Confirmed with Link: Montreal Canadien Offer Sheet Sebastian Aho (5 Years @ $8.45M) III

[Habs]

Something doesn’t add up here. If the offer will be so easily matched, as most everyone in the media is saying, why does MB even bother? I’d assume he’d be privy to the same info as those in the media.

Did MB do this for the optics, for his players and fans?

Or, does MB know something the media does not? Specifically, I wonder if the player agent passed along some pertinent information such as - the contract talks are slowing because the Canes are being stingy with bonus money. You gotta wonder if the agent gave a hint as to what might make the Canes balk at matching. Otherwise, why would MB bother with what appears to be an easily matched offer??

he was played by Carolina. They knew he would make the bare minimum offer, which they would match. Now they will tie his hands for a week and make him sweat it out. Bergy is just doing whatever he can to make it look like he is a capable GM with the fans.

 

[Milhouse40]

So after reading that and knowing they have increased their season ticket base for the upcoming season do you think there is more risk in alienating their new and existing STH's by not matching the offer for their best young player?

As i've said in most of my post....still think they are going to match it.

C'mon, man, you're being silly. I don't know if you were one but most people on this board thought 2 x 2nd picks was too much for Shaw. Now, after three years service and a couple of concussions the Habs trade him for a 2nd and a 3rd and it is scrap. Let's be fair.

And how this team is better next year?
Are those pick going to play top 6 F or top 4 D nest year?

The year after that? No?
Maybe the year after that one? Again no?

So are the odds of those picks turning into an NHL in 4 years from now?
Oh, only 3.5% chance to have an NHLer in 4 years from now....

That return was total trash, we just traded a guy that was slated as a top 6 forward next year for a 3.5% chances to have an NHLer (and not even a good one) in 4 years from now. Remind me how does this move help the team?

 

[Perrah]

You think weekends matter to billionaires?

I think the fact that they haven't matched it right now means that they currently don't have the ability to do so, that's all.

This is Dundon's call. Not Waddel's, his bloviating notwithstanding.

Well I wouldnt think 21 million means much to a billionaire that is trying to rebuild his assets fan base but look at these 3-4 threads.

 

[ottawa]

Maybe he just doesn't see this as a worthy investment from his pockets. It's quite probable when you look at Dundon's history and how he is with the Canes in salary and cheap budget management.

He probably has the cash let's not kid ourselves. But I do wonder how someone can just lose 250M$ this spring, be involved in a lawsuit and all of these other things and expect to be a guaranteed wealthy investor. I get that he's worth alot, how do we know he's not in debt over his head. We don't but it's pretty unlikely. Big Corporations go bankrupt all the time, look at Gibson or even Sears/Zellers that left Canada because they probably couldn't afford it or wasn't worth the investment.

This is exactly what this is about. Some people suggest Marleau's buyout decision wasn't that easy to make, sure. But theres something about the 21M$ bonus that could change his decision. Canes season gate numbers (whatever that is, I'm assuming profit/revenue) was 19-21M$ after Marleau's buyout. What happens when this makes it automatically a number below 0 before the season even starts.

How is he with the Canes salary? He's only signed one major player (TT) and got rid of a couple useless staff players during his year as the owner.

Him losing 250m and then buying a 1st for 4.5m also speaks volume of how deep his pockets are.

 

[NotProkofievian]

People are blinded by the PR move, they know we havn't had a young ppg player in decades and getting one this way sounds too good to be true...

I think there is an extra effect happenning because we have so many talented prospects in the pipeline that havn't had time to reach their potential yet and this just gives so many fans a taste for a player that has produced 80+ points.

I mean I completely understand why it's easy to be convinced the offer sheet is within the realm of reality or that it's plausible Carolina doesn't match. I really just don't see it and I think it cheapens the Montreal brand , just build it well and they will come...

Perhaps the rarest opinion in this discussion is ''Carolina definitely will not match.'' The overton window runs from ''I don't think this is as easy as Carolina beat writers and Waddel are trying to make it seem'' to ''Carolina will definitely match.''

I will personally believe the match when I see it.

 

[CauZuki]

It's all about optics and protecting the brand. Winning is not a priority.

It's as simple as the agent sold a loophole to Bergevin. Bergevin totally buys that and submits an offer attempting to exploit the loophole. Such loophole which just happens to give the Agent's client everything he wanted, while creating a scenario where it's not his fault "they are using tools in the CBA"...

