Last game at the Joe

[Red Stanley]

This thread exists because of the broken ass system in professional sports where it has become preferable to leverage the hell out of fan loyalty by sucking on purpose until the parity and lottery picks work out and you're not in the bottom of the league anymore instead of actually trying to manage a team. It's a race to the bottom until you're lucky enough to hit the jackpot.

All teams not in the playoffs should get the same chance at the top picks. From a fan standpoint, cheering for your team to lose feels so awkward to me. On that note, yes, absolutely try to win this game. Play like it's game 7 of the finals.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

What's the alternative to the draft as a concept?

There is not going to be any perfect solution, but I do like Red Stanley's idea. With the cap, revenue sharing, and everything else that pretty much drives everyone to the middle (towards parity) by equalizing resources, everyone should have an equal shot. If you suck and are at the bottom of the league? Get better. Make better managerial decisions. You'd also need to include some kind of bonus that is worth it for making the playoffs, because with a straight draw, why would an 8 seed go crazy to make it?

You could also do a reverse draft lottery based on most points since trade deadline. Picks 16-30 apply just the same as normal, but if you have a team like Ottawa last year that skyrockets in the second half but falls just short of the playoffs, you reward that play. I'd rather a team earn a high draft pick or better chance at one by working hard and playing well as opposed to finagling their roster to get as many losses as they can.

 

[dream43]

For the Last game at the Joe, I personally want a win with Riley Sheahen scoring the OT Winner

 

[Red Stanley]

There is not going to be any perfect solution, but I do like Red Stanley's idea. With the cap, revenue sharing, and everything else that pretty much drives everyone to the middle (towards parity) by equalizing resources, everyone should have an equal shot. If you suck and are at the bottom of the league? Get better. Make better managerial decisions. You'd also need to include some kind of bonus that is worth it for making the playoffs, because with a straight draw, why would an 8 seed go crazy to make it?

You could also do a reverse draft lottery based on most points since trade deadline. Picks 16-30 apply just the same as normal, but if you have a team like Ottawa last year that skyrockets in the second half but falls just short of the playoffs, you reward that play. I'd rather a team earn a high draft pick or better chance at one by working hard and playing well as opposed to finagling their roster to get as many losses as they can.

Exactly. Give an incentive to actively improve your team year-to-year and always try to stay as competitive as possible, because you never know when you're going to land that draft player who'll swing your fortunes. That will increase the overall quality of the game. Rewarding the nosedives of AHL-caliber teams damages the integrity of the competition.

 

[Retire91]

No matter what system is in place there will always be a system to protect the smaller markets from being outspent and from teams getting stuck at the bottom. All 30 teams know this system and the wings employed a strategy that was almost guaranteed to lead into decline.

All debates aside let's take out the Joe with a big win.

 

[ArGarBarGar]

There is not going to be any perfect solution, but I do like Red Stanley's idea. With the cap, revenue sharing, and everything else that pretty much drives everyone to the middle (towards parity) by equalizing resources, everyone should have an equal shot. If you suck and are at the bottom of the league? Get better. Make better managerial decisions. You'd also need to include some kind of bonus that is worth it for making the playoffs, because with a straight draw, why would an 8 seed go crazy to make it?

You could also do a reverse draft lottery based on most points since trade deadline. Picks 16-30 apply just the same as normal, but if you have a team like Ottawa last year that skyrockets in the second half but falls just short of the playoffs, you reward that play. I'd rather a team earn a high draft pick or better chance at one by working hard and playing well as opposed to finagling their roster to get as many losses as they can.

And how does a team do that while getting shafted in the draft lottery and being a low destination for free agents? Also when the reality is a team can't simply trade their way into a contender.

Not to mention there has not been a single team in recent memory that has only had to suck to build a contender and didn't make moves to supplement their elite talent.. The draft is meant to distribute talent in a cyclical fashion. The Wings had to suffer for decades before they finally got their magic pick (that wasn't even their first choice), and the only reason that worked out was BECAUSE management made the right moves to build them into a contender.

 

[Wingsfan 4 life]

I'll check out the pre-game ceremonies, but could care less about the game itself.

