Nashville Predators Hockey Talk 2023-2024

[Predsanddead24]

We have enough real forwards that need playing time. Him sitting doesn't even register as a concern for the organization. We might just lose out on a 3rd or 4th rd pick which isn't a big deal.

Yeah we're already scratching Glass and I'd call up Afanasyev or even Gurianov before I try and transition Barrie to offense. It sucks for Barrie that he's stuck in no mans land while he's trying to show out for a final contract but him being scratched doesn't really harm the team at all.

 

[triggrman]

Perhaps this has been brought up and answered before, but why don't the Preds give Barrie a look at forward? He'd probably produce...maybe he doesn't want to do it? Seems like a better option than sitting in the press box

That's a totally different skillset. It's hard to move up and have the play behind you when you're entire career it's been in front, positioning and instincts would all be off, it would take serious time to adapt, IMHO. I've tried to play center some for the fun of it, I couldn't do it. I could produce more as a defenseman.

 

[Predsanddead24]

That's a totally different skillset. It's hard to move up and have the play behind you when you're entire career it's been in front, positioning and instincts would all be off, it would take serious time to adapt, IMHO. I've tried to play center some for the fun of it, I couldn't do it. I could produce more as a defenseman.

Yeah offensive skills as a defender are completely different from offensive skills as a forward. Maybe Barrie could be a competent enough forward if he spent a good amount of time working at it, but it is incredibly unlikely you could just throw him in the lineup at forward and he would produce better than even someone like McCarron. Even Burns and Byfuglien who are the two most prominent examples of guys who can play both forward and defense were middle six quality at best at forward despite being two of the better defenseman in the league.

 

[beardawg]

That's a totally different skillset. It's hard to move up and have the play behind you when you're entire career it's been in front, positioning and instincts would all be off, it would take serious time to adapt, IMHO. I've tried to play center some for the fun of it, I couldn't do it. I could produce more as a defenseman.

I get what you're saying. I watched the Devils game last night and they had Brendan Smith at left wing, so I imagined Barrie could do something similar.

I mostly play defense as well but find playing wing the hardest. It's a quick game!

 

[jumb0]

Forsberg made the ASG

 

[ShagDaddy]

 

[Kat Predator]

On the other hand, we're using a different system than Hynes deployed. In trying to be more aggressive offensively and take more chances [*], we're exposing the defense to more rushes. Maybe that doesn't explain everything, but Juuse doesn't have that same protective Hynes shell standing in front of him.

[*] I'm not sure if a defenseman literally diving for pucks in the middle of the offensive zone is "aggressive" so much as being dumb.

 

[Armourboy]

I remember hearing on the broadcast last night that Brunette wanted guys to defend differently than I guess is typical, something about being with the player and going with them or something. They made it sound like it was causing some of Schenn's struggles.

Even with giving up more chances, all of those first 4 on Saros were very saveable, and are something you expect to be stopped by most NHL level goalies.

 

[Predsanddead24]

Last night was his fifth time being pulled this season and second in five games too. He’d looked good through late November to early December too but it does seem like that Dallas game killed his confidence.

I’m far from a goalie coach but he just looks so uncomfortable. That second goal last night is a prime example where he just botches an easy glove save although I haven’t done the physics calculations to know if it going in was Josi’s fault or not. Even when he’s making saves he just looks really uncomfortable and scrambly too which is the opposite of his usual technically sound self.

 

[101st_fan]

Last night was his fifth time being pulled this season and second in five games too. He’d looked good through late November to early December too but it does seem like that Dallas game killed his confidence.

I’m far from a goalie coach but he just looks so uncomfortable. That second goal last night is a prime example where he just botches an easy glove save although I haven’t done the physics calculations to know if it going in was Josi’s fault or not. Even when he’s making saves he just looks really uncomfortable and scrambly too which is the opposite of his usual technically sound self.

