OT: LOCAL COVID19 - PART I... Seriously, local only

[Emerica]

I wasn’t talking about fully vaccinated.

Might want to make it clear next time.

That’s not that important.

I know its your shtick on here to present your opinion as a fact with little to no evidence but yeah, you don't get to chose what is the important metric and which isn't to fit your agenda. I'm sure you're a very smart person but I very much doubt you have the knowledge to make those claims. I'll stick to the opinion of actual experts and scientists who contradict pretty much everything you've said up to this point.

No country is waiting until everyone has double doses to open up.

No one said that either.

The most important metric is getting everyone possible with one dose.

Source? That is the strategy Canada opted to go with because of lack of supply.

evidence and data are showing countries are doing extremely well with the majority having one dose. UK,US, Germany, Israel are all showing this right now. Canada will be virtually fully open by July —August.

All those countries you've listed save Germany have above 31% fully vaccinated. We are definitely not going to hit that mark by July so you're comparing apples to oranges.

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

Might want to make it clear next time.

I know its your shtick on here to present your opinion as a fact with little to no evidence but yeah, you don't get to chose what is the important metric and which isn't to fit your agenda. I'm sure you're a very smart person but I very much doubt you have the knowledge to make those claims. I'll stick to the opinion of actual experts and scientists who contradict pretty much everything you've said up to this point.


No one said that either.


Source? That is the strategy Canada opted to go with because of lack of supply.


All those countries you've listed save Germany have above 31% fully vaccinated. We are definitely not going to hit that mark by July so you're comparing apples to oranges.

I wouldn’t be so sure about that. Canada has a ton of supply coming and people are already having their second doses moved up to a new date. I bet we could be at that figure by end of July.

 

[Stylizer1]

How do you think COVID got into the long term care homes? In many cases it was from people who didn't follow the rules. I've witnessed numerous examples of family, friends, colleagues and neighbours who broke the rules. You have examples on here of people breaking the rules.

Not true. At the beginning no one knew anything about the virus and many people unknowingly brought it in. There are definitely cases where some homes were negligent but overall the majority of the deaths happened in the first wave.

 

[Stylizer1]

Wuhan lab staff sought hospital care before COVID-19 outbreak disclosed: report | Ottawa Sun

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Wuhan lab staff sought hospital care before COVID-19 outbreak disclosed: report | Ottawa Sun

I don't think we'll ever get to the truth.

I don't think people really want to know the reality, that pretty much every technically advanced country has labs that are making (or at least refining) viruses that could be The One to wipe out humanity sometime in the future.

Civilization is on a razors' edge, and has been since we split the atom.

 

[JD1]

Lol. The US have 38% fully vaccinated, we have 4%. We definitely dont have more vaccination than them.

I won't mention the rest of your bro-sciency post.

Well, you are correct in terms of fully vaccinated

However late last week we crossed a threshold where a higher percentage of Canadians had a first jab than Americans

That was highly publicized

 

[JD1]

Dude I transport patients every day that I am at work to the hospital that are horribly sick with Covid and they have already been vaccinated. The hospitals are filled with sick Covid patients patients that have already been vaccinated. My fellow paramedics who are fully vaccinated are still getting sick.

Even those that are vaccinated, test positive but are asymptomatic can still infect others around them.

So to suggest that ten vaccinated people get together because it causes no risk to the community is completely misinformed and totally asinine.

Please show me the data which says that Canada is more vaccinated than the US currently.

You must be the most unlucky son of a bitch on the planet

You're a paramedic. We get it. You transport people to hospitals every day with covid? Either all the other paramedics also transport covid patients every day or you're one unlucky guy.

Maybe the dispatchers pick on you? Suspected covid pickup in Kanata. Lets send DJB.

If you're transporting covid patients every day, so are all the other paramedics. You do know that they publish data every day right?

