Nylander Chronicles Part XXIV: Homer's Odyssey Edition

[Ciao]

To me that shows the teams still low balling him .

Also half the league wants to trade for him so they must consider his ask reasonable and that also shows me the team is low balling him .

If the Leafs were low-balling him, Nylander would have an offer sheet by now.

None of those other GMs are willing to do that.

That proves to me that the problem is Nylander's ask is unreasonable for an RFA.

Willy wants to be paid like a UFA without paying his dues.

 

[Walshy7]

Today
"Dubas showing his inexperience, he should pay whatever the highest bidder is offering, regardless of the leverage he has or how far that offer is off of market norms"

Signed for 7x7 in the summer
"Dubas showing his inexperience, got out negotiated and gave a greater than market norm deal, was too scared to use his leverage to get a good deal for the team"

$7M is barely an overpay. $500K is not far off market norms well done though it was a nice effort.

Also I like dubas he was the right choice for GM and still is for me, but if we let an elite talent go for the sake of $500K maybe even $1M that shows naivety to me.

This post is an example of posters taking one persons post and attributing to a group of posters and what is wrong with HF boards IMO. You picked one of my posts out of all context and tried to use it as a way to paint a picture for any poster arguing for Nylander right now.

I will say again, trading nylander and having him sign for $7M is optically very bad for Dubas and co. $7M is barely an overpay. We aren't getting a top dman for a top winger so the return wont be worth it to lose a top line winger

 

[Cor]

Make a final offer of 6.8M x 6 years.

If he doesn’t want it, he doesn’t want to be here, so go get us Brett Pesce Dubas!!

 

[4thline]

how many ****ing times. Ehlers contract kicking in has no relevance,

Cap friendly's chosen methodology has very little bearing on what constitutes logical valuation and comparison.

 

[Walshy7]

Why would that make him look like an amateur?

because $7M is maybe (maybe) $$750K-500K too much to lose an elite winger for that is very amateur. Teams will trade for him at $7M so sign him and if it turns out after this year it wont work with Marner and Matthews then trade him. Signed Nylander will also bring a much better return in trade. And we keep him for this years cup run

 

[AppsSyl]

In response to those putting forward the argument that, if the other GMs feel his market value is what the Leafs are offering, than no one is going to pay him what he wants anyway.

There is a difference between what a team that currently already has the player is willing to pay within their cap structure, with what a team who doesn't have said player, needs a player like them and can otherwise not acquire one.

What the Canes or another team really wanting Nylander would pay him to get him is guaranteed higher than if they already owned his rights and were negotiating, especially if they had the depth up front and pending contracts coming up the Leafs do. How many 22 year old players off their ELC like Nylander (who can play C or W) become available?

In addition, it is to the advantage of the GMs in the league to anonymously support Toronto's position, because one less Draisatl or Eichel type contract helps keep others down.

 

[ToneDog]

on this board that's a good thing

-a few stood together when the rabid hordes attacked relentlessly for not believing in the almighty overlord Burke

-a few stood together when the rabid hordes attacked for believing we should trade Dion instead of extending him because he was over rated and wouldn't age well

-a few stood together when the rabid hordes attacked for believing the team needed to be gutted and built through the draft instead of doing an accelerated re tool

have i been wrong ? plenty of times but not nearly as much as when the majority pick up there pom poms collectively to defend the honor of the Leafs even against there own players , lol

but i need to know one thing , why has it been reported that a large number of teams want to trade for Nylander if his demands are so ridiculous ?

Interested in and actually trading for and signing are two different things. They can talk the talk but can they walk the walk ? There is nothing stopping a team from making Dubas an offer he can't refuse like Burke did when he traded for Kessel.

