Player Discussion Mark "Vigilante” Borowiecki

solidprospect

Borveetzky
Sep 30, 2017
4,422
1,274
Here is one small chart example showing our best D 5 on 5 offense vs def last season compared to the Hawks:

Tableau Public

Chabot or others might be better one day but right now Boro is a good choice. Ceci on the other hand...

And compared to the Leafs:

Tableau Public
 

Micklebot

Moderator
Apr 27, 2010
53,756
30,956
Stats and facts, comparisons to other d in the league. Not simply an eye test or he's not good , trust me.

Well, statistically, he's terrible offensively, not sure I need to dig up the data, but probably can if you want. Defensive metrics are notoriously unreliable in hockey, so not sure there's much value in going there.
 

Micklebot

Moderator
Apr 27, 2010
53,756
30,956
Here is one small chart example showing our best D 5 on 5 offense vs def last season compared to the Hawks:

Tableau Public

Chabot or others might be better one day but right now Boro is a good choice. Ceci on the other hand...

And compared to the Leafs:

Tableau Public
Huh, so Connor Murphy is almost as much of a stud defensively as Karlsson is offensively based on that table. Seems plausible.
 

solidprospect

Borveetzky
Sep 30, 2017
4,422
1,274
Huh, so Connor Murphy is almost as much of a stud defensively as Karlsson is offensively based on that table. Seems plausible.
Yeah he's really good on a decent contract until 2022-2023, out for a month or so from injury. Osterle was an ok defenceman as well.
 

slamigo

Skate or Die!
Dec 25, 2007
6,434
3,819
Ottawa
you dont understand hockey. Look at all the open space Boro gave up to commit to defending a 2 on 1 where the 2nd player is still at center ice. Note also the two ottawa senator sticks indicating how close they are to the rushing forwards.
You’re proving my point and it shows that you probably don’t actually play hockey. Once you have position on someone and they are three feet behind you, that’s all the space you need. Three feet might as well be thirty feet. The only thing that Sen player can do is hook or slash the Hawk player’s pants. Lol
I don’t even think Boro is a good player but on that one play, he did the best he could. Andy should have that.
I would continue debating this but you’re probably a 12 year old kid out trolling the internets.
 

Sens of Anarchy

Registered User
Jul 9, 2013
65,259
49,885
You’re proving my point and it shows that you probably don’t actually play hockey. Once you have position on someone and they are three feet behind you, that’s all the space you need. Three feet might as well be thirty feet. The only thing that Sen player can do is hook or slash the Hawk player’s pants. Lol
I don’t even think Boro is a good player but on that one play, he did the best he could. Andy should have that.
I would continue debating this but you’re probably a 12 year old kid out trolling the internets.
Boro could have played that so much better than he did. He left Toews too much room whether Anderson should have had the shot or not.
 

slamigo

Skate or Die!
Dec 25, 2007
6,434
3,819
Ottawa
Boro could have played that so much better than he did. He left Toews too much room whether Anderson should have had the shot or not.
I dunno. He has a split second to make a decision and from his viewpoint it’s a 3 on 1. It’s bizarre that I’m defending Boro because I’d be doing cartwheels if the team replaced him. But I personally don’t feel he was the problem on that play. Ceci and White created that mess and Andy has to be better. But also, it’s Toews and he’s an elite player.
You can certainly blame Boro for a lot of things but I think it’s unfair to blame him on that goal.
 

Sens of Anarchy

Registered User
Jul 9, 2013
65,259
49,885
I dunno. He has a split second to make a decision and from his viewpoint it’s a 3 on 1. It’s bizarre that I’m defending Boro because I’d be doing cartwheels if the team replaced him. But I personally don’t feel he was the problem on that play. Ceci and White created that mess and Andy has to be better. But also, it’s Toews and he’s an elite player.
You can certainly blame Boro for a lot of things but I think it’s unfair to blame him on that goal.
He had a split second initially ; where it looks like he was behind the eight ball early, then he had more than a second or two...to close the gap; he would have had to turn but only to close.
 

Agent Zub

Registered User
Jan 2, 2015
14,536
11,799
You’re proving my point and it shows that you probably don’t actually play hockey. Once you have position on someone and they are three feet behind you, that’s all the space you need. Three feet might as well be thirty feet. The only thing that Sen player can do is hook or slash the Hawk player’s pants. Lol
I don’t even think Boro is a good player but on that one play, he did the best he could. Andy should have that.
I would continue debating this but you’re probably a 12 year old kid out trolling the internets.

because no player has ever caught another player before? not only that none of the players were fast enough to even make it a 2 on 1. not even close

this is a pic slightly after the shot. the puck is already in the net. at what point ever did toews have an option to make a pass? it was a phantom 2 on 1 that boro was defending. also Ceci bust his ass coming back and actually made it before the hawks player. that stick you see on the far right is cecis.



boro read.PNG
 

Agent Zub

Registered User
Jan 2, 2015
14,536
11,799
pic of Ceci coming into the frame first, there was never a pass. Boro was defending no one while watching Toews stroll in on a breakaway.

boro read 2.PNG


One of the keys to being a good hockey player is having your head on a swivel. Boro doesn't look around at all. He's constantly playing the game with tunnel vision. he just doesn't think or process the game at all.
 

Micklebot

Moderator
Apr 27, 2010
53,756
30,956
I dunno. He has a split second to make a decision and from his viewpoint it’s a 3 on 1. It’s bizarre that I’m defending Boro because I’d be doing cartwheels if the team replaced him. But I personally don’t feel he was the problem on that play. Ceci and White created that mess and Andy has to be better. But also, it’s Toews and he’s an elite player.
You can certainly blame Boro for a lot of things but I think it’s unfair to blame him on that goal.
I think the forwards did a great job backchecking to take away the odd man rush, and gave Boro lots of time to get over to toews, he just didn't seem to notice. It looked worse than it was, but I thing he has to recognize the forwards getting into the play and be more aggressive on Toews even all it does is rush the shot a bit more.
 

topshelf15

Registered User
May 5, 2009
27,993
6,005
Boro is a very good role defender,tough as nails and will do anything to help the team.. Hard not to like the guy,but the game has become more about skill and speed,and sadly he lacks in both
 

slamigo

Skate or Die!
Dec 25, 2007
6,434
3,819
Ottawa
Boro would be fine as a 6/7 until Jaros or Harpur push him out. But having him rolling 23 minutes a night is not a recipe for success.
 
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