Speculation: Jets General Rumour, Trade, Free Agent and Waiver Speculation 15-16 Part XI

[YWGinYYZ]

Previous thread: http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=2036375

Some posts to get us started:

You are both ignoring the need to protect 2nd year pros and draft picks who are unsigned after 2 years. Those 2 provisions add a huge number of players to the pool. Players who haven't even made it to the NHL yet. For example if Connor stays in school he would have to be protected. AC, that is why I am arguing for the more literal use of the July 1 cutoff date. That date would remove Connor from the list.

The rules for unsigned prospects being exempt don't have to be identical to the contract salary provisions. It's not that hard really.

The way I understand things Connor Roslovic Foley Appleton would still be exempt.

Franklin Poolman Kraskovsky would not.

Quite frankly, I think the bolded is dropped.

What good is a bunch of collegiate players/Euro pros going to provide for a Las Vegas team that still needs to hit the cap floor versus how much it'll piss off the Leafs, for example, who are likely to litter the back half of their draft this year with tiny Russians on KHL contracts (though this year's draftees would be exempt and the Leafs don't have a hell-of-a-lot to protect anyway)?

True, as you have said before they can make any rule they like. Bettman is a lawyer. He thinks like a lawyer. I think they will be consistent. July 1 will be used and pending UFAs without NMCs will count as exposed. Their salaries will contribute to the 25%. Players whose 3rd year pro or 3rd year since being drafted doesn't start untill July 1 will be exempt. JMO of course but it makes the whole package of provisions make a lot more sense to me.

You disagree because no expansion team would waste a draft pick on a UFA. Fine, they don't get taken then. There will be lots of other players available. Maybe LV chooses to take 1 or 2 UFAs and try to sign them before July 1. They have lots of cap space. They have 30 picks. But if not so what?

Meanwhile it makes meeting the 25% requirement a lot more reasonable for most teams. Doing it that way gets to what you described. A team made up mostly of #4D and #8 F. Even so a few higher ones will slip in along with possibly 1 or 2 much higher UFAs. That would be very good by the usual expansion team standards.

Click to read more...

 

[Grind]

I'm excited for this off season again

IMO it's the "safest" one we've had.

Not screwing it up is more about not doing things then doing things IMO.

Honestly if we made no FA signings I wouldn't be bothered.

If acheif and Trouba get decent contracts and Connor gets an ELC there will be very little management could do to really bum me out.

I have my fingers crossed and hoping management is finalky going to move on from some of the dregs or at least use them more appropriately as they seem to actually like the possible replacements (as opposed to previous years when most of the options seemed to be guys our mgmt had some sort of beef with or hesitancy too)

 

[Nickel eye Heel hers]

Anyone see Buff's interview today and his response on playing Ladd ? I almost got the impression he didn't care for #16. Is there anyone Buff doesn't hate after he or a player leaves a team he is on ?

I still like Big Buff but boy he seemed kinda cranky today.

 

[Grind]

I heard the buff interview and it seemed like classic Buff to me. I got the opposite impression.


I get the sense buffs humor/attitude doesn't translate for some...

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Anyone see Buff's interview today and his response on playing Ladd ? I almost got the impression he didn't care for #16. Is there anyone Buff doesn't hate after he or a player leaves a team he is on ?

I still like Big Buff but boy he seemed kinda cranky today.

Saw it. The important word is "almost". He then said "you've got a job to do. You go out and do it." No malice. He also said something like "he'll buy him a beer after".

That interview probably illustrates why Buff doesn't like talking to the media. If he tries to answer honestly he is in danger of having his words twisted. I don't think he likes answering dishonestly unless it is clearly a joke.

 

[Nickel eye Heel hers]

I heard the buff interview and it seemed like classic Buff to me. I got the opposite impression.


I get the sense buffs humor/attitude doesn't translate for some...

I can appreciate a dry wit or sense of humor but usually Buff has a small smirk when he's playing up the media and it didn't seem very apparent today.
It might just be he's feeling testy after a s**t show season and having to talk to media that made me get my impression.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I'm excited for this off season again

IMO it's the "safest" one we've had.

Not screwing it up is more about not doing things then doing things IMO.

Honestly if we made no FA signings I wouldn't be bothered.

If acheif and Trouba get decent contracts and Connor gets an ELC there will be very little management could do to really bum me out.

