Prospect Info: Mikael Wikstrand

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Micklebot

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Given the fact the guys fighting for the #5 & #6 D-spot are Boro, Wideman and Wiercioch, I'd say he'd have a decent shot.

Claesson looked as good as those guys, if not better, and I think Wikstrand is considerably more talented.

It's nearly a guarantee that he'd have gotten a callup this year rather than Kostka or possibly Claesson. He certainly missed out on a chance to make an impression, but I can't blame him if the motivation was to be closer to a sick family member.

Hope he eventually comes over to NA, be it with Ottawa or not, as I still think he can carve out a nice career.
 

WadeRedden

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Panarin is 2 years older than Wikstrand and was a bit of an unknown as to how he'd transition. To put it into perspective, he put up Da Costa like numbers in the KHL prior to coming over (I mean, technically Da Costa put up similar numbers in less games, but I digress). He was a complete unknown as far as how he'd translate.

It's easy to say that all those guys were much better prospects now, as we've seen how they turned out, but I think the point stands.

Fabian Brunnstrom is another example, as is Lehtera (though he played 7 or so games in the AHL before returning to europe for a while and then going direct to the NHL), Berglund, Kuznetsov, Dekeyser, .

There's also countless guys that spend very limited time in the AHL like Gunnarsson, Stralman, ect.

No. Schwartz and Tarasenko were both first round picks and considered bluechip prospects from the get-go. Panarin was passed over in his draft year but was highly thought of in Russia and played a huge role on Russia's WJ team the year they upset Canada, playing alongside Kuznetsov and Tarasenko.

Wikstrand was always a project player and a long-shot to make the NHL.
 

Lenny the Lynx

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I guess I'm still optimistic that this guy can come over next year. Its too bad he didn't stay this year because he would have gotten a shot, but he wasn't ready emotionally for whatever reason. There's no reason they can't all put this behind them.

I don't see him having much value in a trade at this point. He could just be a throw-in but whats the point.
 

WadeRedden

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I guess I'm still optimistic that this guy can come over next year. Its too bad he didn't stay this year because he would have gotten a shot, but he wasn't ready emotionally for whatever reason. There's no reason they can't all put this behind them.

I don't see him having much value in a trade at this point. He could just be a throw-in but whats the point.

Dude, those bridges have been scorched beyond repair. I get that some people feel for him given that he's coping with a family member battling cancer. However, the way he conducted himself in the press both prior and after he was suspended was atrocious. He completely sewered the Sens org. on numerous occasions and called Murray's character into question despite the fact that he was actually in breach of contract and the Sens had every right to suspend him. This guy simply isn't talented enough to justify bringing him into a dressing room given how immature and untrustworthy he is. My guess is they invite him to training camp and doesn't make the team, then refuses to play in Bingo and we're back at square one next year. If his contract wasn't guaranteed the Sens prob would have fired him back in December.
 

Micklebot

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No. Schwartz and Tarasenko were both first round picks and considered bluechip prospects from the get-go. Panarin was passed over in his draft year but was highly thought of in Russia and played a huge role on Russia's WJ team the year they upset Canada, playing alongside Kuznetsov and Tarasenko.

Wikstrand was always a project player and a long-shot to make the NHL.

If Wikstrand were a free agent today without the drama from this spring, he'd likely be one of the more desirable "free wallet" free agents out there, if not the most.

Like I said, you're using hindsight knowing how those guys turned out, and assuming Wikstrand is and will bust. I'm not trying to say he'll turn out as good as some of the above, but there are tons of examples of guys that did not spend time in the AHL, Schwartz Tarasenko, Panarin are some more well known examples because of how successful they've been, so they came to mind first, but I mentioned more.

As I said, the point stands, older players who played in men's leagues jumpng straight to the NHL isn't uncommon.
 

Sentron5000

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My guess is he is traded..most likely a throw-in on a larger deal. His value right now is probably worth a 3rd or 4th, if he came over.
 

