Value of: Mitch Marner

[Johnny Hoxville]

marner 3 million retained

For

Faulk sandford barbashev

Oh that’s terrible.

 

[Colt55]

Oh that’s terrible.

It gives you your long sought 1rhd, gives you a big physical forward and a gritty third line center.

 

[TBF1972]

Zibanejad - Signed his contract way before becoming a star player
Point - 6.75M ... really ?
Johnson - Had one 70 point season 6 years ago, since then his highest is 50. 31 in 65 last year
Marchessault - LOL not even comparable
Karlsson - Nylander has out produced him 2 years in a row now and he's younger
Horvat - Nylander has outproduced him every single year, and Horvat signed his contract extension, for 2017-18
Schwartz - Nylander has out produced him every year and is younger
Couturier - Signed his contract ages ago when he was looking like an average player

Brayden Point is the only guy mentioned who has a legitimate case, rest are just names you're throwing out there for the sake of having some sort of argument

while i agree, that nylander's point production most probably validates his contract (even in a flat cap environment), you can't simply pretend that the 18/19 season did not happen. last season nylander was awful in every sense and the bolded is simply not true.

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

Your only kidding yourself lmao,get what you can for him while you still can!

Most points by the end of their age 22 season since the 03/04 lockout:

1. Crosby 506
2. McDavid 469
3. Stamkos 386
4. Ovechkin 310
5. Malkin 304
6. MacKinnon 303
7. Kane 303
8. Marner 291
9. Matthews 285

I think the Leafs could get a little more value than "get what you can for him while you still can." Even if you go by PPG he's still 11th and 9th among players with more than 1 season.

 

[kabidjan18]

The problem with the value of Marner is that teams have what they value. Kyle Dubas values scoring. Offensive firepower. So he went out and got a team stacked with offensive firepower. And then signed them according to what he thought they were worth, which was a lot, because he values offensive firepower a lot.

Now suddenly there's this weird conversation in Toronto. "We need a defensive defenseman." Or maybe "we need a solid bottom 6 guy with grit." The teams that have defensive defensemen and defensive bottom-6 forwards are the teams that value defensive defensemen and bottom 6 forwards.

So if you went to Dubas and the GM of a real stalwart defensive team and you asked them if they would take a trade of Marner for their best defensive defenseman, both would say no. Dubas would find it disagreeable to give up a top scoring winger for a perennially low-scoring defenseman who probably doesn't rush the puck up the ice in transition. And the other GM would find it disagreeable to give up the cornerstone of their defensive concept, the bedrock of their team, for a winger who isn't really interested in investing himself in a defensive concept, and certainly not at the cost of reduced scoring.

There are a few teams that are shifting concepts to what they perceived as a more new-age approach to hockey. They might also value Marner highly. But their defensemen are usually less attractive. Drew Doughty for example. The Kings, who are known to be shifting towards this new-age concept, might value Marner that highly. But the Leafs would have no interest in that aging contract. And so the saga continues.

 

[Notsince67]

i guess. but i cant imagine habs do this because marner is a winger. and habs need top pairing centres. if it was taveres instead of marner i think this would be more realistic

I seriously think you are being trolled here and good lord you are falling for it. I wouldnt take those 2 contracts for free.
They are boat anchors

 

[Petrus]

The problem with the value of Marner is that teams have what they value. Kyle Dubas values scoring. Offensive firepower. So he went out and got a team stacked with offensive firepower. And then signed them according to what he thought they were worth, which was a lot, because he values offensive firepower a lot.

Now suddenly there's this weird conversation in Toronto. "We need a defensive defenseman." Or maybe "we need a solid bottom 6 guy with grit." The teams that have defensive defensemen and defensive bottom-6 forwards are the teams that value defensive defensemen and bottom 6 forwards.

So if you went to Dubas and the GM of a real stalwart defensive team and you asked them if they would take a trade of Marner for their best defensive defenseman, both would say no. Dubas would find it disagreeable to give up a top scoring winger for a perennially low-scoring defenseman who probably doesn't rush the puck up the ice in transition. And the other GM would find it disagreeable to give up the cornerstone of their defensive concept, the bedrock of their team, for a winger who isn't really interested in investing himself in a defensive concept, and certainly not at the cost of reduced scoring.

There are a few teams that are shifting concepts to what they perceived as a more new-age approach to hockey. They might also value Marner highly. But their defensemen are usually less attractive. Drew Doughty for example. The Kings, who are known to be shifting towards this new-age concept, might value Marner that highly. But the Leafs would have no interest in that aging contract. And so the saga continues.

This is incorrect.

This discussion did not just happen“suddenly”. This has been a discussion in Toronto for a long time.

It is precisely one of the reasons why there was a debate on whether Toronto should draft Hanifin/Provorov over Marner even though Marner was viewed clearly as the better pick at that time.

When Toronto drafted Nylander, Marner and Matthews they went with BPA. Had a defenseman been the BPA in those draft years, Toronto would have drafted them.

Bottomline, the Leafs needs a roster rebalancing and they need to address the RD position as the LD is set with Rielly, Muzzin, Dermott and Sandin.

 

[A1LeafNation]

It gives you your long sought 1rhd, gives you a big physical forward and a gritty third line center.

16 points is a 1rhd?

 

[Colt55]

16 points is a 1rhd?

Bad year transitioning to new team and playing the left side

 

[Hockey 4 Life]

Bad year transitioning to new team and playing the left side

The proposal is terrible but you know that already.

