No Females within NHL coaching nor Management fraternity/ Old boys Club

[TNT87]

Everyone should be forced to have one female on the ice at all times. Kinda like mixed soccer

The Penguins select Amanda Kessel.

 

[Filatov2Kovalev2Bonk]

Won't happen for some time. There are doubtless very smart women out there that could be of us to teams (Angela James, Wickenheiser, Pascall-Campbell among others) but it's a mens-only club and the woman is relegated to being an accessory. This is something that will need to be legislated in by the NHL. The boys will just have to get over themselves on this issue.

 

[LondonKendrick]

More likely to get a black head coach first

 

[LordNeverLose]

Nah I'm pretty sure he's being black listed. He's definitely good enough to be on an NFL team and the media circus around him is over with.

You clearly are not familiar with ESPN...

 

[leaffaninvancouver]

Having a woman as a head-coach would be a terrible idea.

Not that women can't do the job, but because of the dynamics. How long before the players make a bet about who's the first to sleep with her?

Like it or not, that's a locker-room atmosphere.

They said the same thing about women in the armed forces and women bosses, it's all just excuses. I'm not sure when you will see a professional coach whose a woman on a men's team but locker room talk is not a valid reason.

 

[Zarzh]

Nah I'm pretty sure he's being black listed. He's definitely good enough to be on an NFL team and the media circus around him is over with.

No he's not.

Like Chris Kluwe he's a replacement level player

 

[LordNeverLose]

The problem is right now it appears to be entirely based on gender. No one is saying hire a woman just because she's are woman, they are saying don't exclude a woman just because they are woman.

Please point out the women you think are deserving and qualified for an NHL coaching position? I promise you NHL teams care more about winning than they do about maintaining a patriarchy, if there was a qualified woman she'd have a job.

 

[Dreakon13]

they are saying don't exclude a woman just because they are woman.

Is there any evidence of this happening? Where women have applied for these positions and were subsequently asked to leave because they were women? With something tangible?

Or are we just assuming this because their aren't any female GM's or HC's?

 

[93gilmour93]

Find it odd. That there are no females within the coaching nor Hockey decisions Management ranks in the NHL.

It's not like women are not capable of doing the job. I Would like to see someone been given the chance. Old boys club currently. Wouldn't hurt to have some creative female minds in the game; instead of the non creative Jim Bennings of the world.

Don't even think that there are any women within the Scouting ranks .

Lmao Most qualified and experienced gets the job.

 

[Semantics]

I don't see a female coach any time soon though. Even if you ignore that most coaches have played the game at a high level I don't think the average player would be very comfortable with a woman leading them in the dressing room. Sports culture and attitude is very much a thing and, until that drastically changes, it would be a bigger headache than it would be worth for any team.

If women's teams can be comfortable with a man leading them in the dressing room I don't see why the reverse couldn't be true. That said, you'd probably need a mature and intelligent team, who can see past society's unconscious biases.

 

[Semantics]

Sooo, they should hire women just because they're women?

Literally nobody thinks that, way to create a straw man.

 

[Sanderson]

The problem is right now it appears to be entirely based on gender. No one is saying hire a woman just because she's are woman, they are saying don't exclude a woman just because they are woman.

That's just an assumption on your part though. You can't just claim that women are excluded without giving any proof for that.

Fact is, it is extremely rare to see women in a big role in any of the main men's sports, that's just how things work. It's not really the case the other way round, because for the most part, women's sports came up way after the men played it, which often put men into the role of coach early on. That obviously changes over time and now many of the coaching roles in the top sports are filled by women as well.

Not every job is always suitable for everyone, there are specific circumstances that make the same job tougher for one gender than the other, even if the knowledge-level is the same. It's not that someone of the opposite gender would be incapable of doing the job well, but it adds another layer of possible conflict that most team will try to avoid if possible.
In the case of hockey, you have also the sheer difference in skill and playing-style between men's and women's hockey. The games are quite different for a women just to switch over and coach men. That doesn't mean a woman cannot understand the game better than a man does, but the background is quite different.

Pro sports aren't a normal business, dealing with men on such a basis isn't the same as running a company.

These kind of things develop from the bottom up, not the other way round. First you need women who successfully coach lower level teams, before you can have them deal with the absolute elite. Just take a look at foreign coaches in the NHL, the number is ridiculously small, because no one really dares to hire a foreign coach, and foreign coaches aren't all that interested in opting for junior or minor leagues.

