Management Thread | Regular Season Edition

[God]

I don't see how the Canucks' setup was somehow alarmingly barebones compared to the rest of the league. We were actually one of the first teams to have a POHO. Obviously, they were missing a POHO after Linden left and until Rutherford took the role.

Again, the Canucks didn't end up replacing the POHO, but they had 1 GM with 2 AGMs, which isn't barebones. There is a huge diference between having 4 vs the 5-6 you are suggesting that other teams have.

Colorado has a POHO, GM, and one AGM. They won the Cup with a POHO/GM and one AGM (so 2 guys) Previously Sakic held both the POHO/GM role and had one AGM.

Tampa expanded to three AGMs in 2019-2020 after Yzerman left?

Vegas started off with a GM and AGM and changed to POHO and GM in 2019-2020. If I'm not mistaken, that was the setup they won with last year?

St. Louis has one POHO/GM and one AGM. I believe they won the Cup with the same setup.

Pittsburgh has a POHO/GM and one AGM. I believe Rutherford's Cups was with this setup. In Rutherford's last years in Pittsburgh he had one AGM.

Chicago had POHO, a GM and one AGM when they won their Cups?

Bruins have a POHO, GM, and two AGMs for the longest time.

Washington has had a POHO/GM and 3 AGMs for the longest time.

I'm not checking all of these but Craig Billington is/was the other AGM for the Avs in addition to MacFarland, and just looking at a lot of team staff lists on eliteprospects, it seems like the titles are pretty interchangeable depending on a number of things like experience, negotiating power, etc. Someone like Castonguay on other teams isn't likely to have an AGM title on another team, but there was precedent here with Gear being AGM and Rutherford needed to offer it as an incentive to leave her agent role. Usually these people who could be in AGM roles get titles like Director of _____.

In any case, going through the lists of team staff sheets is likely going to be pointless given that it'll be difficult to assess the value of the position without following the team closely. Regardless of whether we had an equivalent number of people at important positions, from the media reports and tidbits dropped by former people, it was a mostly two-man show with Benning and Weisbrod not listening to others (and thus causing Brackett to leave). So even if you tallied up the number of President/GM/AGM/Directors, none of it really matters if you have an upper management group that boxes others out.

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

Relax.

Oh. You're still trying to take the moral high road, lmao.

I'm just taking your nonsense and applying it towards you.

Huh? This is a discussion board. You already did the work. I'm not holding you to any kind of standard here.

Huh? You were the one who originally made the claim. Which you still haven't explained how you arrived at it, so I'm going to assume that my original assumption that you pulled it out of your ass is correct. Especially since...

Nope what? You included him on your list. So are you saying he's no longer running the farm team or that he's not an AGM?

He's no longer running the farm team. I provided a quote as well as old/current versions of the Checkers website which listed him as GM ("showing my work", since this is so important for you) and even explained as such.

This is why I think you pulled your original claim out of your ass, btw, cos you're just checking off what I provided to you.

It's a discussion board. Providing points of discussion and adding context isn't qualifiers.

No, but when someone is trying to cover their ass and save face from making an uninformed statement, it's important to load it as much as possible so you look 'less wrong.' Which is what you're doing.

So you keep making mistakes and you get all pissy at me for asking you which teams you are including?

No. I'm getting 'pissy' because you're not extending me the same courtesy I extended you and are getting mad because I'm holding your feet to the fire over making an unsubstantiated claim. Because, again, if you had 'done the work' you wouldn't:
- Be misunderstanding what's going on with the Panthers AHL sitch
- Retract your comment that it's 'unusual' for an NHL team to not have an AGM running their ffarm team
- Refuse to elaborate on why you found it 'unusual'

Mistakes are fine, but is being mistaken about 2 organizations (out of 32) just as bad as someone making a blanket statement, refusing to explain or back up their statement all while demanding the other party 'show their work'?

(Spoiler: it isn't because unlike your argument, my argument hasn't fundamentally changed, even when accounting for mistakes.)