WadeRedden

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If Wikstrand were a free agent today without the drama from this spring, he'd likely be one of the more desirable "free wallet" free agents out there, if not the most.

Like I said, you're using hindsight knowing how those guys turned out, and assuming Wikstrand is and will bust. I'm not trying to say he'll turn out as good as some of the above, but there are tons of examples of guys that did not spend time in the AHL, Schwartz Tarasenko, Panarin are some more well known examples because of how successful they've been, so they came to mind first, but I mentioned more.

As I said, the point stands, older players who played in men's leagues jumpng straight to the NHL isn't uncommon.

You're basing that on what? He was suspended almost the entire season and it didn't get any attention from the national media. Bruce Garrioch gave an update once every few months and that was it. If he were truly one of the best prospects not playing in the NHL he'd have been a) traded or b) would have at least garnered some decent mainstream media attention a la Johnny Drouin. There's a reason this guy was drafted in the 7th round--he's a project player who needs a lot of work. Can you show me a list of the best prospects not playing in the NHL that has his name on it from a reputable source?

And no, I'm not just using hindsight. As I said, Tarasenko and Schwartz were both first round picks and highly-touted prospects out of their respective junior leagues. I don't think there are too many people out there who are shocked that they became quality NHLers (although Tarasenko obviously exceeded most people's expectations).

My point wasn't that you can't make the jump from Euro pro men's leagues to the NHL; It was that it's not his choice to make. The Sens have invested plenty of money into this guy and obviously wanted their farm team coach (who has like 1,400 games of NHL experience) to monitor and help improve his play on a nightly basis for a year. I don't care that he thought he needed another year in Europe. He was drafted in 2012 ffs. It was time for him to follow his bosses' orders and make the leap.

*Also, one thing I've thought a lot about while following this story is that the Sens seem to have had trouble with Swedish players coming over when they want them to in the past. Silfverberg comes to mind. I remember three or four years back when the Sens wanted to bring him over to play in the AHL and he was adamant about wanting to play another year in Sweden. In the end, the Sens caved and allowed him to play in the SHL where he ended up winning the MVP and the championship (I think). So, obviously it worked out ok for him but the guys in the Sens management were probably thinking "geez, our AHL team is struggling and meanwhile we have one of the best guys not playing in the NHL under contract and he's playing in Sweden? I'm sure that drove Randy Lee (GM of Bingo) nuts."
 

Micklebot

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You're basing that on what? He was suspended almost the entire season and it didn't get any attention from the national media. Bruce Garrioch gave an update once every few months and that was it. If he were truly one of the best prospects not playing in the NHL he'd have been a) traded or b) would have at least garnered some decent mainstream media attention a la Johnny Drouin. There's a reason this guy was drafted in the 7th round--he's a project player who needs a lot of work. Can you show me a list of the best prospects not playing in the NHL that has his name on it from a reputable source?

You seem to haqve missed the part where I said without the drama from this summer. But that's ok I guess. As for why he isn't drawing the same attention as Drouin, well, aside from the fact that Drouin was a top 3 pick with potential top player talent, there's also the fact that Drouin was holding out to play in the NHL as opposed to holding out to not play in the NHL. If you can't see how that might cool perspective trade offers, I really don't know what to tell you. It's also quite possible that Ottawa never showed interest in trading him.

His draft status is irrelevant, Panarin wasn't even drafted. Both guys developed quite a bit since then. They are not 18, 19 yr olds.

As for Reputable sources, Pronman (it's behind a paywall, you can see some of the content herethough) had him ahead of Chabot in our Org rankings after the 2015 draft (partially because he wasn't as high on Chabot, but still had Wikstrand as our 2nd best prospect behind White, ahead of Paul, Puempel, Prince, Lindberg). He was highly regarded whether or not you want to beleive it.