 

[Confucius]

on this board that's a good thing

-a few stood together when the rabid hordes attacked relentlessly for not believing in the almighty overlord Burke

-a few stood together when the rabid hordes attacked for believing we should trade Dion instead of extending him because he was over rated and wouldn't age well

-a few stood together when the rabid hordes attacked for believing the team needed to be gutted and built through the draft instead of doing an accelerated re tool

have i been wrong ? plenty of times but not nearly as much as when the majority pick up there pom poms collectively to defend the honor of the Leafs even against there own players , lol

but i need to know one thing , why has it been reported that a large number of teams want to trade for Nylander if his demands are so ridiculous ?

Team is always 1st, all players will come and go over your lifetime but the team will always be here. Just like a player should play for the name on the front not the name on the back. A fan cheers for the name on the front before the name on the back.

I wonder what all these teams are offering, that would be interesting to see, then we would know what William is worth.

 

[613Leafer]

how many ****ing times. Ehlers contract kicking in has no relevance, its when he signed it Ehelers chose to sign a year earlier than nylander, that's his problem. nylander hasn't ever gone 20 games without a goal either I think Nylande ris better than ehlers.

Which is why most people would say Nylander should get an extra few hundred thousand maybe even 500k. But not 1M.

Nylander waited so he could bet on himself but showed no improvement from age 20 to 21. If he'd shown marginal improvement and put up ~70 points, 7M would make sense.

 

[hotpaws]

If the Leafs were low-balling him, Nylander would have an offer sheet by now.

None of those other GMs are willing to do that.

That proves to me that the problem is nylander's ask is unreasonable.

what does an offer sheet have to do with the Leafs low balling him ?

if Willie is being unreasonable why is half the league interested in trading for him ?

 

[4thline]

$7M is barely an overpay. $500K is not far off market norms well done though it was a nice effort.

Also I like dubas he was the right choice for GM and still is for me, but if we let an elite talent go for the sake of $500K maybe even $1M that shows naivety to me.

This post is an example of posters taking one persons post and attributing to a group of posters and what is wrong with HF boards IMO. You picked one of my posts out of all context and tried to use it as a way to paint a picture for any poster arguing for Nylander right now.

I will say again, trading nylander and having him sign for $7M is optically very bad for Dubas and co. $7M is barely an overpay. We aren't getting a top dman for a top winger so the return wont be worth it to lose a top line winger

I didn't even have you in mind with that post. and I have no problem with something in the 6.5-7.2 range if it get's us 7-8 years

 

[TheBeastCoast]

$7M is barely an overpay. $500K is not far off market norms well done though it was a nice effort.

Also I like dubas he was the right choice for GM and still is for me, but if we let an elite talent go for the sake of $500K maybe even $1M that shows naivety to me.

This post is an example of posters taking one persons post and attributing to a group of posters and what is wrong with HF boards IMO. You picked one of my posts out of all context and tried to use it as a way to paint a picture for any poster arguing for Nylander right now.

I will say again, trading nylander and having him sign for $7M is optically very bad for Dubas and co. $7M is barely an overpay. We aren't getting a top dman for a top winger so the return wont be worth it to lose a top line winger

Optics don't actually mean a damn thing though. If the Leafs have a set number in mind that they feel he is valued at then hold to that number. If Nylander's camp disagrees they have had 4 months to find themselves an offer sheet. I don't get the point in bending to RFA's.

 

[Walshy7]

Cap friendly's chosen methodology has very little bearing on what constitutes logical valuation and comparison.

its common sense man, Ehlers chose security over playing out final year of ELC nylander didn't, Ehlers had a 38 point season and a 64 points season when he chose to sign. Nylander has a 13 point in 23 game stint (probably not useful but its numbers he put up), and 2 x 61 points seasons he has way more of a solid resume to use. Again its just common sense its not that hard man

 

[hotpaws]

Interested in and actually trading for and signing are two different things. They can talk the talk but can they walk the walk ? There is nothing stopping a team from making Dubas an offer he can't refuse like Burke did when he traded for Kessel.

so they're going to make Dubas an offer already knowing they can't sign him ?

c'mon you're better than this

 

[TheBeastCoast]

what does an offer sheet have to do with the Leafs low balling him ?

if Willie is being unreasonable why is half the league interested in trading for him ?

