Player Discussion: Laine (Mod warning OP)

[Heldig]

So on the main board and in a few news articles it is stated Laine has formally asked for a trade. Is that correct? Or are they going by his flippant comments about being here for now?

 

[Hunter368]

So on the main board and in a few news articles it is stated Laine has formally asked for a trade. Is that correct? Or are they going by his flippant comments about being here for now?

Laine hasn't himself, but his legal representation has suggested it for the best of both parties......which legally speaking (if such as thing was a legal matter which it isn't) is as good as Laine as himself saying it. I admit it's a bit somatics but Laine obviously endorsed his agents saying it before they announced it. It was done to try strong arm the Jets into signing him to a lucrative long term deal, force his promotion to #1 line or trade him.

Personally I see both sides POV TBH, it's just one of those things that happen if life.......I've been in the same boat myself as Laine, meaning I've hit the glass ceiling in a two companies (obviously not Laine money haha) where I had no place left to grow/go and yet I knew my worth in the industry outside of my current company so I ended up leaving both companies. I hold no resentment towards them, it happens in hockey & business.

PS: If you see a fake news link or false link stating otherwise report it and I'll investigate it.

 

[wpgfishfan]

Where did you get those odds?

Playnow...Connor was 17-1

 

[wpgfishfan]

Where can we bet?

Playnow

 

[Huffer]

So elite that the Bruins and the flames moved Hamilton.

He is not worth a player like laine.

I would want more because we'd be getting Hamilton's 27+ years and the Canes would be getting Laine starting at 22. But Hamilton is a much better player than Pesce, and a true top pair RHD.

All things on the table though I'd rather get a younger player like PLD IF the Jets are looking to move Laine.

 

[Atoyot]

Playnow...Connor was 17-1

Byram 23:1, Zegras 29:1 for Calder. Might put some money on those.

 

[abax44]

This was nice to read (from Mike McIntyre):

— Laine was focused on defensive detail. At one point, he was the lone man back on a two-on-one, and he nicely broke it up before quickly turning the play the other way. That, even more than his ability to score, is what the team needs more of from him, and others.

— Logan Stanley is quicker. He’s never going to blow anyone away, but the 6-7 defenceman is definitely moving better than ever, which Maurice noted earlier in the week when singling him out as a player who has impressed. Stanley is going to start the season on the farm, but the 22-year-old first-rounder (2016) is getting closer to becoming a potential call-up option if he can continue his long development path. At one point, he and Lowry collided, and I think I felt the Earth shake a bit.

 

[scelaton]

.......

Personally I see both sides POV TBH, it's just one of those things that happen if life.......I've been in the same boat myself as Laine, meaning I've hit the glass ceiling in a two companies (obviously not Laine money haha) where I had no place left to grow/go and yet I knew my worth in the industry outside of my current company so I ended up leaving both companies. I hold no resentment towards them, it happens in hockey & business.

PS: If you see a fake news link or false link stating otherwise report it and I'll investigate it.

Maybe if you'd spent more evenings doing company work and playing less Fortnite, they would have given you the big contract

 

[Hunter368]

This was nice to read (from Mike McIntyre):

— Laine was focused on defensive detail. At one point, he was the lone man back on a two-on-one, and he nicely broke it up before quickly turning the play the other way. That, even more than his ability to score, is what the team needs more of from him, and others.

— Logan Stanley is quicker. He’s never going to blow anyone away, but the 6-7 defenceman is definitely moving better than ever, which Maurice noted earlier in the week when singling him out as a player who has impressed. Stanley is going to start the season on the farm, but the 22-year-old first-rounder (2016) is getting closer to becoming a potential call-up option if he can continue his long development path. At one point, he and Lowry collided, and I think I felt the Earth shake a bit.

Good to hear that about Laine. I always hated the Stanley pick, but hopefully we eventually we get some value from it.......even if it's low value. Having a bottom pairing Zadorov on our team isn't a horrible thing.

