News Article: Morin, Myers and the Future of the Flyers’ Defense

[Rich Nixon]

JFC, this guy is clueless.

We are in for a worse era than the Hextall one.

I find declarations like this to be quite puzzling...we don't really have a sense of the era yet at all. Again, it's been 6 weeks.

Myers is 21 and playing huge minutes on a decent AHL team in his second season there. Fletcher has been up to watch him and the rest of the Phantoms on at least three occasions, but probably not much more than that. The evaluation could well be that he's better off developing (for the immediate future, as in, next 1 to 7 months) in his current situation than he would be playing limited minutes on a bad NHL team. Who knows?

 

[Rebels57]

I find declarations like this to be quite puzzling...we don't really have a sense of the era yet at all. Again, it's been 6 weeks.

Myers is 21 and playing huge minutes on a decent AHL team in his second season there. Fletcher has been up to watch him and the rest of the Phantoms on at least three occasions, but probably not much more than that. The evaluation could well be that he's better off developing (for the immediate future, as in, next 1 to 7 months) in his current situation than he would be playing limited minutes on a bad NHL team. Who knows?

Over 100 games in the AHL is more than enough for Myers.

There are 3 inferior defensemen playing on the Flyers ahead of him.

Getting him NHL games NOW would make him more ready for NEXT SEASON which will hopefully be a turn-around for us. Myers could be a big part of that turn-around.

It's bullshit.

 

[Rich Nixon]

Over 100 games in the AHL is more than enough for Myers.

There are 3 inferior defensemen playing on the Flyers ahead of him.

Getting him NHL games NOW would make him more ready for NEXT SEASON which will hopefully be a turn-around for us. Myers could be a big part of that turn-around.

It's bull****.

Well, maybe he'll get the callup after he's played 100 games in the AHL, then.

I'm not stating a position on any of this, I'm just saying that, perhaps, it's a bit early for any extreme reaction to anything. Have you seen him play in the AHL at all?

 

[Rebels57]

Well, maybe he'll get the callup after he's played 100 games in the AHL, then.

I'm not stating a position on any of this, I'm just saying that, perhaps, it's a bit early for any extreme reaction to anything. Have you seen him play in the AHL at all?

He's played 102 regular season + playoff games.

Yes.

 

[Rich Nixon]

He's played 102 regular season + playoff games.

Yes.

Ah, playoffs included, my bad.

I guess what I'm saying is, none of us have the same access to or insight on the kid and his development that the entire web of scouts and staff between the Flyers and Phantoms do. Nor do we know what the overall team plan or season expectations are within the organization. Hell, Duncan Keith played two full AHL seasons, though times have changed.

Myers is very good and we'll see him quite soon, but declaring a guy "clueless" because he hasn't yet brought him up just weeks into his tenure is probably premature. It echoes the "THE SKY IS FALLING HAKSTOL IS NEVER GETTING FIRED I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS" thing that some posters here were doing after Hextall was fired, and when Fletcher waited all of what, two weeks after taking over to make that decision?

 

[Rebels57]

Ah, playoffs included, my bad.

I guess what I'm saying is, none of us have the same access to or insight on the kid and his development that the entire web of scouts and staff between the Flyers and Phantoms do. Nor do we know what the overall team plan or season expectations are within the organization. Hell, Duncan Keith played two full AHL seasons, though times have changed.

Myers is very good and we'll see him quite soon, but declaring a guy "clueless" because he hasn't yet brought him up just weeks into his tenure is probably premature. It echoes the "THE SKY IS FALLING HAKSTOL IS NEVER GETTING FIRED I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS" thing that some posters here were doing after Hextall was fired, and when Fletcher waited all of what, two weeks after taking over to make that decision?

Keith only played 2 AHL seasons because of the NHL lockout in 2005.

Fletcher hasn't done anything to earn our trust yet so until he does, I am going to be skeptical of what his thought process is.

His most recent move of trading Jordan Weal so he could play Jori Lehtera, instead of promoting a prospect, doesn't inspire much confidence.

 

[Tripod]

Ah, playoffs included, my bad.

I guess what I'm saying is, none of us have the same access to or insight on the kid and his development that the entire web of scouts and staff between the Flyers and Phantoms do. Nor do we know what the overall team plan or season expectations are within the organization. Hell, Duncan Keith played two full AHL seasons, though times have changed.