Because he is a good player I would presume? Probably the same reason the Leafs are interested in signing him.

 

[Walshy7]

I didn't even have you in mind with that post. and I have no problem with something in the 6.5-7.2 range if it get's us 7-8 years

oh im sorry I was the poster who said dubas would look bad if he was traded and then signed for $7M so I thought that was directed at me

 

[ToneDog]

how many ****ing times. Ehlers contract kicking in has no relevance, its when he signed it Ehelers chose to sign a year earlier than nylander, that's his problem. nylander hasn't ever gone 20 games without a goal either I think Nylande ris better than ehlers.

Agreed Nylander > Ehlers but how much better ? Tell you one thing I don't think Jets would trade Ehlers for Nylander because of Nylander's asking price.

 

[Confucius]

Make a final offer of 6.8M x 6 years.

If he doesn’t want it, he doesn’t want to be here, so go get us Brett Pesce Dubas!!

too much

and not enough

 

[Pookie]

No they are not.

So you believe that it’s possible for Dubas to not sign or not trade him and withstand the media and fan storm that will ensue?

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

If you overpay Nylander what do you think happens with Marner and Matthews. What happens to the cap situation then. You really haven't thought long term on that overpay statement.

I know exactly what happens to Marner and Matthews but like I said pay your stars trade the grunts, Hyman and brown are grunts, good grunts but still grunts they can be replaced

 

[hotpaws]

Team is always 1st, all players will come and go over your lifetime but the team will always be here. Just like a player should play for the name on the front not the name on the back. A fan cheers for the name on the front before the name on the back.

I wonder what all these teams are offering, that would be interesting to see, then we would know what William is worth.

players as well mgmt come and go , they're all just employee's , people seem to ignore that reality

i cheer with the best of them when the games on but this situation has nothing to do with cheering for the crest

 

[Walshy7]

Which is why most people would say Nylander should get an extra few hundred thousand maybe even 500k. But not 1M.

Nylander waited so he could bet on himself but showed no improvement from age 20 to 21. If he'd shown marginal improvement and put up ~70 points, 7M would make sense.

no improvement? so many posters here were using his PP points to call him a pp specialist in his first season, so while the pp struggled, 5 on 5 he went out and upped his totals by 14 points that's pretty significant when you realize the game is mostly played 5 on 5.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

players as well mgmt come and go , they're all just employee's , people seem to ignore that reality

i cheer with the best of them when the games on but this situation has nothing to do with cheering for the crest

Yes it does lol

 

[ULF_55]

Marner's agent has the same record of holdouts as Nylander's, its his MO. I expect a marner holdout if it isn't to his valuation the offer.

They have a direct correlation if the leafs are offering below value and they don't want to take below value, it would prove dubas and co were very naïve when judging the "love of the team and city" angle.

Well, you can love the city but not love your employment scenario.

If he really strongly wants to be a center, he has to leave the team.

If he signs with another team for 1st. / 2nd. line center position money we'll know what is what.

IMO the Leafs are in need of his contributions, either via trade value or on ice performance.

Now if Tavares becomes more dominant outside of putting up points, Nylander will be less important.

Again, IMO Nylander can be a dynamic forward, not like a Crosby who does it game after game, but often enough to make him a key player on almost any team.

 

[ToneDog]

so they're going to make Dubas an offer already knowing they can't sign him ?

c'mon you're better than this

Of course not. They have been free to talk to the Nylander camp since July 1st. If they think they can sign him, value him and have the assets to trade for him, they can make an offer the same way Burke did for Kessel. To date no team has done so and they have 30 days left.

 

[Pookie]

sad how people keep ignoring the obvious

Willie's asking for way too much but half the league still wants to trade for him , so if half the league will pay what he wants how can his ask be unreasonable ?

100%.

And what gets me is this talk of “bring me the offer” as some counterpoint to the above.

If their point is that Dubas is ignorant of the market value and is playing hardball over market value.... is that not incredibly concerning??