I have my fingers crossed and hoping management is finalky going to move on from some of the dregs or at least use them more appropriately as they seem to actually like the possible replacements (as opposed to previous years when most of the options seemed to be guys our mgmt had some sort of beef with or hesitancy too)

Agree. The only things that need to be done are signing a few RFA contracts, 1 of which may be difficult and moving on, one way or another from some deadweight. Stafford may or may not be in that deadweight category depending on the draft.

What I would like to see;
Scheif signed long term. Trouba bridged. Pav gone. I mean really gone and I don't care how. Buyout if necessary. Thorburn and Stu also gone. Peluso maybe kept as 14th F (I secretly want to see him get a shot at Cody McLeod. Shhh, its a secret.). Hutch kept as backup. Mathews or Laine and 1 of Chych/Juolevi/Sergachev.

What I would be quite satisfied with;
The same 2 contracts. Pav as backup. Sigh. Only 1 more year. Thor, Peluso and Stu in the press box. Any 1 of the top 6 and 2 D with our next 2 picks unless our first pick is a D. Then only 1.

No trades (Maybe Stafford), no FA signings (unless a good one falls in our lap). No drafting a saviour.

Ehlers - Scheifele - Wheeler
Perreault - Little - Stafford
Connor - Burmi - Armia
Lowry/Copp - Copp/Lowry - Dano

Trouba - Buff
Enstrom - Myers
Morrissey - Postma

Helle - Pav

Connor and Morrissey are the only rookies needed. Everybody else has a year more experience. There are some decent players available for callup. I think we are in pretty good shape there. Fewer penalties (I hope!). Better goaltending. Better STs (surely!).

Trouba and Ehlers are the only 2 players on their off sides and both have shown they can do it successfully. It will be up to Chevy to minimize our exposure to the expansion draft. I think we will lose 1 good young forward. We have replacements.

That is with no provision for drafting an NHL ready player.

Looks pretty promising to me.

 

[Whileee]

Agree. The only things that need to be done are signing a few RFA contracts, 1 of which may be difficult and moving on, one way or another from some deadweight. Stafford may or may not be in that deadweight category depending on the draft.

What I would like to see;
Scheif signed long term. Trouba bridged. Pav gone. I mean really gone and I don't care how. Buyout if necessary. Thorburn and Stu also gone. Peluso maybe kept as 14th F (I secretly want to see him get a shot at Cody McLeod. Shhh, its a secret.). Hutch kept as backup. Mathews or Laine and 1 of Chych/Juolevi/Sergachev.

What I would be quite satisfied with;
The same 2 contracts. Pav as backup. Sigh. Only 1 more year. Thor, Peluso and Stu in the press box. Any 1 of the top 6 and 2 D with our next 2 picks unless our first pick is a D. Then only 1.

No trades (Maybe Stafford), no FA signings (unless a good one falls in our lap). No drafting a saviour.

Ehlers - Scheifele - Wheeler
Perreault - Little - Stafford
Connor - Burmi - Armia
Lowry/Copp - Copp/Lowry - Dano

Trouba - Buff
Enstrom - Myers
Morrissey - Postma

Helle - Pav

Connor and Morrissey are the only rookies needed. Everybody else has a year more experience. There are some decent players available for callup. I think we are in pretty good shape there. Fewer penalties (I hope!). Better goaltending. Better STs (surely!).

Trouba and Ehlers are the only 2 players on their off sides and both have shown they can do it successfully. It will be up to Chevy to minimize our exposure to the expansion draft. I think we will lose 1 good young forward. We have replacements.

That is with no provision for drafting an NHL ready player.

Looks pretty promising to me.

Seems reasonable, and the Jets would still likely have among the best / deepest prospect pools in the NHL...

PLD / Finn, Petan, Comrie, Lemieux, Roslovic, Lipon, 2016 1st (CHI), De Leo, Kosmachuk, etc.

 

[garret9]

random:

I miss Hellebuyck. :'(

 

[Grind]

random:

I miss Hellebuyck. :'(

what the actual **** Lundqvist?

 

[Whileee]

random:

I miss Hellebuyck. :'(

Goalies are absolutely voodoo.

 

[Grind]

garret i'm assuming those are 5v5 numbers yes?

 

[Evil Little]

random:

I miss Hellebuyck. :'(

When you say you miss Hellebuyck, you don't mean that you'd want him starting for the Jets right now, do you? Pavelec is elite at tanking, and that's what the team needs right now.

