Mark Scheifele potential

[Grind]

1) That was just for comparison sake, I don't believe Burmi has capped out as he shows promising signs, but is widely inconsistent. Burmi is light years ahead of Scheifele IMO.

2) That's not what I meant and you know it. His play was inconsistent, he was shaky at times (albeit some of it nerves), and he looked out of place. Not sure why you bust my balls for an opinion, I don't think he'll make it.

3) It's no secret that I think the Jets wasted the pick. But either way if he proves me wrong, great, if he does become an AHLer also great because then we have reliable depth that can be called up. Maybe he cracks the roster eventually, just not yet.

FWIW we all know how reliable stats are, doesn't mean they are the end all be all. Only time will tell with Scheifele. But I can guarantee if he doesn't make the team this year and is sent to the Rock people will be *****ing and moaning about it. If he does make the Jets and doesn't live up to potential, people will still ***** and moan about it.

I'd prefer that he start in the Rock and slowly make his way up so he doesn't crash and burn and can prove me wrong.

If you post an opinion based on flimsy logic, zero quantifiable evidence,, and a conclusion that flies in the face of what (almost) every professional and regular joe believes to be correct, you best bet your going to get your balls busted.


In all your complaining about scheifele you've never actually presented a reasonable argument besides "i just think this because everyone else thinks the opposite"


really hard to take that seriously.

 

[Hank Chinaski]

1) That was just for comparison sake, I don't believe Burmi has capped out as he shows promising signs, but is widely inconsistent. Burmi is light years ahead of Scheifele IMO.

Now I'm just confused. You said Scheifele's ceiling was "a Burmi type player ceiling of 3C", yet at the same time you're saying you think Burmi will improve?

So what do you think Scheifele's ceiling is? You may be the first person I've ever heard saying the best possible thing he can aspire to is a 3rd line C.

2) That's not what I meant and you know it. His play was inconsistent, he was shaky at times (albeit some of it nerves), and he looked out of place. Not sure why you bust my balls for an opinion, I don't think he'll make it.

I'm not busting your balls, I just have no clue where you're getting these opinions. You've somehow judged based on his 11 NHL games that he'll be no better than a 3rd line C and likely a career AHLer? Again, clarification would help.

Saying it's an opinion is fine. If you don't have some sort of logic and evidence to back it up, people aren't allowed to call you on it? I can say "the moon is made of green cheese, that's my opinion", doesn't make exempt me from being told I'm wrong.

3) It's no secret that I think the Jets wasted the pick. But either way if he proves me wrong, great, if he does become an AHLer also great because then we have reliable depth that can be called up. Maybe he cracks the roster eventually, just not yet.

FWIW we all know how reliable stats are, doesn't mean they are the end all be all. Only time will tell with Scheifele. But I can guarantee if he doesn't make the team this year and is sent to the Rock people will be *****ing and moaning about it. If he does make the Jets and doesn't live up to potential, people will still ***** and moan about it.

I'd prefer that he start in the Rock and slowly make his way up so he doesn't crash and burn and can prove me wrong.

Starting his year in St. John's =/= career AHLer. If Scheifele's fate is as a career AHL depth player a la Gagnon, then saying the Jets wasted the pick is a gross understatement.

I'll wait until training camp and the preseason to make a full judgment, but I really don't see him being sent to St. John's. I felt he was ready for the NHL this year and deserved to be integrated into the top 6 gradually. I will be beyond frustrated if he's still getting the 4th line treatment next season and told to pack his bags for St. John's because he's not producing on a line with Chris Thorburn and some waiver wire scrub.

 

[ps241]

i look at his tool box and see a second line centre, but i look at his numbers and hope for a first line centre.....its definitely the million dollar question....what will he become?

playing against every day OHL teenagers and he is a star....put him in against better competition and he fades away.

i feel bad for him because there is so much pressure...he has a 90% chance of not meeting expectations just because he was first, he was a surprise pick and he stayed in the OHL and put up big numbers, whetting everyone's appetite.

i would love it if he could play with Kane on the second line....and Chevy went out and got us a strong right wing free agent to complete the line.....or an awesome waiver pick up.

it will be very interesting...couturier is basically putting up burmistrov numbers, who everyone thinks is a bust....and scheifele is killing it against kids.....which path was best?.....who is ahead?...who is behind?....it will be fun to watch in the end.....

one thing is scheifele is a great kid.....hard not to love him...