 

[PhilJets]

This was nice to read (from Mike McIntyre):

— Laine was focused on defensive detail. At one point, he was the lone man back on a two-on-one, and he nicely broke it up before quickly turning the play the other way. That, even more than his ability to score, is what the team needs more of from him, and others.

— Logan Stanley is quicker. He’s never going to blow anyone away, but the 6-7 defenceman is definitely moving better than ever, which Maurice noted earlier in the week when singling him out as a player who has impressed. Stanley is going to start the season on the farm, but the 22-year-old first-rounder (2016) is getting closer to becoming a potential call-up option if he can continue his long development path. At one point, he and Lowry collided, and I think I felt the Earth shake a bit.

He did that numerous times last year.
One resulting in a pretty goal fo him the other way.

 

[tntkid]

I would want more because we'd be getting Hamilton's 27+ years and the Canes would be getting Laine starting at 22. But Hamilton is a much better player than Pesce, and a true top pair RHD.

All things on the table though I'd rather get a younger player like PLD IF the Jets are looking to move Laine.

Trading an elite prospect forward for a rhd which we had a steady supply of a couple years ago is bad business.

True North would be a fool to move a player like Laine and lose a lot of fans.

Good luck to them filling the mts centre without our star players after this pandemic.

 

[Jet]

Watching a 'Laine's first 100 goals' video last night really made me pine for the old Laine. He really seemed to move up the ice so much faster and with purpose. His hands/ stickhandling seemed so much more slick, and he really used them well to get into scoring position or to to get the puck in a better spot to rip a shot.

His shot was so lethally accurate and his release was elite. We see a lot that people complained that he's not getting the puck in scoring position as much (passes to him not as good) but when you watch where he scored from, it was everywhere. He was 1T from near the blue line, in that spot in the circle, scoring from the opposite side, getting to the net and tipping it or just getting it in the slot and ripping it.

He is not nearly as effective or confident attacking with the puck at speed, beating defenders, and his shot has lost a lot of velocity and accuracy. I really hope he can get some of that back.

 

[ps241]

Watching a 'Laine's first 100 goals' video last night really made me pine for the old Laine. He really seemed to move up the ice so much faster and with purpose. His hands/ stickhandling seemed so much more slick, and he really used them well to get into scoring position or to to get the puck in a better spot to rip a shot.

His shot was so lethally accurate and his release was elite. We see a lot that people complained that he's not getting the puck in scoring position as much (passes to him not as good) but when you watch where he scored from, it was everywhere. He was 1T from near the blue line, in that spot in the circle, scoring from the opposite side, getting to the net and tipping it or just getting it in the slot and ripping it.

He is not nearly as effective or confident attacking with the puck at speed, beating defenders, and his shot has lost a lot of velocity and accuracy. I really hope he can get some of that back.

When he was a teenager he shot 18% for two seasons. For the last two seasons he has shot closer to 12%.

Both are significant sample sizes.

Keep in mind the alleged greatest goal scorer of all time Ovi has a career shooting % of 12.7 which isn’t elite. What he is elite at is shooting the puck more than anyone else ever.

Each season Patrik has been able to increase the amounts of shots per game he has taken which is positive and generally leads to more goals.

what has happened is after the first two seasons when as you said he was all world for accuracy that element is way less prevalent.

I know there is always a rush to blame everyone but Patrik for any minor shortcoming in his results but allow me to be delusional for a moment.

I think the change in results is either

regression to the mean meaning it was artificially too high when he broke in the league (probable)... artificially too low for the past two seasons (possible)?

He got injured and it’s impacted his shot (possible with back).

Goalies have figured out some tendencies (maybe but I don’t think to the extent we are seeing results change)

He has lost some confidence in his most lethal weapon (this ebb and flow happens to literally every shooter in the NHL and yea it’s a big part of it I think)

My prediction is he bounces back to just over 15% this season. I will be watching for that and also how many shots per game he generates this season. I am hoping that is where we see his biggest growth.