New cases
Hospitalizations
ICUs

What you're saying and that data don't jive and quite frankly that old phrase about not believing everything you read on the internet is relevant here

Here's one for you. Google tells me there are 450 paramedics in Ottawa. I had no idea what the number was, but good old Google can answer just about anything. This website here
Ottawa COVID19
Tells us the current covid hospitalizations

Does that data and your story about daily transports to hospital line up?

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

I don't think we'll ever get to the truth.

I don't think people really want to know the reality, that pretty much every technically advanced country has labs that are making (or at least refining) viruses that could be The One to wipe out humanity sometime in the future.

Civilization is on a razors' edge, and has been since we split the atom.

The funny thing is that early on anyone who brought this theory to light was immediately met with criticism, general public and experts. Fast forward to current time and now that mainstream media picks up on the story of the plausibility of the virus originating elsewhere and its deemed as normal and not fake news.

Point is, news will only be news when they make it out to be and the masses will take it as such while anyone who disagrees gets ostracized

 

[DJB]

You must be the most unlucky son of a bitch on the planet

You're a paramedic. We get it. You transport people to hospitals every day with covid? Either all the other paramedics also transport covid patients every day or you're one unlucky guy.

Maybe the dispatchers pick on you? Suspected covid pickup in Kanata. Lets send DJB.

If you're transporting covid patients every day, so are all the other paramedics. You do know that they publish data every day right?

New cases
Hospitalizations
ICUs

What you're saying and that data don't jive and quite frankly that old phrase about not believing everything you read on the internet is relevant here

Here's one for you. Google tells me there are 450 paramedics in Ottawa. I had no idea what the number was, but good old Google can answer just about anything. This website here
Ottawa COVID19
Tells us the current covid hospitalizations

Does that data and your story about daily transports to hospital line up?

Sadly of those 450, only about half are currently road medics. The rest are in the office or not working at the moment due to injury.

Even if 450 were working on the road, that number would have to be divided in 4 to cover all the days and night shifts for each day of the month.

You realize that patients get transferred from hospital to hospital right? That the majority of us work in teams of 2?

Or that sometimes multiple units get activated and arrive at the same call and to help each other out?

I work 14 days a month (unless sick time or vacation)

Is it so inconceivable that I come across about 14 Covid patients in one months time?

Think about that

 

[JD1]

Sadly of those 450, only about half are currently road medics. The rest are in the office or not working at the moment due to injury.

Even if 450 were working on the road, that number would have to be divided in 4 to cover all the days and night shifts for each day of the month.

You realize that patients get transferred from hospital to hospital right? That the majority of us work in teams of 2?

Or that sometimes multiple units get activated and arrive at the same call and to help each other out?

I work 14 days a month (unless sick time or vacation)

Is it so inconceivable that I come across about 14 Covid patients in one months time?

Think about that

Hospital to hospital?

You said you transport vaccinated horribly sick covid patients every day you work

So here's the thing

Either what you've said is not very accurate

OR

The data on vaccination rates, sickness amongst the vaccinated and specifically hospitalizations amongst the vaccinated is not very accurate


You perform a function that is both admirable and necessary and i thank you for doing so but i just don't equate what your saying with what i am reading.

The math just doesn't add up.

 

[DJB]

Hospital to hospital?

You said you transport vaccinated horribly sick covid patients every day you work

So here's the thing

Either what you've said is not very accurate

OR

The data on vaccination rates, sickness amongst the vaccinated and specifically hospitalizations amongst the vaccinated is not very accurate


You perform a function that is both admirable and necessary and i thank you for doing so but i just don't equate what your saying with what i am reading.

The math just doesn't add up.

Dude. There are vaccinated sick patients at the hospitals as well that do get transported from hospital to hospital which Ottawa EMS take care of.

Let's do some math together;

450 medics ÷ 2 (for those injured either physically or mentally + office staff). = 225

225 ÷ 4 rotations to complete 4 12 hour shifts = 56.25

Now we have supervisors and PRU's...so let's subtract at minimum another 10 medics. = 46.25

46.25 ÷ 2 medics per truck= 23.125 trucks.

