MMA General Discussion and Fight Announcements 7.0

[m9]

I don't think anybody who paid money to watch the fight got suckered. From an entertainment standpoint it was worth it and it made for a fun night in Vegas.

The people that got suckered are the ones that actually thought McGregor had a shot and bet money on him at those odds.

 

[pistolpete11]

Regarding Jon Jones, I'm almost expecting him to headline UFC 230 now. These rumors have been going on for quite some time that he'd be back "sooner than expected" or even "he'll fight in 2018". There's just too much smoke for there to not be any fire.

My questions are against who and at what weight. Despite what he says, I can't see DC going back down to LHW by November. So if it is at LHW, it almost has to be Gus for the interim belt. As great of a fight as that is, is it headlining MSG good? For fight fans who watched Jones-Gus 1, f*** yeah. For more casual fans who don't really know Gus...?

But has anyone seen Jones lately? Dude looks huge. If he fought at HW, the only 2 possible fights are DC and Stipe. I can't imagine DC risking the Brock fight, though. Jones-Stipe would be an interesting fight, but again, is it headlining MSG big?

I don't know. I'm expecting something huge, so maybe they will do DC-Jones at HW with the belt and Brock fight on the line. As far as legacy and payday, winning those 2 fights would be best case scenario for DC.

 

[Avs_19]

Regarding Jon Jones, I'm almost expecting him to headline UFC 230 now. These rumors have been going on for quite some time that he'd be back "sooner than expected" or even "he'll fight in 2018". There's just too much smoke for there to not be any fire.

My questions are against who and at what weight. Despite what he says, I can't see DC going back down to LHW by November. So if it is at LHW, it almost has to be Gus for the interim belt. As great of a fight as that is, is it headlining MSG good? For fight fans who watched Jones-Gus 1, **** yeah. For more casual fans who don't really know Gus...?

But has anyone seen Jones lately? Dude looks huge. If he fought at HW, the only 2 possible fights are DC and Stipe. I can't imagine DC risking the Brock fight, though. Jones-Stipe would be an interesting fight, but again, is it headlining MSG big?

I don't know. I'm expecting something huge, so maybe they will do DC-Jones at HW with the belt and Brock fight on the line. As far as legacy and payday, winning those 2 fights would be best case scenario for DC.

I never thought of that before but I kinda like it if Gus isn't ready and/or Jones wants to move up. I think the LHW division needs Jones but this would be a big fight that could lead to the winner fighting DC/Lesnar.

 

[pistolpete11]

I'm really surprised with Tony-Pettis being added to UFC 229. Seems like a tuneup fight for Tony which the UFC usually doesn't do and I thought they were angling for Lee-Pettis which makes more sense from a ranking point of view. Awesome to see Tony back so soon though. Hopefully he looks good and gets the next title shot (although I'm expecting the UFC to cave to GSP vs. the winner of Conor-Khabib). Between Conor-Khabib-Tony, I could see any of them beating each other. Or Khabib beating Conor, Tony beating Khabib, Conor beating Tony or something along those lines.

Glad to (potentially) see Max back so soon, too. It is a little worrisome that they never found out what the matter was. According to his camp, he hadn't started the weight cut yet and he didn't have a concussion, so what the hell was it? I really want to see that fight, though, so I hope he's 100% and they get to do it.

Robbie-Wonderboy is an exciting fight, too, but I think they are going to add an even bigger fight for the first ESPN card. Definitely think they will tank the last Fox card and save the best fights for PPV and ESPN.

 

[m9]

I'm really surprised with Tony-Pettis being added to UFC 229. Seems like a tuneup fight for Tony which the UFC usually doesn't do and I thought they were angling for Lee-Pettis which makes more sense from a ranking point of view. Awesome to see Tony back so soon though. Hopefully he looks good and gets the next title shot (although I'm expecting the UFC to cave to GSP vs. the winner of Conor-Khabib). Between Conor-Khabib-Tony, I could see any of them beating each other. Or Khabib beating Conor, Tony beating Khabib, Conor beating Tony or something along those lines.