And my point about "free wallet" is that he would have received UFA attention akin to the Panarin, Justin Shultz, and Mike Reilly type of buzz if he became a free agent (he actually still has a year under contract, I though it was up after this season, so it's kinda a moot point).

And no, I'm not just using hindsight. As I said, Tarasenko and Schwartz were both first round picks and highly-touted prospects out of their respective junior leagues. I don't think there are too many people out there who are shocked that they became quality NHLers (although Tarasenko obviously exceeded most people's expectations).

And Panarin? I never suggested that Wikstrand was at their level, I just mentioned that it isn't uncommon. I went on to list more guys, which you've ignored, focusing instead on two guys. But yes, you are using hindsight. Even Schwartz exceeded rational expectations.

My point wasn't that you can't make the jump from Euro pro men's leagues to the NHL; It was that it's not his choice to make. The Sens have invested plenty of money into this guy and obviously wanted their farm team coach (who has like 1,400 games of NHL experience) to monitor and help improve his play on a nightly basis for a year. I don't care that he thought he needed another year in Europe. He was drafted in 2012 ffs. It was time for him to follow his bosses' orders and make the leap.

Ok, if that's you're point it's an odd way of going about making it. I responded to someone asking how often do guys skip the AHL, you responded by saying the guys I mentioned off the top of my head were much better prospects. I gave more examples, with guys that weren't as good, you continued talking about how great a player those first examples were, and went on to downplay Wikstrand as a prospect. You never once said or implied that the issue was with him trying to decide what route is better for his development, hence why I replied the way a have. As for why he wanted to stay in Europe this year, he's made public his rationale; whether you accept it as acceptable, or beleive the veracity of it or not is up to you, I guess.

*Also, one thing I've thought a lot about while following this story is that the Sens seem to have had trouble with Swedish players coming over when they want them to in the past. Silfverberg comes to mind. I remember three or four years back when the Sens wanted to bring him over to play in the AHL and he was adamant about wanting to play another year in Sweden. In the end, the Sens caved and allowed him to play in the SHL where he ended up winning the MVP and the championship (I think). So, obviously it worked out ok for him but the guys in the Sens management were probably thinking "geez, our AHL team is struggling and meanwhile we have one of the best guys not playing in the NHL under contract and he's playing in Sweden? I'm sure that drove Randy Lee (GM of Bingo) nuts."

Sure, I guess. There are advantages and disadvantages to Eur and NA in terms of developing prospects. I know they weren't happy with how Zibanejad was handled over there as well. That's a different issue altogether though.
 

starling

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My point wasn't that you can't make the jump from Euro pro men's leagues to the NHL; It was that it's not his choice to make. The Sens have invested plenty of money into this guy and obviously wanted their farm team coach (who has like 1,400 games of NHL experience) to monitor and help improve his play on a nightly basis for a year. I don't care that he thought he needed another year in Europe. He was drafted in 2012 ffs. It was time for him to follow his bosses' orders and make the leap.

Wikstrand had very similar progression to Klingberg while having same size, playing same type of game, on the same team, under same coach in SHL and in WJC, drafted in the later rounds 2 years apart.
 

danielpalfredsson

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I could see him coming over next season. If he is as good as some people are saying he is, then him and his agent probably have a pretty good idea that he could be on the team out of training camp. The Senators already punished him with the beer league/grocery store exile stint that he had to go through for half the year so it isn't like they should be worried about looking soft and having future prospects think they can walk all over them.

Wiercioch is as good as gone. Kostka is not an NHLer. That leaves Chabot (19 years old, extremely young for a d-man) and Claesson as his only real competition for that 7th spot. That is also assuming the team doesn't carry 8 d-men as they have done in the past.

If he is happy as a career SHLer and never intends to come over to the NHL, that's one thing. But my impression was he didn't want to have to play in the AHL. The Senators have had both Kostka and Claesson up in the NHL for what will work out to be almost a third of the season combined. So if you're Wikstrand and you're looking at things objectively, you probably could make an argument to yourself that had you "played the game" you would have been in the NHL this season.