Great to here but I think you're missing the point.

Right back at you. Again, this is just you trying to save face. "Oh, I guess technically you're correct..."

Huh? I was under the impression that it was rare and you pointed out that it isn't that rare. What is your problem?

More qualifiers. You were stating it as fact while trying to own MS and now the tune has changed to "oh, well, I thought this."

Huh? But you're the one who are bringing up Chicago Wolves and Hershey Bears.

You opened the door by talking about 'which ones own their farm team.' The Wolves and Bears are two notable examples of independent AHL orgs.

How silly of me to think you might be referring to teams that aren't owned by an NHL club.

You should discuss this with MS.

I mean, you were the one who brought it up.

And what, you can't be arsed to answer my question on why you put so much importance on role/title? HOW SURPRISING.

For reference:

Then why would you originally make a statement about how it's 'unusual' that a job title isn't running an AHL club and place emphasis on the role/title?

So even if you tallied up the number of President/GM/AGM/Directors, none of it really matters if you have an upper management group that boxes others out.

This is the crux of the matter and the talking about positions/titles (which aren't important, btw, because it's totally devalued the argument I was making about how 'unusual' things are) are just attempts at snowing the issue.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

While F A N isn’t always bad faith posting, his ego certainly gets in the way when his argument has been disproven and he cannot admit he is wrong, which just leads to condescending rebuttals to try to belittle the opposition. Basically once he realizes he is incorrect (or ought to realize so), he attacks the poster rather than their arguments through ridicule and condescension. People who let their ego dictate the flow of an argument generally are worthy of the ignore list.

 

[MS]

I don't see how the Canucks' setup was somehow alarmingly barebones compared to the rest of the league. We were actually one of the first teams to have a POHO. Obviously, they were missing a POHO after Linden left and until Rutherford took the role.

Again, the Canucks didn't end up replacing the POHO, but they had 1 GM with 2 AGMs, which isn't barebones. There is a huge diference between having 4 vs the 5-6 you are suggesting that other teams have.

Colorado has a POHO, GM, and one AGM. They won the Cup with a POHO/GM and one AGM (so 2 guys) Previously Sakic held both the POHO/GM role and had one AGM.

Tampa expanded to three AGMs in 2019-2020 after Yzerman left?

Vegas started off with a GM and AGM and changed to POHO and GM in 2019-2020. If I'm not mistaken, that was the setup they won with last year?

St. Louis has one POHO/GM and one AGM. I believe they won the Cup with the same setup.

Pittsburgh has a POHO/GM and one AGM. I believe Rutherford's Cups was with this setup. In Rutherford's last years in Pittsburgh he had one AGM.

Chicago had POHO, a GM and one AGM when they won their Cups?

Bruins have a POHO, GM, and two AGMs for the longest time.

Washington has had a POHO/GM and 3 AGMs for the longest time.

You've listed a few teams and most of those have 4-6 people in roles covered by 3 people here in 2021. Again, one of the smallest front offices in the NHL. I don't know why you're still arguing this.

And again, as was pointed out before, those 3 people here were also pushing their way into scouting much more than in other organizations so it was 3 people spread *really* thin.

 

[Canucker]

I don't see how the Canucks' setup was somehow alarmingly barebones compared to the rest of the league. We were actually one of the first teams to have a POHO. Obviously, they were missing a POHO after Linden left and until Rutherford took the role.

Again, the Canucks didn't end up replacing the POHO, but they had 1 GM with 2 AGMs, which isn't barebones. There is a huge diference between having 4 vs the 5-6 you are suggesting that other teams have.

Colorado has a POHO, GM, and one AGM. They won the Cup with a POHO/GM and one AGM (so 2 guys) Previously Sakic held both the POHO/GM role and had one AGM.

Tampa expanded to three AGMs in 2019-2020 after Yzerman left?

Vegas started off with a GM and AGM and changed to POHO and GM in 2019-2020. If I'm not mistaken, that was the setup they won with last year?