Myers is very good and we'll see him quite soon, but declaring a guy "clueless" because he hasn't yet brought him up just weeks into his tenure is probably premature. It echoes the "THE SKY IS FALLING HAKSTOL IS NEVER GETTING FIRED I CAN'T BELIEVE THIS" thing that some posters here were doing after Hextall was fired, and when Fletcher waited all of what, two weeks after taking over to make that decision?

I am trying to keep an open mind until Fletch does more.

But we only had 6 healthy Dmen and brought up no Dman...regardless who is was. That was a dumb mistake and certainly gives cause for concern.

 

[Stizzle]

Great article. For those who desire toughness as much as skill THESE are the types of D men you want. In particular Myers, who's not a liability at transition or clearing the puck (Hagg). They can both skate circles around the Hagg's and Folin's of the world.

I'm not sure how we define toughness. But if it's in the traditional hockey way of hits, fights, crease clearing, and intimidation, no one should desire toughness as much as skill.

I've seen a huge upswell of excitement over Morin on here the last few days. Very strange. Nostalgia effect, maybe? I think people are setting themselves up for dissapointment with this player.

 

[MSSLYNX]

Great read OP. Regarding Morin, i was able to get my "annual post-holiday check on Sam" through his cousin 2 weeks ago. Sam is hopeful new regime will treat him better. Last time, Jan 2018, i was told Sam was more than fed up with Philadelphia especially after training camp went so well for him so i was actually surprised he resigned for 3 yrs last summer.

Cant wait to see him play with Lehigh.

 

[deadhead]

I've seen a huge upswell of excitement over Morin on here the last few days. Very strange. Nostalgia effect, maybe? I think people are setting themselves up for dissapointment with this player.

It's the general tendency around here of overrating favorites and trashing players people don't like.
Because some people hate Hagg, Morin is the solution, even though he's coming off a serious injury and has yet to show he's a NHL starting defenseman.

Myers becomes an instant savior, even though he's not dominating the AHL (I've watched every televised Phantom's game and he has yet to jump out at me, doesn't mean he won't become a good NHL defenseman, but promoting him isn't some no-brainer).

And so on. In real life, the correct answer is often "we'll see" or "I hope."

The prospects will come up at some point this spring, meanwhile I have yet to see anyone present evidence that a couple extra months in the AHL ever hurt a prospect's development - and those who can't benefit from more AHL time are pretty obvious (Giroux when he was in the AHL, for example).

 

[Magua]

I've watched every televised Phantom's game and he has yet to jump out at me

That's like 4-5 games.

You didn't address my point yesterday that Myers is having a historically good ES season for someone his age. Hmmmm.

 

[deadhead]

Historic?
>. 0.5 ppg at ES is rare in the AHL, but not unheard of, and most of the players who've done it are scrubs, like, uh Mr Brennan!
A half dozen to dozen each year between 0.4 and 0.5 ppg at ES

Myers 39 games 5-15 20
Guance 34g 3-15 18
Capobianco 34g 3-16 19
2017-18
Andersson 56g 8-20 28
2016-17
Heed 55g 6-23 29
Warsofsky 58g 7-23 30
2015-16
Brennan 69g 16-32 48
2014-15
Wideman 75g 12-27 39
Brennan 73g 9-28 37

 

[Outlaw Samurai]

I'm not sure how we define toughness. But if it's in the traditional hockey way of hits, fights, crease clearing, and intimidation, no one should desire toughness as much as skill.

I've seen a huge upswell of excitement over Morin on here the last few days. Very strange. Nostalgia effect, maybe? I think people are setting themselves up for dissapointment with this player.

Stizzle, I'm not looking for that personally. My comment was more for Hatch and anyone pumping up Hagg.

By toughness in this regard I mean the "new" kind - Strong on the puck, can deliver hits, stand up forwards at the blue line..etc but is NOT a liability with skating, transition, zone exits, executing a rush - Myers for sure; Morin is a ? with how he has recovered and can he hit his ceiling.

