Value of: Matt Murray

[BHD]

Everything on this entire site is speculation...., kinda what drives this site.

My post was more in response to those talking like certain things were a foregone conclusion.

 

[NickLidstrom]

Jones hadn't backstopped a team to a Stanley Cup. Given what he's accomplished AND the Pens' situation (win now), he would probably cost more.

Boston also didn't NEED to trade him. Pittsburgh has to get rid of a goalie before the trade deadline.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Boston also didn't NEED to trade him. Pittsburgh has to get rid of a goalie before the trade deadline.

No they don't, that's just not true. The Pens don't need to trade Murray for pennies on the dollar, they'll either trade Murray for an obscene price or trade Fleury for a discounted price.

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

We had other problems in our series, but our odds of making the SCF would have been so much better playing against MAF for the whole ECF.

The Penguins need to keep Murray.

 

[BHD]

Boston also didn't NEED to trade him.

And Pittsburgh doesn't NEED to trade Murray.

Pittsburgh has to get rid of a goalie before the trade deadline.

This much is true.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

I don't think Derrick Pouliot being a top 4 defenseman is an entirely safe assumption at this point. I don't think the Penguins currently have an ideal player to take over 2RD next year. Honestly I don't think it's possible to convince me otherwise. If I'm wrong, so be it; just let me wallow in my supposed ignorance.

And Honka being a top four defenseman is an entirely safe assumption at this point? They're both unproven prospects with relatively high ceilings.

The fact you think Honka's any more of a sure thing than Pouliot suggests you're doing so because Honka's your team's prospect and Pouliot isn't.

Again, I think it's a Murray thing and not a position thing. I think if someone was to offer up a right handed defenseman for Fluery for instance, I think it would probably be pretty well received.

Of course it would, because (most) Pens fans want Murray to be their goalie and are hoping the organization trades Fleury. So of course the reception to a "lower" price would be more positively received by Pens fans.

But that's kind of irrelevant to the discussion about whether Honka's a good enough upgrade over Pouliot, or a good enough return for Matt Murray. He's not, and he's not.

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

Yes, I believe Julius Honka will have a better career than Derrick Pouliot.

 

[Cotton]

Mitch Marner?

 

[NickLidstrom]

And Pittsburgh doesn't NEED to trade Murray.



This much is true.

I'm not saying they need to trade Murray, but other teams see the situation Pittsburgh is in and would be foolish not to use it in negotiations,whether its for MAF or Murray.

No they don't, that's just not true. The Pens don't need to trade Murray for pennies on the dollar, they'll either trade Murray for an obscene price or trade Fleury for a discounted price.

I never said they have to trade Murray. I said they have to get rid of a goalie. You saying trading MAF is an option is you agreeing with me.

 

[airbus220]

Mitch Marner?

It's sad, the Leafs kicked themselves out of the race to take advantage of the goalie market.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'm not saying they need to trade Murray, but other teams see the situation Pittsburgh is in and would be foolish not to use it in negotiations,whether its for MAF or Murray.

And if someone tries to tell the Penguins that, they'll just hang up the phone on them. They're targeting the wrong goalie if they're trying to lowball for Murray.

I never said they have to trade Murray. I said they have to get rid of a goalie. You saying trading MAF is an option is you agreeing with me.

I meant they don't need to trade one by the deadline, they could trade one after the playoffs are done.

 

[NeedleInTheHay]

Vegas has to draft an avg cap hit of 1.46M per player to reach the 60% and the max avg cap hit is 2.43M. Why should Vegas waste 5.75M on a goalie when goalies are the least problem they have. Fleury wasn't even better than Johnson in Buffalo. Buy him out and enjoy his cap hit for 4 years.

Cmon now, you really don't believe that.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Yes, I believe Julius Honka will have a better career than Derrick Pouliot.

Based on? You're not exactly presenting any sort of evidence or argument other than simply stating "because I think so".

 

[Son Goku]

Mitch Marner?

Man I'd have to think long and hard about that.

 

[airbus220]

Cmon now, you really don't believe that.

EVsave% .927 cap hit 5.75M birth 841128 Fleury
EVsave% .926 cap hit 1.30M birth 860610 Johnson

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

Based on? You're not exactly presenting any sort of evidence or argument other than simply stating "because I think so".