St. Louis has one POHO/GM and one AGM. I believe they won the Cup with the same setup.

Pittsburgh has a POHO/GM and one AGM. I believe Rutherford's Cups was with this setup. In Rutherford's last years in Pittsburgh he had one AGM.

Chicago had POHO, a GM and one AGM when they won their Cups?

Bruins have a POHO, GM, and two AGMs for the longest time.

Washington has had a POHO/GM and 3 AGMs for the longest time.

But when Weisbrod is one of your AGM's and Benning is your GM (and I'm not even sure how much weight Chris Gear carried in the same room with Jimbo and Weisbrod)...its just an echo chamber of stupid. It might not have been alarmingly "bare bones", but it was most certainly bare brained...although I'm sure even if you added 3-4 people to Benning's staff it wouldn't have made much difference, not sure anyone was going to override the Jimbo/Weisbrod uni-brain once Linden was gone.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

But when Weisbrod is one of your AGM's and Benning is your GM (and I'm not even sure how much weight Chris Gear carried in the same room with Jimbo and Weisbrod)...its just an echo chamber of stupid. It might not have been alarmingly "bare bones", but it was most certainly bare brained...although I'm sure even if you added 3-4 people to Benning's staff it wouldn't have made much difference, not sure anyone was going to override the Jimbo/Weisbrod uni-brain once Linden was gone.

Benning only wanted people in power that agreed with him, anytime someone had dissenting views they were let go (Gilman, Linden, Brackett, etc.). Which is the opposite of most successful management groups and is poetically the reason we drafted Pettersson. Funny how Benning couldn’t appreciate this and maintained his dysfunctional approach to management until being shitcanned for incompetence.

 

[andora]

Are we counting benning as one whole one?

 

[F A N]

You've listed a few teams and most of those have 4-6 people in roles covered by 3 people here in 2021. Again, one of the smallest front offices in the NHL. I don't know why you're still arguing this.

What are you talking about? The few teams I listed are recent Cup Champions and they don't have 5-6 people in POHO/GM/AGM positions. I don't know why you're still arguing this.

I'm not checking all of these but Craig Billington is/was the other AGM for the Avs in addition to MacFarland, and just looking at a lot of team staff lists on eliteprospects, it seems like the titles are pretty interchangeable depending on a number of things like experience, negotiating power, etc. Someone like Castonguay on other teams isn't likely to have an AGM title on another team, but there was precedent here with Gear being AGM and Rutherford needed to offer it as an incentive to leave her agent role. Usually these people who could be in AGM roles get titles like Director of _____.

So at the time it would have been Sakic POHO/GM, McFarland and Billington AGMs. So 3 people.

I was responding to MS who was specifically discussing people in POHO/GM/AGM positions.

 

[Petey But Really Jim]

As is typical. Pastor is hoisted by his own petard and shrinks back into non-answers.

And as has been outlined numerous times, it's exceedingly hard for NHL teams to not accrue some amount of talent through the draft.

I am pretty confident in saying that (outside of interim GMs or incredibly short term GMs) there aren't any organizations that went an entire tenure without finding some NHL players. It's exceedingly hard to not come up with an NHL caliber player if you're drafting in the top 10 (although Benning managed to do that...twice!)

The thing that's always glossed over with Benning is that he was touted as some master drafter/developer of talent. Yet he provided very average results. That's without going into the usual discussions/debates that crop up when talking about that (eg, EP.)

The comment I made that started this whole discussion is that he set back the organization by years. Which is true. The Canucks were fumbling for nearly a decade under his leadership and are only now starting to come out of the darkness.

However, as much as I want to just simply enjoy the team, there are still a few issues facing the Canucks. I'm not trying to be doom and gloom, as these are just things the team has to deal with and can affect their future success:

- Dealing with EP. Will he or won't he? And if he doesn't (or if the team elects not to) who do they pursue?
- Sorting out the D. Hughes is the only defenseman signed longterm.
- Sorting out UFAs in general.
- Dealing with the regression. Folks crowing about the team being 'elite' are ignoring that there is likely to be a regression coming for the Canucks. As much as I like laughing at the Oilers fans seething over it, guys like Bluegar are going to regress.

