Confirmed with Link: #MelnykOut Campaign - successfully raised 8K over this past weekend.

[Filatov2Kovalev2Bonk]

The problem in Ottawa isn't the fans of Ottawa, it's the teams inability to convert other teams fans. That's a marketing issue, not a fan issue.

This is the Ottawa Senators fault, and TSN1200's fault. TSN1200 had mundane and childish "Leafs Suck" stuff and if they had approached a more urbane, high-end approach many Leafs fans would have converted. Same with Habs.
But all this costs money and time and creativity and, well, you know...easier to just go to the lower brow and go from there.

Leafs fans will not be converted now that their team is on the cusp.
Habs fans can come over, but it will take a concerted effort to do so.

 

[Sensung]

This is the Ottawa Senators fault, and TSN1200's fault. TSN1200 had mundane and childish "Leafs Suck" stuff and if they had approached a more urbane, high-end approach many Leafs fans would have converted. Same with Habs.
But all this costs money and time and creativity and, well, you know...easier to just go to the lower brow and go from there.

Leafs fans will not be converted now that their team is on the cusp.
Habs fans can come over, but it will take a concerted effort to do so.

No Leaf fan or Hab fan is converting to a team with the worst owner in the NHL.

 

[Cosmix]

Again, as others have already mentioned, what exactly is this grand conspiracy? What is this 15 year long con that Melnyk is running? I fail to see the logic in your accusations. Melnyk isn't crying poor. He has loads of money. The Senators franchise has trouble operating in the black. There are a ton of reasons why this is so. Small market being a big one. Some have mentioned the fact that this is a Govt town, Phoenix issues, arena location, etc. The exchange rate and attendance have a direct impact on the financial success of the team. If the Senators were selling out every home game, the team would be in a very different position.
There is a veritable mountain of evidence of actual tangible evidence that explains the situation. But some folks choose to ignore that and instead ascribe bizarre motives to the owner of the team. It's baffling.

Other than the baffling part, I totally agree with you!

 

[Cosmix]

I think the problem with the argument put forth by the "this fanbase doesn't show the same devotion" crowd is this; it's not the fanbase that's the problem. The fans we have are fantastic and every bit as passionate as any other teams fans. The issue is this market was already saturated with diehard Toronto and Montreal fans. Winnipeg, Calgary, Vancouver, Edmonton, none of them had that problem. So even if you argue only 20% or 25% of the population is a fan of an out of market team (surveys have suggested the actual numbers are much higher), that's still a huge hit compared to other markets. The problem in Ottawa isn't the fans of Ottawa, it's the teams inability to convert other teams fans. That's a marketing issue, not a fan issue.

Winnipeg has a legacy of strong fan support for Toronto Maple Leafs and MONTREAL Canadians. It is reducing over time but was there going back to when Ben Hatskin started the Winnipeg Jets in the WHA. Hurrah for Benny and the Jets!

 

[coladin]

Look where we were in 2014 when we still wouldn’t spend.

Toronto Maple Leafs most expensive ticket in NHL; all teams listed 1 to 30 | The Hockey News

And even if attendance was papered, we were in the top half of the league
In profits.

Were you one of those that bought into his whole “You’ll see, I’ll spend soon. Trust me!” scam?

Ottawa spent nearly $15M on Phaneuf and Ryan. The question isn't spending is it? Or is it allocating that money properly?

 

[coladin]

You're right, circumstances have changed, tv revenues have skyrocketed. The team got an expansion fee of 16 mil and expects another one in short time. The tv deals alone are generating about 40-45 mil a year (mostly from the regional deal which expected to give them about 2 times as much as the national deal). The old regional deal was paying them 125k a game and the national deal basically doubled with the new one. Revenue loses from the drop in attendance would have been more than offset by these tv deals.

Why does revenue have to be "offset"? Why can't people go to the rink AND watch the games on TV. TV revenues are great, but salaries have skyrocketed too. Everything has gone up and while nice to have TV revenues that Melnyk was able to negotiate, I don't think it is enough to keep players like Karlsson, Stone and Duchene.

 

[coladin]

Seriously you say not to compare, and then at the end say hopefully a smaller downtown arena will help. YOU'RE COMPARING US TO WINNIPEG WITH EXACTLY THAT.

Jesus man, I said our market has problems but brushing them aside as excuses isn't a way to solve them. PS I've worked at the arena for 10 years, and have gone to at minimum of 10 games a year during that time so gtfo with I'm part of the problem.

I don't want to speak for Ice, but where did he say "you" are part of the problem? You are not if you go to games. The problem is for those who DON'T go. I am frustrated that ticket buyers who go are content to lop themselves in with people who don't go. You are not the problem. Those who have abandoned the arena are putting the team in a financial predicament. Especially with this owner.

Your post is the typical, generalized excuse laden argument about why people don't go. It was more excuses. Doesn't mean those are YOUR excuses.

