Mike Babcock discussion part 3.

[Martin Skoula]

Yes, they were down and he played more.
I don't see the issue.

"More" in this case is just "average" for other star players. I don't know how Babcock's only takeaway from the game being that he played Matthews too much isn't concerning.

 

[Bust]

Yes, they were down and he played more.
I don't see the issue.

Babs thinks he played too much, 22 mins seems in line for average top line minutes IMO

 

[Bust]

I would treat it as well as I could to make sure that it would last 20 years...

We only have our lambo on a 5 year rental. nothing further is promised.

 

[ACC1224]

Babs thinks he played too much, 22 mins seems in line for average top line minutes IMO

Yeah they probably have some optimal number set and prefer not to go over that.

 

[Bust]

Yeah they probably have some optimal number set and prefer not to go over that.

does that not sound ridiculous to you? A professional athlete cant play an extra minute or 2 in a game where his team needs production?

 

[Martin Skoula]

does that not sound ridiculous to you? A professional athlete cant play an extra minute or 2 in a game where his team needs production?

Well unless that professional athlete is a 40 year old Marleau or running a 37 year old Hainsey into the ground on the PK.

 

[Bust]

Well unless that professional athlete is a 40 year old Marleau or running a 37 year old Hainsey into the ground on the PK.

You forgot about 1 legged Hyman! Dont need to rest him if hes already broken!!11!

 

[Teeder Keon]

Incoming


Mike Babcock

is a good person
Very good human , father , husband
Good professional
Inspiring philosopher
Good coach ( not great coach )
Was excellent in setting up the rebuild
Just not the right coach for us today , with our roster and makeup and age and skill set and era and trend happening in hockey Moving forward .

 

[ACC1224]

does that not sound ridiculous to you? A professional athlete cant play an extra minute or 2 in a game where his team needs production?

I think he prefers to keep them under a certain number and mentioned that they went over it.

 

[Teeder Keon]

I think he prefers to keep them under a certain number and mentioned that they went over it.

He’s trying to do the right thing in his mind and experience in attempting to make this group of young stars we have to be complete hockey players in the way he deems fit .
The problem is that these young players coming up today for the most part are just not going to follow this program no matter what and with them making the kind of money they do and the importance of who they are as “ stars “ for the organization and team and fan base and themselves . They know they are staying put
They want to play a style that differs from what he wants
He is stubborn and maybe rightfully so , but it doesn’t take away the fact that they are not going to follow
It’s over with him
Shelf life is over ...

 

[ACC1224]

He’s trying to do the right thing in his mind and experience in attempting to make this group of young stars we have to be complete hockey players in the way he deems fit .
The problem is that these young players coming up today for the most part are just not going to follow this program no matter what and with them making the kind of money they do and the importance of who they are as “ stars “ for the organization and team and fan base and themselves . They know they are staying put
They want to play a style that differs from what he wants
He is stubborn and maybe rightfully so , but it didn’t take away the fact that they are not going to follow
It’s over with him
Shelf life is over ...

Yep, agreed.
Never really liked him as Coach, I doubt he has any supporters left.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

I'm actually thinking we should keep Babcock just to ensure ourselves a lottery pick this year.... Then fire his butt after the season.

Might as well make the best of the cards we've been drawn....

That would be a very nice thing to do for Carolina

 

[Bust]

I think he prefers to keep them under a certain number and mentioned that they went over it.

Yes you mentioned that.
My question to you was does that not sound silly? that a young, professional isn't capable of an extra shift or 2, regardless if those shifts take him above some arbitrary number of minutes? By Babs own admission he mentioned that he played too much, Matthews got 4 points. does that not kibosh his argument for excessive minute management?

 

[Erdinger]

I think he prefers to keep them under a certain number and mentioned that they went over it.

Of course some of those extra minutes were on those extended shifts when they were hemmed in and kept icing it. One shift was over 2 minutes

 

[ACC1224]

Yes you mentioned that.
My question to you was does that not sound silly? that a young, professional isn't capable of an extra shift or 2, regardless if those shifts take him above some arbitrary number of minutes? By Babs own admission he mentioned that he played too much, Matthews got 4 points. does that not kibosh his argument for excessive minute management?

I think it's more of an accumulative thing. Playing extra minutes every night over the course of the season is probably said to have some negative affect.
If it were up to me Matthews line and Tavares line would play a ton.

 

[Bust]

I think it's more of an accumulative thing. Playing extra minutes every night over the course of the season is probably said to have some negative affect.
If it were up to me Matthews line and Tavares line would play a ton.

Yeah, probably.

