Value of: Nylander - Offer sheet

[Kelly]

Before JT signed, in the first half of last season, the majority of your fans speculated in 7.5-8 millions, now its 6- 6.5, whats happened,lol!

Good supporting players is happy to play with good players, player at Nylanders caliber wants to have the puck and getting primetime, to many players who are before him in the team , slow down his development and own goals when not using him properly! No young players with elite potentional take less dollars to make the chance to win bigger, and then let a equal player get a lot more.

You can agree to not agree with posters on the main board and smile as much you want, but as long biased Leafs fans keep posting fantasies on the main, you would expect answers.

You should keep many of your Leaf threads on your own board, like cousin marriages to avoid have your world picture beeing ruined.

JT is a good C, doesnt mean he takes a team to cups, took islanders nowhere in these years, lundqvist and karlsson at least had some effects on their mediocer teams. So hold your breath and wait a couple of years before you are happy as a child, it takes more then C a signing to make your team a serious threat with all the flaws in the team.

Shouldnt be surprised if the fans has turned on JT in a couple of years and the "genius" Dubas renamed to Dum b ass, the fans in Toronto arent famous for their patience!

Majority of our fans? Source? I read the Leafs forum a lot and definitely did not see a majority. Seems like delusional made up bs from your side.

Again more made up bs, do you know Nylander, I'm sure he's perfectly fine with Tavares signing, I'd imagine he wants to win, and he's going to be playing with AM34, so not like his role is going to diminish.

Funny you call us Leaf fans bias, yet your on the other side of spectrum, in terms of making up bullshit to rip on the Leafs.

Yeah I'll make sure to bring up "keeping the Leaf threads on the Leaf board" in our next annual Leaf fan meeting held in Toronto.............wtf

You spewing your incorrect blabber isn't ruining anything for me, it's quite easy to prove you wrong.

Nice little shot there at the end as an Oiler fan, we have a good team there won't be any turning on going on here aslong as that stays the case. But speaking of dumbassess -- good luck with Chia

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

How many rebuilds the last 5 decades? The big and vocal fanbase in Toronto hasnt any patience with players, first they overestimate their players and prospects, then they want to ship them after a so so season(some after a 10 game bad streak). Gardiner is the latest example, a first D among alot of your fans last season. today hes trash and gone after his contract has expired.

I think the worst media and fan climate to be in as a player if things not going smoth is easily Toronto . Have followed some gamethreads and the hate for Hyman, Polak was really scary, even Andersen who stole so many games last season was butchered after a couple of bad games, was scapegoat in the playoffs too.

If you are in a rebuild, you surely doesnt act like it!

How many proper ones? One. It's not the fan bases fault that Burke decided to re-tool instead of rebuild and trade two firsts for Phil Kessel. The majority of Leafs fans were on board for a rebuild after drafting Schenn and Kadri. Burke's the one who had no interest in doing one.

I mean, I think we've got a pretty good track record when it comes to judging our own players and prospects, at least, no worse than other fan bases. Kadri was chirped endlessly on here and is now a 30 goal shutdown centre. All three of Matthews, Marner, and Nylander are great and getting better. Rielly is a #1 Defenseman. Really, if the neutral fans of HF were even close to correct on their assumptions of Leafs players the past half decade this team would consistently place in the bottom five. No one who is serious calls Gardiner a #1 defenseman. If you're judging a fan base by a few people making ridiculous claims I can do the same thing with literally every other fan base. The Oilers for example were supposed to be Cup Contenders this past season. What happened with that?

Again, I've read the GDTs and just general threads on every Canadian teams' board on here, the vitriol is not exclusive to Leafs fans.

We are just exiting our rebuild if you want to label it. Though the organization would most likely say that they are constantly building.

 

[Pi]

Islanders wouldn’t need to offersheet if they would have just picked him instead of Michael Dal Colle in the draft.

One of the reasons why Tavares left is that the Islanders just flubbed so many top 10 picks. They could have been such a good team.

Leafs drafting record in the last 10 years or so isn’t exactly great. It’s probavlt average. But they never f***ed up a top 10 picks. Got Kadri, Marner, Matthews, Rielly, Nylander. All homegrown top 10 picks.

