Speculation: Nylander contract discussion

[al secord]

What the hell does Freidman know?

And how the hell would anyone here know who's forcing who's hand?

 

[Walshy7]

Doubt it solves the cap problem, as the RHD would either already be getting paid well, or will be on the cusp of that. The Leafs and Nylander both still have time, and if they feel the need to use it, so be it.

well I think the thinking here is that a $7M forward as 4th best forward isn't the same as a $7M D who is best or 2nd best dman. And I do think there is some validity to that

 

[Notsince67]

I love the insinuation Willy is the greedy one. Is it not possible the leafs are offering lets say $6.5x 7 or 8 years, Willy thinks if he takes a bridge he can prove in the long run he is a $8M player. So willy is not wanting long term and the leafs want long term and they are waiting for the other to blink. Nylander and agent would know their comparable and probably think siging a 3 or 4 year deal at the end of it will have a higher set of comparable.

I could be wrong but so could the nylander greedy asking for $8M brigade, because no one knows what is going on

It is possible. Again...if an offer sheet doesn't materialize, there is little that Willy can do except sit. There really isn't a lot of leverage.

 

[Duke Silver]

Who knows? But Nylander could be asking for crazy money like some have reported to be at 8 mil. A young RHD who is still on his ELC, with potential could be the trade off.

Who is reporting 8 mil? Provide your sources.

 

[ACC1224]

Is there an explanation of how he's "forcing his hand" or is it in the other Nylander contract discussion thread?

 

[Buds17]

well I think the thinking here is that a $7M forward as 4th best forward isn't the same as a $7M D who is best or 2nd best dman. And I do think there is some validity to that

That's a fair consideration and good point, but the same might have to hold true for Nylander, the D-man in question and the team we're trading with as well (unless they need to make a move for contract - or any other - reasons).

Wouldn't say a trade is impossible, but a number of things would have to line up.

 

[diceman934]

I'd say it's highly unlikely that they haven't offered term. Far more likely they're just haggling over the money part.

Based on what is it highly unlikely?

 

[diceman934]

Is there an explanation of how he's "forcing his hand" or is it in the other Nylander contract discussion thread?

No just a new thread talking about the same stuff.

 

[Sypher04]

Based on what is it highly unlikely?

The reality that a bridge deal likely doesn't save you all much and would be stupid to even offer let alone be your preference as the team.

 

[BodaciousBeefBazooka]

Short answer: No
Longer answer: Nope

Medium answer: No..?

 

[Mess]

Friedman came out and said that Nylander and the Leafs are not close.

Is Nylander forcing Dubas's hand to trade him? Is Nylander being greedy?

Nylander could be making decisions easy for Dubas, in his hunt for a quality RHD.

The 2 camps are not close, with the season just a month and change away.

Could this solve our cap problem if Dubas can flip him for a top RHD?

Not close long-term likely means short-term bridge bridge deal is the likely outcome. IMO

Unless you're talking Parayko for Nylander like trade I don't believe he will be traded unless the right deal comes along.

As mentioned before I thought Nylander's agent would play on Dubas inexperience at the GM position in hopes it gets his client the best possible deal financially, so this is a bit of a cat and mouse situation at present. .

A bridge "prove it deal" or a LT deal > $ 7 mil per and Nylander wins. A LT (7-8 years) deal @ < $7 mil and Dubas won the standoff.

 

[Bluelines]

Who knows? But Nylander could be asking for crazy money like some have reported to be at 8 mil. A young RHD who is still on his ELC, with potential could be the trade off.

People who can count above the number of fingers and toes on their body?

 

[LeafGrief]

The thread on the mainboards reads like an erotic fanfiction written by Leafs haters.

Friedman was cagey about his language. He didn't say, "The Leafs and Nylander aren't close" he said, "Last I heard the Leafs and Nylander aren't close". That prefix is just journalistic weasel-speak. We have no idea when he last heard anything and we have no idea what he means by "not close". Is it the dollars, is it the term, or maybe the structure and lockout proofing? Meanwhile, every single word from Dubas and Nylander themselves have indicated that they're looking towards roughly the same things (long term in Toronto) and we've seen absolutely nothing to indicate a significant rift. Tons of comparables sign reasonable deals late into September, training camp, or even early October. Everything else is fever/wet dream speculation. When Kyle Dubas said there was no rush, he meant there was no rush. It might be a difficult negotiation, but this is all summer hysterics either way.

 

[Notsince67]

Medium answer: No..?

I guess we'll have to mark it down as a maybe

 

[glue]

Until I hear someone like Bobby Mac reporting a rift or both sides being 'not close' I'm going to be just fine. Extremely normal for these things to go down to the wire, just look at history. Especially if, as it appears, the Leafs are attempting to sign all the big 3 together since all 3 contracts are currently being negotiated. To me that does make sense given the Leafs staff must have some sort of max number in their mind that the big 3 can cost and for them to remain competitive. So juggling that all at the same time will take more time.

I get that we're all anxious and other fan bases are praying we somehow don't sign all 3, but we will - have faith and f$%# the haters

 

[diceman934]

The reality that a bridge deal likely doesn't save you all much and would be stupid to even offer let alone be your preference as the team.