Also, what's explosive save percentage?

Also, Hammond? Really?

 

[Board Bard]

Anyone see Buff's interview today and his response on playing Ladd ? I almost got the impression he didn't care for #16. Is there anyone Buff doesn't hate after he or a player leaves a team he is on ?

I still like Big Buff but boy he seemed kinda cranky today.

Ladd chuckled at it in his interview. Said he told Buff he'd have an elbow for him. Seems like regular kidding around to me.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
You are both ignoring the need to protect 2nd year pros and draft picks who are unsigned after 2 years. Those 2 provisions add a huge number of players to the pool. Players who haven't even made it to the NHL yet. For example if Connor stays in school he would have to be protected. AC, that is why I am arguing for the more literal use of the July 1 cutoff date. That date would remove Connor from the list.
Quite frankly, I think the bolded is dropped.

What good is a bunch of collegiate players/Euro pros going to provide for a Las Vegas team that still needs to hit the cap floor versus how much it'll piss off the Leafs, for example, who are likely to litter the back half of their draft this year with tiny Russians on KHL contracts (though this year's draftees would be exempt and the Leafs don't have a hell-of-a-lot to protect anyway)?

You could be right about that provision. I did a double take (literally, I rewound and listened again ) when I heard that. But until I hear otherwise I will assume it is there.

I don't know what the thinking might have been. Help the expansion team stock a development system? There could be some very good players available that way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mortimer Snerd View Post
True, as you have said before they can make any rule they like. Bettman is a lawyer. He thinks like a lawyer. I think they will be consistent. July 1 will be used and pending UFAs without NMCs will count as exposed. Their salaries will contribute to the 25%. Players whose 3rd year pro or 3rd year since being drafted doesn't start untill July 1 will be exempt. JMO of course but it makes the whole package of provisions make a lot more sense to me.

You disagree because no expansion team would waste a draft pick on a UFA. Fine, they don't get taken then. There will be lots of other players available. Maybe LV chooses to take 1 or 2 UFAs and try to sign them before July 1. They have lots of cap space. They have 30 picks. But if not so what?

Meanwhile it makes meeting the 25% requirement a lot more reasonable for most teams. Doing it that way gets to what you described. A team made up mostly of #4D and #8 F. Even so a few higher ones will slip in along with possibly 1 or 2 much higher UFAs. That would be very good by the usual expansion team standards.

The point you are missing is the purpose of the 25% rule. The new team has to reach the floor of the SC range. If they make rules that allow team(s) to avoid providing contracts with salary attached then it becomes difficult for them to do so. It's not about being reasonable for existing teams. Its about being reasonable for the new team joining the league. It's only 1 player after all (if only Vegas)

I haven't given a lot of thought to the new team needing to meet the salary floor. I'd be surprised if they have any difficulty with that. I'm looking at the whole package of rules and disagreeing with you on your expectation for one aspect. I expect all the provisions to use the approaching July 1 cutoff for all provisions that deal with the question of whether a player is under contract or for how long he has been a pro, etc. You expect a different rule for pending UFAs. You could be right but I don't think so.

What I am expecting strikes a balance between being excessively hard on some teams and providing the expansion team(s) with a decent start. I think it all works when applied consistently.

 

[10Ducky10]

Ladd and Buff are friends away from the ice.
They've been team mates since Chicago.
They go on fishing trips in the off-season.
Buff will wallpaper him if given the chance but there is no animosity between these two.

 

[fmrdh]

Pretty sure they are close friends

 

[Gm0ney]

You could be right about that provision. I did a double take (literally, I rewound and listened again ) when I heard that. But until I hear otherwise I will assume it is there.

I don't know what the thinking might have been. Help the expansion team stock a development system? There could be some very good players available that way.


I haven't given a lot of thought to the new team needing to meet the salary floor. I'd be surprised if they have any difficulty with that. I'm looking at the whole package of rules and disagreeing with you on your expectation for one aspect. I expect all the provisions to use the approaching July 1 cutoff for all provisions that deal with the question of whether a player is under contract or for how long he has been a pro, etc. You expect a different rule for pending UFAs. You could be right but I don't think so.

What I am expecting strikes a balance between being excessively hard on some teams and providing the expansion team(s) with a decent start. I think it all works when applied consistently.

