Speculation: Most disappointing 2020 draft result?

[aragorn]

Because traditionally only players in the finals get votes, some notable exceptions being Karlsson in 2017 and Forsberg in I think it was 2002.

Right & we have only made it that far once in over 25 yrs of trying, even with all those great defencemen & forwards. I wonder why that is?

 

[PatrickEaves]

Our best chance to win a Stanley Cup, the lockout happened.
Our 2nd best chance to win the Stanley Cup, our starting goalie got injured in the Olympics, we never traded for another starter, and went into the playoffs with our rookie backup that obviously wasn't ready to be the man.

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

Sorry what? I admit that most of the SC teams have good players & IMO most teams that win the SC have had great to elite goaltending. Where I disagree is that it's easy to trade for an elite goalie, numerous teams over the yrs have never found one, Leafs are still looking for one. It's easy to draft a goalie in the later rds, but how the hell would you know if he is going to be elite or not? What does that even mean?

Let’s just agree to disagree

 

[aragorn]

Let’s just agree to disagree

Of course.

 

[GCK]

Right & we have only made it that far once in over 25 yrs of trying, even with all those great defencemen & forwards. I wonder why that is?

1 final is the same as Price and Lundqvist combined over a combined 28 seasons. We are doing pretty well I guess.

 

[Stylizer1]

Guys, we're not winning a cup so we're on the right path.

 

[Micklebot]

Teams sometimes win with guys who were not drafted very high, so what? Are you saying that's all this team needs is just any old goalie to come in here & win a cup? This team has been in the NHL for over 25 yrs now, how has that worked out for them so far? How's that worked out for the Leafs or Philly & a number of other teams that can't seem to find a great goaltender. You guys sound like it's an irrelevant position, that it doesn't matter who plays in net, it's the elite defenceman & forwards that win games, not goaltending. You can win with anyone in nets even a Zaboni driver, remember him?

There's a list as long as my arm of teams that won it all without elite goaltending. Not sure what you're looking for here. Elite goaltending is of course great to have, but it is in no way a requirement for winning. It's also the most volatile position to draft, the chances of getting elite goaltending out of a 1st round pick is far less than getting an elite skater out of that same pick. We drafted Chouinard 15th OA,

Drafting Askarov at 5th is doubly problematic because he's not actually ranked that high, so we'd be reaching to fill a perceived need when we actually have needs everywhere and players available ranked where we are drafting that also fill needs and are more likely to realize their potential.

Drafting Askarov is a high risk move that while it had great upside, we'd be passing up on much lower risk options that also have great upside.

 

[Micklebot]

Right & we have only made it that far once in over 25 yrs of trying, even with all those great defencemen & forwards. I wonder why that is?

Not because of goaltending, at least not in any years Karlsson was with the team. Nobody is suggesting we should be fine with sub par goaltending, just that 5th OA is the wrong asset to use to get a quality goalie.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Actually if you would be satisfied with half a dozen potential options at #5, then trading down a few spots while picking up extra assets should sound good no? Because you will still end up with one of the players you like, so maybe not so disappointing.

We're at a point where we have so many picks and prospects, we need to consolidate to get better pieces...not add more average parts.

 

[aragorn]

1 final is the same as Price and Lundqvist combined over a combined 28 seasons. We are doing pretty well I guess.

Price won a goal medal for Canada & Lunquist has been a very good NHL starter for yrs. Montreal has always been too soft to advance very far in the playoffs when the play gets much tougher & the Rangers while being a good team some yrs had to contend with some pretty good Pittsburgh teams in their division. We aren't doing well, we've had some good regular seasons & a couple of very good playoff runs, but have come up short on numerous occasions sometimes because of crappy goaltending.

 

[GCK]

Price won a goal medal for Canada & Lunquist has been a very good NHL starter for yrs. Montreal has always been too soft to advance very far in the playoffs when the play gets much tougher & the Rangers while being a good team some yrs had to contend with some pretty good Pittsburgh teams in their division. We aren't doing well, we've had some good regular seasons & a couple of very good playoff runs, but have come up short on numerous occasions sometimes because of crappy goaltending.

