Player Discussion Nate Schmidt

[F A N]

Tanev made everyone he played with a better player.

Tanev put everything on the line to make the right defensive play.

Regardless of organizational dysfunction, Tanev, like the Sedins, ALWAYS put in an honest days work.

Schmidt is probably more skilled than Tanev, however, character-wise? When the chips are down? When you're on a franchise record losing streak? When most of the vets have checked out because your trash coach is giving minutes to the trash players your trash GM has acquired?

The worth of a person isn't measured in good times, it's measured in bad times and Tanev more than acquitted himself during our descent into the league cellar.

I'm of course optimistic about Schmidt but we'll see.

Don't disagree with most of what you said. There really isn't a need to put down a player to prop up another. Tanev has been an absolute warrior for the Canucks and a leader in the locker room. "Dad" will be missed.

I don't think there's a need to compare Schmidt's character vs Tanev's. Tanev has been part of the Canucks organization for 10 years and like Bieksa there was no doubt he would have gone down with any Canucks ship. The problem really was his injury history and he has objectively shown signs of decline. I think Schmidt is the better bet going forward.

 

[mathonwy]

Don't disagree with most of what you said. There really isn't a need to put down a player to prop up another. Tanev has been an absolute warrior for the Canucks and a leader in the locker room. "Dad" will be missed.

I don't think there's a need to compare Schmidt's character vs Tanev's. Tanev has been part of the Canucks organization for 10 years and like Bieksa there was no doubt he would have gone down with any Canucks ship. The problem really was his injury history and he has objectively shown signs of decline. I think Schmidt is the better bet going forward.

Tanev's greatest asset is his mind and his control over his emotions.

Tanev's a very smart d-man that does an amazing job quarterbacking the d-zone 5v5 and on the PK and he never gets rattled. Always cool as a cucumber.

Just like Hammer and Salo.

The only thing Tanev hasn't been very smart at is his nutrition which has led to him being a bit of a stick over the last few years and I can definitely see that changing in his new

environment.

I think Tanev has a lot more to show everyone and the fact that he's on Calgary legitimately scares me a lot.

Tanev and Marky are the only reasons why we were in the playoffs.

Anyone that thinks otherwise wasn't watching the same games I and mossey and orcatown and ms and everyone else were watching.

And now they're magically in Calgary.

So ridiculous. I can't even.

 

[F A N]

I think Tanev has a lot more to show everyone and the fact that he's on Calgary legitimately scares me a lot.

Tanev and Marky are the only reasons why we were in the playoffs.

Anyone that thinks otherwise wasn't watching the same games I and mossey and orcatown and ms and everyone else were watching.

More to show? We've seen Tanev in his prime as an elite level first pairing shutdown Dman. He's turning 31 in less than 2 months time. He ain't bouncing back to where he was a few seasons ago.

Tanev and Marky are the ONLY? reasons why we were in the playoffs? I think you're the only one who thinks that, not mossey, not orcatown, and not MS (they are free to correct me here). The two certainly played a big role especially Marky. The question was never whether Tanev was or still is a good player. The question is whether it is prudent to sign him to the contract that Calgary gave him (or slightly less to factor in the home town discount).

I would have been happy if the Canucks brought back Tanev. But that has more to do with what he did as a Canuck in the past. If the Canucks brought in Tanev as a UFA I'm thinking that is a big gamble. That's 4 years $4.5M AAV for a soon to be 31 year old Dman who has historically had trouble staying healthy.

 

[DonnyNucker]

Tanev's greatest asset is his mind and his control over his emotions.

Tanev's a very smart d-man that does an amazing job quarterbacking the d-zone 5v5 and on the PK and he never gets rattled. Always cool as a cucumber.

Just like Hammer and Salo.

The only thing Tanev hasn't been very smart at is his nutrition which has led to him being a bit of a stick over the last few years and I can definitely see that changing in his new

environment.

I think Tanev has a lot more to show everyone and the fact that he's on Calgary legitimately scares me a lot.

Tanev and Marky are the only reasons why we were in the playoffs.

Anyone that thinks otherwise wasn't watching the same games I and mossey and orcatown and ms and everyone else were watching.

And now they're magically in Calgary.

So ridiculous. I can't even.