 

[McClelland]

Majority of our fans? Source? I read the Leafs forum a lot and definitely did not see a majority. Seems like delusional made up bs from your side.

Again more made up bs, do you know Nylander, I'm sure he's perfectly fine with Tavares signing, I'd imagine he wants to win, and he's going to be playing with AM34, so not like his role is going to diminish.

Funny you call us Leaf fans bias, yet your on the other side of spectrum, in terms of making up bull**** to rip on the Leafs.

Yeah I'll make sure to bring up "keeping the Leaf threads on the Leaf board" in our next annual Leaf fan meeting held in Toronto.............wtf

You spewing your incorrect blabber isn't ruining anything for me, it's quite easy to prove you wrong.

Nice little shot there at the end as an Oiler fan, we have a good team there won't be any turning on going on here aslong as that stays the case. But speaking of dumbassess -- good luck with Chia

Do you know Nylander? Still you sure! We dont need to prove anything on HF boards, its how other posters see it in this case. Majority is more then who had Nylander at 6-6.5!

I understand the embarrassment that so many changed over night(JT trade and start to call Nylander greedy if he dont accept what they offer him and take peanuts for the team. But marner should have 8-9 with the same numbers and impact.

You and most of the Leaf posters continues to spew insults at my posts. You doesnt bring any sort of lights to the Nylander case. Hell you dont even see a problem sign both Nylander and Marner and at the same time going for defensive help.

I dont think you try to understand what situation Nylander are in! Before the JT signing, he was expected to take over in a 2 C role and playing a head role in the rebuild, thats changed over night and the need for Nylander is much much less with 2 albatross C contracts(1 incoming). If the team wants to compete in the next 2-3 years to come, you has to improve the D and also make the team tougher(which easier) thats why i think the Leafs need to use founds from the prospect pool to make the team more playoff suitable.

Has read many excellent Leafs posters who understands the big picture, sadly they drown in crap and insulting posts.

Nylander is the odd man out, dont need to be mad over that, the Defensive help Nylander + will bring, will hugely improve the team(if do it right). If it turns ugly with Nylander it probably brings less! Michael Nylander has a big impact on William and he sees a future star in his son, and i would be very surprised if he signs anything under 7.5 long term and that the Nylander camp is worried about the JT signing and what it means to his position and development in the team.

We will have to wait and see!

Im done here "bro", dont go into denial when hes traded in not more then 2 years from now or when he signs a bridge deal or gets in a contract dispute!

Take it like a man!

 

[Kelly]

Do you know Nylander? Still you sure! We dont need to prove anything on HF boards, its how other posters see it in this case. Majority is more then who had Nylander at 6-6.5!

I understand the embarrassment that so many changed over night(JT trade and start to call Nylander greedy if he dont accept what they offer him and take peanuts for the team. But marner should have 8-9 with the same numbers and impact.

You and most of the Leaf posters continues to spew insults at my posts. You doesnt bring any sort of lights to the Nylander case. Hell you dont even see a problem sign both Nylander and Marner and at the same time going for defensive help.

I dont think you try to understand what situation Nylander are in! Before the JT signing, he was expected to take over in a 2 C role and playing a head role in the rebuild, thats changed over night and the need for Nylander is much much less with 2 albatross C contracts(1 incoming). If the team wants to compete in the next 2-3 years to come, you has to improve the D and also make the team tougher(which easier) thats why i think the Leafs need to use founds from the prospect pool to make the team more playoff suitable.

Has read many excellent Leafs posters who understands the big picture, sadly they drown in crap and insulting posts.

Nylander is the odd man out, dont need to be mad over that, the Defensive help Nylander + will bring, will hugely improve the team(if do it right). If it turns ugly with Nylander it probably brings less! Michael Nylander has a big impact on William and he sees a future star in his son, and i would be very surprised if he signs anything under 7.5 long term and that the Nylander camp is worried about the JT signing and what it means to his position and development in the team.

We will have to wait and see!

Im done here "bro", dont go into denial when hes traded in not more then 2 years from now or when he signs a bridge deal or gets in a contract dispute!

Take it like a man!

Yeah we're done here..

Make sure to remember..... you're suppose to wear the tin foil hat, and don't microwave it!

 

[Jimmy Firecracker]

Islanders wouldn’t need to offersheet if they would have just picked him instead of Michael Dal Colle in the draft.