 

[Bench]

No matter what system is in place there will always be a system to protect the smaller markets from being outspent and from teams getting stuck at the bottom.

It's good for the health of the league. The Wings are only as healthy as the league. And teams fail if they don't get star players and win, with the exception of baked in hockey markets like Montreal or Toronto.

The "incentive" for franchises to win is usually financial. Put butts into seats, sell merch, and boost television deals. There are only a franchises that can survive forever being perpetually bad and with dwindling fan support.

As for the last game, sure, win. I'm pretty indifferent about the sendoff. I don't think the Joe is historic or anything, despite it's reputation as a great place for hockey. It's the building most of us grew up watching and is the backdrop for the Wings modern dynasty, but I'm not sure you can have a significant landmark legacy if Billy Joel has a longer career than the building.

 

[Sparkzuk]

Well I'm hoping panthers beat buffalo and dallas beats the avs (which shouldn't be hard right?). That way DET can lose to MTL and beat the crap out of NJD and still be in the same draft spot. I'm envious of those who can go watch the live NHL games best I can get around here is EIHL. Also if Sheahan could score 6 goals to beat Franzen's record and be the first player to score 5+ since Franzen t hat'd be great but here's hoping for just one haha.

 

[Frk It]

All teams not in the playoffs should get the same chance at the top picks. From a fan standpoint, cheering for your team to lose feels so awkward to me. On that note, yes, absolutely try to win this game. Play like it's game 7 of the finals.

There is not going to be any perfect solution, but I do like Red Stanley's idea. With the cap, revenue sharing, and everything else that pretty much drives everyone to the middle (towards parity) by equalizing resources, everyone should have an equal shot. If you suck and are at the bottom of the league? Get better. Make better managerial decisions. You'd also need to include some kind of bonus that is worth it for making the playoffs, because with a straight draw, why would an 8 seed go crazy to make it?

You could also do a reverse draft lottery based on most points since trade deadline. Picks 16-30 apply just the same as normal, but if you have a team like Ottawa last year that skyrockets in the second half but falls just short of the playoffs, you reward that play. I'd rather a team earn a high draft pick or better chance at one by working hard and playing well as opposed to finagling their roster to get as many losses as they can.

If you weren't a fan of a team with a 25 year playoff streak would you hold this opinion?

I sincerely doubt it.

Fans of the team that haven't drafted top 10 in 20 years want to fundamentally change how the draft works? Sorry guys, that reeks or self-interest.

 

[chances14]

Maybe I'm biased because I'll be at the game, but this kind of mentality towards what could be the last endearing moment we get for awhile as Wings fans is really sad to me.

it amuses me that people have so much hatred towards the current team that they are gonna let it ruin it for themselves.

 

[TheMule93]

The loss if it would put us ahead of Dallas in the draft

 

[jolly roger]

For the Last game at the Joe, I personally want a win with Riley Sheahen scoring the OT Winner

Bring your four leaf clovers for good luck for Sheahan to score.

 

[Red Stanley]

Biggest indicator that the system is fundamentally flawed: fans are cheering for losses and years of scraping rock bottom.

 

[jkutswings]

If you weren't a fan of a team with a 25 year playoff streak would you hold this opinion?

I sincerely doubt it.

Fans of the team that haven't drafted top 10 in 20 years want to fundamentally change how the draft works? Sorry guys, that reeks or self-interest.

Pretty much.

All those years that Detroit was the Cadillac franchise of the league, winning championships left and right, and boasting ridiculous amounts of talent? Yeah, there were plenty of teams that made smart moves, and still didn't sniff a title, and plenty of other teams that languished in either mediocrity or outright awfulness.

If you make smart moves, you get better, but whether you win it all or not, every run comes to an end, and then you need to pay the piper, hit the bottom, and hopefully draft well enough at the top to start ascending again. Exceptions to the rule do happen, but it's far and away the most common theme among all major sports, for the distribution of talent.

I'm happy that Detroit is finally approaching the bottom of the standings, because I don't think they have a realistic shot of becoming good again without it. Now they just need a front office that doesn't use a fun house mirror for self-examination.

 

[inthe6ix]

Is Howard starting tomorrow or Sunday?