Tanev and Marky were the only reason we were in the playoffs. LOL Imagine thinking you have a keen eye for watching hockey and also thinking Tanev was more important than Hughes, Elias, Miller etc.

 

[mathonwy]

More to show? We've seen Tanev in his prime as an elite level first pairing shutdown Dman. He's turning 31 in less than 2 months time. He ain't bouncing back to where he was a few seasons ago.

Tanev and Marky are the ONLY? reasons why we were in the playoffs? I think you're the only one who thinks that, not mossey, not orcatown, and not MS (they are free to correct me here). The two certainly played a big role especially Marky. The question was never whether Tanev was or still is a good player. The question is whether it is prudent to sign him to the contract that Calgary gave him (or slightly less to factor in the home town discount).

I would have been happy if the Canucks brought back Tanev. But that has more to do with what he did as a Canuck in the past. If the Canucks brought in Tanev as a UFA I'm thinking that is a big gamble. That's 4 years $4.5M AAV for a soon to be 31 year old Dman who has historically had trouble staying healthy.

Yep.

Only reason(s).

Tanev and Markstrom gave this team the time they needed to be able to score winning goals while the team was being hammered in possession... over and over and over again.

Both were core players last season. But that's neither here or there.

There are two issues here.

Tanev being injury prone and Tanev not being worth 4.5M over the 4 years.

Tanev being injury prone.

Let's see the type of injuries Tanev has experienced in the last three seasons

2020-03-11 - Sidelined week-to-week with lower body injury
2019-03-16 - Out for the season due to ankle injury from shot block
2019-02-14 - Ankle injury
2018-08-25 - Hip
2018-03-27 - Sprained knee
2018-02-09 - Leg
2018-01-07 - Mouth
2017-12-15 - Groin
2017-11-09 - Thumb

So injury-wise, his ankle is the highest risk item at this point of time.

I didn't see any problems with his ankles in the playoffs. Did you?

IMO, Tanev's injuries have been, more often then not, the result of lack of possession by the Canucks and a lack of dedication to his nutrition by Tanev.

The team has been ass and Tanev blocks a lot of shots and has stayed a light-welterweight who opposing forwards love to target on the forecheck.

Yes Tanev has suffered a lot of injuries.

IMO, No Tanev hasn't suffered the type of reoccurring injury that would result in a marked decrease in performance. Like Sami Salo and his fragile groin or Kes and his hip. Barring some catastrophically bad luck, I don't see Tanev's performance decreasing over the next 4 years.

Also, it's a fact that last season, Markstrom aside, Tanev is the guy that Green trusted the most in every situation and the results speak for themselves.

4.5M over the next 4 years?

That's a low-med risk contract a well managed team would have been able to fit in their salary cap easily.

 

[elitepete]

Don't disagree with most of what you said. There really isn't a need to put down a player to prop up another. Tanev has been an absolute warrior for the Canucks and a leader in the locker room. "Dad" will be missed.

I don't think there's a need to compare Schmidt's character vs Tanev's. Tanev has been part of the Canucks organization for 10 years and like Bieksa there was no doubt he would have gone down with any Canucks ship. The problem really was his injury history and he has objectively shown signs of decline. I think Schmidt is the better bet going forward.

Tanev had a relatively healthy year where he bounced back closer to the level he played at before 2018. The extra protection from blocking shots on his shins/ankles seems to have helped.

Nate Schmidt also has an injury history fwiw and his game relies much more on skating. If his skating were to take a hit due to injuries the guy would be a shell of his former self signed for 5 more years until age 34 at 6 million...

Also, stylistically, Tanev is a better fit.

 

[VanJack]

There's no way to sugar-coat it, but even playing with Hughes for most of last season, Tanev's advanced stats have been declining for the past couple of seasons. And based on offense alone, Schmidt is a huge upgrade in the top-four.

Some pundits in Calgary are already having 'buyer's remorse' about shelling out $4.5m for Tanev with a four year term. Based on his injury history alone that's a significant risk--particularly when they see how little the Canucks gave up to acquire Schmidt.

 

[I am toxic]

It was a Schmidty trade.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

There's no way to sugar-coat it, but even playing with Hughes for most of last season, Tanev's advanced stats have been declining for the past couple of seasons. And based on offense alone, Schmidt is a huge upgrade in the top-four.