One of the reasons why Tavares left is that the Islanders just flubbed so many top 10 picks. They could have been such a good team.

Leafs drafting record in the last 10 years or so isn’t exactly great. It’s probavlt average. But they never ****ed up a top 10 picks. Got Kadri, Marner, Matthews, Rielly, Nylander. All homegrown top 10 picks.

Leafs first round picks the past 10 drafts (NHL Roster Players Bolded):

2009: Nazem Kadri, 7th overall.
2010: No First Round Pick (Thanks Burke).
2011: Tyler Biggs, 22nd Overall (Barf), Stuart Percy, 25th overall.
2012: Morgan Rielly, 5th overall.
2013: Frederik Gauthier, 21st overall.
2014: William Nylander, 8th overall.
2015: Mitch Marner, 4th overall.
2016. Auston Matthews, 1st overall.
2017: Timothy Liljegren, 17th overall.
2018: Rasmus Sandin, 29th overall.

Leafs got 5 impact players out of the the last 10 drafts (and exactly 10 picks), and the book still isn't written on Liljegren or even Gauthier who could be this team's 4th line penalty killing centre this year. Contrasted with the Islanders over the past 10 drafts.

Islanders first round picks the past 10 drafts (NHL Roster Players Bolded):

2009: John Tavares, 1st overall, Calvin De Haan, 12th overall.
2010: Nino Niederreiter, 5th overall. Brock Nelson, 30th overall.
2011: Ryan Strome, 5th overall.
2012: Griffin Reinhart, 4th overall.
2013: Ryan Pulock, 15th overall.
2014: Michael Dal Colle, 5th overall.
2015: Matthew Barzal, 16th overall.
2016: Kieffer Bellows, 19th overall.
2017: No First Round Pick.
2018: Oliver Wahlstrom, 11th overall, Noah Dobson, 12th overall.

Islanders came out with the same amount of NHL players, though more than half of them are on a lower level compared to their Leaf counterparts. It also doesn't help that the Islanders had 5 top 5 picks and only hit on one of them (Tavares). Leafs by comparison have only had 3.

 

[me2]

It's nice that you think so highly of William Nylander, he is a great young player. Fact is though, his comparable Nikolaj Ehlers -- who he compares very nicely too, received 6millionx7years, (8% of the cap) which would put William @ around 6.36 for 7 years -- which is a very manageable number for the Leafs, even if he went up to 6.5.

Not very well. Ehlers had 1 season over 38 points, Nylander has two over 60. Repeating a high point season gives you much more bargaining power.

 

[francis246]

it doesn't matter cause I don't believe Nylander will accept an offersheet, why would he not want to keep playing with Matthews. His numbers are thriving playing with Matthews

 

[HockeyAnalystGenius]

Fans will be calling him No Lander when Mathews isn't bouncing pucks off him into the net.

 

[francis246]

If this happened and Arizona ends up with 1st or 2nd OA in 2019 i feel like the Leafs feel better about the Offer Sheet they gave Kessel oh so long ago.

leafs never gave phil kessel an offersheet. That was the problem. Burke didn't offer sheet him and we ended up paying more than we should have. In retrospect we should have offersheeted Kessel.

 

[McClelland]

How many proper ones? One. It's not the fan bases fault that Burke decided to re-tool instead of rebuild and trade two firsts for Phil Kessel. The majority of Leafs fans were on board for a rebuild after drafting Schenn and Kadri. Burke's the one who had no interest in doing one.

I mean, I think we've got a pretty good track record when it comes to judging our own players and prospects, at least, no worse than other fan bases. Kadri was chirped endlessly on here and is now a 30 goal shutdown centre. All three of Matthews, Marner, and Nylander are great and getting better. Rielly is a #1 Defenseman. Really, if the neutral fans of HF were even close to correct on their assumptions of Leafs players the past half decade this team would consistently place in the bottom five. No one who is serious calls Gardiner a #1 defenseman. If you're judging a fan base by a few people making ridiculous claims I can do the same thing with literally every other fan base. The Oilers for example were supposed to be Cup Contenders this past season. What happened with that?

Again, I've read the GDTs and just general threads on every Canadian teams' board on here, the vitriol is not exclusive to Leafs fans.