Saros is fighting the puck. At the same time, Lankinen gave up 4, 3 (plus an empty net allowed by the team as well), and 5 in his last three starts (four or more allowed in 3 of 7 starts, 42.8%) ... he went 1-2-0 in his three starts during December, averaging four goals allowed. We're back at that early season chicken and egg, which comes first ... poor team defense or poor goaltending leading to high scores against us? Since the beginning of December this team has given up 4 or more in seven of seventeen games ... 2 or fewer in nine ... 3 goals allowed just once. The doors are blown off in over 40% of the games, more common than holding the opposition to 1 goal or less.

 

[herzausstein]

He has had 4 games in the last 10 with 5 Goals against. Overal that same span his GAA is only actually 2.9 indicating that outside of those 4 games he is doing decent enough.

He had
3 in his first 10 games (starts 1,4,9)
3 in his second 10 games (starts 11,12,18)
3 in his third 10 games (starts 25, 28, 29)
1 in the 1st game of his fourth 10 games (start 31)

This one is particularly frustrating because he has had 4 games with 5 GAA in a span of 7 games. He had a similar stretch of 3 bad games out of 4 earlier in the season as well. There seem to be a cluster of junk possibly related to other team issues followed by a stretch of great play an a one off stinker. Then rinse and repeat the cycle.

If historical patterns hold, he should be coming around soon and have a real good stretch.

 

[weeze]

Sure Juse should have stopped a couple of those shots BUT especially on the last goal both Fabbro and Josi just swipped at the guy with the puck instead of driving him away from the goal or off the puck! That was awful Defense by both of those two! Should Juse have made the save, probably but when your goalie is struggling your D should step up and make a few plays as well. Your Goalie can't stop every shot and Calgary at times were up close and shooting.

 

[triggrman]

Saros sucked but he wasn’t the only one, Fabbro, Josi and Novak all terrible in the defensive zone

 

[herzausstein]

Fabbro definitely got hit with a decrease in TOI being given the least of all dmen. Novak and particularly Sherwood saw less TOI as well. I know Josi is the Captain but it wasnt a banner night for him and he didnt seem to get any benching for his lackluster plays

 

[nine_inch_fang]

On the other hand, we're using a different system than Hynes deployed. In trying to be more aggressive offensively and take more chances [*], we're exposing the defense to more rushes. Maybe that doesn't explain everything, but Juuse doesn't have that same protective Hynes shell standing in front of him.

[*] I'm not sure if a defenseman literally diving for pucks in the middle of the offensive zone is "aggressive" so much as being dumb.

Though there is a different forecheck system both were high pressure. There were all kinds of odd man rushes last season because of the forecheck system being high risk high reward and the players not being urgent getting to their marks, hence, more risk than reward. Hynes actually used two forechecking schemes, one being passive, depending on the situation and so does Brunette but to a lesser extent.

I remember hearing on the broadcast last night that Brunette wanted guys to defend differently than I guess is typical, something about being with the player and going with them or something. They made it sound like it was causing some of Schenn's struggles.

Even with giving up more chances, all of those first 4 on Saros were very saveable, and are something you expect to be stopped by most NHL level goalies.

Gill was talking about the fact that Brunette wants the Dmen to be tight on their gaps, basically flowing around the Nzone man on man, where as Schenn is used to a more passive system waiting to step up and angle guys once they receive the puck or skate into his zone of the "trap".

It's a big difference for a guy like Schenn, he isn't the most nimble skater to begin with so asking I'm to continuously be shifting his hips and feet to stay in proper defensive position with a tight gap is a tough ask.

The whole idea is for the passing lanes coming out of the Dzone and through the Nzone to be completely cut off so the puck carrier has no option and hesitates long enough to be caught by one of the forwards. This requires two things, first, the Dmen have to be way up ice and not floating back in to the Dzone. Second, the forwards must be committed to "recovering above pucks" or classically called back checking hard.

 

[Predsanddead24]

The shot data between this year and last year is pretty interesting. At least based on those numbers we're suppressing high danger shots better this year. Rush shots and rebound shots are mostly the same. I didn't include the mid danger and low danger shots here because of space issues, but if you look at the GSAA its suggests its the low and medium danger shots that are killing Saros not the high danger ones. The opposite is true for Lankinen who has a much lower GSAA for high danger shots than low danger shots.