You also need women who want to reach such a role in the NHL. Most probably don't even think about going that route, which obviously makes it less likely that someone actually makes it.

Managing a team is something different, access should be easier there, but you still end up with some similar issues as before. You usually need to have some success on a lower level as well, before you can aim for the big league.

All that doesn't even include the pressure on the first women and the person who hires her. It probably wouldn't matter much when it comes to the role of an assistent coach, but when it comes to head coaches or GMs, lots of people would complain if there is no success right away (and yes, to a large extend because it would be a woman) and they would likely ask for the head of the man who though it was a good idea to hire a woman in the first place. Seeing how few people are interested in making a bold pick that could cost them their job, you are unlikely to see anyone pick a woman for such a role unless she has shown a lot at every level of men's hockey.

 

[Jerzey Devil]

Maybe most of the women involved in hockey stay in women's hockey to help it grow.

 

[JackFr]

1960: "Banks should maybe consider hiring women?"

1960s HFBoards: "Oh so you're saying they should just hire people just because they're women?? I guess qualifications don't matter these days..."

The point isn't that women should just be gifted jobs for no reason, that's a straw man that's so people can close their ears and ignore the idea that just maaaaybe organizations that are run by traditionalist old white dudes tend to hire other white dudes.

Hockey is obviously an old boys club, no one would deny that. Is it so crazy to think that it might extend to hiring practices?

 

[Dreakon13]

Hockey is obviously an old boys club, no one would deny that. Is it so crazy to think that it might extend to hiring practices?

It's not crazy to think it, it may even be true... but it's applying the same haphazard generalizations/conclusions that you're claiming they're applying to women.

It's also possible women aren't really applying for these positions, maybe some quality female managers/coaches aren't comfortable coaching or building men's teams (or they'd just rather help build women's hockey as someone else said). Maybe there aren't many women qualified to be GM or HC of an NHL team, with proven track records at all (or most) levels, compared to their male counterparts.

Like others have said, you can't hire a woman to the highest level (GM or HC in the NHL) on a whim and say the system is fixed or better for it... if we're going to, let's aim to get women into some associate GM positions or coaching positions in lower leagues (if they aren't already), then jump at ownerships throats when they make the mistake of passing over a qualified female candidate with a name and face to rally behind.

 

[The Thin White Duke]

It's not crazy to think it, it may even be true... but it's applying the same haphazard generalizations/conclusions that you're claiming they're applying to women.

It's also possible women aren't really applying for these positions, maybe some quality female managers/coaches aren't comfortable coaching or building men's teams (or they'd just rather help build women's hockey as someone else said). Maybe there aren't many women qualified to be GM or HC of an NHL team, with proven track records at all (or most) levels, compared to their male counterparts.

Like others have said, you can't hire a woman to the highest level (GM or HC in the NHL) on a whim and say the system is fixed or better for it... if we're going to, let's aim to get women into some associate GM positions or coaching positions in lower leagues (if they aren't already), then jump at ownerships throats when they make the mistake of passing over a qualified female candidate with a name and face to rally behind.

Nothing is stopping them from taking the Chayka route. Start a blog in your free time, demonstrate a keen understanding of what makes teams win. You don't even have to disclose your identity online when you do this, there's no way to be biased against a faceless/genderless blog.

 

[Mickey Marner]

Needs to be some women qualified via experience coaching / managing at the junior / minor league level first.

Agreed. Need grassroots to begin with.

 

[Daximus]

It's no secret that women would likely never be considered for a GM job right now, I mean we recycle NHL GM's like crazy in this league, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be. I don't think you'll ever see GM's apply for a position. Does that even happen? I think potential GM's are typically contacted by the teams are they not? So at it would take is a team to scout out a women for the job at boom it's done. I think hiring a young guy like Chayka and women as skating coaches is what we would call some progress. We will probably see a women in a GM position in the next 10 years I'd bet. People are lying to themselves if they think women in hockey aren't capable of being a GM or higher level coaches.

 

[MPGA]

Coach Mckay was a train wreck for Team USA during the Goodwill Games until Coach Bombay showed up in the 3rd and saved the day.

 

[Laineux]

Coaches and GM's are generally ex-players with long history in ice hockey. It could happen, but 100% of players in high-level hockey are men and this will never change.