We are just exiting our rebuild if you want to label it. Though the organization would most likely say that they are constantly building.

Pretty fair post! Said it before that you are the biggest fanbase by marginal and that means that you have more vocal kids then others.

About Gardiner, it was plenty of posters who claimed that after last season and not many who disagreed with that. If the reason are that even some Leafs fans doesnt wants to get in a dispute with the over biased ones, perhaps, but can only go after how i experiencing it from what i read.

Have followed many other gtd especially playoffs when we were in the basement, and every team have scapegoats but Leafs Hfboards execute players on daily basis after a bad stretch, have posters who try to settle them down ,but are mostly over voiced.

GL great to have a post against without insults!

Cheers!

 

[sandybridge]

leafs never gave phil kessel an offersheet. That was the problem. Burke didn't offer sheet him and we ended up paying more than we should have. In retrospect we should have offersheeted Kessel.

How would that have helped though. It seems that more picks would have gone the other way if there was an OS. Maybe I'm too hazy on the original deal, but the Leafs seems to have gotten a good deal with only two picks going back, except both of those drafted elite players.

 

[Kelly]

Not very well. Ehlers had 1 season over 38 points, Nylander has two over 60. Repeating a high point season gives you much more bargaining power.

Nylander first season: 0.59ppg
Ehlers first season: 0.53ppg

Nylander second season: 0.75ppg
Ehlers second season: 0.78ppg

Ehlers signs extension

Nylander third season: 0.74ppg
Ehlers third season: 0.73ppg

Nylander signs extension

Seems to me they match up very well, Nylander may end up at around 6.5m due to repeating, but they're damn similar in ppg. Nylander also didn't play a full year his first season, where as Ehlers did -- that shouldn't go against Ehlers.

 

[francis246]

Do you know Nylander? Still you sure! We dont need to prove anything on HF boards, its how other posters see it in this case. Majority is more then who had Nylander at 6-6.5!

I understand the embarrassment that so many changed over night(JT trade and start to call Nylander greedy if he dont accept what they offer him and take peanuts for the team. But marner should have 8-9 with the same numbers and impact.

You and most of the Leaf posters continues to spew insults at my posts. You doesnt bring any sort of lights to the Nylander case. Hell you dont even see a problem sign both Nylander and Marner and at the same time going for defensive help.

I dont think you try to understand what situation Nylander are in! Before the JT signing, he was expected to take over in a 2 C role and playing a head role in the rebuild, thats changed over night and the need for Nylander is much much less with 2 albatross C contracts(1 incoming). If the team wants to compete in the next 2-3 years to come, you has to improve the D and also make the team tougher(which easier) thats why i think the Leafs need to use founds from the prospect pool to make the team more playoff suitable.

Has read many excellent Leafs posters who understands the big picture, sadly they drown in crap and insulting posts.

Nylander is the odd man out, dont need to be mad over that, the Defensive help Nylander + will bring, will hugely improve the team(if do it right). If it turns ugly with Nylander it probably brings less! Michael Nylander has a big impact on William and he sees a future star in his son, and i would be very surprised if he signs anything under 7.5 long term and that the Nylander camp is worried about the JT signing and what it means to his position and development in the team.

We will have to wait and see!

Im done here "bro", dont go into denial when hes traded in not more then 2 years from now or when he signs a bridge deal or gets in a contract dispute!

Take it like a man!

First of all, you know nothing about the Leafs by our posts. Nylander wasn't lined up to be the #2C. Tavares signing here, confirmed my believe as a TRUE leafs fan... the organization and Mike Babcock especially never believed that Nylander could or would be a center for the Maple Leafs.

1. He's terrible defensively
2. He's just better as a winger
3. He works well with Matthews, so why split that up?

 

[francis246]

How would that have helped though. It seems that more picks would have gone the other way if there was an OS. Maybe I'm too hazy on the original deal, but the Leafs seems to have gotten a good deal with only two picks going back, except both of those drafted elite players.

the compensation was lower when we traded for kessel. The compensation has changed drastically since we traded for Kessel.

Also Kessel's first contract was about 5 million. So we would have had to have only given up a first and a second at that time. As opposed to two first round picks. So it would have helped a lot. We would have been higher in the first round in 2011 and could have taken a defenseman (ala hamilton)

 

[wankstifier]

This thread still happening? LOL

Here is the answer, it's never going to happen to any of our players, plus they would never agree to it, and Dubas and Co. will make sure of that.

