Joffrey Lupul: Why He's Being Robidas'd and Not Bought Out OR Traded

BlueBaron

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May 29, 2006
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I'd imagine it would change when the season turns over from 16-17 to 17-18. Thing is, we don't know when the draft would take place. It would be during that summer I'd assume, but would it technically be during the 16-17 season or the 17-18 season? Big difference for many reasons.

Safe bet the expansion draft would be held before the entry draft to create/allow more movement at the draft. So one would think June. That said this is such an administrative headache they may have to make a ton of tweaks to make it work. That or you may see people trading for Clarkson type guys to have the contract % required.
 

Hoverhand

Barry Trotzky
Dec 6, 2015
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Clarkson was a unique situation which we aren't likely to come across again.

We could call Florida and ask them how Marc Savard is affecting their internal cap.

They could save money for a slightly used Milan Michalek. :laugh:
 

Stand Witness

JT
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Oct 25, 2014
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He's injury prone, so a trade is just not going to happen.

The buyout is a tough pill to swallow.

2017 (1.5 M)
2018 (3 M)
2019 (1.5 M)
2020 (1.5 M)

That second year into the buyout would be damaging.

Keep in mind that he would still be under contract for 5.25M in 2018 though. (assuming thats the 2017-2018, your post made it seem that way).
 

Faltorvo

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Feb 18, 2008
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won't need to keep Lupul around for the 25% part, they can still buy him out.

They will have to get the 25% from the 2016/17 roster and we have plenty to offer up without Lupul.

and yes

pending UFAs will count, the draft will happen before july 1 2017, before the start of UFA season.

Laich,greening,robidas,michalek,hunwick,bozak horton

we have plenty to get to 18 million ish
 

keon

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won't need to keep Lupul around for the 25% part, they can still buy him out.

They will have to get the 25% from the 2016/17 roster and we have plenty to offer up without Lupul.

and yes

pending UFAs will count, the draft will happen before july 1 2017, before the start of UFA season.

Laich,greening,robidas,michalek,hunwick,bozak horton

we have plenty to get to 18 million ish

Great post. With the names mentioned above and Lupul we have about $28M of dead cap space at the end of 2016/17. Some of this could be a tradable asset.
 

Mad Brills*

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July 2017 ufas would only get their rights. Why would they get picked? They could simply go elsewhere.
 

keon

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July 2017 ufas would only get their rights. Why would they get picked? They could simply go elsewhere.

The value of the July 2017 UFA's is that they help meet the requirement of exposing players to the expansion draft of 25% of our Cap spend. If Toronto spends close to the Cap say $74 M, their exposed draft eligible players will have to have a combined Cap cost of $18M (25%). With all of the current UFAs and contract players likely available on Toronto's roster at the TDD Toronto will likely have approximately $28M available in Horton, Lupul, Robidas, Michalek, Greening, Laich, Humwick, Bernier and others. Some other team struggling to meet the 25% provision might want to trade for some of Toronto excess expansion draftable deadwood.
 

keon

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If pending UFAs are eligible, then we should be golden.

Normally the following:

First the Expansion draft would possible happen around June 20

Second the Entry draft would possible happen around June 25

UFA availability begins around June 30

Toronto's UFAs will be Toronto property up to June 30. If there are no changes in the rules Toronto will have excess expansion draft eligible deadwood available (salary cap wise) to meet the requirement of exposing at least 25% of Toronto's 2016/17 salary cap. Excess cap laden expansion draft eligible players could have some attraction to other teams at the TDD.
 

Wafflewhipper

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Jan 18, 2014
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I was reading Friedman's 30 Thoughts article this week, and he covered some important things about the potential upcoming expansion draft, which may be June 2017.



So based on this, it really clarifies the Joffrey Lupul situation. If he's "at odds" with the team and they don't want him around (speculation on my part), then why hasn't he been bought out? Or traded. He's got some value, if it really came down to it, a team could take him in a cap dump deal. They managed to find a way to unload Phaneuf, Kessel, and Clarkson. Lupul's deal is not as bad as those were.

So reading thought #20, the reason finally became clear. He's need as part of the "Expansion Draft Floor".

Teams need to expose 25% of their cap expenditures. We're not loaded with NMCs, so it shouldn't be an issue there, but our high-dollar-earners are keepers (except for Lupul).

We have a LOT of ELC players and RFAs, so getting $18M won't be easy. That's where Lupul comes in. He can be exposed in the expansion draft to drive up the total cap we expose, and ensure we aren't forced to expose someone we don't want to, like Rielly or Gardiner.

Additionally, I think we're going to see Lamoriello be somewhat active in the UFA market, targeting players that will allow the Leafs to further rack up the cap hit to hit the 25% mark. Or maybe they'll target more cap dump players with more interest in the actual cap dump than anything else.

Anyways, some food for thought.

Bad contracts can be had if you need one.
 

