Player Discussion Koskinen Re-Signed PT2

[MikeGrier99]

Thanks for blowing another season Talbot!

So glad we got rid of that bum, he was a cancer to the team.

Prime Hasek couldn't save this team. It's an uphill battle for any goalie to put up good stats on this team.

 

[LaGu]

So the poster you are defending, that just inferred other opinions "are full of ****" is inviting discourse?

C'mon.

Of course everybody is welcome. But the poster is intentionally baiting, and with such tag lines as "when everybody proves you wrong" This has not occurred, and is an opinion disguised as fact. If the poster was replying with any substance I wouldn't have responded as I did. Did you not see his latest post. Inferring others posts are "full of ****" is NOT conducive to discussion on a moderated board. Is it?

Do you approve of that nature of derision?​

I did find it funny that a poster that only posts on Koskinen, that is from Finland initiates that I'm the one having the player bias. Do you not follow what I'm stating?

I am defending Finnish posters. The problem when you respond like that is that it becomes about more than just him. I am speaking from experience on this, it happens from time to time.

It's better imo to leave affiliation out of it, especially if affiliation is a nationality. I am not saying I don't understand why you react, I just think you could have responded differently. Also because you are more of a resident here than the guy attacking you, he did a drive by (which can be ok when the poster is level headed, this time not really).

 

[Jamin]

Its been 2 years since Talbot was good and he wasnt gonna re-sign anyways. Good on Gretzky for trading him and getting the cap space for Sekera's return.

Im not fully sold on Koski yet but he has his big contract so might as well support him for the rest of the year and see how he plays with Russel and Klefbom back and now Sekera as well.

I dont think its a coincidence his stats dropped as soon as the d core went to shit and I wouldnt be surprised if they improved now that the d core is healthy (he is still unknown enough stats could go down but lets give the man a chance).

 

[oljimmy]

I have Kostko at .912 his last 7 games, even including the .750 relief performance in CHI. Not spectacular but not horrible by any stretch, the key for him is to find a little more consistency. #clingingdesperatelytopositivity

 

[Drivesaitl]

I am defending Finnish posters. The problem when you respond like that is that it becomes about more than just him. I am speaking from experience on this, it happens from time to time.

It's better imo to leave affiliation out of it, especially if affiliation is a nationality. I am not saying I don't understand why you react, I just think you could have responded differently. Also because you are more of a resident here than the guy attacking you, he did a drive by (which can be ok when the poster is level headed, this time not really).

This is actually a weird reply. Do you not see the inconsistency in the bolded?

I don't respond differently because I don't support or look the other way on unsolicited driveby attacks. Why would I?

 

[LaGu]

This is actually a weird reply. Do you not see the inconsistency in the bolded?

I don't respond differently because I don't support or look the other way on unsolicited driveby attacks. Why would I?

Maybe lost in translation but for me the point makes sense. You singled out that he was a Finnish poster, I've been singled out at times for being a Swede posting about Swedish players. Let's say I am defending or reacting to someone being singled out because of his nationality.

Honestly I almost never react and/or intervene but since I was active in these last pages and I've had the same thing said to me I commented on it. It's really a disarming line in a discussion because with it you basically nullify any opinion as product of an inherent bias which, if it's a nationality, is very hard to defend against.

I'll leave it now because it's derailing the discussion if you think my point is weird then there is probably no point of taking it further.

 

[Drivesaitl]

Maybe lost in translation but for me the point makes sense. You singled out that he was a Finnish poster, I've been singled out at times for being a Swede posting about Swedish players. Let's say I am defending or reacting to someone being singled out because of his nationality.

Honestly I almost never react and/or intervene but since I was active in these last pages and I've had the same thing said to me I commented on it. It's really a disarming line in a discussion because with it you basically nullify any opinion as product of an inherent bias which, if it's a nationality, is very to defend against.

I'll leave it now because it's derailing the discussion if you think my point is weird then there is probably no point of taking it further.