Yea it will be interesting to see Peter.....Sean took the fast track but this season has been a setback for him and despite some time on the 2nd PP unit he doesn't make it look easy when it comes to offense and some of the luster has worn off even on the Flyers board. I still think Sean (and Burmi) will find a way to produce offensively one day but this debate is just getting warmed up.

I look at Mark as a late bloomer physically with a very slick skill set that will transfer well to the NHL when his body fills out properly. Mark is unique for a high draft pick in that he took the slow path to the OHL (almost didn't make it) but when he got there he exceeded expectations as a rookie on a terrible team and put up very respectable numbers and ended up being a kid who shot up on draft day. Since then he has done everything the organization has asked from him and is progression has been great. He has rounded into a more complete two way player and his production rates have been exceptional all while keeping a good attitude despite some setbacks (not sticking with the parent club).

Mark has a few things going for him that I think will lead to success at an NHL level. He is 6'3" and has a decent frame and it is going to fill out one day soon and you can't fake size. Mark's work ethic and attitude are a 10 out of 10 and it seems like it is easy to knock him over but impossible to keep him down. Many elite junior players were always the star and dominated and didn't have to get their chin tested until they made it to the NHL and then once they took the hit mentally they were not able to fight through it. Mark is the opposite, everything has been a fight and he has taken allot of hard knocks but he does not know how to quit. His compete level is inordinately high and his mind is hard wired to fight through tough challenges. Also Mark has something that we are missing.....It seems like our Jets can beat you with speed and skill (Wheels, Kane, Little, etc) but we are a bit more challenged when the pace slows down. We don't seem to have as many naturally dangerous opportunists that know how to get to the soft areas and get the easy looking goals like Mark can. Make no mistake Mark is going to be facing much better goaltending, much tougher checking, and much higher talent levels but I sense he is going to be one of the more natural point producers on our team. It might not look pretty with Mark but I sense when his body adapts his combination of natural vision, hockey IQ, and his dangerous shot are going to lead to points.


I believe Mark will continue to do what he has always done and exceed expectations in the NHL (although it might take 2 seasons). IMO in his prime Mark’s ceiling could be a top 20 NHL point producer……floor is a 3rd line two way centre.

As you said Peter he is a great kid and it’s hard not to love him......maybe it is clouding my judgment.

 

[roosemoose]

Second line center for sure but would like to see him in that top spot, don't rush this guy because there is far too much upside to him.

 

[sully1410]

Mark Scheifele > Wayne Gretzky....

AINEC.

 

[Scheifele]

Mark Scheifele > Wayne Gretzky....

AINEC.

This


But seriously, hoping for 1st line Center to play with Kane, doesn't need to be Crosby.

 

[surixon]

Yea it will be interesting to see Peter.....Sean took the fast track but this season has been a setback for him and despite some time on the 2nd PP unit he doesn't make it look easy when it comes to offense and some of the luster has worn off even on the Flyers board. I still think Sean (and Burmi) will find a way to produce offensively one day but this debate is just getting warmed up.

I look at Mark as a late bloomer physically with a very slick skill set that will transfer well to the NHL when his body fills out properly. Mark is unique for a high draft pick in that he took the slow path to the OHL (almost didn't make it) but when he got there he exceeded expectations as a rookie on a terrible team and put up very respectable numbers and ended up being a kid who shot up on draft day. Since then he has done everything the organization has asked from him and is progression has been great. He has rounded into a more complete two way player and his production rates have been exceptional all while keeping a good attitude despite some setbacks (not sticking with the parent club).

Mark has a few things going for him that I think will lead to success at an NHL level. He is 6'3" and has a decent frame and it is going to fill out one day soon and you can't fake size. Mark's work ethic and attitude are a 10 out of 10 and it seems like it is easy to knock him over but impossible to keep him down. Many elite junior players were always the star and dominated and didn't have to get their chin tested until they made it to the NHL and then once they took the hit mentally they were not able to fight through it. Mark is the opposite, everything has been a fight and he has taken allot of hard knocks but he does not know how to quit. His compete level is inordinately high and his mind is hard wired to fight through tough challenges. Also Mark has something that we are missing.....It seems like our Jets can beat you with speed and skill (Wheels, Kane, Little, etc) but we are a bit more challenged when the pace slows down. We don't seem to have as many naturally dangerous opportunists that know how to get to the soft areas and get the easy looking goals like Mark can. Make no mistake Mark is going to be facing much better goaltending, much tougher checking, and much higher talent levels but I sense he is going to be one of the more natural point producers on our team. It might not look pretty with Mark but I sense when his body adapts his combination of natural vision, hockey IQ, and his dangerous shot are going to lead to points.