Some pundits in Calgary are already having 'buyer's remorse' about shelling out $4.5m for Tanev with a four year term. Based on his injury history alone that's a significant risk--particularly when they see how little the Canucks gave up to acquire Schmidt.

I'm currently looking into comparing ga rates of top 4 defenders. Chris Tanev last year had 3.1 ga/60 which isn't "bad" for top pairing D, but isn't good either. Getting below 3 is what I would consider good. Tanev in his prime would be in the low 2's which is absolutely incredible considering his usage, and how bad of teams he played for. There definately was a decline though, and Schmidt's numbers were better last year. I do think he still will be an effective top 4D for the next 2-3 years though.

Playing with Hughes was a double edge sword. He was absolutely amazing offensively and transitioning the puck, but had the worst GA/60 of any Canucks defender at even strength.

 

[rypper]

I haven't really been following Calgary's moves thus far in free agency besides all the former Canucks going there but it seems to me they have a deeper defensive corps then the Canucks did, so perhaps Tanev will be able to stay healthier because he won't be playing the same amount/type of minutes he did here.

On topic though, hopefully Schmidt doesn't fall victim to the same kind of injury bug curse that Sutter and others have.

 

[F A N]

Tanev had a relatively healthy year where he bounced back closer to the level he played at before 2018. The extra protection from blocking shots on his shins/ankles seems to have helped.

Nate Schmidt also has an injury history fwiw and his game relies much more on skating. If his skating were to take a hit due to injuries the guy would be a shell of his former self signed for 5 more years until age 34 at 6 million...

Also, stylistically, Tanev is a better fit.

Statistically Tanev did not bounce back to where he was 2018.

Schmidt is considered an elite skater so his skating taking a hit due to some injuries and normal aging isn't going to render him a pylon.

 

[mathonwy]

Tanev and Marky were the only reason we were in the playoffs. LOL Imagine thinking you have a keen eye for watching hockey and also thinking Tanev was more important than Hughes, Elias, Miller etc.

1. Defense leads to offense.
2. No defense = no offense.

Tanev is an absolute monster transition d-man.

It's absolute poetry how Tanev can take the ring-around and start the break-out with a pass that always connects. Tanev doesn't f***ing throw pucks away like all of the trash d-men our esteemed GM has decided to grace our team with over the last 5 years.

If you don't have an eye for this part of the game then that's your loss, not mine.

Tanev helped the Sedins so damn much getting through the neutral zone it's not even funny (and then Sbisa came along and it all went to shit).

Your team needs to be able to hit the opposing blue line with speed to maximize your % of scoring and Tanev's clockwork break-outs played a key role in this part of the game for us.

 

[DonnyNucker]

1. Defense leads to offense.
2. No defense = no offense.

Tanev is an absolute monster transition d-man.

It's absolute poetry how Tanev can take the ring-around and start the break-out with a pass that always connects. Tanev doesn't f***ing throw pucks away like all of the trash d-men our esteemed GM has decided to grace our team with over the last 5 years.

If you don't have an eye for this part of the game then that's your loss, not mine.

Tanev helped the Sedins so damn much getting through the neutral zone it's not even funny (and then Sbisa came along and it all went to shit).

Your team needs to be able to hit the opposing blue line with speed to maximize your % of scoring and Tanev's clockwork break-outs played a key role in this part of the game for us.

You think Tanev is more effective than Hughes At breakouts. Sorry man, it’s you that doesn’t have an eye for the game. It really comes across either you are a new fan or have some hurt feelings because your favourite player was traded. It’s sad to see Tanev gone but you are clearly ignoring his deficiencies and the downward trend in his game.

 

[canuckking1]

Vegas basically collapsed the year Schmidt got suspended and then went on a heater the second he got back into the lineup. Hope his impact can translate to the Canucks.

 

[mathonwy]

You think Tanev is more effective than Hughes At breakouts. Sorry man, it’s you that doesn’t have an eye for the game. It really comes across either you are a new fan or have some hurt feelings because your favourite player was traded. It’s sad to see Tanev gone but you are clearly ignoring his deficiencies and the downward trend in his game.