Now let's add in some vacation...so let's go with 20 trucks per shift.

Until you've walked a mile in my work boots you have no idea what my job is like or what it entails.

I've done the job for 10+ years. I know what the hell im talking about.

 

[Sens]

I got my vaccine this morning

So in two weeks I should be able to hit the gym
I feel as if all vaccinated people can gym

let’s get some immunity passports going so I can do whatever I want and laugh at the non vaxed that can’t

 

[Sens]

Dude. There are vaccinated sick patients at the hospitals as well that do get transported from hospital to hospital which Ottawa EMS take care of.

Let's do some math together;

450 medics ÷ 2 (for those injured either physically or mentally + office staff). = 225

225 ÷ 4 rotations to complete 4 12 hour shifts = 56.25

Now we have supervisors and PRU's...so let's subtract at minimum another 10 medics. = 46.25

46.25 ÷ 2 medics per truck= 23.125 trucks.

Now let's add in some vacation...so let's go with 20 trucks per shift.

Until you've walked a mile in my work boots you have no idea what my job is like or what it entails.

I've done the job for 10+ years. I know what the hell im talking about.

you make it sound like vaccines are pointless

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

We got this deep into the shit because we didn't listen to the people who saw what was going on firsthand, and it's nothing short of mind-boggling that the same thing still seems to be happening here. I'm much more inclined to believe that the numbers paint an incomplete picture than I am to believe that a paramedic who's directly involved in transporting sick patients is lying.

 

[DJB]

you make it sound like vaccines are pointless

Some vaccines do provide some form of protection vs the variants to varying degrees.

Does the vaccine help against normal Covid? Absolutely.

Can you still get Covid and pass it on to others even though you are vaccinated? Absolutely.

Does being vaccinated reduce the chances that you will be required to visit a hospital if you get sick with Covid? Absolutely.

Point is, vaccines are good but not perfect.

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

Does the vaccine help against normal Covid? Absolutely.

Can you still get Covid and pass it on to others even though you are vaccinated? Absolutely.

Does being vaccinated reduce the chances that you will be required to visit a hospital if you get sick with Covid? Absolutely.

Point is, vaccines are good but not perfect.

It’s scary that you’re spreading this misinformation. The vaccines are not pointless against variants at all. Have you even looked at any research on this topic?



Also your chances of being hospitalized after getting the vaccine aren’t just “reduced”. They are significantly reduced. Once you get two vaccines, the chances are almost zero.

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

We got this deep into the shit because we didn't listen to the people who saw what was going on firsthand, and it's nothing short of mind-boggling that the same thing still seems to be happening here. I'm much more inclined to believe that the numbers paint an incomplete picture than I am to believe that a paramedic who's directly involved in transporting sick patients is lying.

You should listen to experts such as Isaac Bogoch who understand the significance of vaccines and show the real data. The numbers are the numbers.

 

[YouGotAStuGoing]

You should listen to experts such as Isaac Bogoch who understand the significance of vaccines and show the real data. The numbers are the numbers.

I'm so glad you bring up Dr. Bogoch. I'm familiar with him from watching Global News and I agree that, of what I've seen, he's very credible. Check him out speaking here, starting at the 1:15 timestamp where he specifies that it's still possible to get the virus after being vaccinated — perfectly in line with what DJB has claimed.

The vaccines are not pointless against variants at all.

I'd also like to know who's making any claim in the inverse because, to my eyes, you're the first to bring this up in this thread. Or are you just setting up a strawman to knock down yourself?

 

[FormentonTheFuture]

I'm so glad you bring up Dr. Bogoch. I'm familiar with him from watching Global News and I agree that, of what I've seen, he's very credible. Check him out speaking here, starting at the 1:15 timestamp where he specifies that it's still possible to get the virus after being vaccinated — perfectly in line with what DJB has claimed.