 

[suddeninterest]

How many female head coaches and GM's are there at the AHL level? Major Junior? NCAA? Even Major Midget/Midget AAA? Let alone the NHL. A change can't start at the NHL, it needs to start at those lower levels and in local communities around North America and the world. NHL GMs and head coaches are almost always hired because of a resume of success at lower levels or within assistant positions at the NHL level. Women need to be given the opportunities at those levels first, so they can build those resumes and gain attention by NHL owners and GMs. Then even after that comes the social challenges facing women in a male dominated career path. It's not an easy road at all. I think there's a much better chance of a female GM than a coach though, just based on the possibility of circumstances like Chayka's hiring. But lets say a woman coaches a midget team to several championships are starts to get noticed in major junior circles. Now a GM there has to take a chance on her, and it's almost certainly not going to be a top team. So now she's in a massive uphill battle to lead a poor team to success. And that's going to happen at probably every level she coaches. Now men can face the same problems but the sheer probability that women will succeed there just based on how many are in those positions is basically zero. It will be a long time if ever we see a female head coach.

 

[Bank Shot]

It's no secret that women would likely never be considered for a GM job right now, I mean we recycle NHL GM's like crazy in this league, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be. I don't think you'll ever see GM's apply for a position. Does that even happen? I think potential GM's are typically contacted by the teams are they not? So at it would take is a team to scout out a women for the job at boom it's done. I think hiring a young guy like Chayka and women as skating coaches is what we would call some progress. We will probably see a women in a GM position in the next 10 years I'd bet. People are lying to themselves if they think women in hockey aren't capable of being a GM or higher level coaches.

I doubt it. I think the first woman in the front office will start as a capologist or video coach or something of that nature. I think you will need to see women filling the secondary roles before they leap into the big chair.

I think we will see women break into the front office at some point. Not sure if it will be within ten years. The amount of participation in hockey still lags way behind men.

https://www.hockeycanada.ca/en-ca/Hockey-Programs/Female/Statistics-History.aspx

Registration in hockey for women in 1991 was 8,000. In 2010 it was shot up to 85,000 which is still dwarfed by something like 500,000 for men.

I think you could see some women in front office roles when that 2010 generation is in their 30s/40s.

 

[JackSlater]

Where do NHL head coaches come from? I see mainly three sources:

CHL head coach
Former NHL player
NCAA head coach (mens)
AHL coach
ECHL coach

To the best of my knowledge there have never been any females in any of those positions, other than the Manon Rheaume publicity stunt. Considering that no woman to this point has gone through the proper channels to become an NHL coach, while thousands of men have, it isn't surprising that none of them have been seriously considered for NHL positions. Women will need to get positions at the lower levels before the NHL becomes even remotely realistic.

Management positions are far more likely for women, and I expect that there will be female executives in hockey eventually. There are more channels than with coaching, as a successful businessperson or agent can become a hockey executive. Even then though it will be statistically unlikely as men will still be in the majority of positions in the lower channels that lead toward the NHL.

I do laugh at the idea that NHL teams are conspiring against putting women in prominent positions. It's very 2017. I don't doubt that a female would have a tougher path to such a position than a similarly qualified male, but to this point there haven't been realistic female candidates.

 

[Daximus]

I doubt it. I think the first woman in the front office will start as a capologist or video coach or something of that nature. I think you will need to see women filling the secondary roles before they leap into the big chair.

I think we will see women break into the front office at some point. Not sure if it will be within ten years. The amount of participation in hockey still lags way behind men.

https://www.hockeycanada.ca/en-ca/Hockey-Programs/Female/Statistics-History.aspx

Registration in hockey for women in 1991 was 8,000. In 2010 it was shot up to 85,000 which is still dwarfed by something like 500,000 for men.

I think you could see some women in front office roles when that 2010 generation is in their 30s/40s.

You are probably right about that. The old boys club will do everything in their power to keep women from gaining to much ground. When they move on from hockey is likely the day we start to see real change in how things are done and run.

 

[Evil Janney]

Sooo, they should hire women just because they're women?

Of course silly. . . It's 2017, qualifications don't matter anymore

Hire a woman just because already

Yeah.

Teams tend to hire former players for the simple reason that they were stars or very beloved on that team, yet have zero credentials at being effective management people (Trevor Linden, Joe Sakic, Kevin Lowe, Craig MacTavish, Mike Milbury, Eddie Olczyk, etc).