Confirmed with Link: Marek Zidlicky to Detroit for a 3rd

[Invictus12]

Again, not to be a gadfly, but Zids is exactly the right kind of Dman for a quick rental... but exactly the opposite of our schema long-term.

The primary duty of a Dman... is to play solid D.

If you can get that, and some offensive talent, you've got it going on.

That is NOT Marek Zidlicky , nor is it Mike Green. Pressure either, and they cough-up the puck.

Zid's is a great rental, but he's an old dog: ain't gonna be no new tricks.

We don't need new tricks. He has exactly what we need on our team.

 

[Dotter]

We already have prospects and picks to cover us for the next 10+ years. You also underestimate the significance of having our young guys playing with guys like Datsyuk and Zetterberg. Datsyuk himself has been boasting about how much he learned playing on the same line with Brett Hull, for instance. Kids need guidance and D and Z are absolutely great influence on our young guys.

True, but doesn't mean toying around with the idea should be eliminated from the equation.

I don't even know what their NTC look like. So might not be possible anyhow

 

[hyduK]

Love it when people want specifics of players that may not have even been drafted yet. But I'll humor you anyhow. William Nylander

Why would Toronto trade a large part of their future for a player that will retire by the time they make the playoffs...

 

[KJoe88]

At least Zid chose us!

 

[DanZ]

We already have prospects and picks to cover us for the next 10+ years. You also underestimate the significance of having our young guys playing with guys like Datsyuk and Zetterberg. Datsyuk himself has been boasting about how much he learned playing on the same line with Brett Hull, for instance. Kids need guidance and D and Z are absolutely great influence on our young guys.

Exactly. Having young players lead themselves has as much a chance of ending up like Edmonton than it does Chicago.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Love it when people want specifics of players that may not have even been drafted yet. But I'll humor you anyhow. William Nylander

Grass is greener syndrome. Larkin and Mantha are just as legit as Nylander and I'll take my bets on the prospects who will be learning from players like Datsyuk and Zetterberg instead of being on a team near the bottom of the standings with no veterans to help them.

 

[Dotter]

Why would Toronto trade a large part of their future for a player that will retire by the time they make the playoffs...

I had MTL Canadians and TOR mixed up. Whoopie

 

[DanZ]

Why would Toronto trade a large part of their future for a player that will retire by the time they make the playoffs...

Hey, he was humoring you. Laughing is appropriate.

 

[BTCG]

We don't need new tricks. He has exactly what we need on our team.

Except for coughing up the puck when pressured, I agree.

 

[ashenhigh]

I never disputed that. I said Z and D are on the decline and only have a few left. Why not cash in for another 10+ years for players/picks that will make Detroit a legit contender.

2-3 year window vs 10+ year window.

And you call yourself a Red Wings fan? Madness.

Zid is a great pick-up for us, hello #2 PPQB.

 

[Invictus12]

True, but doesn't mean toying around with the idea should be eliminated from the equation.

I don't even know what their NTC look like. So might not be possible anyhow

Look up Edmonton Oilers. They have have the youngsters. No leadership however. No experience... I don't think I need to elaborate much further.

 

[izlez]

Love it when people want specifics of players that may not have even been drafted yet. But I'll humor you anyhow. William Nylander

No one in here will agree that we should trade Zetterberg for Nylander.

A team already out of the playoffs also wouldn't trade for Zetterberg.

You don't even really want Nylander? Your master plan is to trade away Datsyuk and Zetterberg for draft picks?? Unless that is guaranteed to be Mcdavid, it is a ridiculous idea. If it is Mcdavid, you just aren't getting that pick

 

[Dotter]

Look up Edmonton Oilers. They have have the youngsters. No leadership however. No experience... I don't think I need to elaborate much further.

I'm pretty sure Nill or Yzerman could turn that team around in a few years... without giving up on all the youth.

Bad example

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

Again, not to be a gadfly, but Zids is exactly the right kind of Dman for a quick rental... but exactly the opposite of our schema long-term.

The primary duty of a Dman... is to play solid D.

If you can get that, and some offensive talent, you've got it going on.

That is NOT Marek Zidlicky , nor is it Mike Green. Pressure either, and they cough-up the puck.

Zid's is a great rental, but he's an old dog: ain't gonna be no new tricks.

Darryl Sutter: “The big thing in today’s game is you have to be able forecheck and backcheck, and you have to have the puck. You can’t give the puck up. We don’t play in our zone, so there’s not much defending. I’ve coached in three decades now and this stuff where they said Marian had to play in Jacques’s system is a bunch of bull-crap. The game’s changed. They think there’s defending in today’s game. Nah, it’s how much you have the puck. Teams that play around in their own zone think they’re defending but they’re generally getting scored on or taking face-offs and they need a goalie to stand on his head if that’s the way they play.â€

You sign Zidlicky (or Green as you mention) because they can move the puck quickly out of the zone. The less time you spend in the zone, the less time you need to worry about deficiencies in defensive zone coverage. Uncle Darryl is very right in that regard.