This has been a fantastic season, I am enjoying it, but I want to see what happens after other organizations scout the shit out of us, our role players regress slightly, etc. and if we can continue to keep this momentum rolling into multiple seasons.

There's a lot of similar energy from certain posters that cropped up around the time of the Covid play-in series. Cart before horse. Etc.

Oh my. Such a perfect description for it.

 

[AwesomeInTheory]

Benning only wanted people in power that agreed with him, anytime someone had dissenting views they were let go (Gilman, Linden, Brackett, etc.). Which is the opposite of most successful management groups and is poetically the reason we drafted Pettersson. Funny how Benning couldn’t appreciate this and maintained his dysfunctional approach to management until being shitcanned for incompetence.

Yeah, and it's weird that everyone who left the organization under Benning's tenure (who were in prominent positions) all hinted or intimated that disagreement was the issue.

Linden confirmed it in a radio interview (that people still challenge the meaning on.)

Gilman (or Henning, I can't remember which one it was) gave an interview where they danced around the topic of agreement/consensus and it was pretty clear what it was about.

Brackett's situation was well documented.

Crawford was another one that was pretty interesting, as well.

This summarizes why the decision to drop some dudes was questionable:

Canucks fire front office executives Laurence Gilman, Lorne Henning, Eric Crawford

<p align="center" style="font-size: 10px"><img src="//thenationnetwork...

canucksarmy.com

(Incidentally, the firing of Gilman/Henning/Crawford coincided with the Canucks entering cap hell, needing help from the NHL head office with paperwork, and the drafting going to shit with the worst draft since 2007*)


* = I say that because 90~ NHL GP, with including a first rounder is pretty bad. There are cases to be made with 2011 and 2010 as well, so, asterisk.

 

[hookshott]

Looking at what we paid for Lindholm and look at what Dallas paid for Tanev, I have to wonder if our management team is all that sharp after all?

 

[Vector]

 

[dez]

Looking at what we paid for Lindholm and look at what Dallas paid for Tanev, I have to wonder if our management team is all that sharp after all?

Lindholm price was always a rumored to be a roster player, prospect and a first. They were able to get out from a $5M commitment next year and gave up only one prospect worth a damn. Tanev's return was expected a 2nd and a prospect on par with D.Petey.

 

[andora]

Lindholm price was always a rumored to be a roster player, prospect and a first. They were able to get out from a $5M commitment next year and gave up only one prospect worth a damn. Tanev's return was expected a 2nd and a prospect on par with D.Petey.

You took the bait!!!

 

[valkynax]

Mr. Clean and Moleman came through yet again, made the best out of a pretty dicey and potentially disastrous situation.

I actually can't recall the last time I looked at the approaching date for TDL and not recoil in absolute horror.

 

[arttk]

Mr. Clean and Moleman came through yet again, made the best out of a pretty dicey and potentially disastrous situation.

I actually can't recall the last time I looked at the approaching date for TDL and not recoil in absolute horror.

I think you should give more respect to JR.

 

[CpatainCanuck]

Lindholm price was always a rumored to be a roster player, prospect and a first. They were able to get out from a $5M commitment next year and gave up only one prospect worth a damn. Tanev's return was expected a 2nd and a prospect on par with D.Petey.

Unless the Canucks win the cup this year they just weakened their future for a 1-year rental. So far Lindholm has been a complete non-factor at best. Hopefully he improves.

 

[MarkMM]

Unless the Canucks win the cup this year they just weakened their future for a 1-year rental. So far Lindholm has been a complete non-factor at best. Hopefully he improves.

True, but a sensible risk to take, and getting out of Kuzmenko's contract for next year when he clearly wasn't working out here and may have had declining value if we held on to him is not nothing.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

Looking at what we paid for Lindholm and look at what Dallas paid for Tanev, I have to wonder if our management team is all that sharp after all?