 

[nine_inch_fang]

Fabbro didn't look good in the Chicago game and looked even worse last night. He might need a couple hours with the psychologist, he looked like a rookie out there last night.

 

[Predsanddead24]

He might need a couple hours with the psychologist

That applies to a good portion of our team it seems like. Confidence issues abound in a lot of our young guys nowadays. I don't really ever remember seeing so much of it with the last generation of young guns coming up like Fiala, Forsberg, Josi, or Ellis. If anything those guys seemed to have too much confidence in themselves at times. I don't know if its a generational thing or how we've handled the development of many of these guys but it is definitely a bit strange.

 

[triggrman]

Fabbro didn't look good in the Chicago game and looked even worse last night. He might need a couple hours with the psychologist, he looked like a rookie out there last night.

He's regressing rapidly for sure. Playing on the left isn't helping him any.

 

[Legionnaire11]

Not excusing Saros' season, but I wonder how many other fanbases are freaking out about their goalie play as well as league average SV% trends down.

Among goalies with 20+ games this season, Saros is 20th at .901 just slightly ahead of the league average .899. There are five goalies at .915 or better, nine at .910 or better and 12 at .905 or better. Contrast that against 2010-2017 when we league average was at .910-.911 every season.

Of course Saros shouldn't be at the average, he really should be in the top 5-10 of the league rather than 20th.

 

[wmupreds]

It's obvious that Saros hasn't been himself and rotating some more might be a good idea but this idea some have posted of benching him or whatever is ridiculous to me. I know we're a good ways into this season but he's only 28 and I think betting on him progressing towards his career numbers is a much better bet than assuming he's somehow cooked

 

[nine_inch_fang]

The problem is not Saros' averages, it's the wildly inconsistent play and the extreme lows.

If he played every game with some semblance of a lower limit the team would be in a much better spot in the standings.

Sub .800 ----- 0-6-1
.850 - .880--- 0-5-0
.890 - .921--- 2-3-0
.922 - .950--- 6-0-0
.955 - .1000- 8-0-0

This shows the extremes he's been having. Sure there's other issues in some of those bad games but those extreme lows lose games. This also shows that when he plays good the team is scoring enough to win games. No zero or one goal against games that were lost.

The middle ground numbers .890 - .921 are interesting, two of those losses were in the first 11 games of the season-- 10/14 vs Bos L 3-2 SV% .900 and 11/7 vs Cal L 4-2 (1 empty net goal) SV% .921-- these losses are team losses with not enough scoring. The third loss was Dallas-- L 3-2 SV% .912-- Saros gave up two goals in the final 20 seconds. That was a complete lack of focus by him.

Stop a couple of the goals in 3-4 of those 12 bad games and the season looks different. If Saros could maintain the good to really good play this team could be very dangerous.

 

[nine_inch_fang]

It's obvious that Saros hasn't been himself and rotating some more might be a good idea but this idea some have posted of benching him or whatever is ridiculous to me. I know we're a good ways into this season but he's only 28 and I think betting on him progressing towards his career numbers is a much better bet than assuming he's somehow cooked

I'm not advocating benching or trading, Lankinen isn't going to help the cause and Askarov should finish out this year in Milwaukee.

The choice to ride Saros until he pulls himself out of this funk or give more games to Lankinen (also not playing great) isn't an easy decision. Does less playing time mess with his head more than going out there and having another shitty game?

 

[Armourboy]

The benching thing I think comes with the caveat that fans want to see the coach be consistent. If other guys are going to get benched for poor play then why should the " stars " get a pass doing the same thing.

Trade wise it comes down to the idea that if he is going to play like this and lose games, we'll that pretty much negates the entire reasoning behind keeping him to begin with.

 

[herzausstein]

The benching thing I think comes with the caveat that fans want to see the coach be consistent. If other guys are going to get benched for poor play then why should the " stars " get a pass doing the same thing.

Trade wise it comes down to the idea that if he is going to play like this and lose games, we'll that pretty much negates the entire reasoning behind keeping him to begin with.

Fabbro makes bad moves gets benched.

Josi makes bad moves gets better defensive partner and nothing else happens.