Glad to (potentially) see Max back so soon, too. It is a little worrisome that they never found out what the matter was. According to his camp, he hadn't started the weight cut yet and he didn't have a concussion, so what the hell was it? I really want to see that fight, though, so I hope he's 100% and they get to do it.

Robbie-Wonderboy is an exciting fight, too, but I think they are going to add an even bigger fight for the first ESPN card. Definitely think they will tank the last Fox card and save the best fights for PPV and ESPN.

I bet they asked Ferguson to be ready as the "backup" and he chose to take a fight instead of just going through a camp/weighing in for nothing.

Agreed on everything else.

 

[La Masse]

I'm really surprised with Tony-Pettis being added to UFC 229. Seems like a tuneup fight for Tony which the UFC usually doesn't do and I thought they were angling for Lee-Pettis which makes more sense from a ranking point of view. Awesome to see Tony back so soon though. Hopefully he looks good and gets the next title shot (although I'm expecting the UFC to cave to GSP vs. the winner of Conor-Khabib). Between Conor-Khabib-Tony, I could see any of them beating each other. Or Khabib beating Conor, Tony beating Khabib, Conor beating Tony or something along those lines.

Glad to (potentially) see Max back so soon, too. It is a little worrisome that they never found out what the matter was. According to his camp, he hadn't started the weight cut yet and he didn't have a concussion, so what the hell was it? I really want to see that fight, though, so I hope he's 100% and they get to do it.

Robbie-Wonderboy is an exciting fight, too, but I think they are going to add an even bigger fight for the first ESPN card. Definitely think they will tank the last Fox card and save the best fights for PPV and ESPN.

If we get the Pettis of old this could be a great fight. Tony does get hit quite a bit and Pettis is very accurate with his kicks. Agreed on everything else tho

 

[pistolpete11]

I never thought of that before but I kinda like it if Gus isn't ready and/or Jones wants to move up. I think the LHW division needs Jones but this would be a big fight that could lead to the winner fighting DC/Lesnar.

It's kind of strange. For so long the HW division was kind of 'meh'. But it got a little bit of a shot in the arm with Francis and now there's even more new blood with Blades, Lewis, and Volkov plus the additions of DC and possibly Jones. Makes giving Brock a title fight that much more frustrating.

I bet they asked Ferguson to be ready as the "backup" and he chose to take a fight instead of just going through a camp/weighing in for nothing.

Agreed on everything else.

That's a good point. Knock the ring rust off, show you're back where you were, and get your title shot next.

Pettis is, IMO, about as perfect of an opponent for Tony, too. Still a big name, exciting, a good test, but at the same time is not stepping back into the cage with an absolute killer like Khabib or Conor. The only better fight for him might be Nate.

If we get the Pettis of old this could be a great fight. Tony does get hit quite a bit and Pettis is very accurate with his kicks. Agreed on everything else tho

Pettis is a good enough fighter, and a well rounded enough fighter, that it wouldn't blow me away if he won. But it's still a very winnable fight for Tony...assuming he's back relatively healthy.

 

[Avs_19]

Nick Diaz has been cleared of all charges he was facing and says he's looking forward to focusing on his return. There are a lot of potentially fun fights for him at 170/185 like Till, Lawler, Wonderboy, Masvidal, Gastelum, Costa, Adesanya, etc. Unfortunately, he's probably more interested in a rematch against GSP or Anderson than fighting one of those other guys.

 

[pistolpete11]

Nick Diaz has been cleared of all charges he was facing and says he's looking forward to focusing on his return. There are a lot of potentially fun fights for him at 170/185 like Till, Lawler, Wonderboy, Masvidal, Gastelum, Costa, Adesanya, etc. Unfortunately, he's probably more interested in a rematch against GSP or Anderson than fighting one of those other guys.

Yeah, I don't see Nick coming back to actually challenge for a title. I think he'd just be interested in the biggest paydays. So Till, Wonderboy, Gastelum, etc., I don't think he'd be interested in. Costa, Stylebender, etc. aren't big enough names yet, so I don't think he'd be interested in them either.