Okay so we agree. We need better players, we can get a really good skater at 5. Good talk.

 

[Karl Prime]

Canada would not have won the Gold Medal without him. Not his fault that Montreal loves those small soft players.

That 2014 Canada team was utterly dominant at every facet of hockey. Price didn't have to do quite as much as he's used to doing in Montreal.

 

[DJB]

I'll be dissapointed if its:

Anyone other than Byfield or Stutzle at 3.

Anyone other than Drysdale, Sanderson or Raymond at 5.

 

[aragorn]

Not because of goaltending, at least not in any years Karlsson was with the team. Nobody is suggesting we should be fine with sub par goaltending, just that 5th OA is the wrong asset to use to get a quality goalie.

Well I disagree with you, drafting a generational goalie at 5th OA would be great. However, I have said & that's what started this whole debate that I think PD should make a trade to acquire him & I still think he should do that if he doesn't take him at 5th OA. I have also said I would like to see them draft Sanderson at 5th OA. Just so we're clear.

BTW - I have been wanting Askarov since last yr's draft & said as much, him & Byfield. It's why I didn't want Ottawa to draft Knight last yr because Askarov was in this yr's draft. I have been saying this for an entire yr now.

 

[aragorn]

That 2014 Canada team was utterly dominant at every facet of hockey. Price didn't have to do quite as much as he's used to doing in Montreal.

Agreed, but he still made some great saves & was in net when they won the Gold Medal because he was Canada's best goalie at the time.

 

[aragorn]

Okay so we agree. We need better players, we can get a really good skater at 5. Good talk.

Agreed, we need better players at every position. It was a good talk.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Except Rossi actually had a 1st round-worthy season last year. Quinn not so much.

I respect the amount of knowledge in the fan base here and several follow junior hockey or prospects fairly closely.
The OHL GMs named this year's draft eligible Rossi MVP of the league and 1st team all star C. Drysdale is the only other 1st year eligible prospect to make the 1st all star team.. and besides those 2, Perfetti and Byfield are the only other 1st year eligible to make one of the teams voted on by all the OHL GMs across the two conferences.
Quinn was not on 1st , 2nd or 3rd teams while Rossi was on the 1st team and friggin' MVP of the league as voted by the OHL GMs and Quinn is better .. that's what I've heard from more than one person on here.

 

[Micklebot]

Well I disagree with you, drafting a generational goalie at 5th OA would be great. However, I have said & that's what started this whole debate that I think PD should make a trade to acquire him & I still think he should do that if he doesn't take him at 5th OA. I have also said I would like to see them draft Sanderson at 5th OA. Just so we're clear.

Drafting a generational goalie is always great, regardless of which pick is used. The issue is generational goalies are very hard to predict. I think Price might be the only guy that might crack that label who was actually taken top 5, and I guess Luongo. There are far more Montoya's, Lehtonen's, DiPietro's, Fleury's ect than there are Price and Luongo's.

 

[Masked]

Why only the last 10 yrs?

The salary cap era has significantly changed how rosters are created. Every dollar you spend on goalies means you're spending less on skaters. How much difference is there between a $10M goalie and a $4M goalie? Not as much as the difference between similarly priced defencemen.

 

[aragorn]

Drafting a generational goalie is always great, regardless of which pick is used. The issue is generational goalies are very hard to predict. I think Price might be the only guy that might crack that label who was actually taken top 5, and I guess Luongo. There are far more Montoya's, Lehtonen's, DiPietro's, Fleury's ect than there are Price and Luongo's.

Agreed there are, it's a risk, but isn't most 18 yr old players a risk? Who knew Daigle would hate playing hockey & wanted to do something else? Who thought Wickenhieser, Stephan or Dipeitro would suck in the NHL?