There's a significant difference between Lindholm and Tanev. While he isn't working out here, he was the biggest fish on the market and several teams were interested. We also paid to essentially dump Kuzmenko who is now getting healthy scratched on the sorry Flames roster. The longer we kept him, the more that off season cost to dump him would have become.

 

[geebaan]

Oh my. Such a perfect description for it.

The Kings young guys are only being hoisted up by their good veterans.

The Kings young guys this year, “and I took that personally”.

 

[Cogburn]

A quick, dirty, and probably incomplete history of Ruthervin so far with the Canucks:

Staffing has seen us lose/replace just about everyone. We did keep Clark, and are still a goalie factory as a result. I don't like the dismissal of Boudreau, and I wish we could have kept Judd Brackett, both of which could have been solved by firing Benning much earlier, but that's not on Allvin/Rutherford.

Signings, one massive buyout, and who we've let walk has been pretty good.

I couldn't find an easy copy and paste grid for this, but we lost Bear, Burroughs, Delia and Martin as UFAs, bought out Ekman-Larsson (a great short term move that hopefully becomes less impactful then it looks as the cap goes up), resigned Miller, Hoglander, Pettersson, DiGiuseppe, Brisebois, and Boeser, and added Nielsen, Hirose, McWard, Bains, Joshua, Soucy, Cole, Blueger, Suter, Mikheyev and Kuzmenko.

Edit: Aman and Lazar were also signed, Juulsen, Wolanin and Martin got new contracts under the new regime. Martin was a waiver wire loss too, my mistake. Thanks @Vector

Trades are looking overall quite good:

Calgary Flames Acquire:​ Andrei Kuzmenko · $5,500,000 Joni Jurmo · $0 (AHL/JR) (Signing Rights) Hunter Brzustewicz · $0 (AHL/JR) (Signing Rights) 2024 1st round pick (VAN) 2024 4th round pick (NJD) [Conditional]* *Conditions: 1. The 4th round pick becomes a 3rd round pick (VAN) if Vancouver makes it to the conference finals. 2. If the pick remains a 4th, Calgary will receive the better of the two picks that Vancouver currently owns (VAN & NJD) Sum: $5,500,000 Change: +$650,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Elias Lindholm · $4,850,000 Sum: $4,850,000 Change: -$650,000
San Jose Sharks Acquire:​ Jack Studnicka · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: $0	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Nick Cicek · $0 (AHL/JR) 2024 6th round pick (SJS) Sum: $0 Change: $0
Calgary Flames Acquire:​ 2024 5th round pick (CHI) [Conditional]* 2026 3rd round pick (VAN) *Conditions: Calgary will receive the best of the 5th round picks that Chicago owns Sum: $0 Change: -$3,750,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Nikita Zadorov · $3,750,000 Sum: $3,750,000 Change: +$3,750,000
Chicago Blackhawks Acquire:​ Anthony Beauvillier · $4,150,000 Sum: $4,150,000 Change: +$4,150,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ 2024 5th round pick (CHI) [Conditional]* *Conditions: Vancouver will receive the best of the 5th round picks that Chicago owns Sum: $0 Change: -$4,150,000
Pittsburgh Penguins Acquire:​ Jack Rathbone · $0 (AHL/JR) Karel Plasek · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: $0	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Mark Friedman · $0 (AHL/JR) Ty Glover · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: $0
Toronto Maple Leafs Acquire:​ 2024 5th round pick (VAN) Sum: $0 Change: -$1,150,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Sam Lafferty · $1,150,000 Sum: $1,150,000 Change: +$1,150,000
Montreal Canadiens Acquire:​ Tanner Pearson · $3,250,000 2025 3rd round pick (VAN) Sum: $3,250,000 Change: +$1,450,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Casey DeSmith · $1,800,000 Sum: $1,800,000 Change: -$1,450,000
New York Rangers Acquire:​ Wyatt Kalynuk · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: $0	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Future Considerations Sum: $0 Change: $0
New Jersey Devils Acquire:​ Curtis Lazar · $1,000,000 Sum: $1,000,000 Change: +$1,000,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ 2024 4th round pick (NJD) Sum: $0 Change: -$1,000,000
Detroit Red Wings Acquire:​ 2023 1st round pick (NYI - #17 - Axel Sandin Pellikka) [Conditional] 2023 2nd round pick (VAN - #43 - Felix Nilsson) Sum: $0 Change: -$4,400,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Filip Hronek · $4,400,000 2023 4th round pick (DET - #105 - Ty Mueller) Sum: $4,400,000 Change: +$4,400,000
Toronto Maple Leafs Acquire:​ Luke Schenn · $850,000 Sum: $850,000 Change: +$850,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ 2023 3rd round pick (TOR - #89 - Sawyer Mynio) Sum: $0 Change: -$850,000
Buffalo Sabres Acquire:​ Riley Stillman · $1,350,000 Sum: $1,350,000 Change: +$1,350,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Josh Bloom · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $0 Change: -$1,350,000
New York Rangers Acquire:​ William Lockwood · $0 (AHL/JR) 2026 7th round pick (VAN) Sum: $0 Change: -$875,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Vitali Kravtsov · $875,000 Sum: $875,000 Change: +$875,000
New York Islanders Acquire:​ Bo Horvat ($1,375,000 retained - 25%) · $4,125,000 Sum: $4,125,000 Change: -$25,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Anthony Beauvillier · $4,150,000 Aatu Räty · $0 (AHL/JR) 2023 1st round pick (NYI - #17 - Axel Sandin Pellikka) [Conditional]* *Conditions: The pick becomes an unprotected 2024 1st round pick if it is in the top 12. Result: Vancouver receives the 2023 1st round pick Sum: $4,150,000 Change: +$25,000
Carolina Hurricanes Acquire:​ 2023 5th round pick (VAN - #139 - Charles-Alexis Legault) Sum: $0 Change: -$1,800,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Ethan Bear ($400,000 retained - 18.2%) · $1,800,000 Lane Pederson · $0 (AHL/JR) Sum: $1,800,000 Change: +$1,800,000
Boston Bruins Acquire:​ Michael DiPietro · $0 (AHL/JR) Jonathan Myrenberg · $0 (AHL/JR) (Signing Rights) Sum: $0 Change: -$762,500	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Jack Studnicka · $762,500 Sum: $762,500 Change: +$762,500
Chicago Blackhawks Acquire:​ Jason Dickinson · $2,650,000 2024 2nd round pick (VAN) Sum: $2,650,000 Change: +$1,300,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Riley Stillman · $1,350,000 Sum: $1,350,000 Change: -$1,300,000
New York Rangers Acquire:​ Tyler Motte · $1,225,000 Sum: $1,225,000 Change: +$1,225,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ 2023 4th round pick (NYR - #119 - Matthew Perkins) Sum: $0 Change: -$1,225,000
Toronto Maple Leafs Acquire:​ 2022 3rd round pick (WPG - #79 - Jordan Gustafson) Sum: $0 Change: -$1,500,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ Travis Dermott · $1,500,000 Sum: $1,500,000 Change: +$1,500,000
Ottawa Senators Acquire:​ Travis Hamonic · $3,000,000 Sum: $3,000,000 Change: +$3,000,000	Vancouver Canucks Acquire:​ 2022 3rd round pick (VAN - #80 - Elias Pettersson) Sum: $0 Change: -$3,000,000

Only one case of "buying" cap space, and getting net positive returns for spare parts, pieces we couldn't keep or less desirable assets.

