Mackinnon vs Matthews

[blinds]

MacKinnon is having a career year he won't touch again. Matthews for sure from next year onwards (though I also don't think Matthews will have a season like Mackinnon is having right now)

What in the world makes you think that? He's 22 on a young and improving team. How many players peak at 22? I really don't understand how people on this site talk with such certainty about players so young.

 

[besser]

That's cute, but if you want a reasonable response, come up with a something better than an embarrassing comparison (Heatley got 100pts btw genius) and a piss poor prediction.

How is that a piss poor prediction? That, even if my claims are usually outlandish, is a true claim. Matthews won’t ever likely sniff 100 points. Odds are against him to do so. What is your argument for saying he will? I am a person who is a realist, you leaf fans overate the hell out of your players, so who really is in the wrong here? Remember Leaf Fan, it was your delusional fan base that suggested gems such as Matthews > McDavid and suggesting Marner AND Nylander would both crack 90 points, not to mention the Kapanen 60 points argument. And before you use the excuse ‘where did anyone ever even say that, find me an example’ it is common knowledge on these boards that your delusional fan base overrates your players all to hell. I’m happy you guys are having a great second season, but don’t forget about your 2 decades of bad hockey.

 

[nobody]

How is that a piss poor prediction? That, even if my claims are usually outlandish, is a true claim. Matthews won’t ever likely sniff 100 points. Odds are against him to do so. What is your argument for saying he will? I am a person who is a realist, you leaf fans overate the hell out of your players, so who really is in the wrong here? Remember Leaf Fan, it was your delusional fan base that suggested gems such as Matthews > McDavid and suggesting Marner AND Nylander would both crack 90 points, not to mention the Kapanen 60 points argument. And before you use the excuse ‘where did anyone ever even say that, find me an example’ it is common knowledge on these boards that your delusional fan base overrates your players all to hell. I’m happy you guys are having a great second season, but don’t forget about your 2 decades of bad hockey.

So the guy who is so obsessed with the Leafs that he has Auston Matthews superman profile photo is calling Leafs fan base delusional.

Seems about right.



Jealousy doesn't suit certain Canucks fans.

 

[besser]

So the guy who is so obsessed with the Leafs that he has Auston Matthews superman profile photo is calling Leafs fan base delusional.

Seems about right.

Very obsessed. He is generational.

 

[nobody]

Very obsessed. He is generational.

Well, I'm glad you're the one who said it. Don't pin that claim on the Leafs fan base. I however do agree that he is generational though.

 

[besser]

So the guy who is so obsessed with the Leafs that he has Auston Matthews superman profile photo is calling Leafs fan base delusional.

Seems about right.



Jealousy doesn't suit certain Canucks fans.

Lol, you guys are enjoying your second season of good play, out of what, 2 decades? I’m far from jealous, I’m happy the Canucks were a great team in the early 2010’s. They gave us a lot of great memories and gave us a taste of what it is like to go far in the playoffs. Let me know when your Leafs get past the first round.

 

[besser]

Well, I'm glad you're the one who said it. Don't pin that claim on the Leafs fan base. I however do agree that he is generational though.

So not one leaf fan has claimed Matthews to be generational on HF Boards? Hahahahahaha

 

[Atomos2]

Well, I'm glad you're the one who said it. Don't pin that claim on the Leafs fan base. I however do agree that he is generational though.

I think its best to ignore him. Some Vancouver fans just need something else to do rather than watch their team.

 

[Regal]

one great season doesnt mean hes forever better. I love Mac and all but one year ago I think this poll wouldve been 80-15 Matthews.

Another classic case of what have you done for me lately.

This would be a really weak example of what have you done for me lately. That's an issue when an established player has a bad year or even half a year, and another player has a single season at a level of that established player's usual level of play. But MacKinnon is playing this year at a level far above what Matthews has shown so far, and Matthews has played barely over a season and a half of games, so MacKinnon's year of being better is already a large chunk of Matthews' sample size.

 

[nobody]

This would be a really weak example of what have you done for me lately. That's an issue when an established player has a bad year or even half a year, and another player has a single season at a level of that established player's usual level of play. But MacKinnon is playing this year at a level far above what Matthews has shown so far, and Matthews has played barely over a season and a half of games, so MacKinnon's year of being better is already a large chunk of Matthews' sample size.

56 games vs. 135 games

OR

56 games this year vs. 300 other games MacK has played

Sample sizes do matter. That said, there's no question Mack has been on a whole other level offensively this year compared to everyone (including Matthews).

 

[Regal]

56 games vs. 135 games

OR

56 games this year vs. 300 other games MacK has played

Sample sizes do matter. That said, there's no question Mack has been on a whole other level offensively this year compared to everyone (including Matthews).