Today obviously there is a lot more scouting of kids at much younger ages & forecasts are getting much better, but there are still lots of flops. Askarov is rated & ranked quite high which in itself is unusual for a goalie & all indications are that he will be a very good one & Ottawa could use one. Maybe he won't be great, who knows but most think he is one of the best to come along in quite a while. IMO it's just as important a position as any other & I'm not a fan of a few guys around 5th, I have more confidence with some guys that are ranked higher. Is that fair?

 

[aragorn]

The salary cap era has significantly changed how rosters are created. Every dollar you spend on goalies means you're spending less on skaters. How much difference is there between a $10M goalie and a $4M goalie? Not as much as the difference between similarly priced defencemen.

Valid point. But why would you pay a goalie $10 mil when you could get one almost as good for $4 mil? Unless of course that $10 mil goalie wins you a SC or multiple SCs while that $4 mil goalie comes close, but never seems to get quite as far.

 

[R2010]

Valid point. But why would you pay a goalie $10 mil when you could get one almost as good for $4 mil? Unless of course that $10 mil goalie wins you a SC or multiple SCs while that $4 mil goalie comes close, but never seems to get quite as far.

I'm not as cynical as some of the others and think that drafting in the right situation in the 1st is okay and Askarov in the teens is solid. At #5 I want a player that I can guarantee is going to be better than any of the prospects we have currently within the next 2-3 years.

I'm not convinced that Askarov is so certain that we can say for sure he is going to be better than Hogberg, Daccord, Sogaard, Gustavsson five years from now. You do - that's fine. I personally think that there have been a lot of really highly touted goalies that have taken a long time to become quality NHL starters on a consistent basis and if I have a pick at #5 then I want someone who is contributing on a shorter time frame with a higher guarantee. At 25 years old I bet he is a high quality starter in the NHL but that is in 7 years. Price was farther along technically than Askarov is right now but Askarov is more athletic. I'm calling my shot that Askarov has a harder transition to the NHL than Price did because Askarov has so much excess movement and relies so much on athleticism.

As an aside, Hogberg's stats in the SHL (albeit at an older age) were absolutely unreal and yet the transition has still taken awhile. Though I believe in him probably more than most on here.

 

[R2010]

Agreed there are, it's a risk, but isn't most 18 yr old players a risk? Who knew Daigle would hate playing hockey & wanted to do something else? Who thought Wickenhieser, Stephan or Dipeitro would suck in the NHL?

Today obviously there is a lot more scouting of kids at much younger ages & forecasts are getting much better, but there are still lots of flops. Askarov is rated & ranked quite high which in itself is unusual for a goalie & all indications are that he will be a very good one & Ottawa could use one. Maybe he won't be great, who knows but most think he is one of the best to come along in quite a while. IMO it's just as important a position as any other & I'm not a fan of a few guys around 5th, I have more confidence with some guys that are ranked higher. Is that fair?

As an aside, Askarov reminds me a lot of Marc-Andre Fleury at the same age in regards to the major components of their game (Albeit Fleury had even more excess movement). The price comparable is always weird to me because they really don't play alike stylistically.

 

[R2010]

Drafting a generational goalie is always great, regardless of which pick is used. The issue is generational goalies are very hard to predict. I think Price might be the only guy that might crack that label who was actually taken top 5, and I guess Luongo. There are far more Montoya's, Lehtonen's, DiPietro's, Fleury's ect than there are Price and Luongo's.

I'm fine with the Fleury pick being high. Not #1 but he has not had a disappointing career and to be frank if he got a better goalie coach earlier on he could have been Price/Luongo level. Not sure why they didn't reign him in sooner.

 

[Random Comment]

Count me in the minority, but I don’t think most teams draft based on BPA when you have tiers of players. If there is consensus BPA you do it, but if two of your scouts have Raymond ranked 5th, three have Rossi, and the last 4 have Sanderson, it doesn’t guarantee you take Sanderson. In a vacuum sure, but it isn’t a vacuum - you’re building a hockey team to win. You take the need and that would be Rossi or Raymond in this hypothetical situation. My 2 c