Okay, last post in the thread for me.

You know sometimes how you make a claim that seems so entirely obvious that you don't feel the need to justify it? This is one of those times.

But I'll be sure to watch Pouliot closely this year, hopefully he isn't healthy scratched so often again this year.

Have a good one.

 

[NeedleInTheHay]

EVsave% .927 cap hit 5.75M birth 841128 Fleury
EVsave% .926 cap hit 1.30M birth 860610 Johnson

So you judge a player completely off of one single stat, not even all stats for a season, just one stat?

You think that's a good way to compare players? That we should ignore their entire body of work? That should we rank players based off of one stat from one single season?

 

[SEALBound]

Hilariously, before Murray became a big deal, I offered him to Toronto for Komarov and the majority of Leafs fans said no way. Lol.

I'd want a mid-high first and a blue chip LW with speed.

I think Murray has proved himself enough to be worth that.

 

[NeedleInTheHay]

Okay, last post in the thread for me.

You know sometimes how you make a claim that seems so entirely obvious that you don't feel the need to justify it? This is one of those times.

But I'll be sure to watch Pouliot closely this year, hopefully he isn't healthy scratched so often again this year.

Have a good one.

It's obvious that a player drafted 14th overall with zero NHL games under his belt is better than a player drafted 8th overall that's already played in the NHL playoffs?

 

[Empoleon8771]

It's obvious that a player drafted 14th overall with zero NHL games under his belt is better than a player drafted 8th overall that's already played in the NHL playoffs?

Exactly, and even if you'd pull the "Pouliot was drafted too high" card, it doesn't matter because Pouliot would have most likely been taken around 12th overall at latest. I don't see any sort of big difference between them, and especially not to the "it's so obvious" point either.

 

[Paulie Gualtieri]

Boston also didn't NEED to trade him. Pittsburgh has to get rid of a goalie before the trade deadline.

If plenty of teams would be interested, which they very much would be, I doubt it matters that we would be in a pressured situation. The bidding war would drive the price up.

 

[airbus220]

So you judge a player completely off of one single stat, not even all stats for a season, just one stat?

You think that's a good way to compare players? That we should ignore their entire body of work? That should we rank players based off of one stat from one single season?

I said Johnson in Buffalo, he was there only last season.
Fleury with a cap hit more than 4 times than Johnson's should be better on paper in EVsave% and not the same.
Could be Johnson had a good season and Fleury a bad season, but still I wouldn't want Fleury, wasted money.
And to be on topic, if I were McPhee and Fleury were exposed, I wouldn't draft him.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Okay, last post in the thread for me.

You know sometimes how you make a claim that seems so entirely obvious that you don't feel the need to justify it? This is one of those times.

Actually, this isn't one of those times.

Asking you "do you honestly think Jamie Benn is better than Chris Kunitz" would be an example of one of those times. Or asking you "do you honestly think John Klingberg is more of a proven top four defenseman than Justin Schultz" would be another example of one of those times.

But we're talking about two offensive defensemen prospects, neither of which has solidified themselves as NHL regulars yet.

But I'll be sure to watch Pouliot closely this year, hopefully he isn't healthy scratched so often again this year.

Have a good one.

Hopefully Honka plays in the NHL this year and not on the farm so I can see just how super awesome he apparently is.

 

[McSuper]

Yakupov + picks or Anton Slepyshev + Bogdan Yakimov or mix them around how you see fit . Might have to include the monster as a back up .


Edit . I am forgetting about expansion and we would lose him so scrap that offer . I am trying to build up the Oilers and not worry about expansion but this would cost us Murray or Talbot . Love to have both we would have a solid tandem for years to come

 

[Empoleon8771]

Yakupov + picks or Anton Slepyshev + Bogdan Yakimov or mix them around how you see fit . Might have to include the monster as a back up .


Edit . I am forgetting about expansion and we would lose him so scrap that offer . I am trying to build up the Oilers and not worry about expansion but this would cost us Murray or Talbot . Love to have both we would have a solid tandem for years to come

Implying that the Penguins would even remotely consider that offer

Yeah, Murray will cost the Oilers Draisaitl if they wanted him, but like you said, I don't know why they would want him. Talbot is a starter.