Each team can only lose one player per expansion team at the draft. The Jets could possibly expose players like Dano, Armia, Burmistrov, Lowry - is someone going to pass on those guys to take a shot at Franklin or Niku? I guess maybe if they set the world on fire next season...

I think these are all the prospects I think who would be exposed:

CHL
Nogier (won't he go back into this year's draft if we don't sign him before then?)

NAHL
Karlstrom (?)

NCAA
Poolman
Franklin
Glover
Ustaski
Lane (drafted 6 years ago - I think he's a UFA this summer)
Phillips

Europe
Kraskovsky
Niku
Telegin?

I'm not sure what Telegin's status is - but it doesn't really matter because I think the Chicago Blackhawks have a far better chance of winning this year's draft lottery than an expansion team picking Telegin off our list of exposed players.

Realistically, none of these guys would be an expansion franchise's top pick from the players the Jets could expose.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Each team can only lose one player per expansion team at the draft. The Jets could possibly expose players like Dano, Armia, Burmistrov, Lowry - is someone going to pass on those guys to take a shot at Franklin or Niku? I guess maybe if they set the world on fire next season...

I think these are all the prospects I think who would be exposed:

CHL
Nogier (won't he go back into this year's draft if we don't sign him before then?)

NAHL
Karlstrom (?)

NCAA
Poolman
Franklin
Glover
Ustaski
Lane (drafted 6 years ago - I think he's a UFA this summer)
Phillips

Europe
Kraskovsky
Niku
Telegin?

I'm not sure what Telegin's status is - but it doesn't really matter because I think the Chicago Blackhawks have a far better chance of winning this year's draft lottery than an expansion team picking Telegin off our list of exposed players.

Realistically, none of these guys would be an expansion franchise's top pick from the players the Jets could expose.

The only risk of really good players being caught up in this is if some player decides to remain in Uni for his jnr. year. If this was all happening last year or this year Jimmy Vesey would be an example of a player exposed because of it.

Connor and Roslovic could stay in school next year. I don't think that would make them eligible because the anniversary date of their draft would not have passed. So unless the league decides that it should go by when their seasons ended they would be safe. I doubt that happens. Had they been drafted 1 year earlier they would be. Looking for examples who would be vulnerable I find Alex Tuch, Nick Schmaltz and Thatcher Demko as candidates if they decide to stay in the NCAA. All better prospects than Franklin or Niku. I expect all of them will be signed before the expansion draft but the potential is there.

IDK what was the thinking behind this provision. It doesn't make a lot of sense to me. But if it stays in the package teams have to be aware of it. I think it just increases the pressure to sign good players who might otherwise be exposed. As you point out, weaker prospects wont be affected.

 

[Aavco Cup]

Each team can only lose one player per expansion team at the draft. The Jets could possibly expose players like Dano, Armia, Burmistrov, Lowry - is someone going to pass on those guys to take a shot at Franklin or Niku? I guess maybe if they set the world on fire next season...

I think these are all the prospects I think who would be exposed:

CHL
Nogier (won't he go back into this year's draft if we don't sign him before then?)

NAHL
Karlstrom (?)

NCAA
Poolman
Franklin
Glover
Ustaski
Lane (drafted 6 years ago - I think he's a UFA this summer)
Phillips

Europe
Kraskovsky
Niku
Telegin?

I'm not sure what Telegin's status is - but it doesn't really matter because I think the Chicago Blackhawks have a far better chance of winning this year's draft lottery than an expansion team picking Telegin off our list of exposed players.

Realistically, none of these guys would be an expansion franchise's top pick from the players the Jets could expose.

Nogier needs to be signed to an ELC by June or he won't be Jet property.

 

[10Ducky10]

What about Phillips........30 days after this season ends?

 

[Holden Caulfield]

What about Phillips........30 days after this season ends?

Jamie Phillips has his rights expire on August 15th, 2016.

 

[Channelcat]

Jamie Phillips has his rights expire on August 15th, 2016.

I'm guessing it makes most sense for him to go FA at this point? Assuming thats how its works.

 

[Heldig]

Jamie Phillips has his rights expire on August 15th, 2016.

Jets should sign him. Assuming Helle boy is on the Jets next year and one of Pavelec or Hutchison leaves...Phillips can back up Comrie on the AHL team.

 

[allan5oh]

I don't see any reason why the Jets wouldn't sign him. We can give him incentives other teams cant.