Post-Game Talk: Laffing Stock - The call-ups get it done in Winnipeg (Pens win 7-2)

[Gurglesons]

Lafferty reminds me more of Guentzel right now than Rust.

Nah. Jake’s goals in those first couple games were straight snipes and awareness plays. Lafferty’s are all effort and disruption.

 

[heysmilinstrange]

Going back to the set play discussion from a couple of pages ago, how can you tell it's a set play? I've never played before (um, if you couldn't already tell from my posts), so I'm just curious what to look for.

 

[DesertPenguin]

Gudbranson with just 12 ES minutes. The clock is definitely ticking on him with Marino's emergence. I'm still not totally sold on Pets as a top-4 D man, but it would be huge if he can thrive next to Schultz.

I think Guds lasts the season over JJ, but they either move him or let Schultz walk this summer. That lets Marino slot in full time.

It's telling that they put Guds in on his non dominant side over playing JJ or Riikola there instead. Especially JJ, as he brings a lot of the same penalty killing and physicality.

Im willing to bet they were toying with jettisoning JJ and determining how bad a D core with 5 RHS, 3 LHS would look.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Yeah I never expected Rust to be a viable option for the top 6, but the way I saw it, it didn't surprise me when it happened. If he ever carved a role in the top 6 it was gonna be as the 3rd wheel energy guy.

Speed definitely isn't the issue with Lafferty either but I never saw him as super skilled with the puck on his stick for more than a few seconds.

Like, Rust is a guy I'd be comfortable with carrying the puck through the neutral zone and doing whatever he thinks is the right play. Chipping it in, driving wide, pulling up.... Lafferty never stuck out as cerebral to me and I think his first goal last night is a perfect encapsulation of his game. Winning a puck battle, Finding space, using his speed and finishing in tight.

Lafferty isn't going to be Mcdavid with his speed and dangle 2-3 guys, but he's a good stickhandler. Kind of like the way Tanev can motor through a couple guys at full speed and confidently handle the puck. They aren't going to have the puck on a string and stickhandle in a phone booth though.

Rust has always kind of relied on one move (power to the net on his backhand). He can stickhandle ok, but Lafferty just understands how to buy time and dish at the right moment.

Rust was never much of a playmaker in the A, while Lafferty lead the team in helpers by a pretty big margin last season. Just numbers, but it does back my argument with what I've seen though.

They are just different players that use their speed in different way. Rust is still more of a horse blinders guy and Lafferty is pretty slick at dishing the puck and finding the open man, or if he wants to create an opportunity for himself, he has the hands to do it.

 

[Dominance]

I'd play him with Sid and Guentzel. He looked unreal with them.

Yeah, my ideal healthy lineup is:

McCann-Crosby-Guentzel
Galchenyuk-Malkin-Rust/Hornqvist
Kahun/Simon-Blueger-Hornqvist/Tanev
Kahun/Simon-Lafferty-Tanev/Rust
ZAR

With Bjugstad floating around in space somewhere. The guy just does not fit the style of play we win with. I’d be happy as hell to get a third back for him, but I’d be fine with some good ol’ Future Considerations - and $4.1M in cap space moving forward.

 

[Turin]

I think it’s pretty clear by now for even the most dense minded people, that if you give Sullivan what he needs... speed and puck movers on the back, he is extremely tough to beat.

And the analogy I will continue to make is that when you give him spam and twinkies and expect miracles at the dinner table like JR has done... well... you get the last two seasons.

From what I’ve discovered, JR basically picks the ingredients and Sullivan has to cook with them...

Which is why I hope Sullivan outlasts JR or JR starts skipping the Changs and starts eating more brain food as he ages. JR’s rosters were listless until Sully came in and said he needed speed and brought up his AHL guys.

 

[billybudd]

Nice to see Aston-Reese wake up in this one. In addition to the goals, he was noticeable (in a good way) on the penalty kill. More like this, please.

Gudbranson with just 12 ES minutes. The clock is definitely ticking on him with Marino's emergence. I'm still not totally sold on Pets as a top-4 D man, but it would be huge if he can thrive next to Schultz.