They (Agent and player) are forcing the owners hand to break internal budget policies while essentially knowing there is a 99.99999% Carolina will match. Happens that the offer doesn't hurt Carolina too badly in terms of cap and term. If they have success (as they most recently have) why wouldn't Aho want to re-sign before UFA?

Come on now, this is business 101...

 

[Runner77]

It's not really STICKING IT to the Habs. It's just tying up their cap money for a week. They can't go on to their next RFA target until next Monday.

A week is nothing and Habs still have significant cap space available to make other moves. It’s a nothing burger that certain fans who like to shower Dindon with superlatives in caps, will exploit to death on other fan forums.

 

[HockeyDBspecialist]

I went into the Carolina forum and posted:

"the only thing I would be scared of is, why is Dundon NEVER giving signing bonus and front-loaded contract ? is he short on immediate money (12 months) ? I have a feeling that Aho's agent knows way more about his current flowing situation.
Now, does his pride take over ? probably"

and I got warnings + ban from this ? seriously ?

 

[zx81]

Is not bullying or personal, it's just business and competition.

What he means and I agree, is that the offer is too focussed on the penalty (signing bonus) and not enough on the reward (compensation).

This offer has a ridiculous compensation and can not be not matched by the Canes.

It only works if they can make a side deal to sweeten the OS.

 

[Wats]

The only way I see Habs getting Aho is if the Canes can trade Aho to them during the 7 days. Otherwise, safe to assume this is going to be matched. 8.5M for a 80+ point C is very reasonable.

 

[znk]

In a years time he can trade Aho or others for assets making higher cap hits then dollars owed to earn some of his money back from this deal.

In one year he will already have given $21M to the guy. Trading him at this point would be foolish when you just payd half of what hes supposed to make over 5 years.

 

[Ozmodiar]

He had no other logical options is the simple answer. So might as well throw money at the unattainable. This is where Edmonton turned when nobody would go there as well. Lucky for them Buffalo matched on Vanek.

Yes, that answer is indeed simple, isn’t it

 

[mitchmagic]

Every year people want Bergevin to do something "big." He fell into the offer sheet trap, which very rarely works. It sounds all glamorous and exciting, but in reality you'd probably end up paying more for an offer-sheet player than you would for a UFA... because you have to assume the team your poaching from will match almost ANY offer sheet. Bergevin got blinded by the excitement of offer sheets because he's dumb and childish and falls into those traps. Added to that, he wanted to show the fans that he's not scared of making a "big" signing. It's just that he didn't actually want to make a big signing.

He's probably terrified of making another mistake like Alzner and being a laughing stock for a couple of years.

 

[Mario Lemieux fan 66]

If Aho is not a Habs at the end of the Week, Bergevin should be fired. Player like Aho are rarely available and when they are, it's because they are UFA and they don't sign with the Habs.

Price and Weber will not be elite or near elite for 5 + years. Who care giving 2, 3 or 4 1st round pick for Aho when your window to win with Price and Weber is the next 3-4 years. A trade would have also allowed the Habs to sign Aho for 7 years instead of 5. Habs needs elite talent now and not maybe some bust like Leblanc, Beaulieu , Tinordi, McCarron and Scherbak.

With Aho our 1st round pick would have been most likely 20 + overall each year baring major injuries.

 

[M.C.G. 31]

What would people have thought if Bergevin took that offer sheet & used it to bait Waddell/Dundon to negotiate trade for Aho instead and hold the offer sheet over their heads structured the exact same way, knowing they wouldn’t want such a bonus laden deal (and talking it over with Aho’s camp, knowing he’d be willing to sign it)?

I still think Carolina’s PR team & Waddell himself only saw the AAV. The details didn’t come out until a bit later on the structure, no? They had the press conference like... 20 minutes after they got the email or something?

 

[BargainBinSpecial]

Something doesn’t add up here. If the offer will be so easily matched, as most everyone in the media is saying, why does MB even bother? I’d assume he’d be privy to the same info as those in the media.

Did MB do this for the optics, for his players and fans?

Or, does MB know something the media does not? Specifically, I wonder if the player agent passed along some pertinent information such as - the contract talks are slowing because the Canes are being stingy with bonus money. You gotta wonder if the agent gave a hint as to what might make the Canes balk at matching. Otherwise, why would MB bother with what appears to be an easily matched offer??

Well the agent probably leaked info to MB and the Habs jumped on the occasion.

Here's why MTL did this. Last year, they missed the playoffs after a solid run. Our lousy GM was unable to land a big UFA once again. What message does this show to the fans? MB had no choice and did a d*** move.