A bridge deal can also be used on players you are not completely sold on yet and not just to save money.

So tell me why would it be stupid to offer a bridge deal if they were not sold on a player?

 

[willmma]

Nylander wants to be here long term, that's what he said. I trust him more than EF.

That said, this whole thing doesn't make sense. His on ice performance puts him in a certain range. If he asks for more than he warrants and shows stubbronness and ill will (no pun), then not only is he hurting his prospects with Toronto but with the entire league. Who will trade a top RHD for a guy who wants more money than he deserves and is willing to sit out for it?

 

[diceman934]

The thread on the mainboards reads like an erotic fanfiction written by Leafs haters.

Friedman was cagey about his language. He didn't say, "The Leafs and Nylander aren't close" he said, "Last I heard the Leafs and Nylander aren't close". That prefix is just journalistic weasel-speak. We have no idea when he last heard anything and we have no idea what he means by "not close". Is it the dollars, is it the term, or maybe the structure and lockout proofing? Meanwhile, every single word from Dubas and Nylander themselves have indicated that they're looking towards roughly the same things (long term in Toronto) and we've seen absolutely nothing to indicate a significant rift. Tons of comparables sign reasonable deals late into September, training camp, or even early October. Everything else is fever/wet dream speculation. When Kyle Dubas said there was no rush, he meant there was no rush. It might be a difficult negotiation, but this is all summer hysterics either way.

Dubas has never said he is looking to sign Nylander long term. Nylander has stated he would like long term.

 

[Stephen]

I keep thinking the issue is Marner and not Nylander. Nylander ought to be in the Pastrnak level, maybe at around $7 million because of inflation. But the whispers of Marner wanting close to Matthews money (i.e. Eichel level money) and that throws everything out of whack. Because for me, Marner and Nylander should get nearly the same deal, and Matthews more. Something like $10 million, $7 million, $7 million. Not $10 million, $10 million and $8 million.

 

[Mess]

A bridge deal can also be used on players you are not completely sold on yet and not just to save money.

So tell me why would it be stupid to offer a bridge deal if they were not sold on a player?

Because you plan to play him on the wing with one of the best young C in the league and potential franchise superstar.

#1 player comparables for contracts are points and PPG rates.

Talk about shooting yourself in your own foot in contract negotiations, when you stack the deck in favour of the player against your own bargaining position.

Resigning players to LT contracts before they break out is Cap Management 101.

PS. If that isn't bad enough if Leafs don't re-sign Marner LT this year also, the very same thing will be happening with Mitch by playing him alongside JT all year.

 

[Walshy7]

I keep thinking the issue is Marner and not Nylander. Nylander ought to be in the Pastrnak level, maybe at around $7 million because of inflation. But the whispers of Marner wanting close to Matthews money (i.e. Eichel level money) and that throws everything out of whack. Because for me, Marner and Nylander should get nearly the same deal, and Matthews more. Something like $10 million, $7 million, $7 million. Not $10 million, $10 million and $8 million.

it throws nothing out of whack, if marner (IF, I doubt he actually is) ask for $10M then goodbye marner we cant overpay players like him and nylander. Even a PPG season this year does not get Marner close to $10M, YOu have to factor in at the time Eichel was their franchise essentially future captain ETC and 1C that's how you justify (rightly or wrongly) Eichels payday. Marner may be top scorer some seasons but is not and will not be the leafs best player

 

[LeafGrief]

Dubas has never said he is looking to sign Nylander long term. Nylander has stated he would like long term.

Dubas on keeping Nylander, Marner, Matthews: 'We can, and we will' - Sportsnet.ca

I always think that when a player is going to make a commitment of any length, particularly when they’re signing up long-term, that we need to sit with the player and make sure that they player knows where we’re going as a program and what our vision and our plans are so those are discussions that I’ll have with each of the individual players that are due extensions here or are due contracts for next season

No, he did not say explicitly that he wants to sign Nylander long term. But it's not particularly reading between the lines to assume that he might be talking about Nylander in the above quote, considering that the context is about keeping Nylander/Marner/Matthews. It is a much bigger logical leap to assume that Dubas only wants a short term deal.

I would also be very curious to find a situation where the team doesn't want its young stars locked up long term on reasonable deals.

 

[56 Years No Cup]

He is a very skilled player who dislikes body contact to the point of avoiding it.

Sounds exactly like Gardiner.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

I wouldn't doubt that Willy's agents ask is 8 million AAV and Dubas is offering like 5.5 AAV and like these RFA negotiations always seem to go they meet somewhere in the middle around 6.75 million.

Every RFA asks for crazy money they dont deserve as it is a bargaining tactic.

 

[Walshy7]

I wouldn't doubt that Willy's agents ask is 8 million AAV and Dubas is offering like 5.5 AAV and like these RFA negotiations always seem to go they meet somewhere in the middle around 6.75 million.

Every RFA asks for crazy money they dont deserve as it is a bargaining tactic.

why wouldn't you doubt they ask for $8M? he has no comparables at all at $8M so why this assumption than Nylander is asking for way too much?. Also Dubas at $5.5 long term? what a joke that is we should all be worried if Dubas is genuinely offering that especially long term