Nylander won't be traded (core piece)

[justafan22]

We will need another vet ufa d so his money goes back into the d core imo

Depends on what happens come deadline

 

[saltming]

We will see how time goes before making that claim. 6 years is a long time without 6 years of team and individual playoff success to measure.
Again the deal wasn’t terrible but Nylander won the deal from a player perspective IMO.

He got 7 million and is a UFA in 6 years. Do this next time.
We didn’t even get the 7th year (extra UFA protection) in it. I would have insisted on 7 x 7.
He missed 2 months and because of bonus structure we didn’t really get the cap hit savings most of us were looking for at 6.4 - 6.6.

So this just doesn’t apply to Nylander as the only tradeable option, it’s to difficult to claim nothing will ever or should ever change.

Ya no player is untradeable or guaranteed to play out their contract.
My point is that he wasn't signed to this contract with the intent to trade him in the offseason

 

[wam_raven]

Doesn't front loading a contract also make it "lockout proof"?

Yeah, the signing bonuses get paid yearly, even if the NHL locks out for 5 years.

But I think the earning interest on your money should never be discounted either. there's a reason JT's contract is 90% bonus every year, and he's not worried about a work stoppage in each year of it!

 

[BackPassChampions]

He's not going anywhere.

 

[diehardleafsfan9878]

We will need another vet ufa d so his money goes back into the d core imo

Disagree, at hainseys age I doubt there will be many teams looking to sign him. So if he wants to continue playing I'm not against resigning him for whatever is left if he wants.

 

[saltming]

Yeah, the signing bonuses get paid yearly, even if the NHL locks out for 5 years.

But I think the earning interest on your money should never be discounted either. there's a reason JT's contract is 90% bonus every year, and he's not worried about a work stoppage in each year of it!

Players have to be smart in their business too. I don't know if a lot of fans think that through.

 

[kesleaf]

Penguins won cups with a front loaded offence + great goal tending + mediocre defence.

The Leafs have a lethal front loaded offence (arguably the best in the league right now) + great goal tending + good defence.


HFboards...not even once. Let this group play and see what they can do.

 

[member 147413]

Nylander will be gone.

Dubas can say all the nice things he wants.

 

[TDotMassive]

Cap space and too much money invested in forwards. Even if Willie came in on a team friendly deal they might not be able to win a Cup with this distribution of cap so biased to forwards. And he made sure he is not on a team friendly deal so if Kappy and Johnsson have strong years and can be signed for friendly hits his value to the team drops further. You keep the bargain players. They will probably get hosed by Marner and Matthews this summer and a club can't afford to pay range topping dollars to all of their better players. A 55pt Kappy for 4 x 5 or a 70pt Willie for 7 x 6?

Assuming Kappy progressing to a 55pt player and Willie stays almost exactly the same player he was as a 20 year old?? There is a very real chance Nylander becomes an 80-90 point player...

 

[wam_raven]

Players have to be smart in their business too. I don't know if a lot of fans think that through.

And the same argument works against us if players and agents really want to get smart about money. Obviously, the tax situation here is worse than most places in the NHL. So, counteracting that with player-friendly structured deals is the way to go anyways.

 

[FalcorMulch]

Doesn't front loading a contract also make it "lockout proof"?

A true “lockout proof” contract would be one where you max signing bonuses in the potential lockout year and take the minimum allowable salary.

In Willy’s situation having a front loaded deal will decrease his salary in the potential lockout year so it will benefit him a bit, but it’s not specifically lockout proof.

 

[saltming]

And the same argument works against us if players and agents really want to get smart about money. Obviously, the tax situation here is worse than most places in the NHL. So, counteracting that with player-friendly structured deals is the way to go anyways.

I read an article a while ago saying the tax situation in Toronto is not that bad. Yes it's up there but comparable and better than many states.

 

[saltming]

A true “lockout proof” contract would be one where you max signing bonuses in the potential lockout year and take the minimum allowable salary.

In Willy’s situation having a front loaded deal will decrease his salary in the potential lockout year so it will benefit him a bit, but it’s not specifically lockout proof.

Ya someone pointed out that Tavares is a true lockout proof contract

 

[Trapper]

Ya no player is untradeable or guaranteed to play out their contract.
My point is that he wasn't signed to this contract with the intent to trade him in the offseason

No that I’m with you on.
I fully believe it is the intention of Dubas to sign all and move forward with this core for the next 5 years at least. Don’t expect them to be moved during this time.
In 3 years he will have to sign Andersen and Rielly to the bigger contracts as well.
Then in the 5th year, cap + success will need to be measured again.

 

[Randy Randerson]

You made some great points and when you get to the end of it one can make the argument for all the reasons that he will not be here long term. I think there top three forwards will be JT, Mathews and Mariner, now you add Reilly to that and Anderson and that is the core. Than you start to fill in around. I just don't see a a scenario when you can keep all of them and have a complete team. I hope they can win a cup this year and keep them around for another but after that I just don't see it. If the threat to offer sheet Mathews and Mariner comes into play, having that contract front loaded makes it an easy asset t move.

