Speculation: Matthew's happy with contract progress

[GoonieFace]

It is a guess about Mathews. Marner is not s guess it was reported on by many that his agent said 9m per on a 8 year deal and Dubas said it was to high!

I would like to see this

 

[Throw More Waffles]

I would say that agents would view it as I got commission on 41.77 million dollars. Not 45....

So why isn’t it ever listed that way for Trouba and Lindholm?

 

[diceman934]

So why isn’t it ever listed that way for Trouba and Lindholm?

Because it is only twisted on here to suit the people who want to push an agenda that Willy is not that overpaid.,

 

[Golden_Jet]

It’s 7.5 and that’s how agents will compare, we don’t do any funky math for other players contracts who miss time. The NHL doesn’t do it like that.

Using the 41.78 logic, then it’s not over 6 years it’s over 5 and 2/3 years

 

[sessiroth]

Just give them the toews/Kane bridge deals relative to the current cap.

 

[57 Years No Cup]

So your telling me that he signed a deal that stated he is going to get 41.77 over 6 years. Now who is lying.
He sign a deal with the total amount of salary and bonus money that added up to 45m over 6 years. Then the amount of his salary that he missed out on getting paid for because he had not signed yet was subtracted from the 45m and the remainder was then divided by 6 to get an cap hit of 6.96

Had the 41.77 been his contracted amont over 6 years his cap hit would have been around 6.4per as he still would not have earned the full money of his salary on his first year.

Fact his contract states 45m over 6 years. His actual payout is 41.66 as deducted from his salary is the amount he did not earn as he did not play.

Done with this conversation and math class is over.

You're wasting your time with this guy. His Sportsnet link trumps all!

 

[MyBudJT]

He signed a 6 year 41.77 million contract. That’s what they agreed to. He doesn’t get 45 million never did.

That’s the money. Is it officially listed on cap friendly? Are we counting that as official?

I'm pretty sure Capfriendly is up-to-date by now.

Nylander gets paid in two forms... Bonuses and Salary
He gets 24.3M in signing bonuses
Yrs 2-6, he gets 10.7M in base salary
Yr 1 he gets a fraction of 10M in base salary, since missing a chunk of the season. I forget what the fraction is, its something like 121/182... Which would be approximately ~ 6.65 mil in takehome this season.

so approximately 42M rather than 45M.

 

[nuck]

Um kucherov is a winger..there's no state tax in Tampa so he makes exactly what his contract says. And that was 2yrs ago now cap has gone up every year so it's about % of cap

I was actually thinking of Marner not Matthews. Kucherov's deal was signed in July 2018 after the Cap was announced and kicks in next year, same as Mitch's contract would. He gave up 6 UFA years where Mitch can max give up 5. Kuch scored his 100pts in a year where scoring was 10% lower than this season. Two assists per goal so we can argue the worth of a primary assist but apples are not 1 for 1 to goals and Kucherov's last two years he scored 79 where Mitch will hit 55 at best. Tampa's tax situation is better but the other factors do not support Kucherov money for Mitch, especially if he is only doing 5 or 6 years.

Of course I have no faith in the above arguments based on the deal Willie was able to get. Just venting.

 

[ToneDog]

Ok. Holl has played less than 2 games. Horton hasn’t played in years.

The total value is 41.77. That’s what the agent gets commission on. That’s what the taxman collects on.

Would you feel better about yourself if your boss wrote an imaginary number on your paycheque?

If I am making 50K/per year but take a 6 month sabbatical I only get paid $25K for the year but when somebody asks me how much I earn per year I say $50K.

Pretty sure when Willie's next contract comes up he will say he made $7.5M on his last deal. This number was key for the Nylander camp and 7 AAV was key for the Leafs.

 

[Legion34]

So your telling me that he signed a deal that stated he is going to get 41.77 over 6 years. Now who is lying.
He sign a desk with the total amount of salary and bonus money that added up to 45m over 6 years. Then the amount of his salary that he missed out on getting paid for because he had not signed yet was subtracted from the 45m and the remainder was then divided by 6 to get an cap hit of 6.96

Had the 41.77 been his contracted amont over 6 years his cap hit would have been around 6.4per as he still would not have earned the full money of his salary on his first year.