Skill>>>>>>>>>>>>>>toughness

 

[Outlaw Samurai]

And yes, I'm trying to keep expectations lower for Morin but admittedly I'm guilty of pumping him up.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Historic?
>. 0.5 ppg at ES is rare in the AHL, but not unheard of, and most of the players who've done it are scrubs, like, uh Mr Brennan!
A half dozen to dozen each year between 0.4 and 0.5 ppg at ES

Myers 39 games 5-15 20
Guance 34g 3-15 18
Capobianco 34g 3-16 19
2017-18
Andersson 56g 8-20 28
2016-17
Heed 55g 6-23 29
Warsofsky 58g 7-23 30
2015-16
Brennan 69g 16-32 48
2014-15
Wideman 75g 12-27 39
Brennan 73g 9-28 37

This is like your "GIROUX ISN'T ELITE" argument.

What is with your obsession with Brennan? Why do you think he's some kind of trump card?

 

[deadhead]

Stizzle, I'm not looking for that personally. My comment was more for Hatch and anyone pumping up Hagg.

By toughness in this regard I mean the "new" kind - Strong on the puck, can deliver hits, stand up forwards at the blue line..etc but is NOT a liability with skating, transition, zone exits, executing a rush - Myers for sure; Morin is a ? with how he has recovered and can he hit his ceiling.

Skill>>>>>>>>>>>>>>toughness

You're partially right, but there is a balance, dictated both by how hard it is to find talent, and then to pay for it.
So Myers may turn out to be the complete package, Ghost will always be size challenged, Sanheim struggles with physical play.

Gudas has some skating and skill limitations as does Hagg, Gudas/Hagg is a bad combination (except on the PK) for that reason, but Gudas/Ghost and Gudas/Sanheim both are just fine b/c Gudas' physicality complements their skill package.

If Morin struggles to handle the puck under pressure, he'll be essentially a bigger version of Hagg, a physical D-man who needs to be paired with a puck moving RHD.

 

[Magua]

Historic?
>. 0.5 ppg at ES is rare in the AHL, but not unheard of, and most of the players who've done it are scrubs, like, uh Mr Brennan!

How convenient you ignored the age part of my post. He's a second year pro. He doesn't need to be compared to 30+ players.

 

[Beef Invictus]

@God Bless Mr Gritty it is a very good article, but I echo the sentiment for attractive butts.

 

[BritainStix]

Great read OP. Regarding Morin, i was able to get my "annual post-holiday check on Sam" through his cousin 2 weeks ago. Sam is hopeful new regime will treat him better. Last time, Jan 2018, i was told Sam was more than fed up with Philadelphia especially after training camp went so well for him so i was actually surprised he resigned for 3 yrs last summer.

Cant wait to see him play with Lehigh.

Just stop. There isn't a single person on this board that believes anything you say. Players who are unhappy with the otganisation they are in don't sign for the league minimum for 3 years.

 

[Outlaw Samurai]

Myers is going to come in and make some mistakes. I don't give a shit if he personally costs them a goal a game. Let him learn THIS YEAR.

 

[deadhead]

How convenient you ignored the age part of my post. He's a second year pro. He doesn't need to be compared to 30+ players.

That's because most young D-men who score at that pace don't spend much time in the AHL for good or bad (that is, teams often promote scoring defensemen before they master fundamentals then wonder why they spend years struggling at the NHL level).

Myers won't be in the AHL much longer, but it's not like he's so polished that another month of more intensive coaching (at the NHL level, there is less practice time and the focus is more on winning games than player development) would be wasted on him.

 

[Magua]

"Myers should not be promoted. He hasn't done that well."

"Actually, he's done historically well for his age given no PP1 time."

"Okay, but that's just because defensemen like him get promoted quickly."

 

[Stizzle]

Stizzle, I'm not looking for that personally. My comment was more for Hatch and anyone pumping up Hagg.

Ok, sorry. I have that poster on ignore. So I may have misconstrued the context of your post.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Logic and contrarianism are routinely at odds.

 

[MSSLYNX]

Just stop. There isn't a single person on this board that believes anything you say. Players who are unhappy with the otganisation they are in don't sign for the league minimum for 3 years.

Yep. Its all in my head. People have no relatives in real life. Got it.
Said i was surprised with the signing.
Do not believe Sam was really unhappy last winter. Free country.
Exact words of her cousin were "you can throw that Phantoms jersey away". In French.