 

[izlez]

I'm pretty sure Nill or Yzerman could turn that team around in a few years... without giving up on all the youth.

Bad example

I'm drifting into getting off topic here, but in an effort to shoot down your hypotheticals where all our 3rd round picks turn into superstars and Nill would lead the young Oilers to being a great team...

How is Dallas doing with Nill again?

 

[Invictus12]

I'm pretty sure Nill or Yzerman could turn that team around in a few years... without giving up on all the youth.

Bad example

You're ignoring the fundamental error that everyone is pointing out to you.

This team does not need to be 'turned around'.

We are still in competition for the top spot in the east, in case you want to ignore that further.

 

[BTCG]

Darryl Sutter: “The big thing in today’s game is you have to be able forecheck and backcheck, and you have to have the puck. You can’t give the puck up. We don’t play in our zone, so there’s not much defending. I’ve coached in three decades now and this stuff where they said Marian had to play in Jacques’s system is a bunch of bull-crap. The game’s changed. They think there’s defending in today’s game. Nah, it’s how much you have the puck. Teams that play around in their own zone think they’re defending but they’re generally getting scored on or taking face-offs and they need a goalie to stand on his head if that’s the way they play.â€

You sign Zidlicky (or Green as you mention) because they can move the puck quickly out of the zone. The less time you spend in the zone, the less time you need to worry about deficiencies in defensive zone coverage. Uncle Darryl is very right in that regard.

Read it again. This is why quoting others instead of forming your own opinion is a bad idea.

 

[HisNoodliness]

That's a cop out post that fails miserably at being humorous... or useful.

Ok, honestly lets actually talk about trading Dats and Z. We'll go one player at a time.

First up Dats:
Datsyuk is very well known for wanting to finish his career in Russia. He is probably going to go back after this contract, but certainly will within 4 years. Now let's consider if he had to switch to a new team, almost every team in the GM is going to see massive flight risk. Like I'd say if we trade Dats there is a >90% chance he goes straight to Russia. Every other team will feel similarly and thus no one will trade much for him. So we'll top his value off at a 2nd round pick.

Now Z, our captain. His flight risk is consideably smaller and he could probably fetch considerably more as a result. Let's go with a good prospect (maybe Pulkinnen level) and a 1st round pick.

Now for the drawbacks. Both Z and Dats are excellent mentors and role models for the future. Furthermore they perpetuate the culture of "once a Red Wing, always a Red Wing" that has allowed us to maintain a consistent and strong team for so long. They follow in the footsteps of Lidstrom and Yzerman before them, and hopefully we'll be saying that Mantha, Larkin and Tatar (or whoever our best players are, you get the idea) followed in Pav and Z's footsteps. Last but not least they help us win now. This year we have a very real chance to win the cup, as we will next year and maybe the year after. Hopefully Nyquist and Tatar and Mantha, and DDK and whoever will begin forming their own core by that time and we'll continue to contend under their regime.

So honestly I think that our team will be better in 10 years if we keep them, in five it might be a wash or better if we trade, but building a good environment is incredibly important. Lastly trying to win the cup right now is a nice bonus.

 

[BTCG]

Darryl Sutter: “The big thing in today’s game is you have to be able forecheck and backcheck, and you have to have the puck. You can’t give the puck up. We don’t play in our zone, so there’s not much defending. I’ve coached in three decades now and this stuff where they said Marian had to play in Jacques’s system is a bunch of bull-crap. The game’s changed. They think there’s defending in today’s game. Nah, it’s how much you have the puck. Teams that play around in their own zone think they’re defending but they’re generally getting scored on or taking face-offs and they need a goalie to stand on his head if that’s the way they play.â€

You sign Zidlicky (or Green as you mention) because they can move the puck quickly out of the zone. The less time you spend in the zone, the less time you need to worry about deficiencies in defensive zone coverage. Uncle Darryl is very right in that regard.

I was taking Zid's play strictly from having actually been to many games he played in, but since my memory is being called into question, I just did a quick Google search. Seems THN agrees with my observations:

Assets: Can be a major offensive threat from behind the blueline. Has a wealth of top-level experience and plenty of polish working the power play. Is a clever passer who packs a heavy shot from the point and likes to join the attack.

Flaws: Lacks the size and strength needed to excel when given heavy minutes in the NHL. Is prone to making bad decisions in the defensive zone when under pressure. Doesn't always choose the best time to pinch in from the point.