A rematch with Robbie would be a lot of fun, but Robbie (and Wonderboy for that matter) has that fight rumored in January. So we wouldn't see Nick until at the earliest April if that was his first fight back.

GSP would be fun, but why does GSP take that fight? He says he's about legacy and beating a guy that he's already beat, who doesn't have a belt, and hasn't fought in 4 years, doesn't really do much for the legacy. I think GSP will hold out for the Conor/Khabib winner.

Anderson I think makes the most sense. They've got the history, they've both been out for a while, they're both big names. Could that be your MSG main event? It's kind of a meaningless fight to main event such a big show, but it would be fun and I think it would sell. You'd have both Diaz brothers on the same card, too.

 

[m9]

Given how the last Silva/Diaz fight ended there's no way that headlines MSG.

 

[MD thaivuN]

Seems like Jackson-Wink is in a really bad shape, according to Cerrone. If Greg Jackson has really started to step away from the sport and Wink is the head coach, it would explain the camp's poor performances lately. Wink's striking style is one of my least favorite thing to watch in his fighters, and Jackson's strategic genius was the only thing kept the camp working.

 

[Avs_19]

Still no main event for MSG. There's been some talk that they'll announce it at the Conor/Khabib press conference but nothing confirmed. The event isn't too far away and I believe tickets are supposed to go on sale this week so they have to do it really soon.

The Jones rumours haven't gone away, even though he still hasn't been cleared by USADA. He was also just in Vegas meeting with the UFC last week. If DC and/or Jones aren't involved then it might be Woodley vs. Covington or Valentina vs. Joanna.

 

[pistolpete11]

Still no main event for MSG. There's been some talk that they'll announce it at the Conor/Khabib press conference but nothing confirmed. The event isn't too far away and I believe tickets are supposed to go on sale this week so they have to do it really soon.

The Jones rumours haven't gone away, even though he still hasn't been cleared by USADA. He was also just in Vegas meeting with the UFC last week. If DC and/or Jones aren't involved then it might be Woodley vs. Covington or Valentina vs. Joanna.

I've been convinced it is going to be Jones. There's just too much smoke. I don't know who the opponent is going to be, though. I'm starting to think it is going to be DC. I can't believe he'd put the Brock fight on the line, but the way Anik, Rogan, and DC were talking about it during UFC 228, it seems like it is going to be HUGE. I mean, I want to see Woodley pound Colby's head in as much as the next guy and I'd like to see Valentina-Joanna, but neither of those fights are close to living up to the way they were talking about it. Those fights aren't even good enough to main event over Dustin-Nate, IMO. So if they announce it at the Conor-Khabib press conference, DC-Jones at HW is my prediction. I reserve the right to change my prediction if they don't announce it at the press conference

If they do announce it at the press conference, it seems kind of weird to me that they are making these media blitzes. It seems like some stuff will inevitably get lost in the shuffle. The Conor-Khabib announcement overshadowed Nate coming back. Nate took it back a little bit by walking out (and who knows, maybe that was planned?), but if he didn't...And those 2 things overshadowed a lot of other good fights being announced. I think it would be better to make a big announcement. Let people digest it, talk about it, and then announce something else when the talk dies down. I guess they think while they have everyone's attention.

 

[Avs_19]

I've been convinced it is going to be Jones. There's just too much smoke. I don't know who the opponent is going to be, though. I'm starting to think it is going to be DC. I can't believe he'd put the Brock fight on the line, but the way Anik, Rogan, and DC were talking about it during UFC 228, it seems like it is going to be HUGE. I mean, I want to see Woodley pound Colby's head in as much as the next guy and I'd like to see Valentina-Joanna, but neither of those fights are close to living up to the way they were talking about it. Those fights aren't even good enough to main event over Dustin-Nate, IMO. So if they announce it at the Conor-Khabib press conference, DC-Jones at HW is my prediction. I reserve the right to change my prediction if they don't announce it at the press conference

If they do announce it at the press conference, it seems kind of weird to me that they are making these media blitzes. It seems like some stuff will inevitably get lost in the shuffle. The Conor-Khabib announcement overshadowed Nate coming back. Nate took it back a little bit by walking out (and who knows, maybe that was planned?), but if he didn't...And those 2 things overshadowed a lot of other good fights being announced. I think it would be better to make a big announcement. Let people digest it, talk about it, and then announce something else when the talk dies down. I guess they think while they have everyone's attention.