But nice try

Sometimes a player signs an offersheet to get a better contract. They may like their team, but they're going to want fair pay. Discounts are for suckers

 

[Pi]

Nylander first season: 0.59ppg
Ehlers first season: 0.53ppg

Nylander second season: 0.75ppg
Ehlers second season: 0.78ppg

Ehlers signs extension

Nylander third season: 0.74ppg
Ehlers third season: 0.73ppg

Nylander signs extension

Seems to me they match up very well, Nylander may end up at around 6.5m due to repeating, but they're damn similar in ppg. Nylander also didn't play a full year his first season, where as Ehlers did -- that shouldn't go against Ehlers.

Yeah, Ehlers is Nylander's best comparison. I think Dubas will go for eight years as opposed to six which will see an increase in his AAV but it certainly won't be that hard to keep him long term.

I see the following happening.

Matthews at 11M
Marner at 7M +/- 500k
Nylander at 6.5M +/- 500K depending on how many years he gives. If he's smart, he'll sign a six year deal. Eight years will likely result in 7M AAV. If I were him, I'd bet on myself that I'll be worth more than 7M six years from now.

 

[McClelland]

First of all, you know nothing about the Leafs by our posts. Nylander wasn't lined up to be the #2C. Tavares signing here, confirmed my believe as a TRUE leafs fan... the organization and Mike Babcock especially never believed that Nylander could or would be a center for the Maple Leafs.

1. He's terrible defensively
2. He's just better as a winger
3. He works well with Matthews, so why split that up?

1. Hes not , and there goes your Babcock believes!Maple Leafs' William Nylander: Moves to middle

2. Of course because they mostly playing him there!

3. If Matthews are that good he dont need a 7.5 Winger. McDavid made a 30 goal scorer of maroon. McD and drai have great chemistry, but they splitted them up!

Nylander could certainly be a good 2C in 2-3 years. Leafs got a chance on JT and speeded up the rebuild. Or do do you think they had a agreement with JT a couple of years before the trade. Of course they planned to slowly move Nylander to a C spot, and he did when AM was injured.

 

[Menzinger]

Do you know Nylander? Still you sure! We dont need to prove anything on HF boards, its how other posters see it in this case. Majority is more then who had Nylander at 6-6.5!

I understand the embarrassment that so many changed over night(JT trade and start to call Nylander greedy if he dont accept what they offer him and take peanuts for the team. But marner should have 8-9 with the same numbers and impact.

You and most of the Leaf posters continues to spew insults at my posts. You doesnt bring any sort of lights to the Nylander case. Hell you dont even see a problem sign both Nylander and Marner and at the same time going for defensive help.

I dont think you try to understand what situation Nylander are in! Before the JT signing, he was expected to take over in a 2 C role and playing a head role in the rebuild, thats changed over night and the need for Nylander is much much less with 2 albatross C contracts(1 incoming). If the team wants to compete in the next 2-3 years to come, you has to improve the D and also make the team tougher(which easier) thats why i think the Leafs need to use founds from the prospect pool to make the team more playoff suitable.

Has read many excellent Leafs posters who understands the big picture, sadly they drown in crap and insulting posts.

Nylander is the odd man out, dont need to be mad over that, the Defensive help Nylander + will bring, will hugely improve the team(if do it right). If it turns ugly with Nylander it probably brings less! Michael Nylander has a big impact on William and he sees a future star in his son, and i would be very surprised if he signs anything under 7.5 long term and that the Nylander camp is worried about the JT signing and what it means to his position and development in the team.

We will have to wait and see!

Im done here "bro", dont go into denial when hes traded in not more then 2 years from now or when he signs a bridge deal or gets in a contract dispute!

Take it like a man!

Your analysis of the Leafs current situation is lacking to say the least, I don’t even know where to begin trying to correct it......

 

[McClelland]

Your analysis of the Leafs current situation is lacking to say the least, I don’t even know where to begin trying to correct it......

Why bother and coming with a insult! I bet something triggered you with my speculations! You have a ignore list, you know!

