Speculation: Maple Leafs Management Discussion/Speculation Thread

[SprDaVE]

What makes any of you even remotely certain that Joe Nieuwendyk would be a competent hire? Nothing in his resume even hints at it (look at Dallas).

It's pretty rare that you can find someone with an awesome track record to fill secondary exec roles.

Nieuwendyk didn't do well at all in Dallas but he appears to be a smart guy that's got a future in management.

It's hard to know how good some of these execs really are behind the scenes though. All we have to judge Nieuwendyk with is a bad, but short, record in Dallas. I don't think he'd be the first rookie GM to have a first bad start, only to move on and be good somewhere else.

Another name that would be interesting would be Rob Blake. He seems to be an up and comer exec that everyone likes.

 

[Al14]

I wonder if we might see joe nieuwendyk come back??

Joe failed big time in Dallas. I have doubts that Shanahan would hire him back now. Joe has been available since Shanahan came on board, so, why hasn't he been offered a job by now? We'll see.

 

[Kessley Snipes*]

It's pretty rare that you can find someone with an awesome track record to fill secondary exec roles.

Nieuwendyk didn't do well at all in Dallas but he appears to be a smart guy that's got a future in management.

It's hard to know how good some of these execs really are behind the scenes though. All we have to judge Nieuwendyk with is a bad, but short, record in Dallas. I don't think he'd be the first rookie GM to have a first bad start, only to move on and be good somewhere else.

Another name that would be interesting would be Rob Blake. He seems to be an up and comer exec that everyone likes.

Again you are purely speculating. His track record is nothing to write home about, and frankly I am of the thought that we should bring in fresh blood. Not someone who hasn't been able to latch onto a job in the past year.

 

[TheLeafsBro]

I think Nieuwendyk has a future as an NHL exec but he needs to be mentored and gain experience under an experienced GM/President of Hockey Ops because he was essentially thrown to the wolves in Dallas.

I can see why people think that he would be a good hire for Shanahan to do exactly that except for the fact that Shanahan has already taken on that role with Dubas. So Shanahan's 2nd Assistant GM hire probably won't be someone like Joe but rather someone with more experience that is also open to new ideas and analytics and brings fresh ideas to the table.

Having said that I'm not sure who that would be, I don't really know a lot about who's out there.

 

[darrylsittler27]

Shanahan's envious position.

Whether this team performs or not he can blow it all to kingdom come on trade deadline and try and get some picks to catch up with Buffalo(best prospect pool in the NHL plus 3 first rounders next year in a strong draft). While we misbuilt and fiddle fadled the turtle crept past us. There is no need for a new GM or coach even at this point. Shanahan may realize without a rebuild this team has no chance ever and will be behind teams like Buffalo now for about 10 years.

Because of a total lack of foresight(By other GM's) he may have to blow it up and hope we can someday catch up again with all those teams below us with better prospects.There is a reason we have been a garbage team for 46 years or so.Continually not drafting(no first rounder(Niedermayer,Luongo etc) or giving them away(Rask,Courtnall etc). We also like to overpay players over 30.

What seems to elude some fans is that there is a price to be paid for stupidity and we will soon be paying it.The only way this team makes the playoffs is if virtually every player has a career year while Bernier doesn't get injured and plays better than last year. We can never win a cup without a strong, experienced GM with patience who doesn't continually throw picks away.I don't dislike Nonnis but I do think he is gone as GM.

 

[Menzinger]

I'm cautiously optimistic - hoping it's another 'out of the box' hire like Dubas.

Also, sees to be another sign of Nonis getting pushed more to the side.

 

[Budsfan]

It's pretty rare that you can find someone with an awesome track record to fill secondary exec roles.

Nieuwendyk didn't do well at all in Dallas but he appears to be a smart guy that's got a future in management.

It's hard to know how good some of these execs really are behind the scenes though. All we have to judge Nieuwendyk with is a bad, but short, record in Dallas. I don't think he'd be the first rookie GM to have a first bad start, only to move on and be good somewhere else.

Another name that would be interesting would be Rob Blake. He seems to be an up and comer exec that everyone likes.