Thanks for the reply, and because things can be unclear in online communication I hope you know I am fine what you state, and welcome it, just that I saw an inconsistency in the bolded lines.

i.e. you state leave affiliation out of it, but specifically defend a poster who replied with ad hominem attack, because they are Finnish and that you are sympathetic, due to feeling singled out as well. I understand, I do. But I didn't allude to the Finnish angle until the poster had already derided my posts multiple times (not all occurring recently)


That's that I think, we disagree on some of this, which is fine.

 

[LaGu]

Thanks for the reply, and because things can be unclear in online communication I hope you know I am fine what you state, and welcome it, just that I saw an inconsistency in the bolded lines.

i.e. you state leave affiliation out of it, but specifically defend a poster who replied with ad hominem attack, because they are Finnish and that you are sympathetic, due to feeling singled out as well. I understand, I do. But I didn't allude to the Finnish angle until the poster had already derided my posts multiple times (not all occurring recently)


That's that I think, we disagree on some of this, which is fine.

Cannot like anymore apparently. Tried several times now, but

Whole HF seems to be unstable at the moment. I guess it's TD hf-break-down as usual on new HF.

 

[jonu]

So the poster you are defending, that just inferred other opinions "are full of ****" is inviting discourse?

C'mon.

Of course everybody is welcome. But the poster is intentionally baiting, and with such tag lines as "when everybody proves you wrong" This has not occurred, and is an opinion disguised as fact. If the poster was replying with any substance I wouldn't have responded as I did. Did you not see his latest post. Inferring others posts are "full of ****" is NOT conducive to discussion on a moderated board. Is it?

Do you approve of that nature of derision?​

I did find it funny that a poster that only posts on Koskinen, that is from Finland initiates that I'm the one having the player bias. Do you not follow what I'm stating?

I find it funny that you are still twisting my words to fit your own narrative.

Anyways, I've given you stats many times before but you just discredit them. Or when I'm giving you more substance you just ignore me altogether.

I don't know how I'm baiting you and I never said "everybody proves you wrong".

I gave you stats on other notable struggling goalies this season proving that it is not only Koski or Talbot who have struggled and you discredit me by my nationality, and after that you play the victim card. Get a grip man..

If you'd paid even a little attention before, you'd know that my stance was that both goalies(Koski and Talbot) were struggling more or less cause of the team and not because of themselves but you decided to call me a biased Finnish Koskinen fan because I am trying to prove to you that Koski isn't as bad as you think he is.

 

[Stoneman89]

I find it funny that you are still twisting my words to fit your own narrative.

Anyways, I've given you stats many times before but you just discredit them. Or when I'm giving you more substance you just ignore me altogether.

I don't know how I'm baiting you and I never said "everybody proves you wrong".

I gave you stats on other notable struggling goalies this season proving that it is not only Koski or Talbot who have struggled and you discredit me by my nationality, and after that you play the victim card. Get a grip man..

If you'd paid even a little attention before, you'd know that my stance was that both goalies(Koski and Talbot) were struggling more or less cause of the team and not because of themselves but you decided to call me a biased Finnish Koskinen fan because I am trying to prove to you that Koski isn't as bad as you think he is.

I sure as hell hope you're right, because if you're not, we are screwed for the next 3 years.

 

[Drivesaitl]

I find it funny that you are still twisting my words to fit your own narrative.

Anyways, I've given you stats many times before but you just discredit them. Or when I'm giving you more substance you just ignore me altogether.

I don't know how I'm baiting you and I never said "everybody proves you wrong".

I gave you stats on other notable struggling goalies this season proving that it is not only Koski or Talbot who have struggled and you discredit me by my nationality, and after that you play the victim card. Get a grip man..

If you'd paid even a little attention before, you'd know that my stance was that both goalies(Koski and Talbot) were struggling more or less cause of the team and not because of themselves but you decided to call me a biased Finnish Koskinen fan because I am trying to prove to you that Koski isn't as bad as you think he is.

Somewhere along the line we got off on the wrong foot. For the sake of the board lets try a reset.

My dislike of Koski is not just due to him this might help you follow my pov

1) Koski is a Chiarelli get. Chia is hopeless, and I f***ing hate him, hate what he did to this team. Nothing to do with Koski, I realize. But hard to get over. Chia cratered the franchise, again.

