Rumor: Kyper: Dermott and Holl available for a trade

[LeafChief]

The league would stand no chance if we had the intended Dubas-Lou team. They would keep each other honest and meet somewhere right in the middle. Both are brilliant.

I think I just glitched the board with a post that isn't black or white Lou or Dubas. Expect the server error message soon.

I don't know if you're being sarcastic and I apologize if you are but I would love to have a GM that is the better qualities of Dubas and Lou combined.

 

[supermann_98]

What I do find odd about this situation is ..

Every team needs depth due to injuries and illness throughout the course of a season, and Dmen are valuable resources particularly RHD shooting ones, so why are the Leafs so fast on the trading trigger to dump one in trade?

Most teams wouldn't consider their #7 dman expendable, so there must be more here behind this story.

I get the having a $2 mil Dmen as a healthy scratch is poor cap management, but ....... One injury and Holl would be tossed back into the Leafs line-up as a regular and if dealt unless its for another Dman then its a Marlie Dman getting the call and regular spot instead.

Could just be that they see Biega or Rubins or Menell or even Dahlstrom as an adequate #7 Dman, certainly cheaper than $2m just sitting in the press box

 

[supermann_98]

Matthews thinks it was a mistake.

Dubas thinks it's a mistake indirectly through his actions. Trade block right away....that's pretty damn harsh man.

Don't know about you but I'll stick with Matthews opinion since he actually plays for the team.

What did Matthews say? “We shoulda exposed Holl to the Kraken” … I must’ve missed that one

 

[bossram]

The Leafs D was very good last year and is very good this year, though.

I haven't said anything to the contrary.

 

[hockeynorth]

You need 7 or 8 good dmen for a deep playoff run. IMO Leaf management is looking to make better use of some of Holls' $2m cap hit. If they think Dermott is a fixture on the RS, perhaps they think it is better to trade for a cheaper #6/7 dman and use the cap savings to upgrade elsewhere or they are looking to acquire a cheaper Bogozian type dman to replace Dermott.

This is accurate I feel

I don't at all disagree with moving Holl, I just think the people ripping apart his contract are out to lunch

 

[JT AM da real deal]

They aren't moving Holl once Dubie learns he is only getting a 6th/7th round pick for him .. they may do it before Mik/backup tender comes back, assuming no one else gets hurt, due to CAP issues .. at league minimum he would get a 3rd or 4th rounder but then again Leafs would not trade him as they would have to sign someone else as a 7th and 8th for a run

They can't trade their top 6 guys right now as no one else can improve team today .. unless they get another D back in deal

 

[hockeynorth]

They aren't moving Holl once Dubie learns he is only getting a 6th/7th round pick for him .. they may do it before Mik/backup tender comes back, assuming no one else gets hurt, due to CAP issues .. at league minimum he would get a 3rd or 4th rounder but then again Leafs would not trade him as they would have to sign someone else as a 7th and 8th for a run

They can't trade their top 6 guys right now as no one else can improve team today .. unless they get another D back in deal

They are going to get at a minimum a 3rd back, very likely a 2nd or 3rd + depth piece/prospect. Even the media have already said that there's been a ton of interest so far, and that a deal fell through last Thursday. Historically, dmen of Holls calibre who are EVEN MORE expensive go for 2nd +, I showed that in the trade and free agency thread the other day

 

[Tak7]

Holl contract was good when signed, everyone loved it last year too. Why can’t we just have both a) a surplus of good dmen and b) fairly paid players by their skill set because thats what we have

He's also one of, maybe 2 or 3 guys on this roster, that actually outperforms his contract on a semi-consistent basis.

When you're a capped out team, you need guys like that to help balance the books.

If the Leafs feel the need to upgrade Holl as a top 4 D, that's fine. To do it at the expense of Holl, makes little sense in my books - especially considering they bent over backwards to protect him just a few short months ago. Say what you want about this front office, but they are rarely every shortsighted

 

[LeafChief]

They aren't moving Holl once Dubie learns he is only getting a 6th/7th round pick for him .. they may do it before Mik/backup tender comes back, assuming no one else gets hurt, due to CAP issues .. at league minimum he would get a 3rd or 4th rounder but then again Leafs would not trade him as they would have to sign someone else as a 7th and 8th for a run

They can't trade their top 6 guys right now as no one else can improve team today .. unless they get another D back in deal

So many people on this board are incredibly misinformed.

 

[The Iceman]

Agreed. Let's not think that there's a "punish you" trade in the works.

The greater need is left wing:

Bunting
Kerfoot
Mikheyev
Ritchie

This is bad bad bad. Worse than Holl making a few turnovers. Perhaps a pick for Holl plus Dermott for a LW is what the plan is.

Who steps in as a 6th D?
Not sure the plan is to trade 2 guys.

 

[al secord]

The only thing that should annoy/amuse you is how desperate leafs media is to create negative stories and drama whenever the Leafs play well - because god knows they can never just talk about the leafs playing well.