If he just wants to be a career SHLer, there's nothing wrong with that. But in that case, why sign the ELC deal?
 

danielpalfredsson

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My guess is he is traded..most likely a throw-in on a larger deal. His value right now is probably worth a 3rd or 4th, if he came over.

I don't think he'll be traded.

Senators need NHL ready d-men if they are getting rid of Wiercioch (which all signs point to).

If Wikstrand wants to play in the NHL, there's a very good argument to be made that he could win a spot next season. There's an opening. If he doesn't want to play in the NHL, why does another team give up a decent draft pick for him? I guess he could be part of a trade if the Senators need to even out contracts coming in and out, but that isn't the value of a 3rd or a 4th, being a cog in a trade like that is irrelevant value (see Matt Frattin).

If he wants to play in the NHL and he is as good as some people in this thread are insinuating, I don't see why Ottawa moves him. If he doesn't want to come to the NHL, I don't see why someone gives up the equivalent of a 3rd for him.
 

Lenny the Lynx

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If he is happy as a career SHLer and never intends to come over to the NHL, that's one thing. But my impression was he didn't want to have to play in the AHL. The Senators have had both Kostka and Claesson up in the NHL for what will work out to be almost a third of the season combined. So if you're Wikstrand and you're looking at things objectively, you probably could make an argument to yourself that had you "played the game" you would have been in the NHL this season.

If he just wants to be a career SHLer, there's nothing wrong with that. But in that case, why sign the ELC deal?

The same could be said about last season to be honest. I don't think there is a team in the league with more need for competent defensemen, so he definitely would have gotten a shot. We have been going with a bunch of diaper pails on our 3rd pairing over the last couple of seasons.

Its confusing whats going on but I don't see why everyone can't take the high road next year. If Drouin can go back to the AHL this guy can too.
 

Micklebot

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The same could be said about last season to be honest. I don't think there is a team in the league with more need for competent defensemen, so he definitely would have gotten a shot. We have been going with a bunch of diaper pails on our 3rd pairing over the last couple of seasons.

Its confusing whats going on but I don't see why everyone can't take the high road next year. If Drouin can go back to the AHL this guy can too.

The difference I suppose is that in the AHL, he'd be making 70k (plus signing bonus which he gets either way), in the SHL, he likely is getting between 200-400k.

As for the same thing being said last year, I think it would have been hard for him to crack the roster with us having 8 dmen up with the big team all year, even if our D sucked.
 

Lenny the Lynx

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The difference I suppose is that in the AHL, he'd be making 70k (plus signing bonus which he gets either way), in the SHL, he likely is getting between 200-400k.

As for the same thing being said last year, I think it would have been hard for him to crack the roster with us having 8 dmen up with the big team all year, even if our D sucked.

I'm pretty sure that the high end of salaries in the SHL is about $300K. Someone on here posted about that. I doubt that Wikstrand is getting the league max there. He probably makes like $100K at most realistically (I have no idea).

His 70K in the AHL would be blended with what he made in the NHL at $830K. So at 10% NHL time, thats 146K. At 25% thats $260K, at 50% thats $450K.

Seems very unlikely that its a financial motive because NA is clearly more lucrative for him unless he had zero confidence he could play in the NHL even a little bit.
 

Proust*

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The notion that we shouldn't do everything possible to convince this guy to play on our NHL blue-line next year is preposterous. We suck and we need him. Forget about the AHL. He is better than Borocop and at least up there with Wiercioch and Wideman. Something tells me he is actually closer to Ceci.
 

Micklebot

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I'm pretty sure that the high end of salaries in the SHL is about $300K. Someone on here posted about that. I doubt that Wikstrand is getting the league max there. He probably makes like $100K at most realistically (I have no idea).