I believe Mark will continue to do what he has always done and exceed expectations in the NHL (although it might take 2 seasons). IMO in his prime Mark’s ceiling could be a top 20 NHL point producer……floor is a 3rd line two way centre.

As you said Peter he is a great kid and it’s hard not to love him......maybe it is clouding my judgment.

Very well said!

 

[Zhamnov10]

People just have to remember everyone develops at different paces,you should have watched wheeler at marks age if you wanted to see a guy fall down a lot.Bottom line is Mark could step in and help us on the pp right now,but he may be a little overwhelmed 5 on 5.personally I think as long as jokinen is in the picture come next year mark will start in st.johns,same goes for Trouba for that matter

 

[Bob E]

People just have to remember everyone develops at different paces,you should have watched wheeler at marks age if you wanted to see a guy fall down a lot.Bottom line is Mark could step in and help us on the pp right now,but he may be a little overwhelmed 5 on 5.personally I think as long as jokinen is in the picture come next year mark will start in st.johns,same goes for Trouba for that matter

Jokinen is forcing Trouba to the minors too?

Damn you, jokinen, damn, damn, damn!!!

But, seriously, I agree. If Scheif and Trouba start in the minors its not the end of the world. What's important is where they are in their development 2 yrs down the road.

 

[GJF]

Yea it will be interesting to see Peter.....Sean took the fast track but this season has been a setback for him and despite some time on the 2nd PP unit he doesn't make it look easy when it comes to offense and some of the luster has worn off even on the Flyers board. I still think Sean (and Burmi) will find a way to produce offensively one day but this debate is just getting warmed up.

I look at Mark as a late bloomer physically with a very slick skill set that will transfer well to the NHL when his body fills out properly. Mark is unique for a high draft pick in that he took the slow path to the OHL (almost didn't make it) but when he got there he exceeded expectations as a rookie on a terrible team and put up very respectable numbers and ended up being a kid who shot up on draft day. Since then he has done everything the organization has asked from him and is progression has been great. He has rounded into a more complete two way player and his production rates have been exceptional all while keeping a good attitude despite some setbacks (not sticking with the parent club).

Mark has a few things going for him that I think will lead to success at an NHL level. He is 6'3" and has a decent frame and it is going to fill out one day soon and you can't fake size. Mark's work ethic and attitude are a 10 out of 10 and it seems like it is easy to knock him over but impossible to keep him down. Many elite junior players were always the star and dominated and didn't have to get their chin tested until they made it to the NHL and then once they took the hit mentally they were not able to fight through it. Mark is the opposite, everything has been a fight and he has taken allot of hard knocks but he does not know how to quit. His compete level is inordinately high and his mind is hard wired to fight through tough challenges. Also Mark has something that we are missing.....It seems like our Jets can beat you with speed and skill (Wheels, Kane, Little, etc) but we are a bit more challenged when the pace slows down. We don't seem to have as many naturally dangerous opportunists that know how to get to the soft areas and get the easy looking goals like Mark can. Make no mistake Mark is going to be facing much better goaltending, much tougher checking, and much higher talent levels but I sense he is going to be one of the more natural point producers on our team. It might not look pretty with Mark but I sense when his body adapts his combination of natural vision, hockey IQ, and his dangerous shot are going to lead to points.


I believe Mark will continue to do what he has always done and exceed expectations in the NHL (although it might take 2 seasons). IMO in his prime Mark’s ceiling could be a top 20 NHL point producer……floor is a 3rd line two way centre.

As you said Peter he is a great kid and it’s hard not to love him......maybe it is clouding my judgment.

This is exactly how I see Mark Scheifele.

Thank you for that.

 

[Conflicted Habs fan]

When his opportunity comes, ie playoffs, when half the team is injured and they have no choice to bring him in, he will produce as a first class Gretzky type goal scorer

 

[Gnova]

At very best he is a Burmi type player ceiling of 3C

Worst case he is an Antropov at 4C

Mark has a long way to go, he is lighting it up against kids, but really failed to stand out even the slightest bit when he played with the big club.

He may also become a career AHLer, and I'm okay with that, we need more depth at the Rock.