2)I loved Talbot. I love any goalie that can drag this moribund club into the playoffs and Talbot did that, no small accomplishment. Huge actually. Talbot was among a handful of the best goalies in the league in 16-17. Given a chance, he'll rebound, but it won't be here and that really sucks. Because he's the single best goalie we have had since 2005-06. (Roloson)

3) Oilers fans shouldn't get attached to any players. Whenever you like a player he's gone. In this org that's been going on since Gretzky. Actually since Jim Harrison, so around 45yrs its been happening. I don't expect you to know what this feels like but it sucks.

4)We're long suffering Oilers fans here. All kinds of salt found here. Its been a bitter experience. Do we view everything objectively and positively? No.

So that's some of the potential bias that can make peoples opinion here sound nuts from time to time. Coming in here you wouldn't know any of that, or how the fanbase here is impacted by how bad the org has been, for how long. This is the Gulag of the NHL. Feelings here are often loaded.

Welcome

 

[Tobias Kahun]

Played good against Nashville.

Sucks at shootouts.

 

[Drivesaitl]

He played well again tonight. Was big in net and making Preds miss or shoot into him. We don't get a point without him and Draisaitl. Really nobody else on the team was special. Hopefully Koski is turning it around.

All 4 pucks beat him in shootout but shootout is rare. Not too much of a concern when we have McDrai out there in games as they barely ever get to shootout.

 

[Del Preston]

The only goal I didn't like tonight was the shootout winner. He got really small and Boyle ripped it over his shoulder.

He's 2-0-2 with a 1.93 GAA and .938 SV% since Sekera returned.

 

[jonu]

I sure as hell hope you're right, because if you're not, we are screwed for the next 3 years.

Well I hope I'm right too because I don't like being proven wrong

Somewhere along the line we got off on the wrong foot. For the sake of the board lets try a reset.

My dislike of Koski is not just due to him this might help you follow my pov

1) Koski is a Chiarelli get. Chia is hopeless, and I ****ing hate him, hate what he did to this team. Nothing to do with Koski, I realize. But hard to get over. Chia cratered the franchise, again.

2)I loved Talbot. I love any goalie that can drag this moribund club into the playoffs and Talbot did that, no small accomplishment. Huge actually. Talbot was among a handful of the best goalies in the league in 16-17. Given a chance, he'll rebound, but it won't be here and that really sucks. Because he's the single best goalie we have had since 2005-06. (Roloson)

3) Oilers fans shouldn't get attached to any players. Whenever you like a player he's gone. In this org that's been going on since Gretzky. Actually since Jim Harrison, so around 45yrs its been happening. I don't expect you to know what this feels like but it sucks.

4)We're long suffering Oilers fans here. All kinds of salt found here. Its been a bitter experience. Do we view everything objectively and positively? No.

So that's some of the potential bias that can make peoples opinion here sound nuts from time to time. Coming in here you wouldn't know any of that, or how the fanbase here is impacted by how bad the org has been, for how long. This is the Gulag of the NHL. Feelings here are often loaded.

Welcome

I know Koski's next years contract looks like a steaming pile of turd right now, but I think we should hold on on our horses and judge it next year and judge him right now by this years contract which he right now is kind of worth of. No one likes Chiarelli, I even saw what he did at Boston so technically that would make me a Chiarelli follower for following him here, and that alone is enough to call me stupid

I've seen the amount of salt here in the last few years I've been lurking and I can certainly understand it given all the f*** ups in player development and staff hirings beginning from GM level.

 

[guymez]

The only goal I didn't like tonight was the shootout winner. He got really small and Boyle ripped it over his shoulder.

He's 2-0-2 with a 1.93 GAA and .938 SV% since Sekera returned.

That was a frustrating goal to watch. I do not like Koskinen in the SO...he loses his net and as you said he makes himself too small.
I am actually not at all sold on him being a legit starter but am willing to see if he can work on his flaws.

 

[YakDavid]

That was a frustrating goal to watch. I do not like Koskinen in the SO...he loses his net and as you said he makes himself too small.
I am actually not at all sold on him being a legit starter but an willing to see if he can work on his flaws.

