frequency i guess. and the fact that offer sheeting used to happen, gms would get in public wars about them, and they stopped happening, would lead any normal person to believe the gms have a gentlemans agreement about this. and i didnt say it was a fact, i said "i wonder". it just seems like the most plausible explanation to me.

 

[ucanthanzalthetruth]

Either option is fine, they're both solid on the 3rd pairing

I'm all about a healthy exchange of ideas but you're the one that poisoned the well with "absolute nonsense" and moving the goalposts from "GM's have a gentlemen's agreement not to sheet players" to "I'm rly rly angry we didn't sheet Kucherov, boy am I wicked smaht."

I think I said this before but you really need to change your display picture c'mon