So far the singular draft has looked promising:

• Round 1, Pick 11: Tom Willander, D, Sweden
• Round 3, Pick 75: Hunter Brzustewicz, D, Kitchener
• Round 3, Pick 89: Sawyer Mynio, D, Seattle
• Round 4, Pick 105: Ty Mueller, C, Nebraska-Omaha
• Round 4, Pick 107: Vilmer Alriksson, LW, Djurgarden Jr.
• Round 6, Pick 171: Aiden Celebrini, D, Brooks

Was I drunk? 2022 was also Allvin...good call @Frankie Blueberries

• Round 1, Pick No. 15: Jonathan Lekkerimaki, RW (Sweden)
• Round 3, Pick No. 80: Elias Pettersson, D, Orebro (Sweden)
• Round 4, Pick No. 112: Daimon Gardner, C, Warroad (High School-MN)
• Round 5, Pick No. 144: Ty Young, G, Prince George Cougars (WHL)
• Round 6, Pick No. 176: Jackson Dorrington, D, Des Moines Buccaneers (USHL)
• Round 7, Pick No. 208: Kirill Kudryavtsev, D, Sault Ste. Marie Greyhounds (OHL)

We have 24 million in cap space to resign or replace Hronek, Myers, Zadorov, Cole, Friedman, DeSmith, Joshua, Lindholm, Blueger and Lafferty, have a low number of picks this year and a good number the following years, we look to be buyers this year, and for the first time since Gillis, I feel secure as a fan going into the trade deadline. This is even counting the "what the hell" moments around Horvat, Hronek, Boudreau, Schenn and Lindholm that I really didn't wholly understand.

 

[Frankie Blueberries]

@Cogburn management has had two drafts - 2022 and 2023.

 

[Vector]

@Cogburn Minor thing but Martin was claimed on waivers by the Blue Jackets. He didn’t leave as a UFA.

Aman was signed as a free agent so he should be there. Since you included Kuzmenko, you should have Lazar here.

Juulsen, Wolanin, and Martin were also all re-signed.

 

[timw33]

True, but a sensible risk to take, and getting out of Kuzmenko's contract for next year when he clearly wasn't working out here and may have had declining value if we held on to him is not nothing.

Some dumps of the past few years:

Monahan 6MM x 1 cost a 1st
M.Staal 5.7MM x 1 cost a 2nd
Marleau 6.25MM x 1 cost a 1st (13th OV)
Stralman 5.5MM x 1 cost a 2nd + prospect
Zaitsev 4.5MM x 1 cost 2nd + 4th
Ghost at 4.1MM x 2 cost a 2nd + 2nd
Nemeth 3.25MM x 2 cost a 2nd + 2nd
Kassian 3.2MM x 2 cost a 2nd + 3rd
Dickinson 2.65MM x 2 cost a 2nd

Will also throw in the Pearson 3.25MM x 1 being dumped with a 3rd to get DeSmith (a net 1.35MM cap gain)

So, fair to say that Kuzmenko with cratering value was going to cost at minimum a 2nd to dump after this season was done, and for the 1.5 years left on his deal probably trending closer to a 2nd + 2nd/3rd.

 

[Hodgy]

Some dumps of the past few years:

Monahan 6MM x 1 cost a 1st
M.Staal 5.7MM x 1 cost a 2nd
Marleau 6.25MM x 1 cost a 1st (13th OV)
Stralman 5.5MM x 1 cost a 2nd + prospect
Zaitsev 4.5MM x 1 cost 2nd + 4th
Ghost at 4.1MM x 2 cost a 2nd + 2nd
Nemeth 3.25MM x 2 cost a 2nd + 2nd
Kassian 3.2MM x 2 cost a 2nd + 3rd
Dickinson 2.65MM x 2 cost a 2nd

Will also throw in the Pearson 3.25MM x 1 being dumped with a 3rd to get DeSmith (a net 1.35MM cap gain)

So, fair to say that Kuzmenko with cratering value was going to cost at minimum a 2nd to dump after this season was done, and for the 1.5 years left on his deal probably trending closer to a 2nd + 2nd/3rd.

I haven’t researched this, @Vector bat signal, but I feel like it may be easier to dump players mid season to deadline rather than off season or early season.