Career Potential: Veteran offensive defenseman.


http://forecaster.thehockeynews.com/hockeynews/hockey/player.php?2374

 

[Dotter]

You're ignoring the fundamental error that everyone is pointing out to you.

This team does not need to be 'turned around'.

We are still in competition for the top spot in the east, in case you want to ignore that further.

OMG, am I beating a dead horse or what? Nobody is talking about 2015, but rather 2017/18 and beyond.

Bottom line, these trades makes for NO EXCUSES if Wings get bounced. Players and personal should be held accountable and BIG changes should be made if the team fails this post-season, nobody is safe! And anything less than a SCF is a HUGE FAIL.

I remember not long ago Zetterberg I think was grumbling something about the team needed more top name players to help. I can't remember the exact quote.

Then you have Babcock being annoying about a RH PMD and a top 6 forward. Well they got their wish... and now they need to win the cup or BUST. It's that simple. If Wings don't win the cup after wasting the picks they did, then it's BUST, pure and simple. And people should be held 100% accountable and lose their jobs!

Wings have NO EXCUSES anymore. This is a MUST WIN NOW season, if not, fire everybody and blow up the team.

Babcock and Zetterberg got what they want, so they better hope to god they perform. This **** falls on them if they fail.

 

[DanZ]

OMG, am I beating a dead horse or what? Nobody is talking about 2015, but rather 2017/18 and beyond.

Bottom line, these trades makes for NO EXCUSES if Wings get bounced. Players and personal should be held accountable and BIG changes should be made if the team fails this post-season, nobody is safe! And anything less than a SCF is a HUGE FAIL.

I remember not long ago Zetterberg I think was grumbling something about the team needed more top name players to help. I can't remember the exact quote.

Then you have Babcock being annoying about a RH PMD and a top 6 forward. Well they got their wish... and now they need to win the cup or BUST. It's that simple. If Wings don't win the cup after wasting the picks they did, then it's BUST, pure and simple. And people should be held 100% accountable and lose their jobs!

Wings have NO EXCUSES anymore. This is a MUST WIN NOW season, if not, fire everybody and blow up the team.

Babcock and Zetterberg got what they want, so they better hope to god they perform. This **** falls on them if they fail.

Are you kidding me with this? You have to be joking...

 

[Dotter]

Ok, honestly lets actually talk about trading Dats and Z. We'll go one player at a time.

Admittedly, I didn't read your post. But after seeing what players brought in at this TDL, I think 2 or 3 nice first rounders + top prospects for each player would be easily had. Especially if Holland retained some cap hit.

 

[ap3x]

Don't you think, you overreact a little bit right there?

 

[Invictus12]

OMG, am I beating a dead horse or what? Nobody is talking about 2015, but rather 2017/18 and beyond.

Bottom line, these trades makes for NO EXCUSES if Wings get bounced. Players and personal should be held accountable and BIG changes should be made if the team fails this post-season, nobody is safe! And anything less than a SCF is a HUGE FAIL.

I remember not long ago Zetterberg I think was grumbling something about the team needed more top name players to help. I can't remember the exact quote.

Then you have Babcock being annoying about a RH PMD and a top 6 forward. Well they got their wish... and now they need to win the cup or BUST. It's that simple. If Wings don't win the cup after wasting the picks they did, then it's BUST, pure and simple. And people should be held 100% accountable and lose their jobs!

Wings have NO EXCUSES anymore. This is a MUST WIN NOW season, if not, fire everybody and blow up the team.

Babcock and Zetterberg got what they want, so they better hope to god they perform. This **** falls on them if they fail.

They don't need to hope for anything. You can put together the best of the best from Canada on one team and there are still no guarantee that the cup is theirs. (Think 1980 miracle on ice)

The only thing you can do is set the team up to have a better shot at the title. That's exactly what's been done yesterday and today. We are also looking very good for the future because we have a strong pipeline of prospects and we have out top picks.

At this point, you already know very well you have no argument here but you persist anyway.

When a person is drowning, the best thing to do is relax. (You'll find it that you will float right up on the surface.) Instead you're needlessly trying to grab on to the surface of the water. That won't help, you might as well let go. I know I will because at this point, there is no point.

 

[RedHawkDown]

Admittedly, I didn't read your post. But after seeing what players brought in at this TDL, I think 2 or 3 nice first rounders + top prospects for each player would be easily had. Especially if Holland retained some cap hit.

There is no way in hell we'd get 2 or 3 first rounders AND top prospects for each player. Yandle went for a top prospect and a 1st rounder, and he's much younger than Datsyuk and Zetterberg. Yes, D and Z are better, but they won't be fetching top price as 35+ year old vets that might only play a couple more seasons.