How is anyone taking this post seriously when he has put Antropov's ceiling as a 4th line center?

It's like getting into an arguement with a flat earther.

 

[YWGinYYZ]

How is anyone taking this post seriously when he has put Antropov's ceiling as a 4th line center?

It's like getting into an arguement with a flat earther.

I'm ignoring it, TBH. Everyone is entitled to their opinions. I've watched enough of Scheifele to be in vehement disagreement with that post, but I doubt my 0.02 would sway an opinion that differs so much from mine.

 

[Zhamnov10]

Yea it will be interesting to see Peter.....Sean took the fast track but this season has been a setback for him and despite some time on the 2nd PP unit he doesn't make it look easy when it comes to offense and some of the luster has worn off even on the Flyers board. I still think Sean (and Burmi) will find a way to produce offensively one day but this debate is just getting warmed up.

I look at Mark as a late bloomer physically with a very slick skill set that will transfer well to the NHL when his body fills out properly. Mark is unique for a high draft pick in that he took the slow path to the OHL (almost didn't make it) but when he got there he exceeded expectations as a rookie on a terrible team and put up very respectable numbers and ended up being a kid who shot up on draft day. Since then he has done everything the organization has asked from him and is progression has been great. He has rounded into a more complete two way player and his production rates have been exceptional all while keeping a good attitude despite some setbacks (not sticking with the parent club).

Mark has a few things going for him that I think will lead to success at an NHL level. He is 6'3" and has a decent frame and it is going to fill out one day soon and you can't fake size. Mark's work ethic and attitude are a 10 out of 10 and it seems like it is easy to knock him over but impossible to keep him down. Many elite junior players were always the star and dominated and didn't have to get their chin tested until they made it to the NHL and then once they took the hit mentally they were not able to fight through it. Mark is the opposite, everything has been a fight and he has taken allot of hard knocks but he does not know how to quit. His compete level is inordinately high and his mind is hard wired to fight through tough challenges. Also Mark has something that we are missing.....It seems like our Jets can beat you with speed and skill (Wheels, Kane, Little, etc) but we are a bit more challenged when the pace slows down. We don't seem to have as many naturally dangerous opportunists that know how to get to the soft areas and get the easy looking goals like Mark can. Make no mistake Mark is going to be facing much better goaltending, much tougher checking, and much higher talent levels but I sense he is going to be one of the more natural point producers on our team. It might not look pretty with Mark but I sense when his body adapts his combination of natural vision, hockey IQ, and his dangerous shot are going to lead to points.


I believe Mark will continue to do what he has always done and exceed expectations in the NHL (although it might take 2 seasons). IMO in his prime Mark’s ceiling could be a top 20 NHL point producer……floor is a 3rd line two way centre.

As you said Peter he is a great kid and it’s hard not to love him......maybe it is clouding my judgment.

Great post the only thing I would add is Mark seems like one of those players who takes some time to adapt to new surroundings probably why he barely made the OHL his Skating doesn't jump out and the high hockey iq game he plays is not always appreciated on first impressions I predict he heads to st.johns and struggles for the first ten games then will light fire and will be called up halfway through the season

 

[ajmidd12]

How is anyone taking this post seriously when he has put Antropov's ceiling as a 4th line center?

It's like getting into an arguement with a flat earther.

Actually I put Antropov where he is now. Not where he used to be.

I'm ignoring it, TBH. Everyone is entitled to their opinions. I've watched enough of Scheifele to be in vehement disagreement with that post, but I doubt my 0.02 would sway an opinion that differs so much from mine.

Yeah, you watched him in JUNIOR. Guess what Junior =/= NHL.

 

[HannuJ]

This summer, Scheifele has to work on two and a half things:

1. Speed
2. Putting on 10 lbs of muscle
2a. getting stronger on his skates (part of bulking up)

add a bit more speed (i.e. tinker with his stride and add more power to his skating) and make it more difficult to knock him off the puck (i.e. no more Scheifele Down! like we saw this year) and i see no way that he's a) not starting with the Jets b) not the 2nd line centre for Kane's line.

 

[Jesus Christ Horburn]

Ceiling: Jeff Carter
Floor: Brian Boyle

 

[Whileee]

I had a good look at Scheifele in last night's OHL playoff game; a few observations...

His skating looks fine, with decent straightaway speed and agility. He is a bit "light" on his skates and is not a physical player. But I think that won't be a big problem with his style of play. His game is more about finding gaps and wholes in the defense and exploiting them, rather than bulling his way around the offensive zone. It does suggest to me that he'll be more effective at C than RW.