Fact his contract states 45m over 6 years. His actual payout is 41.66 as deducted from his salary is the amount he did not earn as he did not play.

Done with this conversation and math class is over.

First typing Lying was harsh. It was a throwaway sentence. I didn’t even realize I typed it when I responded the first time. That’s my mistake. I meant skewing the numbers in a negative light to compare Marner and Nylander.

Even so.

You don’t know what his contract says. You know what cap friendly list it as when they even say it is pro rated throughout the year. That’s not official.

All official word is that he signed a 41.77 total contract. That’s the number.


Your argument doesn’t work going backwards. Say marleau decides to retire with 28’games left in the season

He got paid a signing bonus in full. Plus whatever he got paid. So does that mean that his contract increases so that he really signed a 3’year 22 million dollar contract?
He got paid more for this year than
The games he played... or is it ok for him
To get paid in full for missing parts of the season?

The contract is the total value/years. That’s it. The cap penalties etc do not affect the real world.

 

[ToneDog]

Just give them the toews/Kane bridge deals relative to the current cap.

Ans how much would that be ?

 

[Legion34]

If I am making 50K/per year but take a 6 month sabbatical I only get paid $25K for the year but when somebody asks me how much I earn per year I say $50K.

Pretty sure when Willie's next contract comes up he will say he made $7.5M on his last deal. This number was key for the Nylander camp and 7 AAV was key for the Leafs.

You can say you make all you want. Doesn’t put food on the table.

Think it through backwards. Say a player retires halfway through the year after a signing bonus is paid.

He got paid more than the amount for that year. Does the value of the contract now change? Doesnthe leafs cap hit go up mid season? It’s the same thing.

Say marleau retires after game one next year. He got paid 3 million dollars plus one games wage for 1 game.

Does his contract now change?
Do the leafs get charged 240 million dollars as a cap hit?

No. He signed a 3 year 18.5 million dollar contract
Does marleau retire and say he made 250 million dollars in his last year? I don’t think so.

Imagine he gets divorced. Is he listing his earnings as 240 million dollars?

Nylander signed a 6 year 41.77 million contract.

 

[diceman934]

You're wasting your time with this guy. His Sportsnet link trumps all!

Lol yes I ignored that link as he called Cap friendly not an official site and then proceeded to post a sports net link as his proof. Priceless.

 

[Golden_Jet]

5.6 years not 6 years if you want to use 42 million

 

[diceman934]

You can say you make all you want. Doesn’t put food on the table.

Think it through backwards. Say a player retires halfway through the year after a signing bonus is paid.

He got paid more than the amount for that year. Does the value of the contract now change? Doesnthe leafs cap hit go up mid season? It’s the same thing.

Say marleau retires after game one next year. He got paid 3 million dollars plus one games wage for 1 game.

Does his contract now change?
Do the leafs get charged 240 million dollars as a cap hit?

No. He signed a 3 year 18.5 million dollar contract
Does marleau retire and say he made 250 million dollars in his last year? I don’t think so.

Imagine he gets divorced. Is he listing his earnings as 240 million dollars?

Nylander signed a 6 year 41.77 million contract.

Nylander did not sign a 6 year deal. He signed for 5 2/3 year contract. Now do the math and it is a 7.5 per year contract.

 

[zeke]

Fact. He is getting paid 7.5m per. Look st cap friendly. The spin is the cap hit because he missed 3 months of the season. You do not come to work you do not get paid. His 7.5 m this year was prorated and spread over the term of his contract to reduce the cap hit to 6.96m.

he gets paid $7m per year in actual money.

his caphit is $7m per year.

saying $7.5m just makes you sound silly.

 

[zeke]

I had 6.5-8-10.5 Pretty similar.



Is AAV is 7.5 over 6 years on average. I don't think it's silly at all that an agent will argue that. He only receives 7 because he sat out 25% of a year.