I am cheering for him to improve because that will be good for everyone whether he stay or goes.

 

[Jet]

When he was a teenager he shot 18% for two seasons. For the last two seasons he has shot closer to 12%.

Both are significant sample sizes.

Keep in mind the alleged greatest goal scorer of all time Ovi has a career shooting % of 12.7 which isn’t elite. What he is elite at is shooting the puck more than anyone else ever.

Each season Patrik has been able to increase the amounts of shots per game he has taken which is positive and generally leads to more goals.

what has happened is after the first two seasons when as you said he was all world for accuracy that element is way less prevalent.

I know there is always a rush to blame everyone but Patrik for any minor shortcoming in his results but allow me to be delusional for a moment.

I think the change in results is either

regression to the mean meaning it was artificially too high when he broke in the league (probable)... artificially too low for the past two seasons (possible)?

He got injured and it’s impacted his shot (possible with back).

Goalies have figured out some tendencies (maybe but I don’t think to the extent we are seeing results change)

He has lost some confidence in his most lethal weapon (this happens to literally every shooter in the NHL and yea it’s a big part of it I think)

My prediction is he bounces back to just over 15% this season. I will be watching for that and also how many shots per game he generates this season. I am hoping that is where we see his biggest growth.

I am cheering for him to improve because that will be good for everyone whether he stay or goes.

I'd say that is a very fair assessment and spot on. Here is where I see the main difference:

• Decision making/ craftiness and speed of attack when carrying the puck. He was beating players regularly with some nifty moves in that 17/18 season and now we see more turnbacks, dump ins and puck bobbles or failed moves. To me, that is confidence (and to some extent coaching)
• Willingness to shoot the puck and the confidence in the shot
• This to me is affecting his timing which is probably throwing off his release and accuracy.

Overall, I just don't think Laine is buying his own hype anymore, and I also still believe that lethal hit by McCabe changed Patrik.

 

[ps241]

I'd say that is a very fair assessment and spot on. Here is where I see the main difference:

• Decision making/ craftiness and speed of attack when carrying the puck. He was beating players regularly with some nifty moves in that 17/18 season and now we see more turnbacks, dump ins and puck bobbles or failed moves. To me, that is confidence (and to some extent coaching)
• Willingness to shoot the puck and the confidence in the shot
• This to me is affecting his timing which is probably throwing off his release and accuracy.

Overall, I just don't think Laine is buying his own hype anymore, and I also still believe that lethal hit by McCabe changed Patrik.

I think it would be a huge help to play with Stastny because Patrik knows in that case he is the shooter. His role with Paul is crystal clear but when he is with Mark he is playing with another really good shooter and I think at times he looks too hard at deferring.

He has lost some confidence and swagger in his shot but unless he is injured that can come roaring back. If he can improve his line driving a bit I think it could really come together this season. That would increase his time in the O zone and with Paul setting him up we could see his shot volume spike.

allot of “ifs” but hey it’s preseason when faith runs high with me. I have long maintained Patrik has another (all around) level to his game and hopefully this is the season.

 

[DRW204]

50 in 50 incoming.

 

[Gnova]

I don't think Laine is moved until the off season at the earliest.
Once the season starts and people have actually hockey to fill their broadcast time this quiets way way down.

 

[JetsUK]

I'd say that is a very fair assessment and spot on. Here is where I see the main difference:

• Decision making/ craftiness and speed of attack when carrying the puck. He was beating players regularly with some nifty moves in that 17/18 season and now we see more turnbacks, dump ins and puck bobbles or failed moves. To me, that is confidence (and to some extent coaching)
• Willingness to shoot the puck and the confidence in the shot
• This to me is affecting his timing which is probably throwing off his release and accuracy.

Overall, I just don't think Laine is buying his own hype anymore, and I also still believe that lethal hit by McCabe changed Patrik.

I def agree about that hit. I don't think he's been the same player since. The shooting, movement and creativity he was working with then was absolutely exhilarating. And then comes the journeyman McCabe.