I like him, but he really didn't do himself any favors in this game. He was probably the only net negative contributor on the team and, boy was he bad.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Which is why I hope Sullivan outlasts JR or JR starts skipping the Changs and starts eating more brain food as he ages. JR’s rosters were listless until Sully came in and said he needed speed and brought up his AHL guys.

Yet JR came in long before Sullivan and said “we need more skill and speed on all four lines”

Then he got the coach in Sullivan to run that plan when he realized MJ was a fraud.

And then the Wilson boogeyman sucked his brain through his nostrils...

 

[Turin]

My favorite post of the day. Exactly right. Maybe McCann will develop, he is still young but right now he cannot carry the line. Bluegs is right now much better in controlling the play. We are probably in minority that feel that Kahun could be a nice addition here if put in the right spot.

Yea McCann isn’t a good center unless he’s a bottom six guy, he just has limited vision and his brain won’t catch up to his physical tools. Which is fine for what he is, he’s still a decent player. Hate him with Hornqvist though.

 

[DesertPenguin]

I wanna trade both 44 and 3. Add a skating, good puck moving LD to play 2nd pair. Ok with them keeping 8 defenders if it’s L and R shots in Ruh and Riikola. That would be a solid blueline with good backups.

Petterson Letang
Dumoulin Schultz
Riikola Marino
XXXX Ruhwedel

Even if we keep 8 D, XXX could be a cheap veteran that can add some physicality and penalty killing, vs a 3-4 million guy like JJ or Guds.

OR, you accept that Schultz will walk in the offseason and Marino will replace him, rolling into 2020 with:

Dumo Letang
Petterson Marino
Riikola Gudbransson
Ruh

 

[DesertPenguin]

Yeah, I’m on the same page here and the last time JJ looked good was with a Marino type player in Savard.

I think we all want JJ shot to the moon, but for now JJ - Marino and Gudbranson - Marino is p much whatever for a 3rd pairing.

I get the idea of wanting Riikola there, but I think it is much more fun in thought than actual delivery.

Petts not going great with Schultz is a separate issue to tackle, but assuming the top 4 is and must be some combo of Letang, Dumo, Schultz and Pettersson, then you either should be doing:

JJ - Marino
Riikola - Gudbransson

Either of those pairings have nice balance. Riikola - Marino is a bit too inexperienced and under sized, while RR - Gudbransson has no one to handle the puck or join the rush.

The coaches are higher on Marino than they are on Riikola, hence the current setup. Guds playing LD was just odd.

 

[DesertPenguin]

I don't know.... I'm torn. Part of me agrees. Part of me disagrees.

And then also mad credit to Tanev who is hustling down everything, too. The guy is drawing PPs left/right for the team. It's incredible.

Tanev is a Hagelin/Hornqvist love child, combining the best attributes of both, and I love it.

 

[madinsomniac]

And Sully is due credit. These are the missed opportunities that Byslma and Johnson could have seized when Malkin and Crosby were playing the best hockey of their careers.

Sully will be due credit when everyone is healthy and we are still icing young useful players over vets not producing... I’ve been fooled by too many pens squads who utilized young guys in injury pinches but relegated them to invisible status, demoted them, or traded them as soon as pet options were available again...

scuds getting back in when he was healthy that one year we had most of our D hurt and the young guys looked great for a month still haunts me and is one of the reasons i wanted HCDB fired out of a cannon...

If these guys continue to impress and are given a real shot over other options as the season progresses, then i will back your point... one or two games isn’t a big enough sample size to matter

 

[SHOOTANDSCORE]

Sully will be due credit when everyone is healthy and we are still icing young useful players over vets not producing... I’ve been fooled by too many pens squads who utilized young guys in injury pinches but relegated them to invisible status, demoted them, or traded them as soon as pet options were available again...

scuds getting back in when he was healthy that one year we had most of our D hurt and the young guys looked great for a month still haunts me and is one of the reasons i wanted HCDB fired out of a cannon...

If these guys continue to impress and are given a real shot over other options as the season progresses, then i will back your point... one or two games isn’t a big enough sample size to matter

Like Marino playing over healthy JJ and Guds?

 

[EightyOne]

Sully made the calls to sit one of the two boat anchors on D and slot in a rookie both nights of a b2b on the road.