Again, were talking agent mode....... not rationally. I said an agent will ARGUE he gets 7.5, I still believe that.

his take home pay is $42m over 6yrs.

Marner's agent can't make up meaningless numbers to change reality.

 

[Slot]

It's murkier than all that too because most of his money is up front. As of July 2 this year he will have been paid nearly 40% of his contract value. Meaning that he's going to get paid a lot less than his AAV going forward.

 

[zeke]

Arguable.

He was signed for 7.5x6. But HE chose to sit out for two months of his contract and not get paid for it, which affected the cap hit.

I just looked up articles on the Trouba and Lindholm signings. As far as I could find, they just list total money and term (which in Nylander case would be 6 years, $45 million). Nylander seems to be the exception, where I’m guessing the leafs pr team pushed really hard to focus on aav, and not total contract value.

When other agents use Nylander as a comparable, will they cite just his year 2-6 aav? Or will they cite his term/ value (6 years/$45 million)?

Willy is getting $42m in actual money.

his caphit is $7m.

this isn't complicated.

 

[zeke]

Your not giving a straight answer but your basically saying willy at $7m over 6 years is just as good as $7m over 8 years?

I mean pretty much yeah. I don't know what happens in 6yrs. Maybe we're happy it's only 6yrs in the end.

the caphit is by far the biggest concern.

3yrs would be a different story....but 6, 7, or 8? can't find myself caring too much. things will all look much different then.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Willy is getting $42m in actual money.

his caphit is $7m.

this isn't complicated.

According to these guys, his cap hit for this season is $10,277,778, then falls to $6,962,366 for remaining years. Total cap hit for the 6 years is $45,089,608.

William Nylander - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

 

[2022 Stanley Cup]

I was actually thinking of Marner not Matthews. Kucherov's deal was signed in July 2018 after the Cap was announced and kicks in next year, same as Mitch's contract would. He gave up 6 UFA years where Mitch can max give up 5. Kuch scored his 100pts in a year where scoring was 10% lower than this season. Two assists per goal so we can argue the worth of a primary assist but apples are not 1 for 1 to goals and Kucherov's last two years he scored 79 where Mitch will hit 55 at best. Tampa's tax situation is better but the other factors do not support Kucherov money for Mitch, especially if he is only doing 5 or 6 years.

Of course I have no faith in the above arguments based on the deal Willie was able to get. Just venting.

Marner is the only one of the big 3 that we drafter that I imagine is not aiming to bleed the leafs dry. If Marner has realistic expectations of value to production than his salary should be coming in just over 8M/season. A lot is going to be left to length of contract/stubbornness of Marner and his agent. If Marner makes close to Kuch then something is wrong.

 

[zeke]

According to these guys, his cap hit for this season is $10,277,778, then falls to $6,962,366 for remaining years. Total cap hit for the 6 years is $45,089,608.

William Nylander - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

I wish we could make it $15m this year and lower it even more in other years.

but it doesn't make a difference in reality.

Willy is getting paid $42m on a 6yr deal in real money. his caphit for all the years that matter is $7m. using any other number is just silly spin.

 

[Babcocks Marner]

his take home pay is $42m over 6yrs.

Marner's agent can't make up meaningless numbers to change reality.

Yes we all know that.



............................................................................ Because he missed 1/3rd of a season.

So you want to tell player "B" that it's really just meaningless but you expect player "B" to work 3 months longer?

It's not meaningless at all that Nylander sat out.

If a player was 100% a Nylander clone in every sense was up for RFA, and he came in and wanted 7.5 would you say no? Because his clone is paid 7 after sitting out?

 

[Gary Nylund]

I wish we could make it $15m this year and lower it even more in other years.

but it doesn't make a difference in reality.

Willy is getting paid $42m on a 6yr deal in real money. his caphit for all the years that matter is $7m. using any other number is just silly spin.

I was responding to your post where you gave the incorrect figure for his cap hit. If you meant instead his cap hit for "the years that matter", then you should have said so.

Using the correct number isn't "silly spin", it's just ... correct.