Toronto fans who says that the JT signing hasnt made Nylanders situation in the Leafs org weaker are in denial. But it isnt a bad thing if traded for defensive help, its only hurt peoples egos, those who said that they never trade one of their 3 big ones!

 

[me2]

Nylander first season: 0.59ppg
Ehlers first season: 0.53ppg

Nylander second season: 0.75ppg
Ehlers second season: 0.78ppg

Ehlers signs extension

Nylander third season: 0.74ppg
Ehlers third season: 0.73ppg

Nylander signs extension

Seems to me they match up very well, Nylander may end up at around 6.5m due to repeating, but they're damn similar in ppg. Nylander also didn't play a full year his first season, where as Ehlers did -- that shouldn't go against Ehlers.

You'd be wrong. You are counting a season after Ehlers signed to try to make your case look stronger, ignore that season. As for the 1st Nylander "season", trying to pass 22 games off as a season.......

Nylander is coming off two 60+ seasons, Ehlers was coming off one. One had repeated success to fall back on, the other did not.

 

[Kelly]

You'd be wrong. You are counting a season after Ehlers signed to try to make your case look stronger, ignore that season. As for the 1st Nylander "season", trying to pass 22 games off as a season.......

Nylander is coming off two 60+ seasons, Ehlers was coming off one. One had repeated success to fall back on, the other did not.

Ok, you don't like the Ehlers comparable... noted -- doesn't make it a bad one, they're clearly comparables and Dubas will be pushing for something in or around there.

Heres another,

Forsberg - signed june16, had two 60 points seasons before -- 6millionx6 - 8.22 c.h% =6.5million now on a 79.5 million cap.

I mean atleast I'm providing evidence to support my claim. Nylander will be around 6.5 give or take a couple 100g's.

Who's your comparable, and what do you think he comes in at?

 

[GoldenSeal]

This sounds like something the Islanders would do partly out of spite and partly because if it backfired, they got 19m in Capspace and need a 1 C.

 

[Notsince67]

Im not worry about your players at all, responding to Leafs fans whos blind and dont realize the obvious thing about the JT signing. Nylander as the future 2C option has been cemented as a winger and his team cant afford to give him his full value. Yes i like Nylanders chances to be a force in the Nhl(Marner not so much)l, but not in the current Leafs team though. Funny to see fans turning on him over night and demands that he will take 2 million less then before the JT signing. Hes young and talent a former worlds mvp with 2 back to back 60+ seasons. Hes not greedy or stupid, so it will be a big problem to pay him off.

He has lost in position and lost a future 2C place in the team. he will get less primetime and they will lowball him due cap(or going with a crappy D), then more probably trade him then trade Marner, both will not be in the team in 2 years if you want to go anywhere outside a 1 round exit.

Dont think Jt signed to wait 5 years and hope you got lucky to develop a D prospect to a no 1 D or hope some magic beans turns up!

The logic thing with the JT signing will be a Nylander trade for defensive help, if you doing good there, it will help the team.

Im not doing avatar bets, im not even put it in peoples throats when i had it right with players, which i mostly has. I can pm you a list if you are intrested? Or you can lurk in my posts!

I disagree. I've watched enough games to know they are both hugely skilled. It is miraculous that a core as young as this did as well as they did. Offensively, Marner actually was better than people would have expected.
They went to game 7 against a very good bruin team. To think they haven't become better just doesn't make sense

 

[francis246]

1. Hes not , and there goes your Babcock believes!Maple Leafs' William Nylander: Moves to middle

2. Of course because they mostly playing him there!

3. If Matthews are that good he dont need a 7.5 Winger. McDavid made a 30 goal scorer of maroon. McD and drai have great chemistry, but they splitted them up!

Nylander could certainly be a good 2C in 2-3 years. Leafs got a chance on JT and speeded up the rebuild. Or do do you think they had a agreement with JT a couple of years before the trade. Of course they planned to slowly move Nylander to a C spot, and he did when AM was injured.

Nylander isn't a center. Point, blank, period. and that isn't a bad thing. I wish a lot of leaf fans and leaf haters (yourself) would give it a rest.

He's an elite winger and there's nothing wrong with, not everyone can play center. Nylander is more effective on the wing in my opinion. I think his in ability to play down low hurts the team. But that's not to say he can't play it occassionally