Sure, but there's a big difference between a player playing the smaller sample at another level and playing it at a level the other player has regularly hit. Calling MacKinnon now better than Crosby, Malkin or McDavid based on this year would be premature, and worthy of the "what have you done for me lately" tag. But compared to Matthews going forward, he's made it a legitimate discussion

 

[snipes]

Sure, but there's a big difference between a player playing the smaller sample at another level and playing it at a level the other player has regularly hit. Calling MacKinnon now better than Crosby, Malkin or McDavid based on this year would be premature, and worthy of the "what have you done for me lately" tag. But compared to Matthews, it's made it a legitimate discussion

Matthews is still well below a PPG over his career after 135 games.

Malkin, McDavid, Crosby are well over a PPG right from the beginning of their careers. Different scenario all together.

 

[Regal]

Matthews is still well below a PPG over his career after 135 games.

Malkin, McDavid, Crosby are well over a PPG right from the beginning of their careers. Different scenario all together.

Kind of my point

 

[hockeyguy1967]

A guy in his fifth year in the league vs a guy in his second year in the league. A guy who's first four seasons do not come even remotely close to what the other guy did in his first. A guy who is now having an incredible season vs a guy who is playing very well but struggling with injuries. Mackinnon is arguably the best player in the NHL this year, but I'm taking Matthews.

MacKinnon had a better PPG in the regular season and playoffs his rookie season.

 

[hockeyguy1967]

Matthews is the best 60 point player who ever lived according to Leaf fans here lol. MacKinnon needs to prove it more then one season too.

 

[Eltuna]

What in the world makes you think that? He's 22 on a young and improving team. How many players peak at 22? I really don't understand how people on this site talk with such certainty about players so young.

In general I’d agree, but even as an avs fan, I’d probably agree this is going to be Mack’s career year. Not because he won’t continue to be good, but because this year he’s just playing insane. To put his 1.36 ppg into perspective, Ovechkins best is 1.36, Malkins best is 1.37, Mcdavids best is 1.21, and Crosbys best is 1.60. Mackinnons good, but right now he’s playing at a peak Malkin/Ovechkin level, a level a guy like Mcdavid has yet to play at.

 

[amnesiac]

This would be a really weak example of what have you done for me lately. That's an issue when an established player has a bad year or even half a year, and another player has a single season at a level of that established player's usual level of play. But MacKinnon is playing this year at a level far above what Matthews has shown so far, and Matthews has played barely over a season and a half of games, so MacKinnon's year of being better is already a large chunk of Matthews' sample size.

MacKinnon is older and has 3.5 more years of experience. This is "who do you take going forward" not today.

I mean, have you guys forgotten that Mac wasnt so great after his rookie season for the next 3 seasons?

 

[Tobias Kahun]

one great season doesnt mean hes forever better. I love Mac and all but one year ago I think this poll wouldve been 80-15 Matthews.

Another classic case of what have you done for me lately.

So why is Matthews ahead then, he has never had a season above a PPG

 

[Regal]

MacKinnon is older and has 3.5 more years of experience. This is "who do you take going forward" not today.

I mean, have you guys forgotten that Mac wasnt so great after his rookie season for the next 3 seasons?

I don't think anyone's forgetting his extra experience, older age or his stagnating production, prior to this year, but they're the only things that make it a worthy discussion, because if Mac was doing this in his 2nd season, it'd be an easy choice. He's also still only 22 and was always incredibly talented, the question was just whether he could put it together. He's showing this year he can. Obviously the question is how closely he can maintain it and how much Matthews can improve. I don't think either is a wrong choice. But I don't think picking Mac is premature based on this season.

 

[olli]

Not factoring in contracts it's pretty even but factoring in contracts its for sure Mackinnon.

 

[UsernameWasTaken]

Hard decision...I went with Matthews...probably driven by a bias from living in Toronto, seeing him play more, Leafs are my #2 team...tend to default towards preferring those players.

 

[El Travo]

MacKinnon. Now and future.

 

[22FUTON9]

Close, could go either way but homer vote to Mackinnon

I'm just happy mackinnons beig compared to matthews and eichel instead of RNH and Nylander

 

[Mr Serious]

matthews. he'll be the better player

How do you know?

 

[KoozNetsOff 92]

In general I’d agree, but even as an avs fan, I’d probably agree this is going to be Mack’s career year. Not because he won’t continue to be good, but because this year he’s just playing insane. To put his 1.36 ppg into perspective, Ovechkins best is 1.36, Malkins best is 1.37, Mcdavids best is 1.21, and Crosbys best is 1.60. Mackinnons good, but right now he’s playing at a peak Malkin/Ovechkin level, a level a guy like Mcdavid has yet to play at.

Numbers are way off.
OV 09/10: 1.51 PPG
Malkin 11/12: 1.45 PPG

So no, MacK isn't playing at that level. Although I think he has been the best player in the league this season.