Marner vs Rantanen

[VoluntaryDom]

Just like how you discredit Rantanen every chance you get despite the actual data points?

yes the actual 2nd line production at 5v5

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

yes the actual 2nd line production at 5v5

When you use literally one stat to define a player

 

[avsfan09]

marner with 77% better 5v5 primary production this year but yeah its so close

Oh yeah well Rantanen with 64% better Playoff production.
Also I think you mean 23% right? But yeah 77 is close to 23.

 

[Mac2Rants]

Oh yeah well Rantanen with 64% better Playoff production.
Also I think you mean 23% right? But yeah 77 is close to 23.

Lmao I was thinking that myself I just got back rom work and if were talking just EVSP's Marner had 35% more EVSP

 

[LeafsOHLRangers98]

Leafs fan saying Rantanen. Not even close really.

 

[Mac2Rants]

yes the actual 2nd line production at 5v5

You sure you're even in highschool? if you are I suggest moving here to NS, Canada Very good education system.

 

[teravaineSAROS]

Can’t go wrong with either but I’ll stick with Marner

Why'd you vote as a "neutral fan" though?

 

[ijuka]

yes the actual 2nd line production at 5v5

What? He ranks #32 in NHL in even strength points even in the regular season. There are 93 1st liner forwards in NHL. Some players he beat in Even strength points include:
Auston Matthews
Matthew Tkachuk
Tyler Seguin
Evgeny Kuznetsov
Nicklas Backstrom

These are 2nd liners? In the playoffs, Rantanen is only behind Pacioretty and Stone, tied with 2 others who have played more games.

Then let's also make the point that PP goals are worth the same as ES goals, and also the point that the best PP producers in NHL tend to be extremely good players. PP success also heavily correlates into team success, so power play scoring is useful.

 

[missionAvs]

Avs fan voting too close to call but we're happy with our large assed Fin.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

Oh yeah well Rantanen with 64% better Playoff production.
Also I think you mean 23% right? But yeah 77 is close to 23.

uhhhhh

marners 2.57 p1/60 is 77% more than rantanens 1.45. by raw 5v5 p1, marner's 52 is 85% more than rantanen's 28 (though that is a bit unfair to mikko as rantanen played less games)

 

[VoluntaryDom]

What? He ranks #32 in NHL in even strength points even in the regular season. There are 93 1st liner forwards in NHL. Some players he beat in Even strength points include:
Auston Matthews
Matthew Tkachuk
Tyler Seguin
Evgeny Kuznetsov
Nicklas Backstrom

These are 2nd liners? In the playoffs, Rantanen is only behind Pacioretty and Stone, tied with 2 others who have played more games.

Then let's also make the point that PP goals are worth the same as ES goals, and also the point that the best PP producers in NHL tend to be extremely good players. PP success also heavily correlates into team success, so power play scoring is useful.

he was t-69th in 5v5 p1 this year. marner? 1st.

in p1/60 among guys with 500 mins, he was 122nd. so 2nd line is pretty accurate for him. he was behind such star players as jimmy vesey, oskar sundqvist, daniel sprong, dominik kahun, and casey cizikas. now tbf OSR's numbs are a bit weird since guys split time with different teams are counted separately but even so thats not enough to boost rantanen more than a few spots.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

Lmao I was thinking that myself I just got back rom work and if were talking just EVSP's Marner had 35% more EVSP

i was talking 5v5 primary production. marner 85% more 5v5 primary pts and 77% higher rate of said pts.

 

[avsfan09]

uhhhhh

marners 2.57 p1/60 is 77% more than rantanens 1.45. by raw 5v5 p1, marner's 52 is 85% more than rantanen's 28 (though that is a bit unfair to mikko as rantanen played less games)

Ahh you're using p1/60. Well that settles it than. Too bad I couldn't find an obscure stat to support my argument. You do know that Marners points don't go up linearly with more ice time and Babcock likely used him in a more offensive role and got him away from top competition moreso than Rantanen?

Ev strength pts
Marner-70
Rantanen-54
So 16 pts difference and Marner played 8 more games and likely less quality comp. You're picking and choosing stats. 54 pts is not 2nd line production at ev strength its 2nd line production in all situations.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

Ahh you're using p1/60. Well that settles it than. Too bad I couldn't find an obscure stat to support my argument. You do know that Marners points don't go up linearly with more ice time and Babcock likely used him in a more offensive role and got him away from top competition moreso than Rantanen?

Ev strength pts
Marner-70
Rantanen-54
So 16 pts difference and Marner played 8 more games and likely less quality comp. You're picking and choosing stats. 54 pts is not 2nd line production at ev strength its 2nd line production in all situations.

actually marner played against significantly tougher than league avg competition

 

[VoluntaryDom]

View attachment 222743
actually marner played against significantly tougher than league avg competition

rantanen similar (sligtly easier) competition to marner

 

[Bear of Bad News]

You can crop the photo. MS-Paint will do it for you.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

marner also significantly better on ice numbs. and in terms of linemates, i would argue they had pretty similar linemates, rantanen probably better ones.

 

[avsfan09]

View attachment 222747
rantanen similar (sligtly easier) competition to marner

I can't read those at all on my phone. Are they fwds or defense pairings. Also does it take into account offensive/defensive starts?

 

[Fugazy]

Rantanen.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

I can't read those at all on my phone. Are they fwds or defense pairings. Also does it take into account offensive/defensive starts?

1. basically, in terms of forwards, marner plays noticeably more than average against forward number 1-3 of the opponent while its only really noticeable for forward 1. marner noticeably more against top 2 dmen and rantanen against top 3. thats what those images i sent mean at least in terms of qoc
2. no but marner had 34% o zone start % to rantanens 41%. also i dont think zone starts matter that much but thats besides the point

 

[NOTENOUGHJTCGOALS]

Is Mitch Marner the most productive player since he joined the league?

How does he compare to McDavid or Eichel? Those are his competition. Not second rate finlenders

 

[ijuka]

View attachment 222747
rantanen similar (sligtly easier) competition to marner

Someone actually uses print screen instead of the screen cap tool in this day and age? Come on.

 

[Mildan]

They are not even remotely close. Another sad poll in AINEC territory.

Marner is way better 5 on 5 and overall. Rantanen is lucky his team gets a lot of PPs.

why you voted marner as a neutral fan?

 

[sadpanda]

Is Mitch Marner the most productive player since he joined the league?

How does he compare to McDavid or Eichel? Those are his competition. Not second rate finlenders

Must be the best. With 2 60 point seasons and one 90

 

[Byron Bitz]

Too close to call, they will get identical deals around 9-10 mill