Shit. Give him a Jack Adams now. Riveting decision making.

so you don’t think he has been preaching this style of play? C’mon man.

Lol. Just took two years for the preaching to sink in?

 

[madinsomniac]

Like Marino playing over healthy JJ and Guds?

And that is awesome... do you know what will be even more awesome? When Marino has two subpar games in a row and he isn’t benched for one of the goobers...

 

[PensPlz]

Remember how last year we went 0-4 against a really bad Ottawa team and 1-3 against a bad NJ team without Taylor Hall?

Working with the theory that teams are playing down to us right now like we played down to bad teams last year and lost.

Idk. Hockey can be weird like that.

 

[pokey10]

****. Give him a Jack Adams now. Riveting decision making.



Lol. Just took two years for the preaching to sink in?

Not sure why you are so up-in-arms?

 

[Peat]

Lol. Just took two years for the preaching to sink in?

Can lead a horse to a water but can't make it drink.

Same way you can preach high-tempo hockey but it's not going to work great if the roster's full of big bodies that aren't outstanding skaters and don't have the distributors to make the puck do the work. And Sully didn't construct the roster. Tried preaching a different message, some success but not a huge amount, so here we are going back to plan A. And lo and behold all of a sudden things look different.

 

[The Old Master]

Going back to the set play discussion from a couple of pages ago, how can you tell it's a set play? I've never played before (um, if you couldn't already tell from my posts), so I'm just curious what to look for.

what sports have you played?

 

[EightyOne]

Not sure why you are so up-in-arms?

I don't know why I'm like this

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

Yeah, my ideal healthy lineup is:

McCann-Crosby-Guentzel
Galchenyuk-Malkin-Rust/Hornqvist
Kahun/Simon-Blueger-Hornqvist/Tanev
Kahun/Simon-Lafferty-Tanev/Rust
ZAR

With Bjugstad floating around in space somewhere. The guy just does not fit the style of play we win with. I’d be happy as hell to get a third back for him, but I’d be fine with some good ol’ Future Considerations - and $4.1M in cap space moving forward.

Not me, I wouldn’t touch the top line and if I did I would never move Guentzel from LW. You keep your best goal scorer in his best spot. I personally don’t care who play on that line as long as it as a RW.

Guentzel-Crosby-Simon
Galchenyuk-Malkin-Rust
McCann-Bjugstad-Hornqvist
Tanev-Blueger-Lafferty
ZAR, Kahun on bench

Although ZAR had a hell of a game last night I just can’t see any of the above he beats out. McCann has really cooled off since his first game at Center. I would put him back on the wing. McCann’s line is getting outshined by our AHL call up line. It will be interesting who gets traded because I would think at least one forward and a defenseman will be gone in the next month. When those 4 forwards are back if no other injuries happen which with this team is asking a lot. Several teams are in the market for an RD so I think it is a matter of time before something gets done.

 

[Andy99]

Sully was told Tanev is better at RW, so that’s where he’s playing...he also knows Rust isn’t that good at LW...if we want to keep Lafferty up and everyone is healthy, which they won’t be, the only option (because we have too many RWs) is to move Simon from the top line because he’s one of the few players who’s equally effective on left and right wing...also, McCann Bjug and Horny doesn’t work...they need someone who can lug the puck and play make on that line...so this is what to do if you want to play Laff and everyone is healthy in our fantasy world...

Jake-Sid-Rust/Tanev
Gally-G-Rust/Tanev
Simon-Bjug-Horny
McCann-Blueger-Lafferty
Kahun, ZAR

I’d note that there’s no way we’re keeping 14 forwards up unless we go with 7 D and that will be impossible with the JJ and Guds situation...

 

[heysmilinstrange]

what sports have you played?

None.

 

[Khelandros]

Going back to the set play discussion from a couple of pages ago, how can you tell it's a set play? I've never played before (um, if you couldn't already tell from my posts), so I'm just curious what to look for.

Letang drifts to the center, Jake bolts from the boards to other side immediatly, Dumoulin sells the one timer perfectly taking the Jet defender off Letang, Simon picks the Jet coming across trying to follow Jake, Sid floats to the boards freezing the Jets center, all of which leads to Jake being wide open on his forehand for an un-contested shot. It's about as perfect a set play as you could come up with.