I think Joe Nieuwendyk would be a good assistant GM and was here with Nonis under Burke and he is familiar with the Leafs and Marlie's and was well thought of when he was here.

 

[Morbo]

Whether this team performs or not he can blow it all to kingdom come on trade deadline and try and get some picks to catch up with Buffalo(best prospect pool in the NHL plus 3 first rounders next year in a strong draft). While we misbuilt and fiddle fadled the turtle crept past us. There is no need for a new GM or coach even at this point. Shanahan may realize without a rebuild this team has no chance ever and will be behind teams like Buffalo now for about 10 years.

Because of a total lack of foresight(By other GM's) he may have to blow it up and hope we can someday catch up again with all those teams below us with better prospects.There is a reason we have been a garbage team for 46 years or so.Continually not drafting(no first rounder(Niedermayer,Luongo etc) or giving them away(Rask,Courtnall etc). We also like to overpay players over 30.

What seems to elude some fans is that there is a price to be paid for stupidity and we will soon be paying it.The only way this team makes the playoffs is if virtually every player has a career year while Bernier doesn't get injured and plays better than last year. We can never win a cup without a strong, experienced GM with patience who doesn't continually throw picks away.I don't dislike Nonnis but I do think he is gone as GM.

The Leafs aren't going to tank it man. Just accept it and move on with your life.

 

[Gary Nylund]

The Leafs aren't going to tank it man. Just accept it and move on with your life.

I know that life as a Leaf fan is filled with pain and misery.

Bur I am loath to accept it!

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Reid Mitchell - Director, Hockey & Scouting Administration

This is an interesting read of how Leafs rate players, it touches on the validity of data of analytics, and how Leafs have their own private ratings on players character, that enabled us to draft Rielly and Brown.

Director, Hockey & Scouting Administration Reid Mitchell opines.

The one aspect he repeatedly mentioned was character. Judging a prospect by his character gives the organization an understanding about how this player will be able to adapt to higher levels of hockey, and the chances of him improving his game to suite the professional level. Another aspect Toronto scouts have to take into account is how the prospect will deal with the media crazy attention in Toronto, where some really good players may falter for reasons completely void of how good of a hockey player they truly are.

However, it’s not a ranking of character based on eye ball observations and story telling. The scouts put a specially calculated number, a figure not currently available to the public by any statistical database. It’s a number to measure the aspects of the player and hockey that we otherwise label the intangibles, therefore not measurable.

Mtichell specifically mentioned two cases in his talk about analytics yesterday, Connor Brown and Morgan Rielly.

http://www.thehockeyreport.net/2014/03/13/leafs-reid-mitchell-talks-advanced-stats-game-preview/

 

[hockeywiz542]

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/08/16/blue-jays-gm-alex-anthopoulos-set-to-return-next-year

A little bird who usually knows these things whispered this the other day: Brendan Shanahan’s deal with the Maple Leafs is apparently five years and $2.5 million a year ...

SHANNY'S MAKING IT HIS TEAM

Brendan Shanahan met with Dion Phaneuf for a couple of days in Prince Edward Island. This came after a three-hour dinner with Phil Kessel, which is at least two hours more than most of us could handle.

This is what Shanahan is doing with the Maple Leafs: In every department, in every way. He is talking but more than that he is listening. He is asking all kind of questions. He wants to know what everybody does, more than that, he wants to know what everybody is thinking.

And in a short time on the job, without any headline of a singular move, he has maintained Randy Carlyle, but wiped out his coaching staff; maintained Dave Nonis, but wiped out much of his front office; maintained one of his media relations people, fired his PR chief, and sent one to the Marlies and called one up.

That’s three departments turned upside down and more to come.

It may not sound like much, overall. It may not excite Leafs fans. But it’s Shanahan’s belief that a whole lot of small changes can result in large change down the road for the organization. Shanahan is building his organization, his way.

 

[Menzinger]

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/08/16/blue-jays-gm-alex-anthopoulos-set-to-return-next-year

What a pointless jab at Kessel: Simmons' writing is a putrid as ever.

 

[Pyrophorus]

JFJ wasn't allowed to do what he wanted to do - and he screwed the hell up catering to the board

who is the second?