 

[Canadian Time]

There are empty seats all over the league, seriously, watch the games, it's happening everywhere even in the strongest markets.
this isn't just an Ottawa problem but for some reason a couple of hundred empty seats here in the playoffs is dire. It doesn't help when our own media guys like Mendes invite shamers on the pregame show to get it going.

I will bet anything Edmonton's season ticket base and attendance takes a drop next year. Have a look at their secondary market for tickets this year, it's falling hard. For years that market could be enticed with the promise of new youth but they are smartening up and not buying it. Vancouver too. But it will not be highlighted, just here. This market is the same as any other, stop with the hysteria that somehow Ottawa is lesser, it's not true.

 

[coladin]

There are empty seats all over the league, seriously, watch the games, it's happening everywhere even in the strongest markets.
this isn't just an Ottawa problem but for some reason a couple of hundred empty seats here in the playoffs is dire. It doesn't help when our own media guys like Mendes invite shamers on the pregame show to get it going.

I will bet anything Edmonton's season ticket base and attendance takes a drop next year. Have a look at their secondary market for tickets this year, it's falling hard. For years that market could be enticed with the promise of new youth but they are smartening up and not buying it. Vancouver too. But it will not be highlighted, just here. This market is the same as any other, stop with the hysteria that somehow Ottawa is lesser, it's not true.

A couple of hundred seats, in the grand scheme of things, is not a big issue. But you fail to mention 2K plus in a 2nd round game. And that, in the grand scheme of things, is also not a big deal because Melnyk is making money. Fine.

The issue is the perception of having empty seats in a Canadian market, in Round 2. No matter how you slice it, those tickets should be sold, and they weren't. Perception is this is a bad hockey market and how dare they, what's wrong with the fans, yada yada yada...even though the fans were incredible inside the arena. My feelings at the time was that people have become apathetic in this market and the passion is waning. Maybe a new building revitalizes the market, which it will at the beginning. But money is what talks and it is expensive to be an NHL fan. No question. Can this market be a big league market? I have my doubts right now.

It isn't just an Ottawa issue, but that does not change the fact that Ottawa is by far the worst in Canada, with a superstar player and with the cheapest seats. Those factors make Ottawa laughingstock. Other markets maybe don't understand why that is, I am just telling you what you and all of us already know: everyone thinks Ottawa has lousy fans.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

A couple of hundred seats, in the grand scheme of things, is not a big issue. But you fail to mention 2K plus in a 2nd round game. And that, in the grand scheme of things, is also not a big deal because Melnyk is making money. Fine.

The issue is the perception of having empty seats in a Canadian market, in Round 2. No matter how you slice it, those tickets should be sold, and they weren't. Perception is this is a bad hockey market and how dare they, what's wrong with the fans, yada yada yada...even though the fans were incredible inside the arena. My feelings at the time was that people have become apathetic in this market and the passion is waning. Maybe a new building revitalizes the market, which it will at the beginning. But money is what talks and it is expensive to be an NHL fan. No question. Can this market be a big league market? I have my doubts right now.

It isn't just an Ottawa issue, but that does not change the fact that Ottawa is by far the worst in Canada, with a superstar player and with the cheapest seats. Those factors make Ottawa laughingstock. Other markets maybe don't understand why that is, I am just telling you what you and all of us already know: everyone thinks Ottawa has lousy fans.

Yes.

 

[Benjamin]

What changed between 15-16 and 16-17?

 

[Sensung]

More revenue = Bigger budget?

Well in spite of a few empty seats, Eugene made a KILLING on last year's playoff run.

He also got a bonus 16M in expansion fees.

Our team was (as your hero Eugene reminded fans) one goal from the cup final last year. He promised the budget was only temporary and he'd spend when the team was competitive again, right?

Hey @Ice-Tray
Revenue was way up last year...where is the increased spending you promised?

 

[Boud]

What changed between 15-16 and 16-17?

Wasn't it the year they stopped giving tickets away? Not sure.

 

[harrisb]

Wasn't it the year they stopped giving tickets away? Not sure.

This directly correlates to when the Phoenix pay system went live and many of our population stopped getting reliable paychecks. Also not long after us starting to get other teams to buyout our players in return for anchor contracts. Not sure when Alfie bailed but it's in there too and the Melnyks antics of course. Death by 1000 cuts and Melnyk wields the knife

 

[L'Aveuglette]

Hilarious how this thread about a movement started by hardcore Sens fans that are frustrated by the owner is mostly filled with shil- I mean pro-Melnyk posters dead intent on putting the blame on them instead.

 

[Micklebot]

Wasn't it the year they stopped giving tickets away? Not sure.

2013-14 is the year they stopped papering, or at least that's when talk about the change in policy started. They apparently were giving a lot of tickets away in the lockout year.