 

[napoleon in rags]

I honestly don't know how much blame Babcock deserves for the issues of this team. What I do know is that this version of the Leafs (if you look at the season and not two periods tonight) is just the absolute opposite of my preference, system-wise:

- I prefer controlled, creative breakouts. I'll buy the extra turnovers for significantly more controlled zone exits. We're a bit better there, but nowhere near where we (should) be.
- I think a team like ours should be designed around getting the carry-in, rather than the dump-in. Our entire team is specialized towards it, yet we dump it in more than most teams.
- I like offense created from switching positions, playing close to each other and working east-west to get good looks from the slot. The majority of our offense so far has consisted of winning the dump-in, getting the puck up high, and crowd the net. Almost no teams shots as much from the blue line as we do.
- I like a quick, intense forecheck intended to force mistake. We are very quick to abandon it and settle back in the neutral zone.
- I want the team to focus defensively on constant pressure and keeping guys out of shooting lanes, even if that means no blocks. Shots from far out with clear sightlines are routine saves. Let the goalie make them.
- I like teams that care for the puck. As a Swede, it boggles my mind how willing NA teams is to just hand the puck over before line changes or on breakouts. Manage the puck. Don't just hand the opposition possession.

Not going into special teams because that's a whole different area. PK isn't a strong point for me and I quite like our aggressive play and the way we hunt for chances when possible. PP though....

I was struck by how wedded we are to dump in's when last night I watched Moore carry the puck with speed over the opposition blue line. He had a lane to keep going, but he hesitated, then stopped, remembering (I imagine) that dump in's are mandatory, and then dumped it in, resulting in the puck coming back up the other way.

Reluctantly, I'm thinking a change is needed behind the bench.

 

[Martin Skoula]

I was struck by how wedded we are to dump in's when last night I watched Moore carry the puck with speed over the opposition blue line. He had a lane to keep going, but he hesitated, then stopped, remembering (I imagine) that dump in's are mandatory, and then dumped it in, resulting in the puck coming back up the other way.

Reluctantly, I'm thinking a change is needed behind the bench.

My favorite part about it is that the dump-in is supposed to be a safe reliable play, but the way we run it through the stretch pass makes it dangerous against us from the amount of icings we take.

 

[baton elevated]

Babs is full of you know what. he never hesitates to play his favorites as much as he wants Mo Riels, Cici, Z, Hainsey get 15 plus minutes a night but no forward gets an extra minute or two. Nice double edge sword there. He contradicts himself a lot when it meets his agenda. The Leafs will get what they deserve sticking to this coach and this unbalanced team construction.
you will get the odd good games but definitely not a winning formula. That's as clear as day.

 

[supermann_98]

"More" in this case is just "average" for other star players. I don't know how Babcock's only takeaway from the game being that he played Matthews too much isn't concerning.

Too much? Him and Nylander were flying out there! He's mad that Matthews got 4 assists or something?

This old Saskatchewan goofball should be fired no doubt. This team never starts on time, is always chasing the lead, and is treading water against lottery teams.

 

[supermann_98]

We only have our lambo on a 5 year rental. nothing further is promised.

Seriously, Arizona is gonna get a low mileage supercar in 5 years while we restock with Lada's.

Hopefully McDavid still has a soft spot for Toronto and comes back when his contract ends, but that's a supercar that will have a shit-ton of mileage on it and will be even more expensive

 

[hector morrison]

I honestly don't know how much blame Babcock deserves for the issues of this team. What I do know is that this version of the Leafs (if you look at the season and not two periods tonight) is just the absolute opposite of my preference, system-wise:

- I prefer controlled, creative breakouts. I'll buy the extra turnovers for significantly more controlled zone exits. We're a bit better there, but nowhere near where we (should) be.
- I think a team like ours should be designed around getting the carry-in, rather than the dump-in. Our entire team is specialized towards it, yet we dump it in more than most teams.
- I like offense created from switching positions, playing close to each other and working east-west to get good looks from the slot. The majority of our offense so far has consisted of winning the dump-in, getting the puck up high, and crowd the net. Almost no teams shots as much from the blue line as we do.
- I like a quick, intense forecheck intended to force mistake. We are very quick to abandon it and settle back in the neutral zone.
- I want the team to focus defensively on constant pressure and keeping guys out of shooting lanes, even if that means no blocks. Shots from far out with clear sightlines are routine saves. Let the goalie make them.
- I like teams that care for the puck. As a Swede, it boggles my mind how willing NA teams is to just hand the puck over before line changes or on breakouts. Manage the puck. Don't just hand the opposition possession.

Not going into special teams because that's a whole different area. PK isn't a strong point for me and I quite like our aggressive play and the way we hunt for chances when possible. PP though....

The blame stems from the fact that he is in control.Therefore ,whatever problems arise are his to solve. He isn't /hasn't been Pro-active in that regard ...at all!

 

[hector morrison]

playing your best player 21:56 is not “too much” IMO. Especially considering the 4 point, dominant performance.

Bab's hates it when players rack up points.

 

[hector morrison]

I think they are hoping to avoid burn out by playing a couple minutes less.
I don't get the outrage.

Burn out? At 22 years old? Not buyin' that crap!Lad is a horse!

 

[hector morrison]

"More" in this case is just "average" for other star players. I don't know how Babcock's only takeaway from the game being that he played Matthews too much isn't concerning.

Not concerning,but expected. His philosophy is wrong!