It really isn't losing his net. He is a goalie who relies on positioning but a shootout makes it difficult. The five-hole goal was more annoying than the winning one in the shootout to me. He wasn't prepared for it and he went down on his stick.

 

[Soundwave]

Didn't Mac T once change the goalie just for the shootout?

 

[guymez]

It really isn't losing his net. He is a goalie who relies on positioning but a shootout makes it difficult. The five-hole goal was more annoying than the winning one in the shootout to me. He wasn't prepared for it and he went down on his stick.

Losing his net seems to happen more in the game than in the SO...I should have been a little clearer there.

He just doesnt play a very strong positional game for a big goalie IMO. Therefore when his game falls apart it will fall apart spectacularly.
He was as lucky as it gets in this game. He played well but got a lot of breaks when he was caught scrambling unnecessarily.

 

[Del Preston]

Didn't Mac T once change the goalie just for the shootout?

He did it twice and neither time worked.

St. Louis Blues - Edmonton Oilers - February 12th, 2006

Mike Morrison starts and gives up 2 goals on 5 shots. He gets pulled for Jussi Markkanen at 13:29 of the first period. Morrison goes back in for the shootout two hours later and the Oilers lose it 1-0.

Dallas Stars - Edmonton Oilers - March 7th, 2006

Ty Conklin plays the entire game. Morrison goes in for the shootout and both shooters score. I remember Conklin being incredibly angry when he was pulled after OT. This ended up being Morrison's final appearance with the Oilers.

 

[LaGu]

The only goal I didn't like tonight was the shootout winner. He got really small and Boyle ripped it over his shoulder.

He's 2-0-2 with a 1.93 GAA and .938 SV% since Sekera returned.

Koskinen playing with Klefbom:
12 W - 6 L - 3 OT
0.923 Sv%
2.32 GAA

 

[Ritchie Valens]

It really isn't losing his net. He is a goalie who relies on positioning but a shootout makes it difficult. The five-hole goal was more annoying than the winning one in the shootout to me. He wasn't prepared for it and he went down on his stick.

In the shootout, it seems like he comes out too far to start then doesn't back in fast enough or he gets off his angle, leaving part of the net open, like the Boyle goal. He was damn near the bottom hash mark when Boyle was half way between the blue line and face off circle (with speed) at this point and he didn't recover enough. He was outside the top of the crease when Boyle shot and is dropping into his butterfly leaving the top of the net open.

With Forsberg, I think he got caught flat footed. He may have been expecting Forsberg to cut back towards the net and make a move. Instead, Forsberg saw him with his legs wide apart and rifled a perfect snapshot through the legs.

But the shootout is a roll of the dice and I'm not going to crucify Koskinen (or the Oilers shooters) over it.

 

[oljimmy]

Yeah it really looks like Koskinen will finish the season reasonably strong, probably averaging .915 or thereabouts, pulling out a few games. And we're going to argue about him all summer but since we're stuck with him the arguing will be pointless. Then the big test is going to be next season when Bouchard and Yams hit the lineup with either JP or whoever we get for JP. That's when we'll know if this gamble has paid off.

 

[TopShelfGloveSide]

Losing his net seems to happen more in the game than in the SO...I should have been a little clearer there.

He just doesnt play a very strong positional game for a big goalie IMO. Therefore when his game falls apart it will fall apart spectacularly.
He was as lucky as it gets in this game. He played well but got a lot of breaks when he was caught scrambling unnecessarily.

Got to be good to be lucky and lucky to be good.

 

[Aceboogie]

The thing for me with Koskinen is that I think hed be a fine backup goalie and I like the person

I want a good Oilers team. I dont care who the players are. So Ill call a spade a spade, even if that comes off as being down on a player.

Ofcourse I would love if Koskinen proved me completly wrong, but that contract is going to hurt the team in 2 ways. 1) Takes up alot of cap space 2) because we spent so much on him, the next GM could default to forcing him into the #1 goalie spot and not look for an actual starter

I guess this season is a write off, so it will be a good audition period for Kosk. If he becomes a legit starter Ill be over the moon.

(Still doesnt excuse the fact the contract was a horrible gamble)