 

[mat_sens]

Looks like we got some attention in Vancouver and Vegas last night

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

There are empty seats all over the league, seriously, watch the games, it's happening everywhere even in the strongest markets.
this isn't just an Ottawa problem but for some reason a couple of hundred empty seats here in the playoffs is dire. It doesn't help when our own media guys like Mendes invite shamers on the pregame show to get it going.

I will bet anything Edmonton's season ticket base and attendance takes a drop next year. Have a look at their secondary market for tickets this year, it's falling hard. For years that market could be enticed with the promise of new youth but they are smartening up and not buying it. Vancouver too. But it will not be highlighted, just here. This market is the same as any other, stop with the hysteria that somehow Ottawa is lesser, it's not true.

I've been saying it for a few years now....fans aren't willing to go through as many hoops and pay as much cash to watch professorial sports as they used to. Not just the NHL, but you see it across all major pro sports. The hassle of so much extra security (not to mention some sporting events and concerts already being hit by terrorism/mass shootings the last few years), the increase of quality in peoples' man caves to watch games, the amount of sports bars with a great atmosphere, the cost to tickets, and pro sports itself starting to get stale as a Main Event....all plays a part. People are staying at home more often.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

Their is ZERO evidence the Franchise (arena included) is losing MONEY.

If this is true, then the opposite is true as well.

 

[Tuna99]

I've been saying it for a few years now....fans aren't willing to go through as many hoops and pay as much cash to watch professorial sports as they used to. Not just the NHL, but you see it across all major pro sports. The hassle of so much extra security (not to mention some sporting events and concerts already being hit by terrorism/mass shootings the last few years), the increase of quality in peoples' man caves to watch games, the amount of sports bars with a great atmosphere, the cost to tickets, and pro sports itself starting to get stale as a Main Event....all plays a part. People are staying at home more often.

This. And people want to see winners. Not a winning hockey game or an exciting play, they want the brand of winning, they want to see greatness, they want to feel a part of something solid, consistent and reliable.

 

[Sensung]

If this is true, then the opposite is true as well.

Forbes is the best evidence we have, although I agree it is far from rock solid.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

Look where we were in 2014 when we still wouldn’t spend.

Toronto Maple Leafs most expensive ticket in NHL; all teams listed 1 to 30 | The Hockey News

And even if attendance was papered, we were in the top half of the league
In profits.

Were you one of those that bought into his whole “You’ll see, I’ll spend soon. Trust me!” scam?

Those prices, in the article you linked, are re-sale prices, so hardly relevant.

Where did you find the "top half of the league in profits" numbers ??

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

Forbes is the best evidence we have, although I agree it is far from rock solid.

So when you posted

Their is ZERO evidence the Franchise (arena included) is losing MONEY.

Saying there is zero evidence the Senators & the CTC are losing money, you agree there is zero evidence they're making money, other than the unreliable Forbes reports?

 

[BankStreetParade]

Hilarious how this thread about a movement started by hardcore Sens fans that are frustrated by the owner is mostly filled with shil- I mean pro-Melnyk posters dead intent on putting the blame on them instead.

Shills, huh? What an interesting point of view.

Despite the evidence presented, we're shills?

This team is still laden with debt (even according to Forbes who says the debt/value ratio is about 29%).
Cyril Leeder and Erin Crowe (CFO) have both said that the Senators have lost $94 million in a decade.
There have been $60 million in renovations in the last several years.
The Senators continue to be the cheapest Canadian ticket in the NHL, by far.
The Senators continue to be the lowest attended Canadian team of the last few years (coincidentally as soon as ticket giveaways ended).
A new arena is being built, which needs unimaginable amounts of financing, to give fans the location they deserve and to make Ottawa a more complete draw for game-day attendance and experience.
The Canadian dollar hasn't been close to par since 2013 and continues to languish today barely touching the 80-cent mark.

And then there's the fact that no one has an explanation for this ludicrous conspiracy that Melnyk has been hamstringing his own f***ing investment for the last 15 years just so he could reduce the f***ing payroll in 2018?

Three different owners of the team have said the finances didn't add up culminating in a sale of the team out of bankruptcy protection. But we're supposedly the shills because we don't believe that this team is making money hand over fist.

If we're shills, what does that make you guys?

 

[slamigo]

Last time I will post in this thread because folks are just too polarized and unwilling to look at the situation objectively.

I believe in any situation that it’s better to seek a positive approach than a negative one. Spending money to vilify Melnyk is just an angry and churlish response. I understand the anger but acting on anger never solves a problem. Ever.

I think a #resignEk65 would have done more good and would have represented what most fans are actually worried about at present.

Also, I personally cannot summon the depths of feeling that some folks on here are experiencing.

For me, the Sens are just a hockey team owned by a stranger and composed entirely of strangers. I will never know any of them personally. I save real emotions for those close to me. NHL hockey is just another form of entertainment. It’s simply a business that wants my money.