I could see Nylander being part of the core too, it's hard to know from today's vantage point. But, we don't have to make any decisions on that soon, once Marner and Matthews are signed we only have to worry about winning the cup for a few years then evaluate how to best keep the compete window open for as long as possible. I really think it's a coin flip as to whether Nylander stays here even beyond his next contract or is gone in a few years, and I don't think we'll know which until we see him perform for a while

 

[Drytoast]

I agree, but I also think they will try every other option before trading willie.
I made this thread because there are posters out there saying he is gone for sure next season because of his contract structure.
Yes there are reason why he might be traded, but he wasn't signed with the plan to trade him in the offseason as some are suggesting

I wouldn't say for sure he's gone but if the cost of keeping him is too high, we sure as shit made damn clear that we got him on a very trade friendly contract. Dubas, Shanny and Babs are not stupid. And look at what this team did WITHOUT Willie. You don't lose a few key pieces in order to keep one. Analytics will tell ya that.

What we did by signing Willie was give this year's team a really strong opportunity to win. As the season and playoffs unfold will determine what and who we keep long term. But I can tell ya that Willie isn't on a NMC or NTC contract. He's exposed and he's our 6th best player.

I'm 50/50 on him seeing the entire term of that contract in Toronto.

 

[socko]

Dubas got taken to the woodshed by a guy with no leverage. The only thing that makes sense is trade value. I don't think it was worth the damage. How do you offer $8 to Marner now? You don't.

 

[saltming]

I wouldn't say for sure he's gone but if the cost of keeping him is too high, we sure as **** made damn clear that we got him on a very trade friendly contract. Dubas, Shanny and Babs are not stupid. And look at what this team did WITHOUT Willie. You don't lose a few key pieces in order to keep one. Analytics will tell ya that.

What we did by signing Willie was give this year's team a really strong opportunity to win. As the season and playoffs unfold will determine what and who we keep long term. But I can tell ya that Willie isn't on a NMC or NTC contract. He's exposed and he's our 6th best player.

I'm 50/50 on him seeing the entire term of that contract in Toronto.

Seeing the entire term of his contract is another subject completely.
6th best eh? After Matthews and Marner it's pretty darn close for the next tier of players. I don't think I could number them

 

[saltming]

Dubas got taken to the woodshed by a guy with no leverage. The only thing that makes sense is trade value. I don't think it was worth the damage. How do you offer $8 to Marner now? You don't.

Hes on a better deal than pasta...

 

[Damisoph]

The contract is very tradeable but I hope Willie makes it impossible for the Leafs to trade him, get like 75-80 points in the last 55 games, including 20 goals just so grapes can bitch some more about the salary

 

[NoName]

Lots of posters saying willie is gone next year. I don't think that's what TML has planned. Dubas said

Dubas gets first piece of Leafs’ RFA puzzle in place, Matthews, Marner next
There has always been a trade Nylander crowd, but it seems that management identifies him as part of the core and rightfully so.
So why would you trade him?

Like any GM worth his salt, Dubas won't hesitate to make a trade if one presents itself that helps the team win a Cup, regardless of what he says to the media, that is just good business. He may not be actively shopping Nylander anymore though.

 

[NoName]

The contract is very tradeable but I hope Willie makes it impossible for the Leafs to trade him, get like 75-80 points in the last 55 games, including 20 goals just so grapes can ***** some more about the salary

Yeah, I love these new front-loaded lockout-proof deals. They are all designed to incentivize the player, while keeping the actual cap hit as low as possible. Get these contracts done before the next CBA when the owners inevitably outlaw them.

 

[Fogelhund]

I have no doubts that in a perfect world, without cap concerns, they'd love to keep him. However, depending on negotiations with other players, there may not be the Cap room to keep everyone. As many others have suggested before me, the construction of his contract, that pays a huge chunk to him in the first seven months, leaving $24.7 mil left over five years, make it very valuable. I'm not saying he will be traded, but they've certainly set themselves up, to maximize his value, should it be needed... none of us have a crystal ball, whatever shall happen, will happen.

 

[Drytoast]

Seeing the entire term of his contract is another subject completely.
6th best eh? After Matthews and Marner it's pretty darn close for the next tier of players. I don't think I could number them

Matthews Marner Tavares Rielly Andersen...Nylander.

He's 6th.

 

[Mickey Marner]

Yeah, I love these new front-loaded lockout-proof deals. They are all designed to incentivize the player, while keeping the actual cap hit as low as possible. Get these contracts done before the next CBA when the owners inevitably outlaw them.

You can't outlaw these bonus deals the Leafs handout without outlawing the bogus deals the Coyotes take on. Not really sure why fans of other teams are complaining when it's their teams who will get the real dollar savings should we ever choose to move these players post-bonus payouts.

At least what we're doing is victimless.