 

[Red Stanley]

Pretty much.

All those years that Detroit was the Cadillac franchise of the league, winning championships left and right, and boasting ridiculous amounts of talent? Yeah, there were plenty of teams that made smart moves, and still didn't sniff a title, and plenty of other teams that languished in either mediocrity or outright awfulness.

If you make smart moves, you get better, but whether you win it all or not, every run comes to an end, and then you need to pay the piper, hit the bottom, and hopefully draft well enough at the top to start ascending again. Exceptions to the rule do happen, but it's far and away the most common theme among all major sports, for the distribution of talent.

I'm happy that Detroit is finally approaching the bottom of the standings, because I don't think they have a realistic shot of becoming good again without it. Now they just need a front office that doesn't use a fun house mirror for self-examination.

No, the point is if the post-cap NHL is serious about parity, there shouldn't be extreme rock bottoms anymore. The current format wants to keep most teams near each other, but encourages them to fail if they want to rise above the crowd. That's counter-intuitive. Teams out tanking each other for picks and fans cheering for losses is great, right?

 

[Frk It]

No, the point is if the post-cap NHL is serious about parity, there shouldn't be extreme rock bottoms anymore. The current format wants to keep most teams near each other, but encourages them to fail if they want to rise above the crowd. That's counter-intuitive. Teams out tanking each other for picks and fans cheering for losses is great, right?

Except Toronto and Edmonton fans aren't doing that now because they're in the playoffs. So it ends eventually. Which is the point of the system.

Also people exaggerate how much teams actually tank. Teams don't even really tank often at all.

 

[theYman]

Who's going to both games? I'll be there for Montreal and NJ. I hope they win too. The Montreal game doesn't matter. I'd like for us to give them some bruises though. At least my buddy hopes( Rags fan) we do.

 

[Syckle78]

Fun fact. In 1979 the wings tied the Quebec nordiques 4-4 in the last home game at olympia

I miss the nords. I don't miss ties.

 

[Marky9er]

I swear if they beat the habs I will lose any shred of hope remaining. I already doubt that we get an impact player in the draft this year but please have pick number 6 and allow 3 teams 1 through 5 to win the lottery if we don't. I can wait a year or two to experience the first overall selection. Oddly enough a high draft pick is about the only thing I have not seen as a fan. I remember Primeau kind of but I was pretty young and he didn't have such hysteric hype as Lindros in that era.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

I swear if they beat the habs I will lose any shred of hope remaining. I already doubt that we get an impact player in the draft this year but please have pick number 6 and allow 3 teams 1 through 5 to win the lottery if we don't. I can wait a year or two to experience the first overall selection. Oddly enough a high draft pick is about the only thing I have not seen as a fan. I remember Primeau kind of but I was pretty young and he didn't have such hysteric hype as Lindros in that era.

Primeau did have some decent hype though. Heck Bowman and Devellano thought enough of him they wanted to ship out Yzerman for a time...

 

[Syckle78]

I swear if they beat the habs I will lose any shred of hope remaining. I already doubt that we get an impact player in the draft this year but please have pick number 6 and allow 3 teams 1 through 5 to win the lottery if we don't. I can wait a year or two to experience the first overall selection. Oddly enough a high draft pick is about the only thing I have not seen as a fan. I remember Primeau kind of but I was pretty young and he didn't have such hysteric hype as Lindros in that era.

We'll be ok if we can be around the 6 spot. I think liljegren will be available there. Best case scenario is we steal him this year and are bad enough next year to draft a top flight offensive guy higher up.

 

[Syckle78]

Primeau did have some decent hype though. Heck Bowman and Devellano thought enough of him they wanted to ship out Yzerman for a time...

Right but we also had feds who would of been the obvious number 1c. We had an embarrassment of riches at center and Yzerman obviously would of brought back the most between him and prims. Thank God it got nixed and big 55 got shipped out.

 

[theYman]

Primeau did have some decent hype though. Heck Bowman and Devellano thought enough of him they wanted to ship out Yzerman for a time...

But we coulda had Jagr instead that year. You realize that? Can you imagine the possibilities? We would have gotten at least another cup maybe 2 more than the 97/98 in the 90s.