The Leafs playing well means the media is only allowed to talk about which struggling leafs must be traded and how every leaf doing well will be impossible to re-sign for next year.

It's been the media's formula as far back as i can recall. Should come as a surprise to no one.

 

[ottomaddox]

Who steps in as a 6th D?
Not sure the plan is to trade 2 guys.

Other people in hockey media speculate that Dubas might be moving on from 1 or both D because of the cap.

I wish I knew what was going on with Dubas and company. I can only speculate.

Perhaps addressing the LW position won't come until the NHL trade deadline.

 

[ottomaddox]

So many people on this board are incredibly misinformed.

Maybe. Perhaps it's a case of everyone on this board being painfully aware of the cap situation.

 

[kb]

Maybe. Perhaps it's a case of everyone on this board being painfully aware of the cap situation.

Painfully aware that they were in the middle of the cap pack wise for most of the season and are sitting 10th now?

People need to become informed before speaking. Or making threads.

 

[ottomaddox]

Painfully aware that they were in the middle of the cap pack wise for most of the season and are sitting 10th now?

People need to become informed before speaking. Or making threads.

Come again?

 

[zeke]

Come again?

 

[Dekes For Days]

View attachment 478265

That's sure a whole lotta teams having a capocalypse.

It's almost like good teams operate at the cap or something...

 

[Menzinger]

I don't think they expected for Liljegren to be *this* good. They are being pro-active and they probably see an opportunity to open more cap space instead of not having much of any.

Sometimes a young player forces your hand. It happens.

Which was pretty clear to be the case.

And the Leafs weren't in a position to gamble on him being a question make. Which meant either protect Holl or replace him after the expansion draft with a similarly priced UFA

 

[kb]

Which was pretty clear to be the case.

And the Leafs weren't in a position to gamble on him being a question make. Which meant either protect Holl or replace him after the expansion draft with a similarly priced UFA

Couldn't even do that actually.

Not with Kerfoot's and McCann's salaries both on the books.

 

[Leafsfan74]

I think trading Holl is a risky that could have consequences come playoff time. He is one of the guys who is willing to be physical behind the dots, which is especially valuable when playoff-style hockey emerges, the puck is deep and players are skating like a bat out of hell to drive through defenseman.

Whichever one of the two he moves (assuming Dermott or Holl), you can be certain that the difference in the cap space hits between the two is less important than Dubas, Keefe and company assessing what they believe they have a a group and shedding what they view as excess.

Now, if this is a move to free Cap space AND Dubas has his eyes on a particular upgrade in the top four by the deadline (assuming the movement of another contract and/or LTIR Cap accumulation), then it makes perfect sense. Yes, they've played well of late and they could have a good part of their future D set, but, you need a stellar top four and depth is invaluable.

I will say it again, as someone who wants to see this franchise reach the summit, I am not confident in too many young D-Men come playoffs. Certainly I want my top four to be reliable, experienced and with some necessary grit.

We know how important this element of ones D is when one of the Habs (Gallager perhaps, someone can remind me) stated after the Leafs were beaten, something to the effect "we knew we were going to win game seven once Muzzin got injured".

Muzzin brings it when the chips are down and he makes opposing teams work to get to the net.

 

[ottomaddox]

View attachment 478265

Powerful. Dubas is in the top ten now and all is forgiven? What does this prove? That he's above average as opposed elite spending?

 

[kb]

Powerful. Dubas is in the top ten now and all is forgiven? What does this prove? That he's above average as opposed elite spending?

It means lots of bitching for no reason, or bitching for the same reason as 20 other fanbases.

Not a difficult concept for most to get, really.....

 

[ottomaddox]

It means lots of bitching for no reason, or bitching for the same reason as 20 other fanbases.

Not a difficult concept for most to get, really.....

If I don't like the power play I'm going to say something whether you like it or not.

 

[TheShape]

Couldn't even do that actually.

Not with Kerfoot's and McCann's salaries both on the books.

Holl selected by Seattle and Kerfoot moved for a pick. Frees up 5.5m in cap space, more than enough to replace Holl and we could’ve kept McCann who is a better player/fit than Kerfoot.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Holl selected by Seattle and Kerfoot moved for a pick. Frees up 5.5m in cap space, more than enough to replace Holl and we could’ve kept McCann who is a better player/fit than Kerfoot.

McCann is a worse defensive player and was taken off of the PK in PIT because he was not very good there (and has yet to go there in SEA either). The same happened with him as a center (not only because he couldn't take draws, but also because he was just not a good fit at center).

McCann had a really hot year last year. His SH% was much higher than his average (which is the same thing he has going for him early on this year in SEA as well) and he was able to double his PP rate. I wouldn't be surprised if the Leafs preferred Kerfoot, because if McCann reverted back to his averages, he brings similar offense with less defense and no PK ability.