His 70K in the AHL would be blended with what he made in the NHL at $830K. So at 10% NHL time, thats 146K. At 25% thats $260K, at 50% thats $450K.

Seems very unlikely that its a financial motive because NA is clearly more lucrative for him unless he had zero confidence he could play in the NHL even a little bit.


Players in Finland’s SM-liiga, for example, can make more than $200,000 a year, with the top players earning more than twice that amount. The Swedish Elite League teams pay players in a similar range to Finland’s SM-liiga and ranked as the fourth-highest average salary as of 2006 data.
souce

I've also seen the pay for SHL listed as anywhere from 60k EUR to 260k EUR so Idk, but I imagine guys with pretty solid NHL chances that are playing big mins when over there are closer to the top end. For what it's worth, in the AHL, he'd being paid as a bottom end SHL player if those figures are correct.

The other issue is SEL is a guarantee of that money, where as your scenario of blending it with NHL is a chance at more money.

I don't think financial aspects are the primary reason he'd opt to stay over there, but I do think it's likely an incentive as oppose to playing in NA.
 

Sentron5000

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I don't think he'll be traded.

Senators need NHL ready d-men if they are getting rid of Wiercioch (which all signs point to).

If Wikstrand wants to play in the NHL, there's a very good argument to be made that he could win a spot next season. There's an opening. If he doesn't want to play in the NHL, why does another team give up a decent draft pick for him? I guess he could be part of a trade if the Senators need to even out contracts coming in and out, but that isn't the value of a 3rd or a 4th, being a cog in a trade like that is irrelevant value (see Matt Frattin).

If he wants to play in the NHL and he is as good as some people in this thread are insinuating, I don't see why Ottawa moves him. If he doesn't want to come to the NHL, I don't see why someone gives up the equivalent of a 3rd for him.

But will this team play him over Boro? Granted they may try Boro on his off-side, but he needs to come in and dominate in camp to be able to guarantee a spot.

The only reason I suggested a trade, is because a team like Edmonton could guarantee him a spot, regardless of how he performs. Ottawa certainly wouldn't give him that luxury. Edmonton can't wait for defensemen to develop, they need some players who should be able to play now. If I were them I would certainly take a gamble if it were available...especially with 3 3rd round picks.
 

EXTRAS

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He finished the SHL season with 9 points in 17 games. He has 2 points in 2 playoff games.
 

Babych Moustache

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The Sens would be foolish not to try bringing him over one last time.

Nothing to lose at all.

Agreed. Bring him over. Hopefully he's got a bit of a personal chip on his shoulder and some of his pride hurt for how things worked out this year... give him a chance to prove everyone wrong, or at least that he's matured a little and wants to impress with hard work...

If not, wash your hands of him, trade him for a pick, move on...
 

Sens

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Boston waited years for Soderberg... If that's what it takes then that's what it takes.

Anton Rodin too went back to the SEL after coming over abd has quietly transformed into a wicked hockey player being named SEL MVP this season.

There should be no issue letting players develop in Europe
 

Babych Moustache

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Boston waited years for Soderberg... If that's what it takes then that's what it takes.

Anton Rodin too went back to the SEL after coming over abd has quietly transformed into a wicked hockey player being named SEL MVP this season.

There should be no issue letting players develop in Europe

Never an issue with development; where I hope things have changed is with how Wikstrand will communicate with the team, etc. I'm sure he's learned from this whole experience, much like the Sens have as well.
 

jbeck5

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Agreed. Bring him over. Hopefully he's got a bit of a personal chip on his shoulder and some of his pride hurt for how things worked out this year... give him a chance to prove everyone wrong, or at least that he's matured a little and wants to impress with hard work...

If not, wash your hands of him, trade him for a pick, move on...

when you say bring him over do you mean to finish out the season in bingo or in ottawa?
 

OgieO

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Personally, I'd bring him to Ottawa if we could. Anything to not see Kotska out there. Bygones be bygones - get him back in the fold.
 
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