TSN: Justin Schultz - 3.675 / 1 year deal

[Jimmi McJenkins]

Thought the real number was 1.8?

Anyway why would it matter that much? Be different if Barrie got his deal first, but why couldn't Barrie ask for more after the Schultz deal?

The starting point for the agents are dramatically different, pretty easy to understand.

 

[Section337]

I would have liked to pay less to Schultz, but as the top minute per game d-man for the Oilers he was negotiating from a much stronger position than Barrie as the 5th (though his minutes were probably trending upwards) per minute d-man.

 

[rboomercat90]

I would have liked to pay less to Schultz, but as the top minute per game d-man for the Oilers he was negotiating from a much stronger position than Barrie as the 5th (though his minutes were probably trending upwards) per minute d-man.

This is the trap the organization has fallen into by playing players over their heads. Hurts them on the ice and at contract time when they either have to pay a player as a first line player or need to move him because they know he isn't worth first line money.

Are the Oilers going to have to overpay every single contract until we become successful? The answer is yes.

A big part of the reason the answer is yes is because the Oilers have been gifting roster spots to kids and eating up their entry level contracts too early. This has been forcing their hands on bigger deals before they've earned them or proven they deserve them. This happens around the league but it happens here far too often.

 

[Lacaar]

I would have liked to pay less to Schultz, but as the top minute per game d-man for the Oilers he was negotiating from a much stronger position than Barrie as the 5th (though his minutes were probably trending upwards) per minute d-man.

To me that's kind of a two way street.

Barrie played less minutes and scored more points.

Schultz played more and scored less. it's not like his extra minutes were pk too.

gonna hazard a guess and say their defensive games are a wash. I didn't watch much of Barrie but Schultz needs some serious work.

 

[chris11inter]

Sorry, but do you have a point here?

He usually doesn't have a point.. He just criticizes other posts without offering an opinion. See numerous posts in this thread.

 

[guymez]

Klef did not play on that team at all. WE are talking about the lock out year. Players develop in the offseason, players work out, play hockey ect and so on. Some times players did big jumps over a offseason.

Actually you are right about Klefbom...my mistake.


That said your contention that a player improves in the off season (as opposed to game experience) is based on what exactly?

 

[doulos]

So what's the deal here. 6 points, crap for defense, and not really providing much of anything else. He has to be the biggest let down on the roster currently. He's not even living up to his current contract, let alone deserving of a raise.

 

[McDeathbyCheerios*]

So what's the deal here. 6 points, crap for defense, and not really providing much of anything else. He has to be the biggest let down on the roster currently. He's not even living up to his current contract, let alone deserving of a raise.

He is being treated like a top pairing Norris trophy guy and getting paired with the likes of Brad Hunt, Andrew Ference and Nikitin. Which wouldn't be awful but he is playing top pairing minutes with bad partners and he isn't able to do that yet. Schultz should be on the second or third pairing and be a pp specialist.

He isn't fantastic but properly used and he wouldn't look as bad.

 

[The Nuge]

So what's the deal here. 6 points, crap for defense, and not really providing much of anything else. He has to be the biggest let down on the roster currently. He's not even living up to his current contract, let alone deserving of a raise.

It puts us in a good spot next summer. If we offered say 5 years, 17.5 million, how could he say he deserves more?

 

[doulos]

He is being treated like a top pairing Norris trophy guy and getting paired with the likes of Brad Hunt, Andrew Ference and Nikitin. Which wouldn't be awful but he is playing top pairing minutes with bad partners and he isn't able to do that yet. Schultz should be on the second or third pairing and be a pp specialist.

He isn't fantastic but properly used and he wouldn't look as bad.

Most concerning to me is the fact that his offense is slowly getting worse. You simply can't keep a guy as bad at defense as Schultz is, in prime minutes, if he isn't giving you big offense.

You're right, he needs to have his ice time drawn back, but you just named half of the D-core that he played with. It's tough to shelter him when the guys he gets paired with also need sheltering!

 

[doulos]

It puts us in a good spot next summer. If we offered say 5 years, 17.5 million, how could he say he deserves more?

Contractually, you're right. As a fan that wants to see this team win games, it puts the Oilers in a real crap spot.

 

[Master Lok]

He is being treated like a top pairing Norris trophy guy and getting paired with the likes of Brad Hunt, Andrew Ference and Nikitin. Which wouldn't be awful but he is playing top pairing minutes with bad partners and he isn't able to do that yet. Schultz should be on the second or third pairing and be a pp specialist.

He isn't fantastic but properly used and he wouldn't look as bad.

Who's babysitting who?

Schultz has bad partners?

I think its more likely that Schultz IS the bad partner.

 

[Moose Coleman]

Who's babysitting who?

Schultz has bad partners?

I think its more likely that Schultz IS the bad partner.

Or they both suck.

I had high hopes for Ramsay, but I have no idea how he's deploying the D this year.

Look at the ESTOI numbers for D who've played 100+ minutes (and excluding Hunt):

1. Schultz
2. Ference
3. Petry
4. Nikitin
5. Marincin
6. Fayne

It's almost exactly backwards. Crazy. And such an easy fix, too, but it seems they've chosen Schultz as their hill to die on, which is madness.

 

[ponokanocker]

The problems that Schultz is having is the problems that all our D have been having, playing above where they should. McT has failed miserably to solidify the D core because he hasn't gone out and got the top pairing D this team desperately needs. Once we get that, you will see ALL our current D play much better as they are in their proper places. Fayne showed he can play on the top pair with a true top pairing D. Let's get him one. If it costs Yak or a different major piece, it should be done.

 

[Moose Coleman]

The problems that Schultz is having is the problems that all our D have been having, playing above where they should.

IMO, the only D that really applies to based on the ice time is Schultz and Ference.