That's not a bad prediction at all. DC calling fights and doing his other media duties makes me think he's not involved because if I'm not mistaken, I believe he usually stops well in advance of his fights but I honestly have no clue. DC vs. Jones at HW would probably be the biggest fight they could do.

If I had to make a prediction I'd go with Jones vs. Gustafsson for either the official or interim LHW belt.

 

[m9]

I think there's no doubt Jones is who they want, they are just waiting until he's cleared. My guess is Jones v Gus, with Cormier/Miocic 2 as the co-main. Maybe that's crazy, but we'll see.

If Jones isn't cleared, Cormier/Miocic as the main event with Woodley/Covington the co-main.

 

[pistolpete11]

That's not a bad prediction at all. DC calling fights and doing his other media duties makes me think he's not involved because if I'm not mistaken, I believe he usually stops well in advance of his fights but I honestly have no clue. DC vs. Jones at HW would probably be the biggest fight they could do.

If I had to make a prediction I'd go with Jones vs. Gustafsson for either the official or interim LHW belt.

Good point about DC's media job. I don't really pay attention to FOX, but I guess even announcing UFC 228 was within 2 months from UFC 230.

I'd love to see Jones-Gus 2. I just wonder if even THAT is big enough. For more casual fans, I don't think they'd really know Gus...which seems crazy given how his only losses are against the clear top 3 guys of the era and the 2 against the top 2 guys could have gone either way and were epic fights.

The other curious thing for me is that Rumble has all of a sudden shown up and started to do some media. The only fight against the top guys in the LHW division that didn't happen was Jones-Rumble.

 

[pistolpete11]

I think there's no doubt Jones is who they want, they are just waiting until he's cleared. My guess is Jones v Gus, with Cormier/Miocic 2 as the co-main. Maybe that's crazy, but we'll see.

If Jones isn't cleared, Cormier/Miocic as the main event with Woodley/Covington the co-main.

If DC and Jones are on the same card, I can't believe it wouldn't be against each other.

I also don't know what DC has to gain by fighting Stipe again...as much as I want to see it since I'm a big Stipe fan.

I never thought about adding 2 fights, though. If the main underwhelms, they could still make it pretty big by adding 2 fights, especially if they are title fights. Still, I go back to how excited Anik, Rogan, and DC were during UFC 228. That would have been before they knew anything about Woodley. Are there any other title fights that could potentially be added? Max-Ortega? I think they were targeting a later card, though. TJ-Cejudo? As Avs mentioned, Valentina-Joanna? Not really worthy of that excitement if you ask me.

 

[m9]

I doubt Rumble is in the USADA testing pool.

I'm pretty sure two title fights will be added, and I'm pretty sure DC/Miocic is one of them.

 

[pistolpete11]

I doubt Rumble is in the USADA testing pool.

I'm pretty sure two title fights will be added, and I'm pretty sure DC/Miocic is one of them.

Fair point. Though it wouldn't be the first time USADA made some exceptions. Brock at UFC 200 being maybe the biggest example, but heck, if Jones is eligible for UFC 230, something fishy is going on already.

I don't think we'll ever see DC at 205 again regardless of his media stuff or how much advanced notice he has. So I'd expect Jones to move up to HW if they ever fight again. Jones has talked about it numerous times. Talked about Brock. Even talked about the possibility of going up to fight DC.

 

[pistolpete11]

I did a search to see if Rumble is in the USADA pool, didn't find an answer, but came across an old article with his manager talking about him making a comeback at HW. The part I always forget, he used to cut to 170(!!!)!!! Not 185. 170! The same article said he now weights 250lbs. That's amazing.

 

[m9]

I did a search to see if Rumble is in the USADA pool, didn't find an answer, but came across an old article with his manager talking about him making a comeback at HW. The part I always forget, he used to cut to 170(!!!)!!! Not 185. 170! The same article said he now weights 250lbs. That's amazing.