Doc300c

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Does it make any sense to have the expansion draft before free agency?

Why would and UFA re-sign there after?
They could potentially lose their whole team to free agency.
 

teeder333*

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Lupul is going to take a nice nap watch and see. Who wouldn't for that kind of money, he is not going raise any waves.
 

93LEAFS

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We could call Florida and ask them how Marc Savard is affecting their internal cap.

They could save money for a slightly used Milan Michalek. :laugh:
Pretty sure Savard's deal is fully insured which is why they were willing to take it, same with Pronger in Arizona. Very rare for a guys deal to be uninsured.
 

taurine330

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I'm not sure but in the Leafs' case, if they protected Rielly, Gardiner, Carrick on D and Kadri, JvR, Komarov, Bozak, Leivo, Brown, Leipsic at F (Nylander, Sosh, Brown, Hyman and Kapanen are exempt from my understanding) then it'd be difficult to hit that 18M mark with the remaining contracts of players with at least 2 years pro experience.

Who fits the bill?

Lupul, maybe Holland, some UFAs signed between now and then, and a handful of players with <1M contracts. Without Lupul I think it'd be hard to hit that mark because a large portion of those 39 other pro contracts will be exempt (I think).
Nylander is not exempt. This is his 2nd pro season already.
 

Barilko14

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Does it make any sense to have the expansion draft before free agency?

Why would and UFA re-sign there after?
They could potentially lose their whole team to free agency.

The expansion draft has to be before free agency, otherwise how would the expansion teams know who to target as UFAs?They wouldn't know what holes they have to fill.

I'm pretty sure a management team will be smart enough to pick players with some term, they could pick a few UFAs with hopes that a larger negotiating window will benefit them, but I would think the majority of players they would select would either have term, or be RFAs.
 

SprDaVE

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Sep 20, 2008
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Lupol does have upside if he could stay healthy and he is a great guy for the community

But he can't. He's proven this time and time again.

He can be a great community guy without being a member of the Leafs 23 man roster.
 

Barilko14

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I almost wish Robidas was never Robidas'd so we wouldn't have this loophole to discuss. It's happened once since the new CBA and people bring it up like its a simple, common thing to do with players.

Robidas was never put on LTIR, so we never saved his cap, he spent the whole year on IR so he didn't take up a roster spot.

The odds Lupul, the PA or the NHL let this happen next year to Lupul are slim to none, not to mention it would be 3M + 5.25M = 8.25M in dead cap space, I highly doubt Lou wants that either.
 
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Pookie

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It has to be the notion speculated in the OP.

It can't be that players in their early 30s with declining skill and health issues have hard to move contracts.

If HoF boards have taught me anything when people start throwing stupid money and terms at players in their mid-late 20s, it's that these contracts can totally be moved at will.

No risk baby.

Can't be that no one wants him. His cap hit is less than proposed routinely for Kadri and way less than half what is proposed for Stamkos.... sorry Stammer as his friends call him.
 

The Podium

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Nylander is not exempt. This is his 2nd pro season already.

Friedman has already made mention to it. Nylander is exempt. From this we can assume that his 37 games last season either didn't count as a full pro season or slid due to the fact that he was a euro born player playing in the AHL before his draft year CHL prospects were eligible.
 

Joey Hoser

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Jan 8, 2008
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It has to be the notion speculated in the OP.

It can't be that players in their early 30s with declining skill and health issues have hard to move contracts.

If HoF boards have taught me anything when people start throwing stupid money and terms at players in their mid-late 20s, it's that these contracts can totally be moved at will.

No risk baby.

Can't be that no one wants him. His cap hit is less than proposed routinely for Kadri and way less than half what is proposed for Stamkos.... sorry Stammer as his friends call him.

So because Lupul is made of glass we can't sign players in their mid-late 20's?

Nice try there guy.
 

GordieHoweHatTrick

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Sep 20, 2009
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Normally the following:

First the Expansion draft would possible happen around June 20

Second the Entry draft would possible happen around June 25

UFA availability begins around June 30

Toronto's UFAs will be Toronto property up to June 30. If there are no changes in the rules Toronto will have excess expansion draft eligible deadwood available (salary cap wise) to meet the requirement of exposing at least 25% of Toronto's 2016/17 salary cap. Excess cap laden expansion draft eligible players could have some attraction to other teams at the TDD.

The league's mandate is to make the expansion teams competitive off the bat and allowing UFAs to be made available will leave less quality unprotected so unless what you're saying is already fact then I'm not buying it.
 

Barilko14

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The league's mandate is to make the expansion teams competitive off the bat and allowing UFAs to be made available will leave less quality unprotected so unless what you're saying is already fact then I'm not buying it.

I'm pretty sure UFAs would be eligible to be exposed. If not, what cap number would they use. You would hardly be able to figure out a 23 man roster if you to not include the UFAs, some teams would be exposing $12M in players from their remaining $50M in payroll.
 

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