McT has failed miserably to solidify the D core because he hasn't gone out and got the top pairing D this team desperately needs.

Easy to say, all but impossible to do.

Once we get that, you will see ALL our current D play much better as they are in their proper places. Fayne showed he can play on the top pair with a true top pairing D. Let's get him one. If it costs Yak or a different major piece, it should be done.

Before parting with valuable assets, we could try playing the D we have in a way that maximizes the effectiveness of the whole unit.

 

[The Nuge]

Contractually, you're right. As a fan that wants to see this team win games, it puts the Oilers in a real crap spot.

Oh for sure. I was just looking for the silver lining

 

[TKB21]

The guy is terrible, Would love nothing more then to package him with a winger for something decent.

 

[Oilfan2]

Schultz is already a very good offensive defenceman and will only improve with time. He hasn't even had 3 seasons in the NHL yet and defencemen usually take until they're 27/28 before hitting their best.

If you watch him, you can see his instincts.

The last couple of games he's actually played decent defence as well. He isn't putting guys through the boards but his positioning is better and he has an active stick.

If the Oil give upon him, I'd venture that they'll regret it within 3 years or sooner.

 

[ponokanocker]

IMO, the only D that really applies to based on the ice time is Schultz and Ference.

This I'll disagree with you on. How our ice time should be divided up this season:
1. Marincin
2. Petry
3. Fayne
4. Schultz
5. Ference
6. Nikiton
Putting a #1 up there moves Marincin into a more complimentary role, puts Fayne and Petry into the 2nd pairing role, and pushes Schultz/Ference into bottom pairing minutes. You could also move Fayne onto the top pair, and have Marincin/Petry as the 2nd pair. Nikiton becomes the 7th D, like he was in CLB. Realistically, McT wouldn't have gotten Nikiton if he brought in a #1D, which would have been a bonus.

Easy to say, all but impossible to do.

We've seen it happen before. It doesn't happen often, but it does happen.

Before parting with valuable assets, we could try playing the D we have in a way that maximizes the effectiveness of the whole unit.

I agree that they aren't being utilized they way they should, but even if they are, there isn't one member of the group that should be getting #1 minutes.

 

[joestevens29]

Schultz is already a very good offensive defenceman and will only improve with time. He hasn't even had 3 seasons in the NHL yet and defencemen usually take until they're 27/28 before hitting their best.

If you watch him, you can see his instincts.

The last couple of games he's actually played decent defence as well. He isn't putting guys through the boards but his positioning is better and he has an active stick.

If the Oil give upon him, I'd venture that they'll regret it within 3 years or sooner.

I know it's still early, but I don't see what the guy has done to be considered a very good offensive d-man. Guy is getting a lot of PP time and only has 2 points more than Fayne who is out there 6 less minutes a night. And it's not like he's playing tough competition the guy essential is being sheltered while playing a lot of minutes.

He wanted the big contract maybe it's time he steps up and does something to justify it.

 

[Oilfan2]

I agree that they aren't being utilized they way they should, but even if they are, there isn't one member of the group that should be getting #1 minutes.

I'd agree but would sway to giving Fayne the greatest burden, in absence of a stud #1..The minutes should be fairly evenly divided, similiar to the forward lines.

 

[Oilfan2]

I know it's still early, but I don't see what the guy has done to be considered a very good offensive d-man. Guy is getting a lot of PP time and only has 2 points more than Fayne who is out there 6 less minutes a night. And it's not like he's playing tough competition the guy essential is being sheltered while playing a lot of minutes.

He wanted the big contract maybe it's time he steps up and does something to justify it.

I think he's starting to..Whether that continues or not remains to be seen. He makes some excellent offensive plays and see the plays developing well. We don't have anyone else with that offensive instinct at the moment.

Last season he was 37th in the NHL for points as a defenceman. Considering how poorly the team did and no one else on the team was close, I think that's reason enough to have patience and see how he develops.
If they trade Schultz, they have nothing to replace the offense from the back with.

Imo, he's also developing some good defensive habits. Let's see if that continues.

 

[Mr Positive]

Schultz has been great defensively this season and is still our best puck mover back there

 

[Moose Coleman]

This I'll disagree with you on. How our ice time should be divided up this season:
1. Marincin
2. Petry
3. Fayne
4. Schultz
5. Ference
6. Nikiton

TBH I think a Fayne/Marincin pairing and a Petry/Nikitin (or Klefbom) pair would be a 1A and 1B pairing.

Putting a #1 up there moves Marincin into a more complimentary role, puts Fayne and Petry into the 2nd pairing role, and pushes Schultz/Ference into bottom pairing minutes. You could also move Fayne onto the top pair, and have Marincin/Petry as the 2nd pair. Nikiton becomes the 7th D, like he was in CLB. Realistically, McT wouldn't have gotten Nikiton if he brought in a #1D, which would have been a bonus.

I don't disagree that a #1D is a big need. But there's nothing like that coming down the pike, so you gotta dance with them that brung you.

We've seen it happen before. It doesn't happen often, but it does happen.

Last established 1D to go in a trade in the last couple of years is....I can't even think of one.

I agree that they aren't being utilized they way they should, but even if they are, there isn't one member of the group that should be getting #1 minutes.

Well, this is what we're working with. I think they can get a lot more out of them than they have so far.

 

[Spawn]

I've actually thought Schultz has shown some noticeable improvement this year on the defensive side of things. With Brad Hunt he was -6. Partnered with an actual NHL player he's been +4.

If the powerplay wasn't such a dumpster fire (12%!?) he'd likely have at least a few more points on the season.

He shouldn't be playing the most minutes. He never should have at any point in his career. For some reason the coaching staff insists on it. But I think he's a better player so far this year.