I wonder whether that hit didn't have some impact on his back also. Hitting the ice in a dead flop is all kinds of dangerous.

 

[NotCommitted]

He had a 44 goal season after the hit...

 

[NotCommitted]

As for his shot, I don't think close to 20% shooting percentage is realistic from the areas he shoots from, unless he changes his game to more of a floating goal scorer, in which case he might be able to pull it off if he stays healthy and has his confidence going for him. The expectation that he'll be some sort of power forward two-way beast while scoring at will from any area inside the blue line is completely unrealistic. If he's constantly banged up and gassed from power-forwarding it in the corners, I would imagine it shows in his shooting effeciency. I think it's a balancing act between what you ask/demand from him as far as complete game goes. I'd like the wick to be turned back a bit more towards a shooter/goal scorer, that's not to say he should forget all about two-way game, just that goal scoring should be his #1 priority. I also hope continued physical development will aid in him staying fresh, I really think his shot hasn't been the same for the most part since 2019 or so. His one-timers seemed weaker and more off the mark, he used to shoot lasers where you couldn't even see the puck before it was in the net, not so much lately, though he's still been a good shooter, but he hasn't been the best in the world like he was for a couple seasons. Interested in seeing where all this goes.

Btw. not blaming it all on usage, coaching etc. though I think that's a big part. But I haven't seen him drive to the net much for example, which seems like a pretty good way to score goals for a big guy with smooth hands and in general his game hasn't seemed as naturally flowing as it could be. I'm sure trying to learn stuff plays a part in this, if you have to think too much you are always a bit late. Laine hasn't made it impossible to not give him top minutes, that's on him. At times I think he's tried too much to make coach and Scheif happy, I'd like to see the cocky and confident Laine back. That said I'm seriously starting to question the fit in the org, it's been 4 seasons and seemingly he still hasn't found his place in the line up and is still very much a "work in progress", it seems a bit bizarre to be honest. He's a young player, but he should be entering his prime soon, I think it's been a mess. I mean somehow a 44 goal "Winnipeg is good" guy who wants a long term deal has turned into a 30g scorer looking forward to being traded. Even if his ask was unrealistic, it's still been badly handled. Maybe he's a difficult personality to deal with, or he's been just horribly mismanaged by the Jets. Either case, it's not looking too great, but on the other hand the team getting back to winning ways and a good season for Laine and things might get back on track.

 

[Adam da bomb]

As for his shot, I don't think close to 20% shooting percentage is realistic from the areas he shoots from, unless he changes his game to more of a floating goal scorer, in which case he might be able to pull it off if he stays healthy and has his confidence going for him. The expectation that he'll be some sort of power forward two-way beast while scoring at will from any area inside the blue line is completely unrealistic. If he's constantly banged up and gassed from power-forwarding it in the corners, I would imagine it shows in his shooting effeciency. I think it's a balancing act between what you ask/demand from him as far as complete game goes. I'd like the wick to be turned back a bit more towards a shooter/goal scorer, that's not to say he should forget all about two-way game, just that goal scoring should be his #1 priority. I also hope continued physical development will aid in him staying fresh, I really think his shot hasn't been the same for the most part since 2019 or so. His one-timers seemed weaker and more off the mark, he used to shoot lasers where you couldn't even see the puck before it was in the net, not so much lately, though he's still been a good shooter, but he hasn't been the best in the world like he was for a couple seasons. Interested in seeing where all this goes.