In any case, his game isn't really based on speed. He is a very smart, positional player both defensively and offensively.

He has great hands and is very smart with the puck.

He has a very nice shot, and will be dangerous.

To be honest, he looked to have a bit more offensive upside than I first thought. He could be dynamite with a player like Kane (he plays with Camara now, who seems to have a bit of a similar game, but without the great speed).

 

[sully1410]

I had a good look at Scheifele in last night's OHL playoff game; a few observations...

His skating looks fine, with decent straightaway speed and agility. He is a bit "light" on his skates and is not a physical player. But I think that won't be a big problem with his style of play. His game is more about finding gaps and wholes in the defense and exploiting them, rather than bulling his way around the offensive zone. It does suggest to me that he'll be more effective at C than RW.

In any case, his game isn't really based on speed. He is a very smart, positional player both defensively and offensively.

He has great hands and is very smart with the puck.

He has a very nice shot, and will be dangerous.

To be honest, he looked to have a bit more offensive upside than I first thought. He could be dynamite with a player like Kane (he plays with Camara now, who seems to have a bit of a similar game, but without the great speed).

Great to hear. Thanks for the update.

 

[surixon]

I had a good look at Scheifele in last night's OHL playoff game; a few observations...

His skating looks fine, with decent straightaway speed and agility. He is a bit "light" on his skates and is not a physical player. But I think that won't be a big problem with his style of play. His game is more about finding gaps and wholes in the defense and exploiting them, rather than bulling his way around the offensive zone. It does suggest to me that he'll be more effective at C than RW.

In any case, his game isn't really based on speed. He is a very smart, positional player both defensively and offensively.

He has great hands and is very smart with the puck.

He has a very nice shot, and will be dangerous.

To be honest, he looked to have a bit more offensive upside than I first thought. He could be dynamite with a player like Kane (he plays with Camara now, who seems to have a bit of a similar game, but without the great speed).

I was very impressed with his game. His ability to slow the play down and pick apart the other team is something that we don't have. He really did look a lot like Thornton last night but with more willingness to put the puck on net.

Not worried about skating in the least, it was fine and like you said speed isn't his game. However when he adds the muscle and gets tougher on his skates he is going to be incredibly hard to contain.

 

[Whileee]

I was very impressed with his game. His ability to slow the play down and pick apart the other team is something that we don't have. He really did look a lot like Thornton last night but with more willingness to put the puck on net.

Not worried about skating in the least, it was fine and like you said speed isn't his game. However when he adds the muscle and gets tougher on his skates he is going to be incredibly hard to contain.

He looked to have advanced offensive instincts, and is very good with the puck. His shot is excellent. His assist to Hall on Barrie's first goal was genius. He was the focal point of almost every shift on the ice. It was one of the more dominating 2-assist performances I've seen.

 

[allan5oh]

I was impressed by his quick release, which is something the Jets lack.

 

[YWGinYYZ]

(...)

Yeah, you watched him in JUNIOR. Guess what Junior =/= NHL.

Really? That's great. I didn't realize that. I certainly couldn't have my opinion of him because I've watched other players make the transition from junior to the bigs, could I? You have your opinion: I disagree with it. I have my opinion - you disagree with it. Fair 'nuff.

 

[JetsHomer]

Yeah, you're right. Can't tell anything about a players skills from junior. This whole "draft" thing is pointless.

Makes a lot more sense to judge based on 11 NHL games as 4th line RW averaging 8 minutes a game.
That experience shows the real Schiefele.

 

[ajmidd12]

Yeah, you're right. Can't tell anything about a players skills from junior. This whole "draft" thing is pointless.

Makes a lot more sense to judge based on 11 NHL games as 4th line RW averaging 8 minutes a game.
That experience shows the real Schiefele.

Glad to know you are a professional scout, I'll make sure to ask for your opinion next time for sure . The kid is beating kids, great. When it came to playing with the big boys 11 games can make or break you in a professional tryout (which is what he was given). He didn't make the cut, that isn't to say he won't, ever, just not yet, and IN MY OPINION it won't be next year either.

He will be sent to the Rock and in 2 seasons he may be ready. He won't take Little's job unless Little starts to tank, with the Winnipeg Jets he is destined to Cap at 2C unless we pickup a better 2C then he will be bumped to 3C.