I'm guessing Stellick, but he had pure evil behind him.

 

[Warden of the North]

http://www.torontosun.com/2014/08/16/blue-jays-gm-alex-anthopoulos-set-to-return-next-year

Heres to hoping the scouting department (amateur and professional) is his next order of business.

 

[Pyrophorus]

Does anyone else believe that Shanny's next Asst. GM hire will be someone who's been in the game for a while and is respected by his piers. Could possibly replace Nonis at the end of the year and groom Dubas for the future?

I do.
Just like Horachek and Spott behind the bench.

Someone seasoned who can take the helm.

 

[Pyrophorus]

Ray Shero is available.

Has won a Cup (sounds familiar)

 

[Pyrophorus]

Heres to hoping the scouting department (amateur and professional) is his next order of business.

IF we still spend the most on scouting and player development, as long as its working out (now 4 years into it), and staffers aren't incompetent, why not just tweak this?

 

[Pholus]

IF we still spend the most on scouting and player development, as long as its working out (now 4 years into it), and staffers aren't incompetent, why not just tweak this?

I agree. Sure we have missed on some guys at the draft, what team hasn't make a pick they end up regretting 3-5 years down the road? Part of that could be due to the initial evaluation of the player, but another part of that is development. The Leafs are not known to be good at developing home grown talent, this is something that will need to change in order to have success in the future. That said, the Marlies have made deep playoff runs in each of the last 3 seasons, after finishing at the top of the regular season standings, so at least our prospects in the AHL are developing in a winning environment.

 

[SprDaVE]

Again you are purely speculating. His track record is nothing to write home about, and frankly I am of the thought that we should bring in fresh blood. Not someone who hasn't been able to latch onto a job in the past year.

Who said I wasn't speculating? I merely threw a name in the hat that might be hired. He's got a connection to Toronto and the Leafs. He doesn't have much of a track record and may be interested in a lower role compared to someone like Shero or whoever else.

He may have failed in Dallas but that doesn't mean he isn't a good exec to have. Again, it's pretty rare you can find a successful exec to have in a secondary staff role... so you take them as they come sometimes.

I think Joe Nieuwendyk would be a good assistant GM and was here with Nonis under Burke and he is familiar with the Leafs and Marlie's and was well thought of when he was here.

Pretty much. He may have failed in Dallas but he was seen as a pretty good up and comer when he was with the Leafs and was hired quickly by the Stars at the time. Who knows though how good or bad he really is behind the scenes. He's got a bit of experience now and can add a bit to a very green executive staff.

 

[indigobuffalo]

The guy the Leafs are currently missing is the "Negotiator" personality.

We need someone that has tons of photographs of the players' agents with naked strippers and can leverage that into getting guys signed for the best possible dollar, and who can also do the leg-work on trade negotiations so that Nonis isn't allowed to continue the "...and the Leafs add a draft pick." meme.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

We've been spending to the cap for years, have only had one 2nd rounder in the past FOUR drafts and are still missing our 2nd rounder for next year, our core players are predominently aged ~24-30 like most CURRENT contending teams, etc.

The ONLY reason we could arguably be considered "rebuilding" is that despite spending as much as anyone in the league and repeatedly trading picks for "help now", our inept management has still driven us to bottom 10 finishes in every season theyve been here except for one (lockout shortened season) leading to us getting Rielly/Nylander with relatively high picks.

If they come bottom 10 again, i hope we see some significant changes. Nonis/Carlyle gone, and guys like Lupul/Phaneuf/Bozak/etc traded away, maybe even Kessel if the trade return were good enough. Cut salary, acquire picks/prospects for the first time in forever, and retool/rebuild around our youth. Most of our core are in their primes, so if theyre not getting it done, better to move some of them for value then just sit around for years wasting their prime years away.

The first two paragraphs are a good and honest analysis of the Leafs situation. The truth hurts.

As for the last paragraph, this would be a dramatic change that we haven't seen embraced before by any Leafs management group.

 

[sda]

I'm cautiously optimistic - hoping it's another 'out of the box' hire like Dubas.

Also, sees to be another sign of Nonis getting pushed more to the side.

With todays news I thimk you got what you wanted. It is nice to see