Btw. not blaming it all on usage, coaching etc. though I think that's a big part. But I haven't seen him drive to the net much for example, which seems like a pretty good way to score goals for a big guy with smooth hands and in general his game hasn't seemed as naturally flowing as it could be. I'm sure trying to learn stuff plays a part in this, if you have to think too much you are always a bit late. Laine hasn't made it impossible to not give him top minutes, that's on him. At times I think he's tried too much to make coach and Scheif happy, I'd like to see the cocky and confident Laine back. That said I'm seriously starting to question the fit in the org, it's been 4 seasons and seemingly he still hasn't found his place in the line up and is still very much a "work in progress", it seems a bit bizarre to be honest. He's a young player, but he should be entering his prime soon, I think it's been a mess. I mean somehow a 44 goal "Winnipeg is good" guy who wants a long term deal has turned into a 30g scorer looking forward to being traded. Even if his ask was unrealistic, it's still been badly handled. Maybe he's a difficult personality to deal with, or he's been just horribly mismanaged by the Jets. Either case, it's not looking too great, but on the other hand the team getting back to winning ways and a good season for Laine and things might get back on track.

If the choices are between a pure goal scorer who will want 3 mil more or a two way player who we can have 3 mil less option is pretty clear.

 

[NotCommitted]

If the choices are between a pure goal scorer who will want 3 mil more or a two way player who we can have 3 mil less option is pretty clear.

I don't think those are the choices though.

 

[Adam da bomb]

I don't think those are the choices though.

They aren’t? He focuses on goal scoring and gets more and sacrifices rest of game can for more money than a 30 goal guy with a two way game. After we are often told goal scorers get paid the most and that it’s the best way to earn more.

 

[NotCommitted]

Jets forwards 5v5 goal differential leaders (on ice for at least 10 GF)

2016-2017
1. Scheif +13
2. Laine +7
3. Copp +5
4. Ehlers +4
5. Wheeler +1

2017-2018
1. Laine +18
2. Scheifele +13
3. Wheeler +12
4. Copp +11
5. Tanev +9
6. Ehlers +7
Connor+7

2018-2019
1. Copp +16
2. Lemieux +10
3. Appleton +9
4. Ehlers +4
5. Scheifele +3
...
Wheeler -1
Connor -7
Little -12
Laine -14

2019-2020
1. Ehlers +11
2. Laine +4
3. Scheifele +2
4. Wheeler 0
Roslovic 0


There was no cutoff for ice time or anything besides the 10 goal rule, so Lemieux & Appleton make the list for 18-19 with pretty small sample size, but Eakin and Little I omitted from 19-20 because they both were on ice for < 10 GF.

It's just one stat, but goes to show what a **** show 18-19 was and not just for Laine, though he was by far the worst.

19-20 was a bounce back for Laine, and taking into account the defence the Jets had, probably all of Ehlers, Laine, Scheif actually did really really well to stay above the water. Still it would seem Laine has been at his best in terms of goal differential when everyone was complaining about his one-dimensionality, though he did rely heavily on high scoring pct.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Jets forwards 5v5 goal differential leaders (on ice for at least 10 GF)

2016-2017
1. Scheif +13
2. Laine +7
3. Copp +5
4. Ehlers +4
5. Wheeler +1

2017-2018
1. Laine +18
2. Scheifele +13
3. Wheeler +12
4. Copp +11
5. Tanev +9
6. Ehlers +7
Connor+7

2018-2019
1. Copp +16
2. Lemieux +10
3. Appleton +9
4. Ehlers +4
5. Scheifele +3
...
Wheeler -1
Connor -7
Little -12
Laine -14

2019-2020
1. Ehlers +11
2. Laine +4
3. Scheifele +2
4. Wheeler 0
Roslovic 0


There was no cutoff for ice time or anything besides the 10 goal rule, so Lemieux & Appleton make the list for 18-19 with pretty small sample size, but Eakin and Little I omitted from 19-20 because they both were on ice for < 10 GF.

It's just one stat, but goes to show what a **** show 18-19 was and not just for Laine, though he was by far the worst.

19-20 was a bounce back for Laine, and taking into account the defence the Jets had, probably all of Ehlers, Laine, Scheif actually did really really well to stay above the water. Still it would seem Laine has been at his best in terms of goal differential when everyone was complaining about his one-dimensionality, though he did rely heavily on high scoring pct.

He can bounce back after signing a team friendly deal because his numbers are still low.