Ya know..

I'm not the one that's insulting other posters and questioning their "eye".

Or comparing another poster to a "new fan".

And I am not particularly interested in continuing these pointless personal attacks.

You're right in that Tanev was one of my favorite players and that's because whenever Tanev had the puck, my stress level would be consistently low.

I try to watch the game at both ends of the ice because good offensive plays usually start with a good up from the D and as such, I've relayed to you my experiences when I watch Tanev handle the puck in transition hockey.

4.5M over the next 4 years is peanuts for what Tanev contributed and will contribute going forward and I don't accept the convenient "injury-prone" excuse everyone is using to justify not resigning Tanev when in fact not resigning Tanev is just another example of the continuing gross mis-management of the team's salary cap.

I get PO'ed when really good players leave the team REGARDLESS of who magically appears in his stead.

Let's all collectively cross our fingers and hope Schmidt is up to the task.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

You think Tanev is more effective than Hughes At breakouts. Sorry man, it’s you that doesn’t have an eye for the game. It really comes across either you are a new fan or have some hurt feelings because your favourite player was traded. It’s sad to see Tanev gone but you are clearly ignoring his deficiencies and the downward trend in his game.

Agreed...Tanev is average at zone exits/entries...Hughes is one of the best.

 

[DonnyNucker]

Agreed...Tanev is average at zone exits/entries...Hughes is one of the best.

View attachment 375864

Yes, it’s not 2011 anymore. Calgary is not going to like that contract in two years. Maybe even next year

 

[iloovRMB]

Agreed...Tanev is average at zone exits/entries...Hughes is one of the best.

View attachment 375864

Outside of fringe hockey nerd corners of the internet like HF, controlled zone entries and exits aren't a particularly interesting or important stat.

But here we know how that's basically the #1 thing you should look at when evaluating a defenseman in the modern era.

In light of this and Hughes' sheer and utter dominance as a rookie I don't think it's unfair to use the term "generational"

 

[iloovRMB]

Agreed...Tanev is average at zone exits/entries...Hughes is one of the best.

View attachment 375864

Also can you show us how Nate Schmidt fares in this category? Thanks.

 

[Pastor Of Muppetz]

Also can you show us how Nate Schmidt fares in this category? Thanks.

 

[Didalee Hed]

Also can you show us how Nate Schmidt fares in this category? Thanks.

I’m getting turned around here. Ignore this.

 

[iloovRMB]

View attachment 375888

Thanks.

Side note: how the hell is Oleksiak so good at entries and so bad at exits?

 

[VanJack]

Tanev, Tofoli, Leivo and Stecher all took less money on their contracts than they were earning last season. And it's safe to say that all of them desperately wanted to return to the Canucks.

But the Canucks 'couldn't' or 'wouldn't' sign any them, despite them being some of highest character guys in the dressing-room.

Benning may have 'wanted' to sign a couple of them. If the rumor mill means anything, he doubled back on both Tanev and Stecher when the deal for OEL collapsed. But with basically 'zero' cap space, he really didn't have much choice but to let them walk once he'd signed Holtby and acquired Schmidt's contract.

But the real culprit is the awful contracts for bottom of the roster players. I mean would you rather pay Eriksson and Beagle $9m or bring back all three of Tanev, Stecher and Leivo for a shade over $7 million a season?

And that's basically the reason so many Canuck fans are still steaming?

 

[sting101]

There was a lot of chatter coming from Sin City where players didn’t sleep for sure with all the speculations going around. Defenseman Nate Schmidt was shipped out to the Vancouver Canucks to create cap space for Pietrangelo, while forward Paul Stastny was also moved back to the Winnipeg Jets days prior. Schmidt was one of the most popular guys in the room and was said to be the top vote for many of his teammates when it came time to name a captain for the franchise.

 

[bossram]

Thanks.

Side note: how the hell is Oleksiak so good at entries and so bad at exits?

He's bad at passing but likes to jump in and lead the rush. That's how a lot of the Star's defensemen play. The weakside-D will lead the rush when there's room, often leading to an easy zone entry (hence Oleksiak's numbers). He's not a talented passer though, so when he doesn't have the option to skate the puck out, he's pretty bad at exiting the zone.