This sends a message around the league that the Habs are committed to winning and not some organization to toss to the curb. It was a message to the players to stop playing with the Habs. A PR stunt at its finest.

 

[NotProkofievian]

I went into the Carolina forum and posted:

"the only thing I would be scared of is, why is Dundon NEVER giving signing bonus and front-loaded contract ? is he short on immediate money (12 months) ? I have a feeling that Aho's agent knows way more about his current flowing situation.
Now, does his pride take over ? probably"

and I got warnings + ban from this ? seriously ?

Yeah, your mere presence in another team's board can be considered ''trolling.''

 

[ForeverHabs97]

There's a good chance Waddell and the Canes PR staff did not read the actual details of the offer sheet and simply looked at the AAV like so many people.

Even the media, which is why HF and the publics perception of how this will play out is distorted.

I also thought it was a bang on AAV value and peanuts in terms of compensation for us as a team. But it wasn't enough to make the Canes overwhelmed to match.... Until I watched MB's presser and how it explained his decision. Albeit looking very tired/angry and answering very quick answers, he said just enough to make us really understand/believe that there is a solid chance we could get this guy. The situation clearly says so, why didn't he go after Point? Cause Tampa/Leafs would easily pay anything even if it meant going over the cap if compensation wasn't good enough.

The fact that this is Carolina is what makes this the most entertaining MB move. Respect to him for this cause clearly looked out of his mind/tired as hell. On the flip side we can believe this idea that this is a PR tactic... It might just be that AND a legit shot at Aho.

 

[Captain Mountain]

We need to focus on our own issues , not bait our fans into dreaming about Aho...

Which he did.

Lets be real here, on July 1, there was no UFA forward on the market that would have appreciably improved Montreal. They have 2nd, 3rd and 4th line guys, and young, high-potential players they need to make room for (if not for next season, then the year after).

The only UFA that might actually help them to a meaningful degree next season is Gardiner, who is still out there. And Carolina can sit on the offersheet all they want, if Montreal wants Gardiner they can still offer a competitive offer right now.

The worst case scenario cap-wise is that they sign Gardiner, Carolina doesn't match the offer-sheet, and Montreal is forced to move a Lehkonen/Byron at well below market value. That's a pretty fantastic situation to be in.

 

[Be a Hab]

I think the 2nd year bonus is what hurts the most because of the potential of a NHL lockout. Not sure Canes want to pay all that money to a player without any revenue coming in.

 

[Zorba]

We need to focus on our own issues , not bait our fans into dreaming about Aho...

Exactly. PP sucks, need a d man and top 6 forward but so are happy Bergevin screwed the canes
If this fails, Bergevin has been left holding the bag
Our team is no better than last year
What hard to understand bout this
If he doesn’t get Aho and does nothing else, how is this considered a good summer?? Because he didn’t over spend on a ufa?
Bergevin has really set the bar low

 

[donghabs98]

A week is nothing and Habs still have significant cap space available to make other moves. It’s a nothing burger that certain fans who like to shower Dindon with superlatives in caps, will exploit to death on other fan forums.

The Habs can also go 10% over the salary cap (Roughly $8.15m) too. The notion that Bergevin's hands are tied is short sighted. According to some in this thread and pundits, it's a slam dunk match. If that's the case than you bet Bergevin is still calling agents and trying to sign someone.

 

[znk]

I dont think Aho is really hanging, he knows he has 42 million coming over 5 years and 11 mill in the next 11 days. Where ever Aho is, I cant imagine this week means much to him outside of waiting to see who is cutting his cheque.

These guys arent robots... He's eyeing property, imagining himself wearing the jersey he's a god damn 21 year old. What I can see though is them telling him right away "We will match in 7 days." not bah...lets go fishing and dick him and the habs around for a week.

 

[zx81]

Well the agent probably leaked info to MB and the Habs jumped on the occasion.

Here's why MTL did this. Last year, they missed the playoffs after a solid run. Our lousy GM was unable to land a big UFA once again. What message does this show to the fans? MB had no choice and did a d*** move.

This sends a message around the league that the Habs are committed to winning and not some organization to toss to the curb. It was a message to the players to stop playing with the Habs. A PR stunt at its finest.

On the other hand, the agent is doing a good job for his client in making the Habs believe Carolina won't match.

We are being used...once again.

 

[Runner77]

How did a player of Aho’s ability and potential slip out of the first round? Crazy

Imagine that, a franchise player slipping like that while the Habs selected Juulsen. If the Habs can’t get Aho, poach the scout who recommended him. Offer sheet him too.