OT: Memorial Cup - May 16-25 at Budweiser Gardens in London, ON

[Raincouver]

I dont know why everyone wanta Horvat to be an offensive star...not his game. The Canucks drafted a safe, dependable player that is necessary for a winning team.

He's likely a 3rd line NHL centre.

 

[CanaFan]

I dont know why everyone wanta Horvat to be an offensive star...not his game. The Canucks drafted a safe, dependable player that is necessary for a winning team.

He's likely a 3rd line NHL centre.

I think you are greatly overrating the 'quality' of 3rd line centres in the NHL or perhaps underrating Horvat. He would have to develop almost no NHL offensive game to be _just_ a 3C. If he develops even modest NHL scoring - say 20 and 20 - then he is about as good a 2C as Ryan Kesler was this year. Far too soon to put such restrictive caps on any player, esp an 18 yo who is still developing his offensive skills and confidence.

 

[ihaveyuidonttouchme]

Bibeau just stops a breakaway, a penalty shot, and stops another grade a scoring chance

 

[Hardyvan123]

Magic?

While playing with questionable health and taking on the toughest match ups... (Strong Magic)

13 more points in 7 less games shows improvement but he won't be counted on to be an offense only guy his total game is coming along nicely.

 

[CanaFan]

13 more points in 7 less games shows improvement but he won't be counted on to be an offense only guy his total game is coming along nicely.

Actually it's 13 more points (61 to 74) in 13 less games (67 to 54), so an even bigger jump than that, though your point remains a valid one. While I agree his likely outcome is probably not at a 1C level of scoring pedigree (though who knows) I am stunned by those who have already come to the conclusion that Horvat is _limited_ to a 3C. The typical scoring for a 3C is somewhere in the range of 35 pts or less, so if people think an 18 yo kid putting up nearly 1.4 PPG while in a secondary offensive role can't exceed 35 pts then I must say they've got some pretty negative expectations for this kid. Given everything else Horvat brings to the table, he would be an _excellent_ 2C if he produced in the range of 45+ points, which I certainly believe he is capable of hitting.

 

[Hardyvan123]

Actually it's 13 more points (61 to 74) in 13 less games (67 to 54), so an even bigger jump than that, though your point remains a valid one. While I agree his likely outcome is probably not at a 1C level of scoring pedigree (though who knows) I am stunned by those who have already come to the conclusion that Horvat is _limited_ to a 3C. The typical scoring for a 3C is somewhere in the range of 35 pts or less, so if people think an 18 yo kid putting up nearly 1.4 PPG while in a secondary offensive role can't exceed 35 pts then I must say they've got some pretty negative expectations for this kid. Given everything else Horvat brings to the table, he would be an _excellent_ 2C if he produced in the range of 45+ points, which I certainly believe he is capable of hitting.

You are right, I did my math bass ackwards there, the point is that he will be a fine #2 Center and even a serviceable #1 center like Kesler.

Of course that's the projection but he is progressing quite nicely.

 

[Taelin]

Horvat with a beautiful pass to Rupert (don't know which one) but he couldn't score.

 

[Bgav]

Damn it 1-0 storm

 

[Taelin]

Mitchell knees Mermis and now London is on a 5 min. PP.

 

[Orca Smash]

Storm is all over london on this pk.

 

[Taelin]

2-0 Storm.

Ugh.

 

[Tv9924]

Is it just me, or does Horvat seem bigger?

 

[VeteranNetPresence]

Rare goal for london

 

[Bgav]

2-1 sick goal

 

[Lundface*]

Horvat had a good end to the period, missed a couple chances but he was really involved.

He was also impressive on the draws, won them effortlessly.

 

[Bgav]

Horvat had a good end to the period, missed a couple chances but he was really involved.

He was also impressive on the draws, won them effortlessly.

Can't believe he missed that chance off the post. Also so happy we didn't draft domi instead

 

[Orca Smash]

Stolarz finally gave london a big save, but then scores on himself.

 

[iFan]

I dont know why everyone wanta Horvat to be an offensive star...not his game. The Canucks drafted a safe, dependable player that is necessary for a winning team.

He's likely a 3rd line NHL centre.

I think he's more of a solid 2nd line center when he's develop and playing in the NHL

 

[canucksfan]

Max Domi does not impress me

 

[GPNuck]

so after they lose, are they out? I mean out of the tournament Eliminated!

 

[torlev*]

Actually it's 13 more points (61 to 74) in 13 less games (67 to 54), so an even bigger jump than that, though your point remains a valid one. While I agree his likely outcome is probably not at a 1C level of scoring pedigree (though who knows) I am stunned by those who have already come to the conclusion that Horvat is _limited_ to a 3C. The typical scoring for a 3C is somewhere in the range of 35 pts or less, so if people think an 18 yo kid putting up nearly 1.4 PPG while in a secondary offensive role can't exceed 35 pts then I must say they've got some pretty negative expectations for this kid. Given everything else Horvat brings to the table, he would be an _excellent_ 2C if he produced in the range of 45+ points, which I certainly believe he is capable of hitting.

There were roughly 60 Centres this year that scored at that pace or better. So Id say that makes a Centre near the bottom offensively for a second line. Given that, even if a player were excellent defensively, I'd have a hard time considering a 45 point player excellent for second line Centre.

 

[torlev*]

so after they lose, are they out? I mean out of the tournament Eliminated!

Yup.

Guelph is the class of the tourney clearly.

 

[Lundface*]

Zadorov does not look good at all either, pretty disapointing game from him.

Fabbri really reminds me of Mike Ribiero, skilled guy but he is paper thin. He's taking too much punishment at this level...he'll need to find ways to avoid contact if he is going to survive

 

[CanaFan]

There were roughly 60 Centres this year that scored at that pace or better. So Id say that makes a Centre near the bottom offensively for a second line. Given that, even if a player were excellent defensively, I'd have a hard time considering a 45 point player excellent for second line Centre.

Why not? If a player brings _decent_ 2nd line scoring and a high end all around game, in my books that makes the player am excellent 2C. Look at the guys who scored around 45 pts last year and tell me they aren't 2C's either ... Hodgson, Vermette, hell Kesler is right in there. So much value can be found beyond goals and assists that it is ridiculous to define the quality of a player by whether they score +5 or -5 points of some arbitrary number.

 

[torlev*]

Why not? If a player brings _decent_ 2nd line scoring and a high end all around game, in my books that makes the player am excellent 2C. Look at the guys who scored around 45 pts last year and tell me they aren't 2C's either ... Hodgson, Vermette, hell Kesler is right in there. So much value can be found beyond goals and assists that it is ridiculous to define the quality of a player by whether they score +5 or -5 points of some arbitrary number.

As I said, offensively it's lower than average for a second line centre. If a player is going to be above average, for a position, I'd personally say he'd better be at the very least average both offensively and defensively. Below average offensively, and above average defensively, would lead me to think of an average player at that position.

Other players that scored at a similar pace include guys like Matt Stajan, Tyler Johnson, Mikael Backlund. I also don't consider guys like Hodgson or Vermette ABOVE average, or "excellent". Not even Kesler was year.

A 45 point player that is EXCELLENT two way is a top notch third line centre or average second line, as far as I'm concerned.