I'd also like to know who's making any claim in the inverse because, to my eyes, you're the first to bring this up in this thread. Or are you just setting up a strawman to knock down yourself?

Nobody said it’s not possible to get the virus after getting the vaccine. The vaccines purpose is to significantly reduce hospitalization and virtually eliminate the chance of death. There is no data to support that tons of people are getting very sick after getting vaccinated.

DJB, in reply to Sens, originally said the vaccine was pointless against variants, until he edited his post 10 minutes ago. I didn’t say that for no reason. He corrected himself which is good.

the point is, the vaccines are very good and will put an end to any crisis here

 

[JD1]

Dude. There are vaccinated sick patients at the hospitals as well that do get transported from hospital to hospital which Ottawa EMS take care of.

Let's do some math together;

450 medics ÷ 2 (for those injured either physically or mentally + office staff). = 225

225 ÷ 4 rotations to complete 4 12 hour shifts = 56.25

Now we have supervisors and PRU's...so let's subtract at minimum another 10 medics. = 46.25

46.25 ÷ 2 medics per truck= 23.125 trucks.

Now let's add in some vacation...so let's go with 20 trucks per shift.

Until you've walked a mile in my work boots you have no idea what my job is like or what it entails.

I've done the job for 10+ years. I know what the hell im talking about.

You're right. I have no idea what your job is like

20 trucks. 2 shifts. If they're all running into covid patients daily it just doesn't add up to me.

This is what Ottawa public health reported today

Ottawa Public Health reporting 54 people in Ottawa hospitals with COVID-19 related illnesses on Sunday, down from 58 people on Saturday.

 

[Beech]

I don't think we'll ever get to the truth.

I don't think people really want to know the reality, that pretty much every technically advanced country has labs that are making (or at least refining) viruses that could be The One to wipe out humanity sometime in the future.

Civilization is on a razors' edge, and has been since we split the atom.

your fears should be getting worse!!!
https://phys.org/news/2018-10-vouching-vonnegut-polymer-room-temperature.html

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

your fears should be getting worse!!!
https://phys.org/news/2018-10-vouching-vonnegut-polymer-room-temperature.html

Dude, that's amazing!

Imagine having outdoor ice rinks around the city all year round!

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

Ok, but if if ten people who have vaccines decide to have a party tonight, there’s virtually no impact on the community and I wouldn’t say they’re being selfish.

The US has less vaccinations then us and is seeing a huge decline in Covid.

you will always have people who don’t get vaccines. That doesn’t mean we should wait on opening up because of that. The most vulnerable people have been vaccinated and that should be all that matters

Kind of misleading to suggest that they have less.

Until very recently, the US had more people vaccinated per capita than Canada and these markers are very close today.

But a huge percentage of those people have both doses, so their vaccination rate is actually significantly better than ours.

I'm going to add that Canada has had a total of 1.36m cases, which is approximately 3.5% of the population. The US is closer to 10% - these are people who are less likely to get vaccinated, less likely to contract it again, and are therefore less likely to spread it.

This higher number of fully vaccinated people in addition to the higher number of people who have contracted corona is why you're seeing such a decline in new cases despite the economy becoming more open.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

I’m going to skip my vaccine appointment Monday

no indoor dining till October
No gyms till October
No haircuts till August (I solved this one by finding a hairdresser on kijiji and setting up an appointment at her house)

and that’s if the plan goes well... no benefit to get the vaccine

Excellent advice.

I told my nephew to skip his drivers license test. There's nowhere to go, gyms are closed, nowhere to eat, the kid can't even get a haircut. What's the point in being able to drive to these places when they're all closed.

I found him a barber that will actually drive to his house though lol, so problem solved.

 

[Beech]

Dude, that's amazing!

Imagine having outdoor ice rinks around the city all year round!

Imagine it getting into nature and freezing all water. Say the oceans...we are dead.

Luckily entropy is our friend and this is very unlikely.