 

[Dache]

So in this scenario Toronto takes on an extra almost $3 M in salary and retains on Marner while taking on a 33 and 35 year old under contract for another 5 years each and giving up the 23 year old near the top of his position?

Gee, where do I sign?

This is just a forum and not an official trade proposal, you wouldn’t need to sign anything.

 

[Dache]

Tavares is still a franchise center and has been his usual 80-90 point self with the Leafs. He's their second best player after Matthews and he doesn't need elite wingers to go ppg.

Signing Tavares was never the issue. The issue was not resigning Marner prior to his first season with Tavares when he was reportedly willing to sign for $9.5 million and then allowing to ride shotgun to a top 10 C in the league and then negotiating with him.

I get what you’re saying but at that time Marner only had 60 some points and deserved no where near 9.5 mil either.

 

[EC]

Van Riemsdyk (cap dump)
Nolan Patrick
Phillippe Myers
Morgan Frost

FOR

Marner

 

[A1LeafNation]

Bad year transitioning to new team and playing the left side

Or his new norm.

 

[Merrrlin]

You don't a 22 year old 94pt player for a diminished price because he's overpaid by a million or two.

 

[Morbo]

marner 3 million retained

For

Faulk sandford barbashev

yeah, that's about what I expected from this thread.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

For some reason I thought the proposal was Parayko, Sanford and Barbashev for Marner and wondered why it was being laughed at so much. Then I saw it was Faulk and understood.

 

[Colt55]

For some reason I thought the proposal was Parayko, Sanford and Barbashev for Marner and wondered why it was being laughed at so much. Then I saw it was Faulk and understood.

Yeah faulk is the available guy and the one leafs really need.

Besides marner isn't enough for parayko

 

[Sniper99]

Marner is an elite player who is paid like a superstar. But, he is still elite. You don't bail on him just because he is a few million overpaid. Do leafs fans really trust Dubas to get a fair return on a young elite player?

Nope! and after watching him get his ass kicked in contract negotiations I really dont trust him with trade negotiations.

 

[colchar]

I did read a blog suggesting a big return. ?

Stop reading Eklund.

 

[sparxx87]

Yeah faulk is the available guy and the one leafs really need.

Besides marner isn't enough for parayko

The Leafs don’t need another overpaid player, nor do they need a defenseman who isn’t very good at playing defense.

If the Leafs move Marner it will be for a player they actually need, not one another team is trying to dump.

 

[57special]

Marner is a terrific young player, but he is paid like he is an elite C that has led his team to a Cup. Bringing, him, and his salary onto another team creates a financial, and team chemistry problem that a GM will be very aware of. Let's say he is traded to CO, or FLA. Do you think that players(or more likely, their agents) like Mackinnon, Makar, or Barkov aren't going to notice the disparity between their paycheck and his? It's one thing if the player is a been there, done that veteran like Doughty. Quite another when it's a player younger than you who has never gotten out of the first round of the playoffs.
For teams that have little cap space, he just simply won't be an option.

Bottom line is that his cap hit lowers his value, and makes him very difficult to trade. Things will change a bit if he is sipping out of the Cup by this time next year, and he is a Conn Smythe winner.

 

[Bigmarycombo]

Marner is not going to be traded. He may be overpaid by 900k
But that is on dubas and dubas only.

If the leafs need cap to sign their number one RHD they will trade Johnsson Kerfoot and nylander to make that happen.

Lou and dubas made the mistake of not taking advantage of the whole year of negotiating leading up to the big 3 contracts.

Lou left and dubas was in charge. He started negotiations with nylander and it went two months into the season.
Where dubas made his mistake was when he finally signed nylander he didn’t get maximum years and he gave him a 10 million dollar bonus so nylander didn’t lose one cent in money despite sitting out for two months.

Now Matthews was next. Why would he give leafs any discount. He signed for what maximum he could get and signed for only 5 years. And he gave him a no movement clause in the fifth year. Dubas has to start negotiation with him after the fourth year and if they can’t reach an agreement then they have to make a decision to trade him or lose him for nothing.

Now marner. Lou screwed Him by telling him he doesn’t give out bonus B contract and then signed Matthews to A and B contract. Mitch lost a lot of money by Lou doing this. Now he watched the nylander and Matthews negotiations and certainly wasn’t giving away any more. He led the team in points during his ELC as well as penalty killing. His first year he played with bozak andvJVR who both had career years. Next they put him on a line in December with Marleau and kadri who both were in a scoring slump. They became leafs best line with Marleau having his best year in many years and kadri scoring career high.then stupid dubas put him on a line with Tavares and he then scored a career year in goals.

Marner is 23 and only getting better. Leaf fans are saying he had a terrible year but he still led the team in PPG despite missing a month with a severe high ankle sprain.

Marner is going no where stop wasting your time posting trades.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

The quantity for quality trade proposals for Marner are laughable. He is an elite winger. If he’s traded it will be for a high level defenseman. Not for three or four minor pieces. Marner may be overpaid but he still has significant value as one of the top wingers.

 

[The90]

while i agree, that nylander's point production most probably validates his contract (even in a flat cap environment), you can't simply pretend that the 18/19 season did not happen. last season nylander was awful in every sense and the bolded is simply not true.

No he wasn’t. He was a major victim of bad luck. If you actually watched him play, once he got up to speed, he was very good.

the HFBoards narrative that he was hot garbage was just that, a narrative that’s ‘simply not true’.

Please don’t comment on him if you didn’t watch >30 of his games last year. Thanks