Yeah, even when he was a welterweight he would get up to 220+ in between fights.

Jon Jones has been in the USADA testing the whole time, which is why he is a legit option. I would be surprised if Rumble has been.

As for Leanar, the reality is Lesnar made enough money for them to get an exemption. Don't think Rumble does.

 

[pistolpete11]

Yeah, even when he was a welterweight he would get up to 220+ in between fights.

Jon Jones has been in the USADA testing the whole time, which is why he is a legit option. I would be surprised if Rumble has been.

As for Leanar, the reality is Lesnar made enough money for them to get an exemption. Don't think Rumble does.

You're right that Rumble is not a big enough fight for the UFC to call the integrity of their testing into question. Not like Brock. I still think we see Jones-Rumble at some point, at HW, but probably a little bit more by the book.

Jones is in the testing pool, but he failed which is even worse. Since it's his second time, even if they prove it was a tainted supplement, I think he still gets the minimum which I believe would take him after UFC 230. That's what I remember from Chael explaining it anyway.

 

[m9]

You're right that Rumble is not a big enough fight for the UFC to call the integrity of their testing into question. Not like Brock. I still think we see Jones-Rumble at some point, at HW, but probably a little bit more by the book.

Jones is in the testing pool, but he failed which is even worse. Since it's his second time, even if they prove it was a tainted supplement, I think he still gets the minimum which I believe would take him after UFC 230. That's what I remember from Chael explaining it anyway.

It's worse in general, but it's not worse for potentially being able to fight at UFC 230.

As long as he's given some "reduced fault" for the whole thing, he's looking at a suspension somewhere between 8 months and 3 years. It's really up to USADA where that falls, though you would have to imagine the UFC has a good amount of influence. Since he's still in USADA, as long as that suspension is 12 months or less he's good to go for UFC230.

 

[pistolpete11]

It's worse in general, but it's not worse for potentially being able to fight at UFC 230.

As long as he's given some "reduced fault" for the whole thing, he's looking at a suspension somewhere between 8 months and 3 years. It's really up to USADA where that falls, though you would have to imagine the UFC has a good amount of influence. Since he's still in USADA, as long as that suspension is 12 months or less he's good to go for UFC230.

When does the suspension officially start, though? From the failed test? From his last fight? From his last clean test? From when his licence is revoked?

And how does it being his second offense factor in?

I'd have to listen to Chael's explanation again, but he basically said if Jones fights at UFC 230, they did something screwy. He could be wrong of course.

 

[m9]

When does the suspension officially start, though? From the failed test? From his last fight? From his last clean test? From when his licence is revoked?

And how does it being his second offense factor in?

I'd have to listen to Chael's explanation again, but he basically said if Jones fights at UFC 230, they did something screwy. He could be wrong of course.

I can't remember if it's from the last fight or when the failed test occurred, but since they were within a few days of each other it doesn't really matter. I believe it's from his last fight.

Second offense essentially means the potential suspension is doubled. So this drug he was busted with carries max of 2 years for 1st offense, but since he failed a previous drug test the max would be 4 years.

They wouldn't really have to do something screwy to get Jones at UFC230. First, Jones just has to convince USADA that he is not completely at fault for the failed test. If he can do that, he avoids the 4 year ban. I think this one is a done deal. On the other side, the best case scenario is that he proves he had zero fault, which means he is free to fight whenever. This scenario is extremely unlikely and you can rule that one out too.

That leaves an incredibly vague middle-ground where he can be suspended between 8 months and 3 years depending on how much fault they find. I would bet my house that when this is cleared up Jones will be suspended for between 8 months and 3 years retroactive to his last fight/failed test. He will be eligible to fight somewhere between now and August 2020. So as long as we are talking 1 year or less, he's good to go for UFC230.

Far be it for me to question Chael Sonnen on this kind of thing as nobody knows the system more than him, however there is definitely a scenario based on USADA guidelines where Jones is fighting at UFC230 and it's perfectly legit. It just comes down to the level of fault they find with him and then how long they want to suspend him for.